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Rodj Blake
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
864
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 15:29:00 -
[271] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:
Ahh, but the flip side to this may end up being the ability to set Faction standings to people. I would not be surprised if this Winter we see the ability to elect FW officials from the ranks of FW pilots.
If this happens I would hope they would be able to set standings for the Faction towards people outside of FW, for example that pesky gang of pirates that likes to interfere in your Factions business.
If this is the case I sincerely hope the station lock outs will include people that have been set to red standings by the Faction. This gives a tangible benefit to those people that wish to work with the various Factions without necessarily joining. In fact, if a Pirate group picked on one Faction exclusively they would be given blue (or at least retain neutral) status with the other faction... in essence becoming somethin akin to the classic "Privateer" organization.
Having elected player officials would be a disaster unless you find the prospect of all four militias being run by Goon alts amusing.
A better option would be to give neutrals who shoot at militia pilots an automatic standings hit.
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |

Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
1832
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 16:17:00 -
[272] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:I'd like to see the FW game penalize the losing faction(empire) some more without actually hitting those pilots fighting for the losing faction specifically.
For example, if a side loses its territory to represent the fact its losing the war I'd like to see transaction taxes going up in that faction's Hisec (faction high command clawing back some isk from hisec residents to fund the lowsec war).
Imagine just how exciting FW would get if the Caldari faction losing systems led to increased transaction taxes in Jita? Perhaps this could actually lead to the revitalization of other market hubs. Alternatively maybe the Jita bears would be more inclined to privately fund their miliita fighters to improve their transaction taxes.
This could be mapped on top of the new system pretty tidily I think.
Warzone control
1 terrible LP rewards - Emergency Transaction Tax Penalty in Empire Hisec 2 poor LP rewards -Increased Transaction Tax Penalty in Empire Hisec 3 Average LP rewards - Status Quo - Transaction Charges as Now 4 Good LP rewards - War Boon - Transaction Charges Reduced 5 excellent LP rewards - Victory Boon 0 Transaction Charges Reduced Significantly
The real payoff for this would be that the relative attractiveness of the 4 imperial trade hubs (jita, amarr, rens, dodixie) would change over time to reflect the result of faction warfare success and failure and stop being a static no-brainer as now.
One's faction getting hammered in FW will involve hisec players hoping to play the markets and trade their goods and hopefully encourage them to get involved.
Non faction war trade hubs (yulai, ammatar space etc) would have the virtue of stability without the immediate threat of bonus or penalty tariffs.
Consider this a proposal to spread the pain (and benefits) a little more widely and make the systems of Faction Warfare impact the rest of the server far more significantly than even FW 2.0 does.
Everyone in the known universe buys and sells from Jita (on alts if nothing else) - lets have the fortune's of the Jita market tied in some way to the fortunes of Caldari FW (and same for the other empires and hubs).
This is actually a very, very good idea. When I check troll in the dictionary, it has a photo shopped picture of you standing somewhere in the vicinity of a point.
Also, I can kill you with my brain. |

Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1970
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 16:23:00 -
[273] - Quote
Kusum Fawn wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:I'd like to see the FW game penalize the losing faction(empire) some more without actually hitting those pilots fighting for the losing faction specifically.
For example, if a side loses its territory to represent the fact its losing the war I'd like to see transaction taxes going up in that faction's Hisec (faction high command clawing back some isk from hisec residents to fund the lowsec war).
Imagine just how exciting FW would get if the Caldari faction losing systems led to increased transaction taxes in Jita? Perhaps this could actually lead to the revitalization of other market hubs. Alternatively maybe the Jita bears would be more inclined to privately fund their miliita fighters to improve their transaction taxes.
This could be mapped on top of the new system pretty tidily I think.
Warzone control
1 terrible LP rewards - Emergency Transaction Tax Penalty in Empire Hisec 2 poor LP rewards -Increased Transaction Tax Penalty in Empire Hisec 3 Average LP rewards - Status Quo - Transaction Charges as Now 4 Good LP rewards - War Boon - Transaction Charges Reduced 5 excellent LP rewards - Victory Boon 0 Transaction Charges Reduced Significantly
The real payoff for this would be that the relative attractiveness of the 4 imperial trade hubs (jita, amarr, rens, dodixie) would change over time to reflect the result of faction warfare success and failure and stop being a static no-brainer as now.
One's faction getting hammered in FW will involve hisec players hoping to play the markets and trade their goods and hopefully encourage them to get involved.
Non faction war trade hubs (yulai, ammatar space etc) would have the virtue of stability without the immediate threat of bonus or penalty tariffs.
Consider this a proposal to spread the pain (and benefits) a little more widely and make the systems of Faction Warfare impact the rest of the server far more significantly than even FW 2.0 does.
Everyone in the known universe buys and sells from Jita (on alts if nothing else) - lets have the fortune's of the Jita market tied in some way to the fortunes of Caldari FW (and same for the other empires and hubs).
I like this idea, however the problem with lowering hisec transaction charges, means that Caldari navy will be in the best interests of most people to be winning. I would propose a five tier plan that only has inflationary taxes while losing, so its in everyone's best interests to not be losing, which is a different thing, stalemate in terms of war effort is also useful
Yeah that can work too. The non-faction war hisec faction centers (yulai, ammatar) will be the stable obtions and the FW-tied hubs can only get worse (if their side does worse) - + of course have lowsec hubs getting a boost in comparison to hisec ones.
I think tying a system into the 5 levels of warzone control stands the greatest chance of implementation from CCP on programming overhead. Question is does the current game support the inclusion of some variable transaction tax code based on sovereignty (hisec) status.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |

Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
1832
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 16:24:00 -
[274] - Quote
Rodj Blake wrote:Ranger 1 wrote:
Ahh, but the flip side to this may end up being the ability to set Faction standings to people. I would not be surprised if this Winter we see the ability to elect FW officials from the ranks of FW pilots.
If this happens I would hope they would be able to set standings for the Faction towards people outside of FW, for example that pesky gang of pirates that likes to interfere in your Factions business.
If this is the case I sincerely hope the station lock outs will include people that have been set to red standings by the Faction. This gives a tangible benefit to those people that wish to work with the various Factions without necessarily joining. In fact, if a Pirate group picked on one Faction exclusively they would be given blue (or at least retain neutral) status with the other faction... in essence becoming somethin akin to the classic "Privateer" organization.
Having elected player officials would be a disaster unless you find the prospect of all four militias being run by Goon alts amusing. A better option would be to give neutrals who shoot at militia pilots an automatic standings hit.
You actually think the Goons would waste an alt to control FW? 
Consider something else, having elected Faction officials opens to door to other options as well... including the ability to kick FW members or corps suspected of being spies or of simply farming the system.
At that point, if you can't police your own you deserve whatever you get. When I check troll in the dictionary, it has a photo shopped picture of you standing somewhere in the vicinity of a point.
Also, I can kill you with my brain. |

Kusum Fawn
State War Academy Caldari State
57
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 16:35:00 -
[275] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:You actually think the Goons would waste an alt to control FW?  Consider something else, having elected Faction officials opens to door to other options as well... including the ability to kick FW members or corps suspected of being spies or of simply farming the system. At that point, if you can't police your own you deserve whatever you get.
if goons can figure out how to make it easier isk generation then incursions, yes, they will do it.
it also leaves open the door to BOB style meltdowns, something which to a certain extent wouldn't happen in a milita setting.
Its not possible to please all the people all the time, but it sure as hell is possible to Displease all the people, most of the time. |

Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
1834
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 16:55:00 -
[276] - Quote
Kusum Fawn wrote:Ranger 1 wrote:You actually think the Goons would waste an alt to control FW?  Consider something else, having elected Faction officials opens to door to other options as well... including the ability to kick FW members or corps suspected of being spies or of simply farming the system. At that point, if you can't police your own you deserve whatever you get. if goons can figure out how to make it easier isk generation then incursions, yes, they will do it. it also leaves open the door to BOB style meltdowns, something which to a certain extent wouldn't happen in a milita setting.
Compared to their other sources of income Data Cores are completely insignificant.
Perhaps you could be more specific in what you mean by a "BOB style meltdown".
Do you really feel the only way FW can succeed is to have as little control as possible in the hands of the players? Corporations and Alliances have managed to take care of running themselves just fine since the game went gold without CCP wet nursing them. I see no reason why FW pilots should be considered so incompetent that they cannot do the same.
Whatever the mechanics involved, there would have to be a mechanism in place to call a vote of no confidence and have another election if someone were badly dropping the ball.... since in a normal corp/alliance they could simply disband (which obviously Factions cannot do). When I check troll in the dictionary, it has a photo shopped picture of you standing somewhere in the vicinity of a point.
Also, I can kill you with my brain. |
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CCP Ytterbium
C C P C C P Alliance
559

