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Ascenntion
Flames of Prometheus
0
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Posted - 2012.05.01 00:36:00 -
[1] - Quote
Quick question as I'm new to w-space/low/null sec.
When people talk about spamming d-scan, what angle of view do you have?
Do you set it to 360 degrees, or are you also trying to pin down the direction of the incoming threat and setting 60 or 90 degrees and looking around?
I'm thinking defensively rather than offesively...im not hunting...yet.
Thanks |
Substantia Nigra
NFI industrial
720
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Posted - 2012.05.01 00:43:00 -
[2] - Quote
The purpose of DS-spamming is to (hopefully) see something troubling before it actually causes you trouble.
To do this you usually want maximal range and 360 degrees, although in specific circumstances I will use shorter ranges. You also need to make sure you are using the right settings for the purpose GÇô either an appropriate overview setting or the default setting that sees everything. You must have it set to see all ships and scanner probes in the very least.
Then itGÇÖs just a matter of doing it often enough GǪ and we virtually never actually do it often enough.
We can build and sell pretty much every ship. Check my bio for details. Our pirate epic arc completion packages really are very good: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=12973&find=unread |
Ascenntion
Flames of Prometheus
0
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Posted - 2012.05.01 00:46:00 -
[3] - Quote
Right on,
Thanks for the quick reply. Fly safe. |
Klarion Sythis
Bite Me inc Exhale.
10
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Posted - 2012.05.01 01:13:00 -
[4] - Quote
Also, depending on how familiar you are with D-Scan in general, you can always check out Agony's video about it. It's good, if you have the patience for it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WydGHvTH7NA&feature=player_embedded |
discordigant
Doomheim
34
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Posted - 2012.05.01 01:58:00 -
[5] - Quote
It needs to be a Hot key, IMO but i am lazy like that. |
Nathan Jameson
Talocan Dominion Talocan United
388
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Posted - 2012.05.01 04:57:00 -
[6] - Quote
Confirming D-Scan won't help you one bit against attackers that know what they're doing.
D-Scan won't warn you of the Cloaky Loki that just appeared next to you and scrammed you, for the fleet in the next system over. |
Marsan
Production N Destruction INC.
29
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Posted - 2012.05.01 05:04:00 -
[7] - Quote
The only reason to not do 360 is when you are attempting to find some without probes or narrow down where they are so your probes are only out for a few seconds. Rember dscan is in a cone.... |
Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings Situation: Normal
202
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Posted - 2012.05.01 05:19:00 -
[8] - Quote
Nathan Jameson wrote:Confirming D-Scan won't help you one bit against attackers that know what they're doing.
D-Scan won't warn you of the Cloaky Loki that just appeared next to you and scrammed you, for the fleet in the next system over.
QFT
This is where the cloaky scout (s) come into play. |
Nathan Jameson
Talocan Dominion Talocan United
388
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Posted - 2012.05.01 06:07:00 -
[9] - Quote
Derath Ellecon wrote:Nathan Jameson wrote:Confirming D-Scan won't help you one bit against attackers that know what they're doing.
D-Scan won't warn you of the Cloaky Loki that just appeared next to you and scrammed you, for the fleet in the next system over. QFT This is where the cloaky scout (s) come into play.
SsshhhHHHHHhhhHHHH!!!
You're scaring the fish! |
Svodola Darkfury
Born-2-Kill Northern Coalition.
28
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Posted - 2012.05.01 06:28:00 -
[10] - Quote
Nathan Jameson wrote:Confirming D-Scan won't help you one bit against attackers that know what they're doing.
D-Scan won't warn you of the Cloaky Loki that just appeared next to you and scrammed you, for the fleet in the next system over.
In a small enough system that Loki has to come in from somewhere. Either logging in or coming in from a Wormhole. Unless you've been camping there the whole day waiting for somebody to come in, chances are they can catch you before you cloak if they spam enough.
Been saved many a time by catching buzzards who just popped into the system as scouts who appeared for under 5 seconds on d-scan.
Not to mention I've been saved by jamming out a Loki with EC-300s and then warping off to a safe.
