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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Sig Sour
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Posted - 2009.04.27 17:41:00 -
[1]
I have reached a point in the game where I have more than enough ships and isk to do anything I want as an individual. The problem is there is a huge gap between the people I fly with, and the next level. It does not have to be this way, I just believe it is a mindset that people have taken on somewhere along the line in Eve.
I do not want to be a sheep in one of the major alliances. There seems to be a war between 2 napfests. I do not want to be involved with either of them. Every corp and alliance that is not part of this alignment, seems to have the same futile dreams of raising their flag in 0.0. The way current game mechanics are, their dreams are futile. There is a huge class separation taking place in Eve. Unfortunately, the newer players have no idea this is happening and they only fuel the problem. Furthermore the more new players there are the bigger the problem becomes.
To name the problem specifically, from my observations I have seen a lot of people around my main characters age stop playing Eve. It is the age of having a dread sitting in your hanger, an armada of ships and enough isk to replace it all, but you have nothing to do but spin in station or become a sheep.
Breaking the problems into individual areas:
Moon Mining puts an enormous amount of wealth into the 3-4 groups that hold the majority of the good moons.
Inventing and building most items cost more than if you were to buy the item off the market. From what I witnessed, most T2 BPO's are being held by the same groups that hold the high end moons.
Blobs - The only thing I think that could be done about this is by making an official kill board and award points accordingly. Perhaps then mindsets could be changed.
Sovereignty is not based on occupancy, but on who has the most player owned structures in the system.
I can not change the way people think in this game, I do not have a strong enough voice in this community to influence anyone. If the mechanics keep people thinking the way they are now, I will more than likely fade into the same fate that I have witnessed in other Eve accounts. If I do leave the game - no you can not have my stuff, it will be my last victory against the blobs of sheep and CCP (cute t-shirt in your store BTW) to sink all my isk and assets into an inactive account.
If there are any other station spinners out there who haven't yet left the game, please speak up.
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Bren Kasir
Caldari Space Defence
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Posted - 2009.04.27 18:07:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Bren Kasir on 27/04/2009 18:09:06 Interesting, I can understand where you are coming from. I've been playing eve since 2005 and although I have trained nice cap skills, I'll never fly a carrier or dread, simply because I just don't know how to make the silly amounts of ISK to buy a dread or a Carrier. I fight in FW because i like PVP and like its style, I like to fly ceptors, but i always feel I could/should be making more isk elsewhere, perhaps I should train mining, or Industrial, but ive left that too late i think. Seriously thinking about a corp who will help me towards flying caps, or teach me how to make some serious ISK to buy one, EVE has taught me you need buddies and strong helpful corps in EVE to progress. Thats why I've personally not progressed I supposem but its my choice i guess. ---
You want fries with that? |
Shyamalan
Amarr Apex Holdings
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Posted - 2009.04.27 18:18:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Sig Sour bawwwwww im so rich and can do anything i like
seriously? is this a joke?
i have never been able to make serious amounts of cash in eve, and have always had to resort to endless mission grinding to replace ships i lose pvping. I can never afford to T2 fit ships, nor can i afford to take HACs/Recons pvping. The very idea of being able to afford a carrier or dread is hilarious to me.
stop crying about having too much cash and ships, you're incredibly lucky to be in the position you are.
EVE-Gfx.com sig artist. Currently taking sig orders. Eve-mail Shyamalan to make a request. |
Sig Sour
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Posted - 2009.04.27 18:23:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Shyamalan I paTrol the forums.
Hello troll o/
Thanks for reading the thread and stating constructive criticism on the topic.
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Liang Nuren
No Salvation PuPPet MasTers
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Posted - 2009.04.27 18:33:00 -
[5]
Sig, you are completely correct, but I don't think it's really limited to the people that have the isk to replace it all.
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
source
Beyond Divinity Inc
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Posted - 2009.04.27 18:35:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Sig Sour
Originally by: Shyamalan I paTrol the forums.
Hello troll o/
Thanks for reading the thread and stating constructive criticism on the topic.
This.
Also, leave the lameness of 0.0 and go lowsec pirate with a group of people who knows what theyre doing.
Less blobs, more small gang skirmishes, almost NO pos sieges. Fun stuff.
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Shyamalan
Amarr Apex Holdings
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Posted - 2009.04.27 18:39:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Sig Sour
Originally by: Shyamalan I paTrol the forums.
Hello troll o/
Thanks for reading the thread and stating constructive criticism on the topic.
Saying something negative does not a troll make. If you want a more 'constructive' view then here it is: if you are in the position of being able to afford to do whatever you want in the game, and there is nothing you can think of which excites you, then maybe its time to find a new game.