 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 17:10:00 -
[277] - Quote
Hey people, here are some answers for you.
* DO YOU CONSIDER DIMINISHING RETURNS FOR TAKING SPACE? Yes, as mentioned in the Dev Blog, we will possibly consider some ways of make it more difficult for one side to just take everything with ease - we could for example increase VPs to take additional systems, or use NPCs to assist an outmatched faction. Again, nothing is set in stone as this stage as we want to iterate on FW next release as well.
* WHAT ARE THE IMPLICATIONS OF TAKING SOVEREIGNTY? At the moment the Sovereignty changes are quite cosmetic sadly. However in the long run, we would really like Sovereignty to actually have an implication on the solar system as a whole (police / navy NPCs, stations, sentry guns etc...). That's the whole point after all, your faction conquered enemy space, and to the victor goes the spoils.
* NO CHANGES TO FACTION NAVY / NPCS? Not for now, we ran out of time for Inferno. But we really want to have a look at the various NPCs next release. We will start with FW complex NPCs, then possibly have a look at mission and navy NPCs as well. We would like to redirect you to this thread if you want to help us fix them.
* COMPLEX CAPTURE AND I-HUB STORED LP: you should still get LPs from capturing a complex even if the I-hub in the solar system has none. You get no LP for defending though. The way it works is: you gain 10,000 LPs from a minor site, 5,000 are taken from the enemy I-hub, if it had any LP stored in the first place.
* LP STORE PRICE FLUCTUATION IS HUGE, THIS IS MADNESS! We do realize a 16x multiplier to be quite high, which is why we will keep looking at this situation and change it if need be.
* DO YOU PLAN TO TWEAK LP STORE OFFERS? Yes, although not sure when, we definitely want to tweak this, make sure each separate faction has a different and interesting LP store in the first place. That includes revamping existing offers and creating new ones.
* WHAT ABOUT CYNO JAMMERS? The idea was postponed after the feedback we received at Fanfest / forums. It's not out though, but initial discussions showed us that if there is one feature we need to carefully tread with, it's that one as it impacts a -lot- of third party players as well.
* ARE FW COMPLEXES GOING TO BE LOOKED AT? Yes, we want to iterate at them, by changing the NPCs, and possibly restricting pirate ships from entering the small ones (pirate as in Dramiel, Cynabal ships, not pirate players ). The power gap between pirate and tech 1 hulls is just too great for a feature that is supposed to be friendly to new / casual players. However, we would still want navy ships to be able to go in, since you get them from the FW LP stores, it would promote a good incentive to spend LPs there.
* THE DATACORES, IT'S OVER 9000?! Good point regarding mechanical engineering datacores, we will most likely spread this type out to all factions before release. Regarding the change itself, we will not actively adjust the RP amounts you have prior or after release. Which means players cashing in datacores that were worth 150 RP for 100 RP after release will get an advantage. Since the field multipliers are being removed, this change also means players will receive them slower, for 100 and 150 RP fields. But, since all of them now require 100 RP to be exchanged, it will be pretty balanced in the long run. R&D skills will unfortunately not be reimbursed as this profession is not going away - it will most likely be looked into and changed into a more active state separately in the future not to abandon players that invested time and effort into it.
* WHO DROPS THE INFRASTRUCTURE HUB? No one; it is the nothing more than the old NPC control bunker that is being renamed, and as such, doesn't require logistic effort from anyone to be placed. There is also no need to remove all the LP out of it before it can be captured; all LP will automatically be wiped out when captured by the enemy faction.
* ARE THERE ANY REWARDS FOR PODDING SOMEONE? Not at the moment
* DO YOU GUYS PLAN TO ITERATE ON SYSTEM UPGRADES? Yes, as stated in the blog, we acknowledge current upgrades can be improved by a fair margin - we already received feedback and ideas coming from the CSM / community, and we would like to redirect you to this thread if you have suggestions.
* DO YOU HAVE PLANS ON IMPROVING THE LP STORE INTERFACE? Oh yes, my precious, we do yes, we do. We absolutely despise its terrible, horrible current state.
* WILL GALLENTE PILOTS BE REWARDED FOR CAPTURING AMARR PLEXES AND VICE-VERSA: yes, allied factions have been thought of, thus, a Gallente pilot capturing an Amarr FW complex, or a Caldari pilot capturing a Minmatar complex will get paid in their respective militia LP store for instance. Please note allied factions aren't paid for capturing Infrastructure Hubs however, as they can't shoot it in the first place.
Hope that helps!  |
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CCP Soundwave
C C P C C P Alliance
936