Not all is hopeless :)
Svo. |
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Bernie Nator
Talocan Hive Talocan United
277
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Posted - 2012.05.01 07:14:00 -
[11] - Quote
Remember, there are few defences against a competent cloaky pilot. It takes less than a second to move and cloak, and about ten to twelve seconds for a really good scanner to probe you down. Maybe 30 if hes having a crap day. that's all it takes to ruin someone's day, especially if their fleet lands on you and bubbles up. |
Mr Bigwinky
4U Services Inc. Talocan United
227
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Posted - 2012.05.01 07:20:00 -
[12] - Quote
Bernie Nator wrote:Remember, there are few defences against a competent cloaky pilot. It takes less than a second to move and cloak, and about ten to twelve seconds for a really good scanner to probe you down. Maybe 30 if hes having a crap day. that's all it takes to ruin someone's day, especially if their fleet lands on you and bubbles up. Hehe, it takes you that long? I'll have to show you how it's done Welcome to EVE online, here's your rubix cube, go F*** yourself GÖÑ |
Bernie Nator
Talocan Hive Talocan United
277
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Posted - 2012.05.01 07:28:00 -
[13] - Quote
Mr Bigwinky wrote:Bernie Nator wrote:Remember, there are few defences against a competent cloaky pilot. It takes less than a second to move and cloak, and about ten to twelve seconds for a really good scanner to probe you down. Maybe 30 if hes having a crap day. that's all it takes to ruin someone's day, especially if their fleet lands on you and bubbles up. Hehe, it takes you that long? I'll have to show you how it's done Isn't that the plan for some upcoming day?
HOP ON ZE PIG. |
Lexylia
1ST GERMAN POPPLERS CORPORATION
5
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Posted - 2012.05.01 08:17:00 -
[14] - Quote
Nathan Jameson wrote:Derath Ellecon wrote:Nathan Jameson wrote:Confirming D-Scan won't help you one bit against attackers that know what they're doing.
D-Scan won't warn you of the Cloaky Loki that just appeared next to you and scrammed you, for the fleet in the next system over. QFT This is where the cloaky scout (s) come into play. SsshhhHHHHHhhhHHHH!!! You're scaring the fish!
+1 for that,
i love this forum even its young its gonna be my new fav. :D So many good jokes here, and only small flame :) |
Halin Damal
The Night Crew The Night Crew Alliance
7
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Posted - 2012.05.01 15:36:00 -
[15] - Quote
If it is a big system (+200 AU diameter) things may get tough and risky since your d-scan only covers a radius of ~14.4 AU. You may never see that cloaky hunter come in to the system (via a recently spawned K162 or an opened static), unless you got all the WH's covered with a scout. Even then you still need to be aware of the chance that each second a new K162 may spawn letting new neutrals get in :) |
Scoto Timta
EveMerc's
10
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Posted - 2012.05.01 16:38:00 -
[16] - Quote
Bernie Nator wrote: It takes less than a second to move and cloak. Just to be picky... You are correct that it only takes a second for us to move and activate the cloak mod, but it takes longer than that to actually disappear from overview/scan. Try it sometime with a corpmate/alt watching.
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SojournerRover
Insidious Design
11
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Posted - 2012.05.01 18:57:00 -
[17] - Quote
. ROVER (REDRUM)
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Substantia Nigra
NFI industrial
720
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Posted - 2012.05.01 21:26:00 -
[18] - Quote
Scoto Timta wrote:Bernie Nator wrote: It takes less than a second to move and cloak. Just to be picky... You are correct that it only takes a second for us to move and activate the cloak mod, but it takes longer than that to actually disappear from overview/scan. Try it sometime with a corpmate/alt watching.
Hmmm, I donGÇÖt know the technical details but from my experience it seems that cloaking has a couple of phases.
Firstly, when you click the module or hit the hot-key, the button immediately starts its oscillating green border glow business. You do not became invisible to someone on-grid, or watching via probes / DS, for some seconds GǪ and it seems like forever if youGÇÖre surrounded by evil-doers at a gate or WH camp. You do, however, seem to become unlockable and unalignable much earlier than you become invisible. I donGÇÖt know if this is how itGÇÖs meant to work, or perhaps just a manifestation of a difference between graphics update rates and other update rates GǪ but it seems to me that you are effectively cloaked quite a bit before you are actually invisible.
My observation is based on my experience sneaking thru lots of camps, and some hisec tests I ran a long time ago before I ventured into null / w-space.
Is this how others see it, or am I missing something important here?
