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Rico Minali
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
623
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:31:00 -
[241] - Quote
Sigurd Sig Hansen wrote:Rico Minali wrote:I play in Hisec and Nullsec.
I have ice miners in nullsec and the risk of losing a whole fleet by missing even a few seconds of intel is huge. The same with hauling anything around. You think smartbombing BSs are bad with their 5km range? 4 or 5 stealth bombers can murder an entire fleet in one bombing run even if your fleet is spread out.
In nullsec you pay bilions of isk for your services, upgrades and so on, your intel is player run, your safety is in teh hands of your freinds.
I have a Mack/Hulk pilot in Hisec I mine afk alot, I fly around alot, I haul stuff alot adn I have never once lost a ship in hundreds and hundreds of hours hisec mining and hauling.
In hisec I dont pay anything for any upgrades, I dont need intel, i dont need scouts, i dont need roaming home defence fleets, I dont even need to be at my keyboard.
Dont assume that just because people play their main game in nullsec that they dont also play in hisec too. It makes you look stupid.
um.... try it in highsec during hulkageddon then feel re-re when you lose it. Stop being the good little Goon BB er BFF DarthNefarius wrote:Protest thru unsubbing then Meant as a troll I know but amazingly good idea as the summer of QQ told us.
I just dont mine during hulkageddon, because that would be stupid. It isnt hard. Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing. |
Thomas Kreshant
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
41
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:32:00 -
[242] - Quote
Got nothing to do with trust, we pretty much just don't like each other. |
Doctor Ungabungas
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
102
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:32:00 -
[243] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:Andski wrote:Oh, so these RMTers are naturally associated with alliances, because Because null sec is where all of the best digital money is at. It is the most effective way to turn massive quantities of game ISK to real life money.
So all of the people with the 'best digital money' at their fingertips need to run bot empires in high sec for 5 million isk an hour.
Now the story has legs.
And it's walking right out the door. |
Eternum Praetorian
Malum Crusis
765
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:34:00 -
[244] - Quote
Doctor Ungabungas wrote: PS: There is still no reason why you would relocate your 0.0 mining empire to high sec to mine veldspar, there is plenty in 0.0.
Yes there is, and the reason has been repeatedly stated. You want your AFK moon minerals, and you want your AFK mining fleet that can mine unimpeded and without interruption. If you did so in null, your enemies would park AFK cloaking black ops ships in your systems and prevent your baby titans being born before your towers were even impregnated with sperm.
Your player member base does not want to exert nor the time nor the effort involved in protecting a long term mining operation. So doing so in empire is far more economical in terms of time vs ease vs yield.
See? I know all of your secrets.
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Mashie Saldana
Veto. Veto Corp
500
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:35:00 -
[245] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Speaking of botters... Now that CCP is kicking botters out, why is this not creating more trust in the remaining players that they are not botters? It is probably because there is no real cure for paranoia or something. Those who have not been identified as botters are probably just really very tricky botters and hard to identify. Mining barges can drop decent loot which is a good reason as any to suicide them. Dominique Vasilkovsky Mashie Saldana Monica Foulkes |
Doctor Ungabungas
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
102
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:35:00 -
[246] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:Doctor Ungabungas wrote: PS: There is still no reason why you would relocate your 0.0 mining empire to high sec to mine veldspar, there is plenty in 0.0.
Yes there is, and the reason has been repeatedly stated. You want your AFK moon minerals, and you want your AFK mining fleet that can mine unimpeded and without interruption. If you did so in null, your enemies would park AFK cloaking black ops ships in your systems and prevent your baby titans being born before your towers were even impregnated with sperm.
So this cloaking dude doesn't stop us mining high ends, but is someone able to stop us mining veldspar.
Man, he's good. He's real good. |
Eternum Praetorian
Malum Crusis
765
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:36:00 -
[247] - Quote
Doctor Ungabungas wrote:So all of the people with the 'best digital money' at their fingertips need to run bot empires in high sec for 5 million isk an hour.
No, the question was what do RMT'ers and alliances have in common. That was the answer to that question and that question only, not your invented insinuation.