Whatever the case, whether you stay or go, i dont see how you're going to find direction in eve by posting on forums, surely finding something in eve that you enjoy is something that is down to you and you alone?
EVE-Gfx.com sig artist. Currently taking sig orders. Eve-mail Shyamalan to make a request. |
Johnny Tungsten
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Posted - 2009.04.27 18:40:00 -
[8]
I can't say I'm old in EVE, but I can say that I've seen what you've seen. I keep seeing rumors that sov mechanics will change -- and that's a change I can believe in.
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Sig Sour
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Posted - 2009.04.27 18:55:00 -
[9]
On personal wealth: There is a slight gray area between where I am and where you are. The fact is that you and I can be classified as in the same class when you look at the bigger picture. It may seem that I am wealthy compared to you, however the option for you to make money to reach my financial status is there. The problem I am trying to address is the ungodly amounts of wealth that is the black void between where I stand and where the people on the tier above me stand.
I could replace my ships, once. Most of my wealth came from invention and building T2 ships when it was profitable. Where I stand now it would take me a LONG time to get the isk back. Off the top of my head math, they can replace in the area of a hundred capitals every month.
On Low Security Space: Yeah low sec can have less blob, but it has more stations and lots and lots of gates you can not bubble. So most "fights" are actually ganks, and most engagements end up in someone running away instead someone waking up in a new clone.
Shyamalan, you don't get it. Try to get it or go find a thread you understand and quit trolling.
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Lindsay Logan
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Posted - 2009.04.27 19:14:00 -
[10]
"I do not want to be a sheep in one of the major alliances. "
Make your own and lead it then.
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Shyamalan
Amarr Apex Holdings
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Posted - 2009.04.27 19:14:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Sig Sour Shyamalan, you don't get it. Try to get it or go find a thread you understand and quit trolling.
All i did was express my thoughts on your OP, the fact that you don't agree with them does not make me a troll. You're obviously set on branding me as a troll, so for that reason i'll leave the thread before things descend into petty namecalling.
Hope you manage to find some direction
EVE-Gfx.com sig artist. Currently taking sig orders. Eve-mail Shyamalan to make a request. |
Omara Otawan
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Posted - 2009.04.27 19:39:00 -
[12]
Agree on the moon mining issue, too bad thats probably never gonna change as the entities that hold these moons pretty much have the game developers in a chokehold due to their numbers / subscription fees if you want to say it that way.
"We're gonna make moon minerals finite, if you mined it all away its gone."
"All my alliance members are gonna quit the game then."
"Just kidding, nobody is gonna touch your moons."
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Sig Sour
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Posted - 2009.04.27 19:45:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Lindsay Logan Make your own and lead it then.
Oh thank you for bringing this up, I had forgotten to mention the problems here:
Currently it cost about 1.5 million isk to start a corporation and about 1 billion to start an alliance. This is far, far, far too cheap in my opinion. There are more corporations and alliances than one can shake a stick at.
A majority of the corps are made up of 5-10 people with the same objective as the next corp. So many small corps who want to fly under their own flag only empower the superpowers of Eve. The extremely low cost of setting up a corporation is a game mechanic blockade that has been put up and the result is this class separation.
Make my own alliance you say. I am not a good salesmen, and I am not that likable over internet coms, I know this and accept it. I have tried to pull people together to do something different from the ABC Alliance. The game mechanics the way they are put peoples minds into an area where pushing things to the next level is laughable to most at my level. So being a poor salesmen, the next level being laughable, most of the people I know who can fly or close to flying capitals selling their characters or flat out quitting, everyone (not sheep) 2 years and younger divided into small groups "wanting to do their own thing", does not make for easy recruitment. Sure "its not supposed to be easy", but the game mechanics certainly do not need to be working against us.
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Cyberus
Caldari Final Destination. Scalar Federation
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Posted - 2009.04.27 20:55:00 -
[14]
+1 ===== * Your signature file is broken. Please use one that will display - Fallout |
Commander Vic
Minmatar Ioncross
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Posted - 2009.04.27 23:31:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Sig Sour Currently it cost about 1.5 million isk to start a corporation and about 1 billion to start an alliance. This is far, far, far too cheap in my opinion. There are more corporations and alliances than one can shake a stick at.
