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VoiceInTheDesert
Zebra Corp Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2009.04.10 22:49:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Prometheus Exenthal TBH, they are fine for the most part (ashimuu/cruor are really terrible) and really need to be rescaled cost wise. If Daredevils were to cost 15-20mil I wouldn't complain
They really aren't. As you stated, the Ash and Cru are broken beyond reason (mostly a lack of grid).
The Cynabal is just a fancy cross between Stabber and Ruppy and does neither role terribly well.
The Sansha ships are fine.
Machariel is terrible now that its speed is not a viable advantage.
Vigilant is more useless than a deimos at nearly twice the cost.
Worm and Gila are terrible.
It's really a shame, cause I think these ships should be used by those with a flair for something different or just those who have some extra money lying around. They could be adding some spice and variety to pvp, but they end up just collecting dust in my hangar.
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Prometheus Exenthal
Heretic Army
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Posted - 2009.04.10 22:53:00 -
[32]
Edited by: Prometheus Exenthal on 10/04/2009 22:53:09 I'm talking about the frigates, not cruisers/bs'
What part of faction implies better? They are all on par with their racial t1 frigates(except Succubus which exceeds and Cruor which fails).
The Empire faction frigs (Coment/Firetail/Slicer/Hookbill) are all progressive improvements on what they're based on. Their cost is not proportional to their improvements.
Sure the bonuses can be a bit wonky (Dramiel), but that doesn't make them bad. With that said, the Cruor is the only one that truly needs a makeover. Hell, simply adding another mid and a neut range bonus would work well for it. - MY LATEST VIDEO - BATTLE CRUISE |
Roemy Schneider
BINFORD
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Posted - 2009.04.11 01:11:00 -
[33]
well... we're all spoiled by lasers. in the grand scheme of balancing, lasers are supposed to get their cap reduction, hybrids the 25% bonus and minnies have to rely on two 25% bonuses (usually dmg and rof). amarr get an extra turret, gallente (quite) some drones and matari... a missile or two/some tool slots
this rule of thumb is somewhat ancient but it still basis of our weapon systems.
split weapons only work on the phoon because of its drones and a very focused slot layout. none of the faction frigs can say that about themselves - nor the fleet scythe -.-
but when it comes to sanshas, they're actually overpowered. but we don't mind the virtual 10 turrets due to the price. we do mind the 8.333 vTurret-zealot though -.- this thing needs to hand in its 5th turret, the damage or the rof bonus - and why does it have the power grid to actually support this MCA..? i'm willing to grant 15m¦ drones in return ^^ - putting the gist back into logistics |
Kunming
T.H.U.G L.I.F.E White Core
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Posted - 2009.04.11 09:41:00 -
[34]
Sansha ship designline was actually my suggestion for Khanid ships but the devs used it otherwise.
The faction ships shall take the best of both races and not just become a mix of it. Split weapons are a no go unless there is a really good reason behind it.
Lets take the vigilant fex. its no different than any other blasterboat. Its skill indicates its a mix of minmatar and gallente, so "whats the best thing minmatar can do?" guerilla/speed/shields, "what about gallente?" DMG/armor. Now to put something new on the table the vigilant can be made a shield tanking blasterboat!
- Quantum Rise... nerfing the unnerfable! Sponsored by CCP |
Raimo
Gallente Wrath of Fenris
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Posted - 2009.04.11 14:55:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Kunming Sansha ship designline was actually my suggestion for Khanid ships but the devs used it otherwise.
The faction ships shall take the best of both races and not just become a mix of it. Split weapons are a no go unless there is a really good reason behind it.
Lets take the vigilant fex. its no different than any other blasterboat. Its skill indicates its a mix of minmatar and gallente, so "whats the best thing minmatar can do?" guerilla/speed/shields, "what about gallente?" DMG/armor. Now to put something new on the table the vigilant can be made a shield tanking blasterboat!
Oh my god that would be awesome. ---
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Alicia Ryan
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Posted - 2009.04.12 23:38:00 -
[36]
sounds like a really good idea, but maybe for the angel ships... give them some speed, and the machariel atleast one more medslot, so it can be a big vaga, would be really nice to see nano machs again and it would give it a role.
vindi and serpentis ships, best short range dmg and nice active tanks, maybe remove the drone bay, cause of their heavy armor.
gurista ships, hybrid boats with nice active/passive shield tanks.
bloods, maybe give them a smartie/web/neut bonus, range/dmg.
just some new idea's
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Alicia Ryan
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Posted - 2009.04.16 02:13:00 -
[37]
anyone else, think the factionships are ok, as they are right now??