 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 17:13:00 -
[278] - Quote
* DO WE USE CAPS FOR HEADLINES? Yell yes |
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CCP Ytterbium
C C P C C P Alliance
559

 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 17:16:00 -
[279] - Quote
CCP Soundwave wrote:* DO WE USE CAPS FOR HEADLINES? Yell yes
Screw you, get out of here, they are mine, mine, my own! You can't have them, no, you can't, my property, MINE.  |
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1971
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 17:35:00 -
[280] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote:Hey people, here are some answers for you. * DO YOU CONSIDER DIMINISHING RETURNS FOR TAKING SPACE? Yes, as mentioned in the Dev Blog, we will possibly consider some ways of make it more difficult for one side to just take everything with ease - we could for example increase VPs to take additional systems, or use NPCs to assist an outmatched faction. Again, nothing is set in stone as this stage as we want to iterate on FW next release as well. * WHAT ARE THE IMPLICATIONS OF TAKING SOVEREIGNTY? At the moment the Sovereignty changes are quite cosmetic sadly. However in the long run, we would really like Sovereignty to actually have an implication on the solar system as a whole (police / navy NPCs, stations, sentry guns etc...). That's the whole point after all, your faction conquered enemy space, and to the victor goes the spoils. * NO CHANGES TO FACTION NAVY / NPCS? Not for now, we ran out of time for Inferno. But we really want to have a look at the various NPCs next release. We will start with FW complex NPCs, then possibly have a look at mission and navy NPCs as well. We would like to redirect you to this thread if you want to help us fix them. * COMPLEX CAPTURE AND I-HUB STORED LP: you should still get LPs from capturing a complex even if the I-hub in the solar system has none. You get no LP for defending though. The way it works is: you gain 10,000 LPs from a minor site, 5,000 are taken from the enemy I-hub, if it had any LP stored in the first place. * LP STORE PRICE FLUCTUATION IS HUGE, THIS IS MADNESS! We do realize a 16x multiplier to be quite high, which is why we will keep looking at this situation and change it if need be. * DO YOU PLAN TO TWEAK LP STORE OFFERS? Yes, although not sure when, we definitely want to tweak this, make sure each separate faction has a different and interesting LP store in the first place. That includes revamping existing offers and creating new ones. * WHAT ABOUT CYNO JAMMERS? The idea was postponed after the feedback we received at Fanfest / forums. It's not out though, but initial discussions showed us that if there is one feature we need to carefully tread with, it's that one as it impacts a -lot- of third party players as well. * ARE FW COMPLEXES GOING TO BE LOOKED AT? Yes, we want to iterate at them, by changing the NPCs, and possibly restricting pirate ships from entering the small ones (pirate as in Dramiel, Cynabal ships, not pirate players ). The power gap between pirate and tech 1 hulls is just too great for a feature that is supposed to be friendly to new / casual players. However, we would still want navy ships to be able to go in, since you get them from the FW LP stores, it would promote a good incentive to spend LPs there. * THE DATACORES, IT'S OVER 9000?! Good point regarding mechanical engineering datacores, we will most likely spread this type out to all factions before release. Regarding the change itself, we will not actively adjust the RP amounts you have prior or after release. Which means players cashing in datacores that were worth 150 RP for 100 RP after release will get an advantage. Since the field multipliers are being removed, this change also means players will receive them slower, for 100 and 150 RP fields. But, since all of them now require 100 RP to be exchanged, it will be pretty balanced in the long run. R&D skills will unfortunately not be reimbursed as this profession is not going away - it will most likely be looked into and changed into a more active state separately in the future not to abandon players that invested time and effort into it. * WHO DROPS THE INFRASTRUCTURE HUB? No one; it is the nothing more than the old NPC control bunker that is being renamed, and as such, doesn't require logistic effort from anyone to be placed. There is also no need to remove all the LP out of it before it can be captured; all LP will automatically be wiped out when captured by the enemy faction. * ARE THERE ANY REWARDS FOR PODDING SOMEONE? Not at the moment * DO YOU GUYS PLAN TO ITERATE ON SYSTEM UPGRADES? Yes, as stated in the blog, we acknowledge current upgrades can be improved by a fair margin - we already received feedback and ideas coming from the CSM / community, and we would like to redirect you to this thread if you have suggestions. * DO YOU HAVE PLANS ON IMPROVING THE LP STORE INTERFACE? Oh yes, my precious, we do yes, we do. We absolutely despise its terrible, horrible current state. * WILL GALLENTE PILOTS BE REWARDED FOR CAPTURING AMARR PLEXES AND VICE-VERSA: yes, allied factions have been thought of, thus, a Gallente pilot capturing an Amarr FW complex, or a Caldari pilot capturing a Minmatar complex will get paid in their respective militia LP store for instance. Please note allied factions aren't paid for capturing Infrastructure Hubs however, as they can't shoot it in the first place. Hope that helps! 
Good answers thanks ... what do you think about the suggestion I made on the previous page about warzone control level (1-5) being used to calculate a modifier to general transaction tax for everyone using that empire's hisec stations? (basically to make EVERYONE suffer a bit if a given empire is losing FW badly)
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
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Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
2346
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 17:39:00 -
[281] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote:CCP Soundwave wrote:* DO WE USE CAPS FOR HEADLINES? Yell yes Screw you, get out of here, they are mine, mine, my own! You can't have them, no, you can't, my property, MINE. 
I don't give two drakes whether you capitalize or not as long as you keep dishing out the juicy details on what we'll be working on next !! 
Thank you, gentlemen, for all your hard work and for bringing everyone up to speed.
Vice Secretary of the 7th Council of Stellar Management.
|