However, with the complete (and justified) lack of trust between players in Eve joining somebody elses corporation to do the exact same thing isn't alwasy possible and is rarely desireable. Yes, I could merge my small corp of ~20 with a few others but to do that I would have to place my trust in the hands of a stranger in a game with mechanics that support and encourage them to abuse and take advantage of that trust. In a sense alliances allow smaller corps to band together without the risk, which is good, but the maintenance fees for corps and alliances are far too low. And then you have NAPs, with absolutely no hard mechanics to control them or place limitations on their size or efficiency.
But yeah, even without being stupidly rich with more ships than you know what to do with the game can get stale when the realization of what you're up against kicks in. If you have no interest in dealing with the hideous drama and politics of nullsec, no interest in staring at a gate all day in lowsec what is there?
We've been doing well by mixing it up with a good variety of activities but really, how long will that be interesting? I'd like to say moving to 0.0 would be fun, but it wasn't so we got out. Highsec could be fun, I guess, but highsec wardecs are more boring than lowsec gate camps. Lowsec is fun, most of the time anyway but the focus on gate camps to get fights and the inevitable blob make it hard to actually get out and have a good time for more than a few minutes at a time (between a few hours of hunting).
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CCP Mitnal
C C P
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Posted - 2009.04.28 00:03:00 -
[16]
Moved to General Discussion.
Mitnal Community Representative CCP Hf, EVE Online Contact us |
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Gneeznow
North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2009.04.28 00:21:00 -
[17]
I deffo sympathize with the OP, after a while it all becomes so repetative, I dont understand why people bother going into 0.0 for pvp, because its mostly pos shooting, driveby doomsdays and megablobs, so .....
Originally by: source
Also, leave the lameness of 0.0 and go lowsec pirate with a group of people who knows what theyre doing.
Less blobs, more small gang skirmishes, almost NO pos sieges. Fun stuff.
if you can bring yourself to actually spend a bit of time roaming about (even on your own in something cheap) then this is the way to go imho
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Ruze Ahkor'Murkon
Amarr No Applicable Corporation
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Posted - 2009.04.28 00:23:00 -
[18]
Wormholes. They're 0.0, there's very little if any blob warfare, there's absolutely NO moon mining, and it's perfectly suited for small corps who just want to exist and do something together.
Probably off topic, but I got wrapped up in reading the hilarious bickering of trolls than in actually reading the content. Ah, well ... I'm human too ..
Posts by Ruze Ahkor'Murkon and Ruze |
Titan Pilot
Amarr Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2009.04.28 00:41:00 -
[19]
there is a simple reason why the game gets boring
because once you hit 40M sp, fly T2 ships, and have spent countless hours making isk you wonder why that ship only lasted 10 seconds in the pvp OP aka blobfest and then CCP tells you they found nothing in their logs
maybe you could activate your mods but your mates couldn't or maybe the reds you were shooting couldn't bottom line is the combat in this game is ridiculous stupid
then you realize that half of the OP was preplanned with spies on either side...you wonder how they knew they would be on that gate and how you managed to get a fleet there at the same time...hmmm...gee I wonder....
once you realize this, you get sick to your stomach and go watch TV with your wife or GF...
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Sig Sour
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Posted - 2009.04.28 01:09:00 -
[20]
Originally by: CCP Mitnal Moved to General Discussion.
You moved a thread about broken mechanics from the game development forum to the general discussion section, that's comedy. Stick your head in the sand further, it's not in far enough.
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DasDizzy
Garoun Investment Bank
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Posted - 2009.04.28 01:31:00 -
[21]
Are you certain that i cant have your stuff? [SIG START]
Everything i say is the view of the rest of the eve cluster, IM THE PRESSDUDE FFS
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OffBeaT
Caldari Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2009.04.28 01:33:00 -
[22]
i have to say this is one of the most real things i have seen said in eve for a long time.. you are right allot of the old school crew are drooping off eve. i hate seeing the old ones who where so much the beginning of eve selling their guys to others who no nothing of there history.. i lost allot of respect for ccp and the rules of eve when i came back to see that.
pvp was pvp before warp bubbles/spheres.. this is all it is now in oo with the way choke point are and ccp not dropping local, what happened to a fair fighting chance. at lest in the day you might jump into a small gate camp but you stood a real fighting chance of getting out of it. i cant much solo anymore i maby get 3 say 5 jumps before i am cornered bubbled in and trapped. i can cloak sit all day till they get board but i am a dog and hate doing that so i always give it a fight.
i cant keep a ship solo alive in 00 past 2hrs these days. i might get one but i know i am gonna pay for it without a doubt then i gotta sit there a lesion to others say how much i suck because i solo even knowing i am doomed and lose to many ships. i don't see them taking crap for risk unless they got 5 or more with them. really, i cant afford to pay eve like this anymore for real reasons that i just don't got the time to make the isk back to keep going.