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Blane Xero
Amarr The Firestorm Cartel
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Posted - 2009.04.16 02:35:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Roemy Schneider well... we're all spoiled by lasers. in the grand scheme of balancing, lasers are supposed to get their cap reduction, hybrids the 25% bonus and minnies have to rely on two 25% bonuses (usually dmg and rof). amarr get an extra turret, gallente (quite) some drones and matari... a missile or two/some tool slots
this rule of thumb is somewhat ancient but it still basis of our weapon systems.
split weapons only work on the phoon because of its drones and a very focused slot layout. none of the faction frigs can say that about themselves - nor the fleet scythe -.-
but when it comes to sanshas, they're actually overpowered. but we don't mind the virtual 10 turrets due to the price. we do mind the 8.333 vTurret-zealot though -.- this thing needs to hand in its 5th turret, the damage or the rof bonus - and why does it have the power grid to actually support this MCA..? i'm willing to grant 15m¦ drones in return ^^
Oh come on. It wasn't so long ago it just GOT that fifth turret point. Its no more overpowered than the geddon. ______________________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008
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Omara Otawan
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Posted - 2009.04.16 04:13:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Miyamoto Isoruku Gila is in serious need of a boost. Seriously, for what they cost pirate faction ships ought to compete with or outperform T2.
Huh? Ever heard of the concept of supply & demand?
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Roemy Schneider
BINFORD
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Posted - 2009.04.16 04:43:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Blane Xero
Originally by: Roemy Schneider well... we're all spoiled by lasers. in the grand scheme of balancing, lasers are supposed to get their cap reduction, hybrids the 25% bonus and minnies have to rely on two 25% bonuses (usually dmg and rof). amarr get an extra turret, gallente (quite) some drones and matari... a missile or two/some tool slots
this rule of thumb is somewhat ancient but it still basis of our weapon systems.
split weapons only work on the phoon because of its drones and a very focused slot layout. none of the faction frigs can say that about themselves - nor the fleet scythe -.-
but when it comes to sanshas, they're actually overpowered. but we don't mind the virtual 10 turrets due to the price. we do mind the 8.333 vTurret-zealot though -.- this thing needs to hand in its 5th turret, the damage or the rof bonus - and why does it have the power grid to actually support this MCA..? i'm willing to grant 15m¦ drones in return ^^
Oh come on. It wasn't so long ago it just GOT that fifth turret point. Its no more overpowered than the geddon.
ah but the geddon doesnt have the cap bonus. so one may indeed have the _option_ of fitting 8 turrets but one doesnt get very far. i dont mind the 5 turrets per se; vaga cant (really) go all 425mm, nor would i recommend a neutron deimos. a full 720mm muninn may be possible, but it's arties (yes i do understand the difference between expl/kin and em/therm)... and 425mm rails aren't much better; but a heavy pulse or heavy beam zealot is a given - one with a proper active tank and the other with enough speed to make anything except vaga or scimitar cry - while being smaller than those extended buggers. or have you seen a "focused" zealot lately? - putting the gist back into logistics |
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Xelios
Minmatar Broski Enterprises Avarice.
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Posted - 2009.04.16 09:27:00 -
[41]
The sansha ships are the only ones I'd feel comfortable using in PVP, most of the rest are sub par in just about every way possible. Take the Daredevil for instance, 2 bonuses to hybrid turrets but a 2/2 split on turret and missile slots. The thing puts out half the DPS of a Taranis and is at least 1 km/s slower to boot. What's the point?
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Alicia Ryan
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Posted - 2009.04.16 14:37:00 -
[42]
frigs:
daredevil: -2 launcher slots +2 turrent slots
worm: -2 turrent +2 launcher
cruor: change the special bonus to a 50% range bonus of webber, neut/nos
dramiel: -3 launcher +3 turrent, really crap as it is now...
gallente navy comet -2 launcher +2 turrent
cal. navy hookbill -2 launcher +2 turrent
amarr navy slicer +1 turrent
cruiser:
augoror navy issue +10 drone bandwith
omen navy issue fine, maybe change the drone bandwith, for one turrent slot
osprey navy issue useles ship... need complete new roles, maybe as a logisitc ship
caracal navy issue fine as it is
exequeror navy issue same as osprey
vexor navy issue +25 drone bandwith -2 turrent
scythe fleet issue same as exequeror and osprey
fleet stabber nice as it is :)
cynabal -2 launcher +2 turrent +30 base speed
ashimmu -50% reduction bonus +50% range for webs neuts/nos
gila -50% missle bonus +50% turrent range +7.5% dmg to railguns
phantasm nice ship
vigilant remove the 25% mwd bonus 7.5% bonus to armor repair and instead of 25% dmg to med hybrid 50% dmg bonus
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Alicia Ryan
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Posted - 2009.04.16 14:45:00 -
[43]
BS:
Apoc Navy Issue +1 low slot
CNR really nice ship :)
Megathron Navy issue nice ship, maybe add a turrent slot, but then u have fitting issues, so not much will change
tempest fleet issue -1 med slot +2 low slots
machariel +150 base speed
bhaalgorn change the 50% reduction skill to 50% neut/nos range and the webber bonus to 25% per lvl
rattle to be inline with the other guri ships it should have also a rail bonus, but maybe conisder it to be a torp boat with great range
nightmare really nice bs :)
Vindicator remove mwd bonus 7.5% rep bonus per lvl instead of 25% dmg binus 50% to large hybrid.
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Alicia Ryan
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Posted - 2009.04.30 01:28:00 -
[44]
rattle: a hybrid bonus and a 10% shield bonus, as the old scorpion had
and for the bhaal maybe a web strength bonus + smartie range bonus
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