We can build and sell pretty much every ship. Check my bio for details. Our pirate epic arc completion packages really are very good: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=12973&find=unread |
Bibosikus
Universal Moose Federation Moose Alliance
111
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Posted - 2012.05.02 16:58:00 -
[19] - Quote
1) Cloaked scouts on all entrances/exits 2) Deep Space Probe out with all current signatures set to "ignore", rescanning constantly for ships & new sigs 3) D-Scan often
Not 100% safe, but about as good as you can get The box said "Requires Windows-á2000 or better", so I installed Linux. |
Scoto Timta
EveMerc's
10
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Posted - 2012.05.02 20:14:00 -
[20] - Quote
Substantia Nigra wrote:... Firstly, when you click the module or hit the hot-key, the button immediately starts its oscillating green border glow business. You do not became invisible to someone on-grid, or watching via probes / DS, for some seconds GǪ and it seems like forever if youGÇÖre surrounded by evil-doers at a gate or WH camp. You do, however, seem to become unlockable and unalignable much earlier than you become invisible. ... Is this how others see it, or am I missing something important here? I agree with you. Had several times when I *should* have been able to target that visible ship before he cloaked, but I could not - even though my theoretical lock time was well under the amount of time before he disappeared. So I believe you are correct about invulnerability.
My point (and you agreed) was that you are visible on both d-scan and overview for more than that second or 2 before the cloak "engages". Haven't tested the d-scan as much as just seeing my own alt on overview for several seconds AFTER the cloak is supposedly engaged, but it seemed to hold true when I did. So just because you engage your cloak and the green glow starts right away, don't think you are invisible yet, which is what I was responding to. |
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Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings Situation: Normal
202
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Posted - 2012.05.02 20:27:00 -
[21] - Quote
Bibosikus wrote:1) Cloaked scouts on all entrances/exits 2) Deep Space Probe out with all current signatures set to "ignore", rescanning constantly for ships & new sigs 3) D-Scan often
Not 100% safe, but about as good as you can get
This has kept me pretty safe while getting my PVE on. The only thing I add is time. Often if I log in for the first time and I'm unsure of the WH security I will sit cloaked on the entrances with probes out for awhile and just observe. WH hunters seem much more patient than say lS pirates. But even they get bored after awhile and will leave.
I have the advantage of working from home so I often can do this and just watch the system for a long time while working to make sure it is going to be safe. |
Nathan Jameson
Talocan Dominion Talocan United
388
|
Posted - 2012.05.03 03:57:00 -
[22] - Quote
Derath Ellecon wrote:I have the advantage of working from home so I often can do this and just watch the system for a long time while working to make sure it is going to be safe.
Here's another tip. Stick your pilot in an Orca and AFK him in your POS shields all day while you go to work. It'll make stalkers go batty. |
Substantia Nigra
NFI industrial
720
|
Posted - 2012.05.03 04:22:00 -
[23] - Quote
Nathan Jameson wrote: Here's another tip. Stick your pilot in an Orca and AFK him in your POS shields all day while you go to work. It'll make stalkers go batty.
LOL, ya. As a w-space stalker hunter GǪ and a pretty patient one to boot GǪ I can confirm this. Even worse was last nightGÇÖs C3 where they had a noctis and machariel, manned but AFK (I assume), sitting in their POS for ages.
IGÇÖd setup my bombers to try take down a mach and was sitting under that POS for hours waiting for him to warp to an anom or sig GǪ all of which I had previously scanned. The evil beggar never did!! Hmphhh! Downtime came and I logged, mightily pGÇÖd-off.
We can build and sell pretty much every ship. Check my bio for details. Our pirate epic arc completion packages really are very good: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=12973&find=unread |
Terrorfrodo
Deep Space Darwinian Law Enforcement Agency
65
|
Posted - 2012.05.04 10:49:00 -
[24] - Quote
Mr Bigwinky wrote:Bernie Nator wrote:Remember, there are few defences against a competent cloaky pilot. It takes less than a second to move and cloak, and about ten to twelve seconds for a really good scanner to probe you down. Maybe 30 if hes having a crap day. that's all it takes to ruin someone's day, especially if their fleet lands on you and bubbles up. Hehe, it takes you that long? I'll have to show you how it's done That's a little exaggerated, no?