i joined a corp who was apart of a big nasty alliance there awhile back that was at war it seemed with everyone, trying to get my ships out of this area around jita i lost them, it happens so i went on fighting these guys out numbed for days as they didn't seem to care to. i thought i was doing my job as a member of this corp buy fighting there war pretty much solo as they didn't seem to care about it.. i lost ships like you do fighting but they kick me out because it looks bad on there stats. welcome to the new age of eve where kill boards mean more to a corp then its fighting members do. you get a dog in your corp you keep him because when times get tuff for your corp he the one staying and gonna duke it out for yea.. losses or not right!
i have come to the real point of eve that it is not a pvp came anymore but a quake spawn camp ground.
i solo allot as well because i don't get the point to what allot of the corps in eve are doing ether they have no drive to be there own thing or they cant take loss when times get tuff, they run and log when times get tuff in a fight or quit to a bigger corp.
you should start your own corp if you can really back it,look for grinders like me who are use to loss and can stand on there own first as a player. players with real drive to wont to be our own thing..
you just need the right crew it looks like to invest in.. start a 03/04 old school only corp! take only players who have the old way of being in eve.. crew first corp forever!
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Corr Armageddon
Amarr
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Posted - 2009.04.28 01:34:00 -
[23]
Can I have your isk?
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5pinDizzy
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Posted - 2009.04.28 01:41:00 -
[24]
I want to be able to pick up the OP up on some of his points but I can't find fault in anything he said.
I could echo some others and say try moving to lowsec, I rediscovered fun in lowsec pirating or fighting in the militias.
Best to leave the clone wars of 0.0, the politics and the like saps your motivation in the game like nothing else.
If you can, find people to hook up with you have a right laugh with. As the people you fly with can be a major factor in just wanting to quit.
if you disagree with me then you should probably post a response and stop reading my signature. |
Plutonian
Intransigent
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Posted - 2009.04.28 01:54:00 -
[25]
Have enough money to buy lots of ships.
Don't really give a damn since only a few really shine (solo).
Realized 99.9% of Eve either doesn't want to fight or only fights when they have an insanely superior advantage.
Wormhole content turned out to be a group thing. Even if only going for PvP, still pretty much require two accounts.
Dropped second account months ago when I realized I had enough money to fund PvP losses for two years or more.
Dropped subscription when I realized that I might as well burn up the billions I have in some way. Currently purchasing the PLEX cards while I continue changing skills.
But I don't really care what I'm training anymore. Nothing shines.
Old friends long ago moved on.
Don't enjoy carebearing. Won't mine. Did my missions long ago. Sick of trading. Won't play 0.0 alliance drama games. Can't stand the prattle and chest-beating of young people.
Don't like fighting PvE-fit ships or ganking haulers at gates.
Won't alter my schedule (which is hectic; married, kids, house, business owner, home improvement projects, etc.) for any alliance or corporation. Games serve me... not the other way around.
Will NOT train caps. Disliked them in 2006. Dislike them now.
Solo fighting seems to net only newer players as opponents as everyone in Eve races to get in the biggest ship in the biggest blob they can find.
Too much spreadsheet, not enough immersion.
I'm still looking at the same awful nebula backgrounds as I have throughout my whole Eve career.
I don't care about ISK. Never did. I don't care about killmails. Never did. I don't care about 'owning space'. Never did. I don't care about chest-beating over a victory. Never did. I don't care about winning. I don't care about losing.
I hate FC'ing. I hate being guilt-tripped into FC'ing.
So my Rifter kills a Taranis? Big deal. I had two webs and baited him into warping to zero. He never stood a chance. There is little skill to combat. Setup, setup, setup. That's what counts. Along with numbers.
Eve has some amazing features. It will probably be known as one of those landmark games in the genre. But it continually loses ground with me.
Was fun at first.
So... what's left?
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Neo Omni
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.04.28 02:03:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Plutonian Have enough money to buy lots of ships.
Don't really give a damn since only a few really shine (solo).
Realized 99.9% of Eve either doesn't want to fight or only fights when they have an insanely superior advantage.
Wormhole content turned out to be a group thing. Even if only going for PvP, still pretty much require two accounts.
Dropped second account months ago when I realized I had enough money to fund PvP losses for two years or more.
Dropped subscription when I realized that I might as well burn up the billions I have in some way. Currently purchasing the PLEX cards while I continue changing skills.
But I don't really care what I'm training anymore. Nothing shines.
Old friends long ago moved on.
