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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 7 post(s) |
Eben Rochelle
Gallente Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers Reloaded
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Posted - 2009.03.25 09:51:00 -
[481]
Wait so the cloaky no damage Falcon is to become the brawler and the COMBAT recon the sneaky sneaky far away ship? *facepalm* I'm normally a rabid fanboi but seriously! come on! W T F?
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MJ Maverick
IronPig Sev3rance
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Posted - 2009.03.25 09:57:00 -
[482]
Shocking ideas... What on Earth are you thinking making CALDARI SUPPORT ships close range? In any normal fleet Falcons and Rooks will now be pointless, 1 volley insta'death. Unless they can have 10 jamming slots and 5 buffer tank slots. Seriously who is coming up with these ideas out of the blue?
There are plenty of things the players WANT addressing in these forums so why don't you do those instead of running over to something that there's nothing wrong with?
For the record, I hate Falcons and Rooks. --------------------
CCP arse kissing drones are not welcome in my threads. CCP are not perfect.
Please resize your sig to a file size no greater than 24000 bytes - Mitnal |
Aganola
Amarr Ten Below Zero
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Posted - 2009.03.25 09:58:00 -
[483]
Just one word:
LEAK!!
Remember those 4 Falcon BPOs wich were sold 'oh! so suddenly' and simultaneously 2-3 month ago?
Sounds like CCP still has some leaks...
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Kagura Nikon
Minmatar M. Corp
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Posted - 2009.03.25 10:02:00 -
[484]
Originally by: Aganola Just one word:
LEAK!!
Remember those 4 Falcon BPOs wich were sold 'oh! so suddenly' and simultaneously 2-3 month ago?
Sounds like CCP still has some leaks...
dude you must be completely blind to not see that the falcon nerf was comming. Even my parrot knew it! With every one complaining, was just a matter of time. ------------------------------------------------- If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough
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Shadowsword
Epsilon Lyr Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2009.03.25 10:02:00 -
[485]
Originally by: Aganola Just one word:
LEAK!!
Remember those 4 Falcon BPOs wich were sold 'oh! so suddenly' and simultaneously 2-3 month ago?
Sounds like CCP still has some leaks...
This is stupid. Everyone know Falcons are overpowered->A nerf was sure to come one day->some anticipated and sold while they still could get the max price for it.
You should think some more before accusing someone again... ------------------------------------------
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Cheekything
Gallente Fallen Angel's Blade.
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Posted - 2009.03.25 10:04:00 -
[486]
I do think that the range of ECM ships should not out range more than 175km also I think that it should be more focused role wise.
However I also think that maybe if ECM immune ships were added that could provided ECCM support it'd reduce the effectiveness of ECM in fleet fights.
Also I think CCP should rework all EWAR into racial types as even if the new ideas go into place then ECM will still be the better EWAR I mean if you reduce the jamming strength of rooks people will just bring more rooks.
Lastly rooks I think should be the brawlers as falcons have a low dps so up front in the main fight area they would be useless.
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Nova Satar
Annihilate.
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Posted - 2009.03.25 10:06:00 -
[487]
WHATEVER YOU DO, MAKE IT SO THAT WHEN I FINALLY DO MANAGE TO GET A LOCK, THE ****ING THING IS ALEAST IN RANGE OF ME TO SHOOT IT!
If you want to make a real fix, remvoe the ship from game.
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Colonel Xaven
Decadence. RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2009.03.25 10:10:00 -
[488]
Originally by: Cheekything However I also think that maybe if ECM immune ships were added that could provided ECCM support it'd reduce the effectiveness of ECM in fleet fights.
Fit a command ships with ECCM and information warfare modules.
Proud member of RZR - Decadence. |
Nova Satar
Annihilate.
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Posted - 2009.03.25 10:15:00 -
[489]
Originally by: Thetys finally! thank you soo much CCP, keep up the good work! put some more focus on the "small group pvp" in low sec please (10-15 pilots at each side)
What? Your corp is one of the worst low-sec blob corps i know. You simply DO NOT fight until you have more numbers and atleast 2-3 falcons.
Small Low Sec gangs are not "10 or 15" people.
Focus on ONE or TWO or at a stretch THREE man gangs.
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Nova Satar
Annihilate.
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Posted - 2009.03.25 10:20:00 -
[490]
Originally by: Kalissa Dauntless You're going to make the falcon a brawler? You do know it's made of tin foil and falls apart when a small insect passes somewhere close to it?
Do you mean like all the other recon ships?