The scanning itself takes 5 seconds with perfect skills. In a large enough system you can start the probes somewhere out of scan range from the victim, but even then they are visible for additional 2-3 seconds while warping to position before they actually start the scanning. If you manage to get the target to 100% in one go, you can immediately recall the probes GÇô but they'll be visible for another few seconds.
So there is no way to scan someone with probes and not give him at least ten seconds where he can see the probes. If the system is too small to get out of range to drop probes, he has virtually forever to see you. Winner of elections banned, runner-up demoted by rest of the body, the council controlled by the losers. CSM 7 is illegitimate, CCP should remember when dealing with them. Remember what players voted for. |
Nathan Jameson
Talocan Dominion Talocan United
388
|
Posted - 2012.05.04 10:53:00 -
[25] - Quote
Terrorfrodo wrote:If the system is too small to get out of range to drop probes, he has virtually forever to see you.
People who are running sites aren't committing 100% of their attention to hitting the D-Scan.
And that's only concerning signatures like Mags and Radars. Anomalies don't require probes at all for me to find you. |
Terrorfrodo
Deep Space Darwinian Law Enforcement Agency
65
|
Posted - 2012.05.04 10:57:00 -
[26] - Quote
Right, I didn't dispute that. Luckily most people prefer anomalies. Including myself, sig sites are usually not worth the extra effort they require.
I hardly ever use combat probes while hunting. Sometimes for miners, but ideally I have seen the refining array in their POS and bookmarked the arkonor roid in their belt before they even logged on Winner of elections banned, runner-up demoted by rest of the body, the council controlled by the losers. CSM 7 is illegitimate, CCP should remember when dealing with them. Remember what players voted for. |
Nathan Jameson
Talocan Dominion Talocan United
388
|
Posted - 2012.05.04 11:01:00 -
[27] - Quote
Terrorfrodo wrote:ideally I have seen the refining array in their POS and bookmarked the arkonor roid in their belt before they even logged on
And they always wonder how they missed the probes. |
Mr Bigwinky
4U Services Inc. Talocan United
227
|
Posted - 2012.05.04 11:02:00 -
[28] - Quote
Terrorfrodo wrote:Mr Bigwinky wrote:Bernie Nator wrote:Remember, there are few defences against a competent cloaky pilot. It takes less than a second to move and cloak, and about ten to twelve seconds for a really good scanner to probe you down. Maybe 30 if hes having a crap day. that's all it takes to ruin someone's day, especially if their fleet lands on you and bubbles up. Hehe, it takes you that long? I'll have to show you how it's done That's a little exaggerated, no? Yes, completely.
If I did have any skill or technique that made me better than this time however, I would surely divulge it. I apologise for the exaggeration. Welcome to EVE online, here's your rubix cube, go F*** yourself GÖÑ |
Mr Bigwinky
4U Services Inc. Talocan United
227
|
Posted - 2012.05.04 11:08:00 -
[29] - Quote
Terrorfrodo wrote:I hardly ever use combat probes while hunting. Sometimes for miners, but ideally I have seen the refining array in their POS and bookmarked the arkonor roid in their belt before they even logged on This is a good way of catching them but I have since got bored of putting in that kind of effort.
One thing I used to do (with a friend or 2) was create a bookmark off of their POS in the direction of the site they were mining in / plexing in. 1. Wait for them to enter the site 2. Warp an interdictor to the bookmark and cloak 3. Warp bombers to optimal of where they would land 4. SCARE THEM OUT OF THE SITE 5. *hard part* uncloak someone on them in their site and bubble up at the same time (if they hit warp before bubble is up, they will go right through it) 6. Murder them outside their POS 7. Lololololol Welcome to EVE online, here's your rubix cube, go F*** yourself GÖÑ |
Terrorfrodo
Deep Space Darwinian Law Enforcement Agency
65
|
Posted - 2012.05.04 11:25:00 -
[30] - Quote
I have considered trying this several times, but didn't follow through for fear of failing miserably and die to the POS *g*
Instead of a dictor one could also use a T2 small bubble, takes only 60 seconds to anchor and you don't have to warp visibly to the tower. And you save one pilot. Unless you have a lot of firepower and can alpha the victim then warp away, the problem will be to get away from the POS. But I guess you could dodge its guns with small fast ships if it has only mediums or large. Winner of elections banned, runner-up demoted by rest of the body, the council controlled by the losers. CSM 7 is illegitimate, CCP should remember when dealing with them. Remember what players voted for. |
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