Grady Eltoren
Aviation Professionals for EVE
41
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 17:43:00 -
[282] - Quote
Leslie e'Evob wrote:Oh yeah, datacores are currently free money, all right: I have 6 characters with 5 research agents each, each having to do 50+ jumps - some in lowsec - to exchange their RPs for DCs and then move them to areas where the buyers are, and with that, I don't make enough money to pay for even one of my 2 accounts.
If you want to balance DCs, how about changing agent locations around a bit? Caldqri R&D agents are in Caldari space, and naturally Minmatar R&D agents are also in Caldari space. Huh?
EXACTLY.
I don't "farm" that much but I am pissed at CCP's take on this situation and it completely rings true of their past mistakes and the reason we BURNED JITA. You guys seem REALLY OUT OF TOUCH HERE.
TO THE CCP DEVS/GAME OF DRONES:
WHAT THE HECK ARE YOU DOING TO RP RESEARCH?
Just consider this, I like many, started EVE as a scientist and industrialist. THAT IS WHAT GRADY IS. I started out thinking wow - how cool. I was proud of this...then about two years and multiple skills later into my playing I realized how stupid a decision it was and I just hung onto hope you might fix it someday because I had invested so much into it. You started to fix things with the elimination of Meta 1 loot from wrecks. We can now build and sell those for a living. All those BPOs have meaning now.
You started too fix industry removing drone mins. Shooting for minerals is stupid.
You started fixing Moon mins by saying they will be spread out all over 0.0 soon.
But now you are making the broken production of T2 loot worse which comprises a major part of the game.
WHERE IS THE LOVE FOR SCIENCE and BUILDERS/INVENTORS?
T2 production even more than before will be broken by your changes to RP and what I am sure is more of a ramrod coming that we are not even seeing. You wanna do something bold - remove T2 BPOs or limit them somehow.
Invention is hardly anything to be proud of. To make a profit using it you have to find that RARE market and watch it like a hawk and move ships all over the place. It is ridiculous. They should call the industry/science line the "SPREADSHEET WARRIOR/LOGISTICS WARRIOR/MARKET WARRIOR" because that is what you have to do to make any sort of profit off data core "FARMING". You guys are out of touch with your own game.
Why can't building/inventing be its' own entity I ask you??? As it is I had to train and do all the above extra bull$#%# and I sucked it up. Then now you are making my chosen profession even less valuable with the RP changes.
Like someone else said - You just made Datacores into Shooting things for Datacores like Drone shooting was for mining! WTF???
Why can't you FIX SOMETHING instead of patchwork breaking it like you guys have been known to do for years??
Furthermore, where is the love for Science??? Science toons are an embarressment these days! GO LOOK at the Character Bazaar on the forums for evidence of this!
TRUST ME - I GET THAT EVE IS ABOUT CONFLICT - but there are some of us that just like to be the nerds in EVE.
WHY CAN'T YOU MAKE SCIENTISTS A VALID PROFESSION LIKE EVERYTHING ELSE?
Why can't we make data core "farming" a profession (not through running missions and certainly not by shooting stuff) but by making mini games out of it or making ALL that TIME I trained into SCIENCE WORTH SOMETHING!??? This would be awesome in some incarnation. Then your scientists and inventors get hunted for their profession instead of relegated to something stupid and minor like a dedicated salvaging alt.
It just is not "fair" to have so much invested in skill training for such LITTLE reward.
I WANT AN ANSWER FROM THE DEV's that they actually have read these posts on here saying pretty much the same thing and they realize that the players are valuable like you preach you do but ACT THE OPPOSITE.
This isn't just about RP whining - i don't care that much about it in the grand scheme of things - but quit nerfing things instead of fixing them like the OLD CCP we were ALL TOLD WAS GONE.
TEAM GAME OF THRONES JUST LOST A LOT OF RESPECT FROM ME and this coming from their welcomed post about their Inventory changes. :(
Peace out - Grady |

