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Jayrendo Karr
Suns Of Korhal Terran Commonwealth
59
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Posted - 2012.04.27 05:21:00 -
[1] - Quote
Basically make a procurer, but with 50k ehp and 1 Strip miner. If you want to be safe mine in this ship. With RR you can bring out the hulks and mine. Every other proffesion has to balance between gank and tank, currently miners only have a gank option with high yield hulks, create a tank option for miners. It should yield about 1.5 stip miners worth, and have a 2k cargo hold. Only 1 high slot and 15 m3 drone bay. |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
707
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Posted - 2012.04.27 05:22:00 -
[2] - Quote
this already exists it's called a rokh |
Jayrendo Karr
Suns Of Korhal Terran Commonwealth
59
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Posted - 2012.04.27 05:24:00 -
[3] - Quote
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:this already exists it's called a rokh The rokh is a battle ship. Miners need a mining specific ship with high tank and low yield. |
Caleb Ayrania
TarNec
27
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Posted - 2012.04.27 05:41:00 -
[4] - Quote
Jayrendo Karr wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:this already exists it's called a rokh The rokh is a battle ship. Miners need a mining specific ship with high tank and low yield.
Yes its quite amazing, we have moved from beta where you mined in megathrons.. now there are like special ships for that.. Color me impressed, and in only ten years.. "I promise you we will go the Captains Quarter in this decade, and those other things.."
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Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
717
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Posted - 2012.04.27 06:45:00 -
[5] - Quote
Jayrendo Karr wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:this already exists it's called a rokh The rokh is a battle ship. Miners need a mining specific ship with high tank and low yield. A Rokh with 8 Miner IIs has yield equal to a covetor and 55K EHP, which is exactly what you're asking for. |
Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
599
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Posted - 2012.04.27 06:55:00 -
[6] - Quote
Stop mining.
Better yet, lets get CCP to just remove the most boring profession requiring several months to fly well a T2 **** the size of a battlecruiser, hitpoints of a cruiser, the fitting of a frigate(hulk has PG just under a rifter but twice the CPU), a shield bonus but it structure tanks better, those same lows are tied up with mining upgrades that increase CPU BUT!!! combat ship gank mods (+asteroid or +damage, same thing) don't do that and other T2 ships let you fit well either gank or tank in incredible numbers or a blend of both very well. Not so much for that ****** ship.
I am leaning more towards option 2. Seed minerals from NPC course at outrageous prices (1000 isk trit ) in every NPC station in numbers suffiencent to prevent market manipulation and watch isk start to disseapper rather quickly from EVE when Rifters start to cost 60 million without fittings |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
721
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Posted - 2012.04.27 08:28:00 -
[7] - Quote
: TWISTED : |
Nalha Saldana
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
236
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Posted - 2012.04.27 11:10:00 -
[8] - Quote
Jayrendo Karr wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:this already exists it's called a rokh The rokh is a battle ship. Miners need a mining specific ship with high tank and low yield.
Why do you absolutely need a ship that is already covered by another one? If it would have a higher yield then a rokh it would be too much. |
Hortense Sledgemallet
Hedion University Amarr Empire
7
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Posted - 2012.04.27 12:37:00 -
[9] - Quote
I've seen people mining in a Rokh. Its looks quite comical.
I can fill the back of my SUV with a lot of dirt. But I dont because thats what pick up trucks are for.
Use the right tool for the right job. Eve needs more ships anyways.
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Sadleric
GLOBAL DISSENSION Test Friends Please Ignore
0
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Posted - 2012.04.27 13:09:00 -
[10] - Quote
Hortense Sledgemallet wrote:I've seen people mining in a Rokh. Its looks quite comical.
I can fill the back of my SUV with a lot of dirt. But I dont because thats what pick up trucks are for.
Use the right tool for the right job. Eve needs more ships anyways.
Mine mecroxit in nullsec with a cloaked Rokh. Make kajillions of isk.
It's almost safer mining down here when you know how to protect yourself. You'll go from mining one moment to hotdropping covert-ops off a Titan the next back to Gas Cloud harvesting afterwards. |
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Velicitia
Open Designs
884
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Posted - 2012.04.27 14:38:00 -
[11] - Quote
Jayrendo Karr wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:this already exists it's called a rokh The rokh is a battle ship. Miners need a mining specific ship with high tank and low yield.
like fitting strip miner Is to a hulk, some shield mods, and a ~30k EHP buffer?