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Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4076
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:36:00 -
[248] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:Doctor Ungabungas wrote: PS: There is still no reason why you would relocate your 0.0 mining empire to high sec to mine veldspar, there is plenty in 0.0.
Yes there is, and the reason has been repeatedly stated. You want your AFK moon minerals, and you want your AFK mining fleet that can mine unimpeded and without interruption. If you did so in null, your enemies would park AFK cloaking black ops ships in your systems and prevent your baby titans being born before your towers were even impregnated with sperm. Your player member base does not want to exert nor the time nor the effort involved in protecting a long term mining operation. So doing so in empire is far more economical in terms of time vs ease vs yield. See? I know all of your secrets.
let's see, OUR guys are not inclined to defend miners but our enemies are inclined to park cloaked ships in literally every single one of our sov systems to disrupt them
interesting "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Eternum Praetorian
Malum Crusis
766
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:37:00 -
[249] - Quote
Doctor Ungabungas wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:Doctor Ungabungas wrote: PS: There is still no reason why you would relocate your 0.0 mining empire to high sec to mine veldspar, there is plenty in 0.0.
Yes there is, and the reason has been repeatedly stated. You want your AFK moon minerals, and you want your AFK mining fleet that can mine unimpeded and without interruption. If you did so in null, your enemies would park AFK cloaking black ops ships in your systems and prevent your baby titans being born before your towers were even impregnated with sperm. So this cloaking dude doesn't stop us mining high ends, but is someone able to stop us mining veldspar. Man, he's good. He's real good.
Sense, your post makes none.
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Eternum Praetorian
Malum Crusis
766
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:38:00 -
[250] - Quote
Andski wrote:
let's see, OUR guys are not inclined to defend miners but our enemies are inclined to park cloaked ships in literally every single one of our sov systems to disrupt them
interesting
No, their black ops alt Cyno toons. I have 3. They play on their mains while they wait for your hulks to leave the pos shield. It req no effort or patience on their part, being that it is just an alt.
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Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4076
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:39:00 -
[251] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:Andski wrote:
let's see, OUR guys are not inclined to defend miners but our enemies are inclined to park cloaked ships in literally every single one of our sov systems to disrupt them
interesting
No, their black ops alt Cyno toons. I have 3. They play on their mains while they wait for your hulks to leave the pos shield.
yeah because a blackops BS has the range to bridge a gang anywhere in our space "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Whitehound
249
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:39:00 -
[252] - Quote
Mashie Saldana wrote:Whitehound wrote:Speaking of botters... Now that CCP is kicking botters out, why is this not creating more trust in the remaining players that they are not botters? It is probably because there is no real cure for paranoia or something. Those who have not been identified as botters are probably just really very tricky botters and hard to identify. Mining barges can drop decent loot which is a good reason as any to suicide them. What do you do with all those strip miners?
No more crappy expansions!-á-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired." - CEO Hilmar-á-á No more crappy layoffs! |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4076
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:40:00 -
[253] - Quote
Andski wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:Andski wrote:
let's see, OUR guys are not inclined to defend miners but our enemies are inclined to park cloaked ships in literally every single one of our sov systems to disrupt them
interesting
No, their black ops alt Cyno toons. I have 3. They play on their mains while they wait for your hulks to leave the pos shield. yeah because a blackops BS has the range to bridge a gang anywhere in our space
also "playing on my main while waiting for hulks to leave POS shields" while having a "black ops alt cyno toon" (what the ****) parked in a system implies that my main is sitting on a titan or blackops BS
what I'm saying is that you should stop trying to provide your "insights" because you've never left your hisec veldspar belt "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Eternum Praetorian
Malum Crusis
766
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:41:00 -
[254] - Quote
Andski wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:Andski wrote:
let's see, OUR guys are not inclined to defend miners but our enemies are inclined to park cloaked ships in literally every single one of our sov systems to disrupt them
interesting
No, their black ops alt Cyno toons. I have 3. They play on their mains while they wait for your hulks to leave the pos shield. yeah because a blackops BS has the range to bridge a gang anywhere in our space
I have one black ops toon, 2 black ops cov cyno alts and one transportship character. You seem to know nothing about Black ops.