Look at all these falcon pilots whining. This is a ******ed change becuase it won't nearly nerf falcons enough. CCP will never truly balance them becuase of all the falcon alt accounts they'd lose.
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Alex Harumichi
Gallente Gradient Electus Matari
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Posted - 2009.03.25 10:20:00 -
[491]
Originally by: Samiloth Justinian
I canĘt agree with that math. It is not only a matter of strength, but also range. With racials I get a range of 213+38 (240 targeting range with 1 SB), with a multi I get 142+25. At 167 km range the majority of the enemy BS fleet + support snipers can shoot me down if they want to, and since people actually want to shoot falcons down (I always want that when I face them), they will take the chance when they get it.
...
The thing with this thread is that the posters are talking about different kind of fights.
That. I'm talking from the perspective of EM; we do a lot of lowsec warfare, where the combat ranges are usually relatively small (apart from those damn Falcons out at 150km+ ). There, multispecs work fine, since you don't need extreme range.
In 0.0 sniper fleet battles, things are naturally very different, and it's racials all that way.
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NE14CYBER
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Posted - 2009.03.25 10:23:00 -
[492]
Originally by: Vaedian GER Edited by: Vaedian GER on 24/03/2009 21:28:38
Quote: Falcon: - ECM Optimal Range Bonus removed
I f**king love you Chronotis!
<3
P.S.: I'm a -10.0 Low-Sec Pirate.
Agreed.
I'm a low sec pilot who can fly a falcon too.
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Aizhen
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Posted - 2009.03.25 10:32:00 -
[493]
leave falcons as there are BUT: boost other ew weapons
my idea : make all ew as jamers (chance based)
td : 150 optimal + have chance to "100% stop guns" for 20 sec damps : 150 optimal + have chance to "100% reduse lock range" for 20 sec painters (no idea) : 150% range and give them some usefull role ex: reduce rezists ? for 50 / 100 % for 20 sec
if not : im suporting ccp changes
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Colonel Xaven
Decadence. RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2009.03.25 10:33:00 -
[494]
Originally by: Nova Satar Look at all these falcon pilots whining. This is a ******ed change becuase it won't nearly nerf falcons enough.
Haha, the irony.
Proud member of RZR - Decadence. |
Jalif
Minmatar Black Sinisters
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Posted - 2009.03.25 10:38:00 -
[495]
What about ECCM?
|Black Sinisters| |
Muad' Dib
Gallente Beyond Divinity Inc
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Posted - 2009.03.25 10:54:00 -
[496]
Originally by: CCP Chronotis We have been looking again at ECM ships focusing on their roles and whether these ships can be improved overall to better define their roles a little more. With that in mind, we want to share some of our thoughts and gather constructive feedback and suggestions of your own.
ECM Range
Signal Distortion Amplifiers
The SDAs are something of a conundrum. They are really only worth fitting on the ECM specialised ships and are the only EWAR enhancing module we have besides the rigs. Currently they increase your ECM strength and we were looking at swapping this to an ECM range bonus and altering either the base strength of the jammers or the ECM strength bonus of the ships so they become less required in every setup and the low slots could be used for tanking for example.
Ship Changes
We have been looking at all the ECM ships (Griffin, Kitsune, Blackbird, Falcon, Rook and Scorpion). We wanted to ensure each ship had a more focused role which was not just bigger, longer range and better than the others so only one wins outright. The two main themes we were looking at was short range brawler and long range sniper. The brawler would focus on ECM strength at shorter range and the sniper would be longer range but weaker with niches in these areas for each of the ships.
Falcon & Rook
The falcon has been changed to be similar to the pilgrim in its role as a ECM brawler at shorter ranges. It has a bigger ECM strength bonus whilst losing its ECM optimal range bonus. In addition its agility and base velocity and have been increased to allow it to be more manoeuvrable at shorter ranges.
Summary Falcon changes
- ECM Strength Bonus increased from 20 to 25% per level - ECM Optimal Range Bonus removed (52km optimal / 81km falloff w/ 2*SDA IIs) - Increase in general manoeuvrability (might give agility bonus to it to replace the ECM optimal range bonus)
The rook operates at longer ranges, able to attack at distance and whilst having a weaker ECM strength but longer ECM range than the falcon can lay some real damage on its target gaining a heavy/heavy assault and standard missile velocity bonus in addition to a small drone bay for additional utility.
