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tla s'hpyt
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Posted - 2009.04.28 12:22:00 -
[1]
ok one thing that's been bugging me for a while now is in the crusader vs the claw, the fastest ship isn't exactly the claw. While at base speed the claw is faster once you fit on a mwd the difference closes to less than 1%, and if you overheat the mwd the crusader starts going faster by less than 1%. Now I could understand if this was overcome by the claw having faster agility but instead the crusader gets faster agility.
I'll admit this is all eft'ing as I've never really liked flying intercepter, instead I prefer support ships such as the claymore which is why I'm interested in this.
minmatar are the masters of speed so why isn't the fastest ship in the game minmatar?
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Random Womble
Minmatar Master Miners
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Posted - 2009.04.28 12:37:00 -
[2]
Originally by: tla s'hpyt ok one thing that's been bugging me for a while now is in the crusader vs the claw, the fastest ship isn't exactly the claw. While at base speed the claw is faster once you fit on a mwd the difference closes to less than 1%, and if you overheat the mwd the crusader starts going faster by less than 1%. Now I could understand if this was overcome by the claw having faster agility but instead the crusader gets faster agility.
I'll admit this is all eft'ing as I've never really liked flying intercepter, instead I prefer support ships such as the claymore which is why I'm interested in this.
minmatar are the masters of speed so why isn't the fastest ship in the game minmatar?
Because minmatar inteceptors have the largest mass of any interceptors while caldari ceptors have the least mass normally its the other way around with minmatar having least and caldari most but yea for some reason caldari seem to have minmatar stats in that area for ceptors.
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KingDiomedes
Caldari SniggWaffe
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Posted - 2009.04.28 12:46:00 -
[3]
either way a claw eats saders for dinner so it doesnt matter :) claw ftw
Please resize sig to a file size no greater than 24000 bytes - Mitnal |
Perry
Amarr The X-Trading Company RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2009.04.28 13:11:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Perry on 28/04/2009 13:11:27 Claw and Crusader have the same Powergrid. This is usually not the case for amarr and minmatar ships. Minmatar should have the least grid and amarr the most. So why has the Claw this much grid? Maybe it has more Fusion Generators onboard to get more grid (amarr use more efficient Antimatter Reactors), but by doing so the Claw gets very heavy compared to usual minmatar ships.
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CrestoftheStars
Caldari Violent Force Productions
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Posted - 2009.04.28 13:16:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Random Womble
Originally by: tla s'hpyt ok one thing that's been bugging me for a while now is in the crusader vs the claw, the fastest ship isn't exactly the claw. While at base speed the claw is faster once you fit on a mwd the difference closes to less than 1%, and if you overheat the mwd the crusader starts going faster by less than 1%. Now I could understand if this was overcome by the claw having faster agility but instead the crusader gets faster agility.
I'll admit this is all eft'ing as I've never really liked flying intercepter, instead I prefer support ships such as the claymore which is why I'm interested in this.
minmatar are the masters of speed so why isn't the fastest ship in the game minmatar?
Because minmatar inteceptors have the largest mass of any interceptors while caldari ceptors have the least mass normally its the other way around with minmatar having least and caldari most but yea for some reason caldari seem to have minmatar stats in that area for ceptors.
crusader isn't a caldari ship dude..
it's a amarr and it is designed to catch minmatar ships (when you read into the history it is made as a counter too the fast minnie ships).
___________________________________________ Whoever appeals to the law against his fellow man is either a fool or a coward. Whoever cannot take care of himself without that law is both. For a wounded |
CrestoftheStars
Caldari Violent Force Productions
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Posted - 2009.04.28 13:28:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Perry Edited by: Perry on 28/04/2009 13:11:27 Claw and Crusader have the same Powergrid. This is usually not the case for amarr and minmatar ships. Minmatar should have the least grid and amarr the most. So why has the Claw this much grid? Maybe it has more Fusion Generators onboard to get more grid (amarr use more efficient Antimatter Reactors), but by doing so the Claw gets very heavy compared to usual minmatar ships.
hehe nicely said. although they should both be rebalanced to be in their perspective roles. the crusader have a very low dps compared to other amarr close range ships compared with their equel of other races as well ___________________________________________ Whoever appeals to the law against his fellow man is either a fool or a coward. Whoever cannot take care of himself without that law is both. For a wounded |
Deva Blackfire
D00M.
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Posted - 2009.04.28 13:46:00 -
[7]
Actually grid is problem too... just compare AC and lazor fittings :( Also sader has +1 turret to equip :(
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Georgina Eldridge
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Posted - 2009.04.28 15:48:00 -
[8]
gIVE cLAW 4TH TURRET PLOX.
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Resalan
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Posted - 2009.04.28 15:51:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Deva Blackfire Actually grid is problem too... just compare AC and lazor fittings :( Also sader has +1 turret to equip :(
ok and now just compare laser and AC performances.
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Deva Blackfire
D00M.
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Posted - 2009.04.28 15:56:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Resalan
Originally by: Deva Blackfire Actually grid is problem too... just compare AC and lazor fittings :( Also sader has +1 turret to equip :(
ok and now just compare laser and AC performances.
Both fight in web (scrambler) range, ACs deal pretty much same damage (comparing 200mm to dual pulses, coz med pulses dont fit on sader). You were saying?
Hint: AC whine might work, but only on BS level.
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Resalan
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Posted - 2009.04.28 16:40:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Originally by: Resalan
Originally by: Deva Blackfire Actually grid is problem too... just compare AC and lazor fittings :( Also sader has +1 turret to equip :(
ok and now just compare laser and AC performances.