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Doctor Ungabungas
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
104
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:42:00 -
[255] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:Andski wrote:
let's see, OUR guys are not inclined to defend miners but our enemies are inclined to park cloaked ships in literally every single one of our sov systems to disrupt them
interesting
No, their black ops alt Cyno toons. I have 3. They play on their mains while they wait for your hulks to leave the pos shield. It req no effort or patience on their part, being that it is just an alt.
Ok, so move to another system? Veldspar is in literally every system of the game. If you have a few hulks and a rorqual you can mine in a different system every day if you so choose. |
Eternum Praetorian
Malum Crusis
766
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:43:00 -
[256] - Quote
Doctor Ungabungas wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:Andski wrote:
let's see, OUR guys are not inclined to defend miners but our enemies are inclined to park cloaked ships in literally every single one of our sov systems to disrupt them
interesting
No, their black ops alt Cyno toons. I have 3. They play on their mains while they wait for your hulks to leave the pos shield. It req no effort or patience on their part, being that it is just an alt. Ok, so move to another system? Veldspar is in literally every system of the game. If you have a few hulks and a rorqual you can mine in a different system every day if you so choose.
Let me divine an ingenious counter strategy,. Hmmm.... the covert ops ship moves to!!
Whew, its like fighting Sun Tzu.
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Doctor Ungabungas
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
104
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:43:00 -
[257] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Mashie Saldana wrote:Whitehound wrote:Speaking of botters... Now that CCP is kicking botters out, why is this not creating more trust in the remaining players that they are not botters? It is probably because there is no real cure for paranoia or something. Those who have not been identified as botters are probably just really very tricky botters and hard to identify. Mining barges can drop decent loot which is a good reason as any to suicide them. What do you do with all those strip miners?
We refine them to get veldspar so we can build our supercarriers. We don't have veldspar in 0.0 so we are scrambling madly for any we can get. |
Eternum Praetorian
Malum Crusis
766
|
Posted - 2012.05.06 14:44:00 -
[258] - Quote
Doctor Ungabungas wrote:Whitehound wrote:Mashie Saldana wrote:Whitehound wrote:Speaking of botters... Now that CCP is kicking botters out, why is this not creating more trust in the remaining players that they are not botters? It is probably because there is no real cure for paranoia or something. Those who have not been identified as botters are probably just really very tricky botters and hard to identify. Mining barges can drop decent loot which is a good reason as any to suicide them. What do you do with all those strip miners? We refine them to get veldspar so we can build our supercarriers. We don't have veldspar in 0.0 so we are scrambling madly for any we can get.
I never said that. Read the part about how the empire mining of low ends is more economical in terms of time vs ease vs reward, probie.
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Darth Tickles
Dark Sun Consortium
304
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:44:00 -
[259] - Quote
Veldgate. |
Doctor Ungabungas
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
104
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:45:00 -
[260] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:Doctor Ungabungas wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:Andski wrote:
let's see, OUR guys are not inclined to defend miners but our enemies are inclined to park cloaked ships in literally every single one of our sov systems to disrupt them
interesting
No, their black ops alt Cyno toons. I have 3. They play on their mains while they wait for your hulks to leave the pos shield. It req no effort or patience on their part, being that it is just an alt. Ok, so move to another system? Veldspar is in literally every system of the game. If you have a few hulks and a rorqual you can mine in a different system every day if you so choose. Let me divine an ingenious counter strategy,. Hmmm.... the covert ops ship moves to!! Whew, its like fighting Sun Tzu.
Ok, so you schlep it all the way over the other side of deklein to grief me. Then I use our cyno beacon network to jump back to where I was before. Total downtime: about 3 minutes.