Summary Rook Changes
- ECM strength bonus decreased to 15% per level - ECM Optimal Range bonus decreased to 15% per level (92km optimal / 81km falloff) - 5% Heavy/Heavy Assault missile velocity per recon ship level added (105km range with heavy missiles at max skills) - 25m3 drone bay / 25 mbit bandwidth added
The Scorpion
We are looking at putting the scorpion into the short range brawler role. To that end we are looking at removing its ECM Optimal range bonus, increasing the ECM strength bonus a little and adding a cruise/siege launcher rate of fire bonus so it can get close and personal.
Summary Scorpion Changes
- removed the ECM optimal range bonus - increased the ECM strength bonus to 20% per level - added a 5% RoF bonus to cruise & siege missile launchers per level.
Summary
Please provide constructive feedback on the ideas and changes. These changes are not yet on sisi and we will announce when they are. As always, everything is subject to change!
Do you ppl actually play the game, do you actually pvp, or do you make changes based on what you hear ? How does nerfing the Falcon for the pirates alone, solve the problem ? The problem of the Falcon is it's high strength of jammers, and 80-100km range is still snipe range for battleships, just like 160km is. Make ECCM actually work, and reduce the strength of the SDA's. Maybe even buff the sensor strength of every ship in the game by 10%, and you have yourself an easy fix.
How's this for constructive criticism ? --- I smack just for myself.
* Your signature file is to large. Please note: we do not allow signature files larger than 24000 bytes - Fallout |
Algey
The Littlest Hobos Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2009.03.25 10:56:00 -
[497]
This will not fix the problem with the falcon being seen as overpowered in small gangs. Giving the falcon no damage and shorter range / less jamming strength just makes it slightly less good at its job in small gangs, and utterly useless in anything larger (sniper hacs will eat it).
The falcon given a drone bay and more agility would be at least tolerable. It could run a light tank, add dps in small gangs, jam the odd ratter or help control tacklers and would be on a par with the other recons in small gang warfare. You'd need to cap the number of ecm modules on it though, or in small gangs it is still going to jam two or three ships.
The scorp will now be useless in fleet, the rook too expensive to fly in fleet (although it is looking like a mean cerb now), so no more ew in fleet fights :(
DPS and tank, that is the way of things according to ccp.
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Childeric Polaris
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Posted - 2009.03.25 10:58:00 -
[498]
Quote: The two main themes we were looking at was short range brawler and long range sniper. The brawler would focus on ECM strength at shorter range and the sniper would be longer range but weaker with niches in these areas for each of the ships.
If you create some ECM disruption charges launchers (pretty much like interdictors' stuff) with a chance of disrupting each ship within a sphere of 15 km, then fine. It could even be useful against spider-tankers.
If you just put the scorpions in the middle of the battlefield so that they get stabbed when trying to disrupt 1 ship at a time, then not fine.
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Baron Splendiferous
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Posted - 2009.03.25 11:00:00 -
[499]
Originally by: musgrattio Edited by: musgrattio on 24/03/2009 18:22:57 The general idea is fine, DO NOT GO OVERBOARD. We still need a ECM boat that can jam around 200km, and I think we'd all agree that needs to be the Falcon. If you want to make the Rook a close range ship, fine, but recons, in general, especially cloaking recons, are generally not going to be used at very short ranges. ...
First, why do you need a jamming ship at 200km? no other ewar functions at that range.
Also, it is clear from your post you have never flown a pilgrim.
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Muad' Dib
Gallente Beyond Divinity Inc
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Posted - 2009.03.25 11:00:00 -
[500]
Won't even go into how this basically boosts ECM, since everyone will use Falcons still, at 60-70, with even more strength as it is now, and the others that will want to go snipe ecm, will go with a rook with projector rigs and still get the range the falcon presently has. So much for your ideeas. --- I smack just for myself.
* Your signature file is to large. Please note: we do not allow signature files larger than 24000 bytes - Fallout |
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Johnny Sakk
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Posted - 2009.03.25 11:01:00 -
[501]
Adapt or die
Also, look at all dem goon tears. Lawl lawl lawl.
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Nikuno
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Posted - 2009.03.25 11:04:00 -
[502]
Surely the Rook and Falcon should be the other way around? The rook should be the stronger of the 2 at closer ranges with the ability to brawl a little, whilst the falcon should be weaker ecm with it's thinner tank and low to no damage. Even then the Falcon range should max out at the same sort of ranges damps and TD's do.
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Kix'i
Warp Asylum.
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Posted - 2009.03.25 11:04:00 -
[503]
Could you please comment on ECCM and the centurion implants please.