... but oh, yeah ... it'll seriously impede your m3/min... |
DitchDigger
Hibi Proletariat
10
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Posted - 2012.05.01 17:27:00 -
[12] - Quote
It would also need a couple more low slots to fit warp stabilizers and nanos |
Nikk Narrel
Infinite Improbability Inc Mordus Angels
247
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Posted - 2012.05.01 17:57:00 -
[13] - Quote
Check this out: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=98273&find=unread Here is a thought.
Make a turtle.
Make a mining drone ship. No turret slots, no launcher hardpoints.
Make it so tough, that anyone trying to solo gank one is recommended to take a drug test afterwards. (Think Marauder level defenses) 50 m3 dronebay / 25 bandwidth Put the Ore hold for 8k m3 Set a cargo hold for 200 m3
(We don't want this thing cross training to be a replacement for the blockade runner either)
Now, have it rely exclusively on mining drones. It can fit 10 total in it's drone bay, and control 5 in space.
Give it bonuses so these 5 drones can collectively perform at a level between the Covetor and the Hulk.
Now, gankers can eat these drones, sure... but the ship can get away. It can fit a tank they can't get through, if it wants. (again, Marauder levels, but focusing on defense... a fleet could eat one, but not a solo ship very well)
Worried about bots? The ganking clans can still show up and clip those drones to ribbons. Bots don't mine much if there are no drones to supply them, and a smartbombing vessel can instapop them.
TL:DR Gankers can stop it from working, but it is likely to survive the encounter
Figure, using estimates based on: http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Advanced_mining
Rokh hourly output: 84,000 units of Omber
Covetor hourly output: 101,880 units of Omber
Hulk hourly output: 181,920 units of Omber
We would want serious miners, with proper fleet support, to never stray from the Hulk's standards. (Till the day CCP decides they need something better)
This would be a serious mining ship.
Using T2 mining drones, a set of 5 with minimal travel delay can mine 31,200 per hour. This travel time has the mother vessel parked on top of the asteroid, (within 1km), however, not aligned for safe exit, or between multiple asteroids doing several at once. It also presumes skills Mining Drone Operations at 5, and Drone Interfacing at 5.
I would suggest the ship to have a skill, Mining Drone Ship, each skill level to give a 100% increase in drone yield.
For reference, this means IF you have: Mining Drone Operations at 5 Drone Interfacing at 5 Mining Drone Ship at 5 AND the ship within 1Km of the asteroid
Your output would be, (in Omber), 156,000 an hour.
Not as good as the Hulk, certainly more skill intensive, and you get to be safer. |
Draconus Lofwyr
The Green Cross Red Alliance
20
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Posted - 2012.05.01 18:07:00 -
[14] - Quote
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Jayrendo Karr wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:this already exists it's called a rokh The rokh is a battle ship. Miners need a mining specific ship with high tank and low yield. A Rokh with 8 Miner IIs has yield equal to a covetor and 55K EHP, which is exactly what you're asking for.
this works in all but one area, you cant mine ICE without an exhumer. period, end of story, OP's solution would allow for at least that.. |
Gevlin
Universal Might DSM FOUNDATION
137
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Posted - 2012.05.01 18:47:00 -
[15] - Quote
yup - the environment of of Eve dictates a superior tanked hulk. Welcome to eve where players have altered the intial world of Eve. The Goons are Coming, The Goons are Coming Jita the April 28, Hulk a geddon April 29 for a month. The Best Tears are the Geifer's Tears. just hope the new crime watch system is in place by then.... oh the chaos will rain!!! |
Joe Risalo
State War Academy Caldari State
239
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Posted - 2012.05.01 19:40:00 -
[16] - Quote
Gevlin wrote:yup - the environment of of Eve dictates a superior tanked hulk. Welcome to eve where players have altered the intial world of Eve.
I don't know if you're being sarcastic with this comment, but it's actually pretty true.
This has actually been shown in several cases.
Such as titans, super carriers, dreads, drakes, tengus, frigs in general, etc. etc.