[Better solution: Fit a cyno mod on one of the hulks, destroy your blackops BS and refine the mods into minerals.] |
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Whitehound
249
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:47:00 -
[261] - Quote
Doctor Ungabungas wrote:Whitehound wrote:Mashie Saldana wrote:Whitehound wrote:Speaking of botters... Now that CCP is kicking botters out, why is this not creating more trust in the remaining players that they are not botters? It is probably because there is no real cure for paranoia or something. Those who have not been identified as botters are probably just really very tricky botters and hard to identify. Mining barges can drop decent loot which is a good reason as any to suicide them. What do you do with all those strip miners? We refine them to get veldspar so we can build our supercarriers. We don't have veldspar in 0.0 so we are scrambling madly for any we can get. Do Goons have super carriers? I thought most of you were all fapping on some awful Facebook clone of a website.
No more crappy expansions!-á-á Raise A Little Hell"20 percent of CCP staff fired." - CEO Hilmar-á-á No more crappy layoffs! |
Doctor Ungabungas
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
104
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:49:00 -
[262] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:Doctor Ungabungas wrote:Whitehound wrote:Mashie Saldana wrote:Whitehound wrote:Speaking of botters... Now that CCP is kicking botters out, why is this not creating more trust in the remaining players that they are not botters? It is probably because there is no real cure for paranoia or something. Those who have not been identified as botters are probably just really very tricky botters and hard to identify. Mining barges can drop decent loot which is a good reason as any to suicide them. What do you do with all those strip miners? We refine them to get veldspar so we can build our supercarriers. We don't have veldspar in 0.0 so we are scrambling madly for any we can get. I never said that. Read the part about how the empire mining of low ends is more economical in terms of time vs ease vs reward, probie.
It's not any harder than mining the high ends though. And I wouldn't have to worry about hulkageddon. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4076
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:50:00 -
[263] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:I have one black ops toon, 2 black ops cov cyno alts and one transportship character. You seem to know nothing about Black ops.
for one, you probably don't even have JDC V on your blackops character, and even if you did, your jump range is absolutely horrendous so you're far from being a threat to every miner in an entire region
please keep trying to "educate" me regarding things I have a lot more experience than you in "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Eternum Praetorian
Malum Crusis
766
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:51:00 -
[264] - Quote
Doctor Ungabungas wrote:
Ok, so you schlep it all the way over the other side of deklein to grief me. Then I use our cyno beacon network to jump back to where I was before. Total downtime: about 3 minutes.
No. I log off a Cov fleet with a few recons and one 1-2 black ops ship with a few jumps of your mining systems, so you cannot report me for using logoffski exploits. Each toon is an alt of someone else, so they can log them in at will any time of day, while playing on their mains.
I wait until the hulks start mining. I black ops hot drop them and kill a few You counterstruck with a titan hot drop and kill a couple of stealth bombers
You wait We wait.
Your people eventually get tired of waiting. My army of alts regroup and wait for your defense fleet to get involved with something else (protecting miners is boring) My alt army does not get tired of harassing your fleet forever, and they can follow them wherever they go.
This goes on for weeks, all the while you are missing out on minerals that you could be mining far more easily in the safety of empire, on NPC's using bots. All of this has been thought up by people smarted then you already, and this is why mining bots in empire is so prevalent. TBH, prior to the drone region nerf, it was the only way that you guys could compete with the Russian supercapital generating machine.
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Eternum Praetorian
Malum Crusis
766
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:52:00 -
[265] - Quote
Andski wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:I have one black ops toon, 2 black ops cov cyno alts and one transportship character. You seem to know nothing about Black ops. for one, you probably don't even have JDC V on your blackops character, and even if you did, your jump range is absolutely horrendous so you're far from being a threat to every miner in an entire region please keep trying to "educate" me regarding things I have a lot more experience than you in
I do have JJC lv 5 as a matter of fact. For your answer see the above post.
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Doctor Ungabungas
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
104
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:52:00 -
[266] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:Doctor Ungabungas wrote:
Ok, so you schlep it all the way over the other side of deklein to grief me. Then I use our cyno beacon network to jump back to where I was before. Total downtime: about 3 minutes.