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Jalif
Minmatar Black Sinisters
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Posted - 2009.03.25 11:05:00 -
[504]
I agree with Maud here... this is not going to chance anything tbh.
|Black Sinisters| |
Ronin Reborn
Wrath of Fenris
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Posted - 2009.03.25 11:08:00 -
[505]
Good lord the new scorp is gonna rock. Suddenly went from something my raven/falcon alt wouldn't touch to something I might consider logging him in over my main to fly.
+1 for swapping Rook/Falcon roles though.
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The Cuckoo
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Posted - 2009.03.25 11:08:00 -
[506]
ECM is crap anyway, this is suposed to be a fun game right? What is fun about spending an entire battle jammed, while the person who does it safely sits out of harms way? ECM should be changed so that it's weaker and instead of jamming your ability to lock, just jams a random selection of guns on the target ship, but never be able to jam all your guns at once.
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C4pevna
Minmatar xSPECNAZx
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Posted - 2009.03.25 11:10:00 -
[507]
Please boost Widow in comparison to Scorpion, give it some optimal bonus so it feels like a tech2 ship !!!!!!!!! X~ |
Avon
Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers Reloaded
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Posted - 2009.03.25 11:11:00 -
[508]
Originally by: Nikuno Surely the Rook and Falcon should be the other way around? The rook should be the stronger of the 2 at closer ranges with the ability to brawl a little, whilst the falcon should be weaker ecm with it's thinner tank and low to no damage. Even then the Falcon range should max out at the same sort of ranges damps and TD's do.
Yeah, you would expect the combat recon to be the brawler. To be honest, apart from that rather surprising oversight, I think the changes sound okay. You can still use range, but you are in falloff, so effectiveness is reduced. What is wrong with that?
Can't wait to test it all out.
アニメ漫画です
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Leopold Caine
Amarr Ordo Nigrorum Susurri Ordo Magna
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Posted - 2009.03.25 11:12:00 -
[509]
Originally by: Alex Harumichi Edited by: Alex Harumichi on 25/03/2009 08:17:27
Originally by: Anabella Rella Edited by: Anabella Rella on 25/03/2009 07:04:55
Originally by: Alex Harumichi Extra reason I'm loving this change: the Goons seem to hate it.
That proves it's good for the game.
Hmm, think I have to take exception to this Alex. They may be Goons, but when they're right, they're right.
These wholesale changes to ECM would effectively make Caldari ships (with the possible exception of the Rokh) useless in fleets.
Nonsense. Forcing (some) ECM ships to get in closer just puts then vaguely in the same ballpark as the rest. Guess what? Other races have had to deal with limited range on ewar since forever.
"Falcons don't have tank" because people don't fit tank on their Falcons. I'm forced to fit tank on my Lachesis and Arazu, same goes for our Rapier/Huginn/Curse pilots. Those ships don't have any more actual tanking ability than the Falcon does. Why should the Caldari ECM boats be the only ones being able to play in "safe mode"?
Sure, if you give Gallente 200+km range damps, Minmatar 200+km ranged webs, and Amarr 200+km range tracking disruptors, then we can talk.
Before that: welcome to the club the rest of us are in. Tank or die. The Flavor of the Month Express has left the station.
I agree with this. I think it's not a nerf per se, but just balancing the Falcon in low sec warfare, as it is overpowered to act as an EW platform and evade gateguns. However, that's nerfing it in terms of nullsec snipe blobs, but I don't think force recons were designed for that. You don't see much Pilgrims in them, for example. Not to mention we'll see some new interesting fittings and tactics. I was expecting more folks will be discussing if a 1600mm plate would be a better investment than a 800mm, if the new Falcon will get an agility bonus? As for the dps, why would you need dps? It's a force recon ship. Let your dps ships take care of that. Of course, Pilgrims Arazus and Rapiers have some dps, but they don't rely on it as much as on their EW. And Falcon was never a solo ship anyway, so... So, no offense to anyone, but I think Falcons are just about to get fun. For both of those flying them and not flying them. Remember folks, it's just a game. More fun, less whine please. ________________________________________ Me sir? Just a simple passerby, I wouldn't know. |
Lindsay Logan
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Posted - 2009.03.25 11:16:00 -
[510]
Originally by: Mark iT
Spider tanking BS gangs and logistics will be unbreakable. GRAWWW YARRR!!!
This is my main concern about this. The range can be compensated for by adding 1 or 2 more ECM ships to gangs, but not breaking a spider tank is the death of small gang and solo PvP. Welcome blob land.
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