Both fight in web (scrambler) range, ACs deal pretty much same damage (comparing 200mm to dual pulses, coz med pulses dont fit on sader). You were saying?
Hint: AC whine might work, but only on BS level.
its not a whine small AC are fine and small laser are too. laser have better performance than AC and they also have more fitting requirement.
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Deva Blackfire
D00M.
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Posted - 2009.04.28 17:00:00 -
[12]
Im not comparing laser performance but ship performance. And pretty much 3 gun claw is comparable to 4 gun sader. Thing is: one is ***** to fit other is not.
(and all the cool kids fly taranis anyways = as easy to fit as sabre...)
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Raimo
Gallente Wrath of Fenris
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Posted - 2009.04.28 20:34:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Both fight in web (scrambler) range, ACs deal pretty much same damage (comparing 200mm to dual pulses, coz med pulses dont fit on sader). You were saying?
Lol, my Sader does not fight in web range... ---
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Deva Blackfire
D00M.
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Posted - 2009.04.28 20:55:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Raimo
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Both fight in web (scrambler) range, ACs deal pretty much same damage (comparing 200mm to dual pulses, coz med pulses dont fit on sader). You were saying?
Lol, my Sader does not fight in web range...
Lol my sader does. So does every pulse sader which is out there. 13km is web range FYI and your "15km optimal" (if you play TE/locus pulse sader) is way too easy to bring into web/scram range and kill. Been there, done that.
But if you say you use beam sader then what the hell are you doing here budging into AC/pulses discussion?
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tla s'hpyt
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Posted - 2009.04.28 23:07:00 -
[15]
tbh it's not hard too find a working setup for these ships, and they both perform pretty well. The sader does better dps but has cap problems if it starts using it's guns and mwd'ing so it can't really reach that dps. The claw has lower sig res but less ehp, claw has better lock time but it's lock range it's lower than it's scram range.
As for pwg being same, cpu is same as well and usually minmatar have better cpu.
From what I've seen they are both pretty good having slight variations in what they do better but coming out around equal all around, with maybe a slight advantage to the claw. The problem is that's not how it should be, minmatar are supposed to be the masters of speedy tacklers and we come out around the same as amarr. I wouldn't mind if the game was balanced on having each class this similar but it's not, it's balanced around the whole race and this is supposed to be the area where minmatar shine.
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Random Womble
Minmatar Emo Rangers Electric Monkey Overlords
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Posted - 2009.04.29 04:02:00 -
[16]
Originally by: CrestoftheStars
Originally by: Random Womble
Originally by: tla s'hpyt ok one thing that's been bugging me for a while now is in the crusader vs the claw, the fastest ship isn't exactly the claw. While at base speed the claw is faster once you fit on a mwd the difference closes to less than 1%, and if you overheat the mwd the crusader starts going faster by less than 1%. Now I could understand if this was overcome by the claw having faster agility but instead the crusader gets faster agility.
I'll admit this is all eft'ing as I've never really liked flying intercepter, instead I prefer support ships such as the claymore which is why I'm interested in this.
minmatar are the masters of speed so why isn't the fastest ship in the game minmatar?
Because minmatar inteceptors have the largest mass of any interceptors while caldari ceptors have the least mass normally its the other way around with minmatar having least and caldari most but yea for some reason caldari seem to have minmatar stats in that area for ceptors.
crusader isn't a caldari ship dude..
it's a amarr and it is designed to catch minmatar ships (when you read into the history it is made as a counter too the fast minnie ships).
Im well aware crusader is not caldari but its because the masses of the caldari and minmatar interceptors are reversed (compaired with tradition racial trends) it effects the speed of minmatar ceptors compaired to all others so my point was valid. If the claw had the mass of the crow (lightest ceptor iirc) or raptor (second lightest) it would be faster than the crusader. As for fiction Amarr are supposed to be slower than minmatar in general as are every other race hence why they have the fastest ships in most areas.
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Raimo
Gallente Wrath of Fenris
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Posted - 2009.04.29 05:15:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Raimo on 29/04/2009 05:16:15 Edited by: Raimo on 29/04/2009 05:15:53
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Originally by: Raimo
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Both fight in web (scrambler) range, ACs deal pretty much same damage (comparing 200mm to dual pulses, coz med pulses dont fit on sader). You were saying?
Lol, my Sader does not fight in web range...
Lol my sader does. So does every pulse sader which is out there. 13km is web range FYI and your "15km optimal" (if you play TE/locus pulse sader) is way too easy to bring into web/scram range and kill. Been there, done that.
But if you say you use beam sader then what the hell are you doing here budging into AC/pulses discussion?
Well, I indeed have the 15k optimal pulse setup. I dunno, I've gotten 109 kills with it since I skilled it less than a month ago... Compared to the 150 kills I've had with the Ranis in over 6 months its pretty decent IMO. OFC I've lost a bunch of Saders too, most of them indeed to scrambling Ranises/ Saders, but they don't always get me, and when I see what they're trying to do I can just bail. IMO the "been there/ done that" setup is the best blob harassment/ tackler killer ship I've yet found as slowing down to scramble would be suicide there, I can kill almost every other ceptor (except some scrambling ranises, saders and claws) and T1 frig and EAS and be a useful secondary tackler on bigger stuff, and kill them solo too if they're stupid enough to stay aggroed. I would never do the scrambler thing on the Sader, I have the Ranis for that... ---
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