S810 Jr
Shadows Of The Federation Drunk 'n' Disorderly
0
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 17:46:00 -
[283] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote:Hey people, here are some answers for you. *Stuffs*
iHub LP buffer amount ? Isn't 50K (100K earned plexing) a little too low? |

Vanessa Vansen
Cybermana
22
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 17:48:00 -
[284] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote:Hey people, here are some answers for you. * THE DATACORES, IT'S OVER 9000?! Good point regarding mechanical engineering datacores, we will most likely spread this type out to all factions before release. Regarding the change itself, we will not actively adjust the RP amounts you have prior or after release. Which means players cashing in datacores that were worth 150 RP for 100 RP after release will get an advantage. Since the field multipliers are being removed, this change also means players will receive them slower, for 100 and 150 RP fields. But, since all of them now require 100 RP to be exchanged, it will be pretty balanced in the long run. R&D skills will unfortunately not be reimbursed as this profession is not going away - it will most likely be looked into and changed into a more active state separately in the future not to abandon players that invested time and effort into it. Hope that helps! 
No, it does not!
What have datacores to do with factional warfare? - Nothing! Why should datacores have to do something with factional warefare? - No, idea! Did you consider the gain in profit for owners of T2 BPO? - I don't think so.
So, I would be interested in data (not statistics, I only trust the statistics that I faked myself) How much can you make out of datacore farming? Why should it be bad, that it is passive? - Maybe because it reduces the price of datacores, hence the T2 BPO owners do make less profit!
|

Grady Eltoren
Aviation Professionals for EVE
41
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 17:56:00 -
[285] - Quote
Suek Thyben wrote:How about lowering taxes on PI for militia members as the upgrades of systems go up? This would give smaller corps and gangs incetives to join and bring in industiral ships into the systems, which could create interesting PVP dynamic. It also should be easy to implement and it is allways noce to see systems interact together.
Also, it may reinvigorate market in contested space, as more neutrals will come to sell and buy PI goods (and its shame to make trip profitable only one way)
+1 - I like this idea.
It will help make low sec even more attractive by encouraging more PI there.
|

Cromwell Savage
The Rock Hard Roosters Villore Accords
60
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 17:57:00 -
[286] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote: * WHAT ABOUT CYNO JAMMERS? The idea was postponed after the feedback we received at Fanfest / forums. It's not out though, but initial discussions showed us that if there is one feature we need to carefully tread with, it's that one as it impacts a -lot- of third party players as well.
Yet we will have a station docking mechanic that shuts out an entire militia....
I'm fine with/will adapt to any and all other changes, but the full system station docking mechanic is the exact wrong way to go for FW, imho. So much so that after 3 years of FW that I may drop it depending on how things settle out post-release. There are other ways to make the "losing" side feel the pain without something as extreme as this - i.e. limiting docking denial to militia corp stations only and services at all remaining...or some combination thereof. I fear the full system lock out will do more harm than good.
Do appreciate the replies/answers though. |

Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
3851
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 17:58:00 -
[287] - Quote
Role Play Excuse why FW has to do with research cores.
Location of rare and valuable artifacts and research labs.
|

Grady Eltoren
Aviation Professionals for EVE
41
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 18:09:00 -
[288] - Quote
Droxlyn wrote:The idea of locking people out of stations is interesting. But why not turn it into an ISK sink and charge a docking fee instead? Don't make it a trivial fee either. Something along the lines of Max(Standing * -1000000, 1000000). That way, you can if you need to, but you think a little about doing it often. And it gets ISK out of the economy.
Another great idea.
Make it so cost prohibitive to someone who has horrible standing with said station and (or) is in the opposing militia. If it is so low that station can shoot at that person even.
I never could figure out why we didn't do this in EVE from the time I started playing.
Quoted for outside the box excellence.
P.S. CCP Ytterbium - thank you for your post talking about getting back to science at a later date.
BUT PLEASE do not be the CCP of old and say that and don't. I just think this whole RP thing is a slap in the face and patched on to something else when it should be it's own project rolled out at the SAME time as science. My .02 isk.
Less caps this time. :) I am calming down. |

Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
87
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 18:11:00 -
[289] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote:...Once more for those who can't read/think, but without adding anything of value... Errrm. Since you made no mention of I take it the complete eradication of the Amarr militia is a design goal?
Caldari will muddle through, they have the bodies and incentives will make them come out to die plex, but even if Amarr was somehow able to field plexing numbers equal to that of the Shakorites the ease with which they can plex necessitates a 4:1 ratio (low estimate) just to keep up ... you should seriously consider bringing NPC balance back on the table for the initial release or scrapping the lockout "consequence" until such time that you do get around to it.
As for avoiding the inevitable snowball .. what is your genius plan to solve that one .. datacores is nowhere near enough and the crippling (as in Greek debt agreement crippling) LP penalty + lockouts will turn the uphill struggle into a sheer rockface climb so people will more than likely opt for pulling up stakes.
PS: I have asked Hans to tell you, but have no confirmation that he registered it so here goes - Your pet economist has done good work making you more aware of how a market works (judging by decrease in major "whoopsies"), but you still seem to have problems handling the curious beast called human nature. May I recommend you look towards hiring/collaborating with an anthropologist, psychologist or someone similar who has a better understanding of what makes people tick?
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Sarinat Talen
Celestial Arms Manufacturing and Operations New Eden Research.
7
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 18:30:00 -
[290] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote:Hey people, here are some answers for you. * THE DATACORES, IT'S OVER 9000?! Good point regarding mechanical engineering datacores, we will most likely spread this type out to all factions before release. Regarding the change itself, we will not actively adjust the RP amounts you have prior or after release. Which means players cashing in datacores that were worth 150 RP for 100 RP after release will get an advantage. Since the field multipliers are being removed, this change also means players will receive them slower, for 100 and 150 RP fields. But, since all of them now require 100 RP to be exchanged, it will be pretty balanced in the long run. R&D skills will unfortunately not be reimbursed as this profession is not going away - it will most likely be looked into and changed into a more active state separately in the future not to abandon players that invested time and effort into it. Hope that helps! 
Thank you for taking the time to answer player questions. However by giving DCs to FW you are in fact abandoning the players you say you will not be. |
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Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
2346
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 18:34:00 -
[291] - Quote
Some feedback for the developers:
I am hearing reports that the IHUB hitpoints have been increased by 129% ??
Increasing the hitpoints of the IHUB would ensure that only those militia corps with a massive battleship fleet and / or Dreadnoughts could capture it in a reasonable amount of time, this goes against everything CCP has committed to publicly with not streamlining the actual gameplay to coincide with 0.0 sovereignty, even if youGGVd like to streamline the terminology.
Long, protracted structure shoots are exactly what we NEVER want to see built into Factional Warfare mechanics, this will outrage players and severely limit which groups can participate in a system seizure.
If this is indeed the case, please, please roll back the change and allow the control bunker to remain at its current hit point level. The graphics are beautiful and the structure immense in size, but a longer, drawn out structure shoot goes against everything we enjoy about Faction Warfare compared to 0.0 sovereignty.
Docking access is tolerable (at least as far as trying this new system out) because the flip times give players time to move, and because they could potentially increase the number of small gang fights to be had. But more than double the structure grind? - this just flat out punishes small group activity and has no place in Faction Warfare.
Vice Secretary of the 7th Council of Stellar Management.
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Julius Foederatus
Hyper-Nova
79
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 18:37:00 -
[292] - Quote
A few things:
Splitting LP rewards is not a good idea IMO. You shouldn't be disincentivizing people to not play together in a multiplayer game. I understand people want to try and limit blobbing, but all you're really doing is penalizing people for actually putting enough numbers into a plex to capture it. If the defenders show up with 10 guys and you have to bring in 5 more to kick them out, you'll get kicked in the nuts on your reward for doing the only thing you could while still actually participating in the occupancy fight.
Station docking rights need to affect neutrals with bad standings. It's just that simple. If you all don't do this, the whole station lockout thing will be abused to the point of being meaningless. Not to mention the fact that our biggest enemies in Gal Mil are the local pirates, rather than the squids. It's stupid to allow your enemies to dock in your stations when you have control of the system, whether those enemies are pirates or enemy militiamen.
The LP penalties are stupidly high. You should not penalize a side for losing by making it so they can't afford to replace their own losses. The ship loss rate in FW is probably greater than any other area of the game, and the only reason we're able to keep fighting each other is because we're able to earn enough isk to replace those losses. Making it harder for the losing side to replace losses just adds to the snowball effect.
Please, take out FW missions. Everyone hates them, except the farmers. If you won't take them out, at least nerf them into the ground so they're not a viable means of getting the best FW store items. Farmers are the scourge of FW and you all just can't seem to stop buffing them. They don't contribute to FW, in fact they actively hurt it by crashing our LP store markets so that we can't replace our losses. If what they did had an actual contribution to FW it would be at least tolerable, but they're only there to make isk. I've said it many times, but we actually have pirates who keep alts in FW that run our missions so they can make enough money to keep shooting at us. How ridiculous does it need to get for you all to see the problem here?
For the love of god put cyno jammers in as an upgrade. You can't imagine how many fights have been ruined by bored entities showing up with a cyno pilgrim a titan bridge on one of our fights from across the galaxy. If system ownership is actually going to mean something, let us exercise some goddamn control over our area.
I like that you all are actually trying to fix our broken FW playground, but creating all these loopholes just kills it even faster by driving people away. |