Don't enjoy carebearing. Won't mine. Did my missions long ago. Sick of trading. Won't play 0.0 alliance drama games. Can't stand the prattle and chest-beating of young people.
Don't like fighting PvE-fit ships or ganking haulers at gates.
Won't alter my schedule (which is hectic; married, kids, house, business owner, home improvement projects, etc.) for any alliance or corporation. Games serve me... not the other way around.
Will NOT train caps. Disliked them in 2006. Dislike them now.
Solo fighting seems to net only newer players as opponents as everyone in Eve races to get in the biggest ship in the biggest blob they can find.
Too much spreadsheet, not enough immersion.
I'm still looking at the same awful nebula backgrounds as I have throughout my whole Eve career.
I don't care about ISK. Never did. I don't care about killmails. Never did. I don't care about 'owning space'. Never did. I don't care about chest-beating over a victory. Never did. I don't care about winning. I don't care about losing.
I hate FC'ing. I hate being guilt-tripped into FC'ing.
So my Rifter kills a Taranis? Big deal. I had two webs and baited him into warping to zero. He never stood a chance. There is little skill to combat. Setup, setup, setup. That's what counts. Along with numbers.
Eve has some amazing features. It will probably be known as one of those landmark games in the genre. But it continually loses ground with me.
Was fun at first.
So... what's left?
WOW!!! That was intense.
Yes, eventually your reach a ceiling in EVE. CCP needs some fresh ideas.
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Captain Hudson
Caldari Royal Hiigaran Navy SCUM.
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Posted - 2009.04.28 02:06:00 -
[27]
2004 player here, have lost total intrest in the game because simply, there is nothing new to do in it, i think eve proberly has the worst endgame of most mmo's.
And no you cant have my stuff
Iv found him |
Neo Omni
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.04.28 02:14:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Captain Hudson 2004 player here, have lost total intrest in the game because simply, there is nothing new to do in it, i think eve proberly has the worst endgame of most mmo's.
And no you cant have my stuff
But isn't the end game to conquer the EVE universe...or is that even possible given present game mechanics?
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Captain Hudson
Caldari Royal Hiigaran Navy SCUM.
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Posted - 2009.04.28 02:18:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Neo Omni
Originally by: Captain Hudson 2004 player here, have lost total intrest in the game because simply, there is nothing new to do in it, i think eve proberly has the worst endgame of most mmo's.
And no you cant have my stuff
But isn't the end game to conquer the EVE universe...or is that even possible given present game mechanics?
That is a totally unrealistic goal
Iv found him |
Jinx Barker
Caldari GFB Scientific
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Posted - 2009.04.28 02:20:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Jinx Barker on 28/04/2009 02:21:05 Moon Mining puts an enormous amount of wealth into the 3-4 groups that hold the majority of the good moons.
ANSWER: Correct, that is MAYBE an issue, but, then again, you and your friends can go there and take them away. Or, join them, and reap the benefits.
Inventing and building most items cost more than if you were to buy the item off the market. From what I witnessed, most T2 BPO's are being held by the same groups that hold the high end moons.
ANSWER: I will clarify: Inventing & Building SOME items costs more than market - due to morons who think their minerals are free, their datacores are free, and their time is free. Those above-mentioned morons supply me, and many other market profiteers with amazing amounts of ISK when we buy and reprocess, or buy and resell their stuff at proper prices.
T2 BPOS are being held by the same groups that hold the moons - what have you "witnessed" exactly? This is pure conjecture at best, and gross exaggeration at worst. Yes, the alliances in question own the moons, which in turn gives them ability to buy the overpriced T2 BPOs at 5 year ROI. Please go back to answer # 1: Join them, or kill them and take their moons.
Blobs - The only thing I think that could be done about this is by making an official kill board and award points accordingly. Perhaps then mindsets could be changed.
ANSWER: I agree, Blobs are bad... don't know what to do about them, there was always blobbing in EVE, but it has reached an epidemic.
Sovereignty is not based on occupancy, but on who has the most player owned structures in the system.
ANSWER: Another valid point, but, again, if there are not enough occupants, please feel free to go and KICK THEM OUT! Since if they do not have enough manpower to protect the space they should be easy pickings.
(I am summarizing) EVE is dying, things are not fair... whaaaaa...
ANSWER: Get out. EVE has been dying very successfully since 2003, I am sure when the time comes it will die, my guess is, not for another 6 years at least, if not 10. Since EVE is constantly evolving, very much unlike all "other games" out there.
Best of luck in whatever you do, please contract your stuff to me.
Cheers,
::::Click The Signature For the Blog::::
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