No. I log off a Cov fleet with a few recons and one black ops ship with a few jumps of your mining systems, so you cannot report me for using logoffski exploits. Each toon is an alt of someone else, so they can log them in at will any time of day, while playing on their mains. I wait until the hulks start mining. I black ops hot drop them and kill a few You counterstruck with a titan hot drop and kill a couple of stealth bombers You wait We wait. Your people eventually get tired of waiting. My army of alts regroup and wait for your defense fleet to get involved with something else (protecting miners is boring) My alt army does not get tired of harassing your fleet forever, and they can follow them wherever they go. This goes on for weeks, all the while you are missing out on minerals that you could be mining far more easily in the safety of empire, on NPC's using bots. All of this has been thought up by people smarted then you already, and this is why mining bots in empire is so prevalent. TBH, prior to the drone region nerf, it was the only way that you guys could compete with the Russian supercapital generating machine.
Every single system in Deklein is a mining system when it comes to mining trit. You're gonna need a lot of alts. |
Eternum Praetorian
Malum Crusis
766
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:53:00 -
[267] - Quote
Doctor Ungabungas wrote:Fail.
Just one or two Cov cyno alts. Running bubbles is easy yo, and cov ships are dirt cheap.
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Bane Necran
460
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:54:00 -
[268] - Quote
Don't try and reason with these people Eternum. "It's no use crying over spilt milk, because all the forces of the universe were bent on spilling it." ~William Maugham |
Aron Croup
Incompatible Protocol Bittervet Mercenaries
61
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:54:00 -
[269] - Quote
Ayame Tao wrote:If a Catalyst can kill your Hulk - you deserve everything you get.
It should take a gang of 5 Catalysts or a couple of Tornados to take down a Hulk - oh wait... it does (when you do it right - avoid popular belts, fit tank, align, watch d-scan. End. Of. Story.)
Align and watching D-Scan only work when you're actually in the belt. You could also get ganked on a gate or at the undock point of certain stations. You'd have no way of scouting it or preventing it, unless you assume that every destroyer in EVE is out to get you (which would make it impossible to move 2 jumps).
A gang of 5 fitted catalysts = 10-15m
Fitted Hulk = 350m
Even if you're not in it for hulkageddon or the loot, ganking hulks is still great for killboard stats. The same goes for jump-freighters which at present cost 7b isk, but can be destroyed by 14-15 tornoados.
A gang of 15 fitted tornados = 1,6-1,7b
Empty jump freighter = 7b
The numbers are disproportionate. I don't mind that you have to watch not sticking too many valuable mods on a fragile ship or loading your cargo bay with too much expensive loot, but the recent surge in grief style play has exposed certain flaws in the whole ganking mechanic. It's too easy. Too little risk is involved. If you have a guy in an orca, you can continuously gank miners, ignoring your -10 sec status, GCC, concord and faction police.
I'm not against high-sec PVP, ganking and griefing in general, but I do think the numbers merit some attention from CCP, and a possible boost to the jumpfreighter and the hulk, to a level where it is less attractive to attack them.
Ayame Tao wrote: Seriously, that's like leaving your Bugatti Veyron unlocked with the keys in in the dodgiest parts of town and expecting it to still be there after you left it fo half an hour to make a sandwich and watch TV.
I like where you're going with this though, using real world crime as an analogy for what to do in EVE. Well in the real world we ensure that the punishment for criminal activity is severe enough to deter most ordinary people from breaking the law. Losing a 2m ISK destroyer and a small and irrelevant detraction of security status is hardly a deterring anyone, so by your logic we should severely increase the punishment of high-sec ganking.
How about a fine? Destruction of property in the real world is fined relatively to the cost of the property destroyed. So you gank a hulk, you get a 300m ISK fine. Easy peasy.
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Doctor Ungabungas
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
104
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Posted - 2012.05.06 14:55:00 -
[270] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:Doctor Ungabungas wrote:Fail. Just one or two Cov cyno alts. Running bubbles is easy yo, and cov ships are dirt cheap.
And when you finally show up, I'll relocate back over the other side of Deklein again. I guarantee you'll get tired of jumping 15-20 jumps at a time before I will get tired of scooping up all my hulks and cynoing out.
Hell, I'm tempted to do this just to make you waste your time. |
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