Basically the introduction of these ships wasn't an issue and they were quite balanced until the players got hold of them and started building fits that CCP couldn't account for or started blobbing with them which is quite complicated to balance around, and in the case of t1 frigs, the introduction of other ships in general has made them generally irrelivant in eve past the first week of play.
This is the same case for mining barges and exhumers.
In the case of mining barges, exhumers and the next step up barge has made them irrelivant past the training duration to which they would have been used, and in the case of the procurer the retriever made it an unusable ship.
In the case of mining barges I suggest they be given a bit more ehp and also be given the bonuses that their t2 counter parts receive towards specialization. They would receive 20% less yield compared to their t2 counterparts(slight nerf for the covetor), but since they're much cheaper, much less durable, and have smaller holds, then it balances them and allows the player to decide whether the much cheaper cost is worth the risks.
In the case of exhumers, CCP didn't anticipate situations like hulkaggedon where these ships would actually have to face other players. They were essentially designed to be able to deal with belt rats and that's about it.
In the case fo these ships they need some changes to balance them so that they better fit into Eve the way the players have made it.
So, unlike most t2 ships, exhumers aren't exactly specialized in comparison to other t2 vessels.
So with that in mind i'll be suggesting some specializations for these ships, nerfs, and buffs. Skiff - Loses any bonuses not related to deep core mining. However, in addition to its gas reduction bonus, it also receives a specialization of cargohold per lvl of exhumers allowing if to have a large hold than even a hulk. This is to fit it's role as a hostile space miner and allow for prolonged mining durations. On top of its +2 warp strength it could also possibly use a agility buff.
Mackinaw - Loses any bonuses not related to ice harvesting. However, it receives a bonus that when it mines ice it actually melts the ice and stores it in a freezer unit where it is refrozen. This process reduces the m3 of the ice by 1/3rd. Meaning 3 pieces of ice only fill the m3 of what would normally be 2 pieces of ice.
Hulk - Loses any bonuses not related to strip mining(so no more ice mining). However, it receives the specialization of having a mining crystal hold to which only crystals can be stored. Mining crystals are 50m3, so standard crystal hold on the hulk would be 300, allowing for 2 crystals per strip miner. It would receive a bonus towards the crystal hold bonus of 150m3 per lvl, allowing it to hold 7 crystal per strip miner at lvl 5 allowing for much more veratility in ore mining options. There are 15 different types of ore that it could mine, so it would still be limited to only carrying a full set of crystals for just under half of the available ore types.
In the case of all exhumers NEED an EHP buff in order to compensate for the players, which has apparently become a part of balancing when you look at super carriers, titans, and the upcoming nerfs to tengus and drakes. So, with this in mind I would like to suggest and ALTERNATIVE to a straight up EHP buff. This suggestion is based off the Caracal, which has low ehp, but when fitted with a passive shield tank can increase its ehp quite a bit. So, they retain their base EHP but are given the cpu/pg/cap/shield recharge rate and slot layout to allow for them to comportably fit a passive shield tank comperable to that of the Caracal, which like the caracal, drake, rattlesnake, and other passive shield tanked ships allows for them to fit for more durability, better yield, or a more middle grounded fit. This buff to cpu/pg/ blah blah blah should also be able to factor in afterburners and mwds. So, like with a caracal/drake/etc.etc.etc. They would have several available options. High speed/mod tank/base yield high speed/base tank/mod yield mod speed/low tank/ good yield mod speed/good tank/low yield mod speed/mod tank/mod yield low speed/mod tank/good yield low speed/good tank/mod yield
Basically what i'm saying there is that they would have much more capabilites than they currently do but without actually effecting their base ehp or yield and allowing for the players to have much more availability in fitting, which is what every other ship including transport ships, orcas, t1 industrials etc. etc. etc.
This way they would fit better in the world of eve as a ship with modules as compared to what they are now, which is generally a difficult to fit, with limited options ships. |
Tidurious
ResLife Can Suck It
211
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Posted - 2012.05.02 00:34:00 -
[17] - Quote
Jayrendo Karr wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:this already exists it's called a rokh The rokh is a battle ship. Miners need a mining specific ship with high tank and low yield.
Why, because you said so? If you want low yield and high tank, use what is already available to you. Use a Maelstrom with 8x mining lasers. I don't care what you use, just don't re-invent the wheel.
If you want a tanky hulk, then tank your hulk. End of story.
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