Hrett
Quantum Cats Syndicate Villore Accords
80
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 19:13:00 -
[293] - Quote
I know I might have mentioned this before but just in case:
Offensive plexing can be exploited too. People will just go to backwater systems and plex minors in speed fit condors or atrons.
Please give LP for both offensive and defensive, but only after a system is contested. That will create real conflict systems where fights will happen. Otherwise mission farmers are just going to turn into offensive plex farmers in backwater systems.
Oh, and cyno jammers please. |

Vyktor Abyss
Shadows Of The Federation Drunk 'n' Disorderly
139
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 19:24:00 -
[294] - Quote
Julius Foederatus above makes some good points.
I just wanted to post this quick idea - what about having missions be offered to you based on your pvp or plexing effort?
For example make a couple of good kills or take a couple of plexes and you get a mission offer? Might combat the farmers a bit. |

Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3089
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 19:37:00 -
[295] - Quote
Grady Eltoren wrote: I don't "farm" that much but I am pissed at CCP's take on this situation and it completely rings true of their past mistakes and the reason we BURNED JITA. You guys seem REALLY OUT OF TOUCH HERE.
who the **** is "we" pubbie scum |

Valerie Valate
Church of The Crimson Saviour
91
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 19:51:00 -
[296] - Quote
a minor thing relating to faction warfare.
Clone locations.
A character can move their clone, to any of the following: the station they're in (if it has a medical facility) any stations their corp has an office in stations belonging to their school corporation.
Now, for an Amarrian character that has the school corporation "Imperial Academy", then they can move clones to any Imperial Academy station.
But if that character is enlisted in say, the Minmatar militia, then that is not really convenient.
Would it be possible to add stations belonging to a character's militia to the places that a character can move their clone to ? perhaps replacing the school corporation?
So that a character can move their clone to: the station they're in any stations their corp has an office in stations belonging to their militia
Would there be any downsides/potential exploits with this ? |

Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
2349
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 20:02:00 -
[297] - Quote
Julius Foederatus wrote:Splitting LP rewards is not a good idea IMO. You shouldn't be disincentivizing people to not play together in a multiplayer game. I understand people want to try and limit blobbing, but all you're really doing is penalizing people for actually putting enough numbers into a plex to capture it. If the defenders show up with 10 guys and you have to bring in 5 more to kick them out, you'll get kicked in the nuts on your reward for doing the only thing you could while still actually participating in the occupancy fight.
Splitting LP rewards for plexing isn't just a good idea, its necessary to prevent farming on an absurd scale. Otherwise certain *cough* individuals *ahem* are going to use an army of 27 alts inside seize each plex they find, stacking LP endlessly.
Same goes for PvP kills, the only way a PvP payout can be given such that it prevents exploitation with alts in enemy militias is for the total payout to be less than the value of the ship that is lost. If you start handing out the same LP to everyone who participates, all you have to do is load up on enemy alts to blow up your own ships and and endless profit fountain can be created.
I think its far better to skimp on the rewards given to large plexing groups, than to implement some sort of a flat payout that can be stacked and exploited.
As for mission running - you'll never find a bigger advocate for killing the farming of militia missions than myself. From suggestions like Vyktor Abyss's all the way to the pending NPC balancing, I'd say CCP Ytterbium is getting pretty tired of hearing me cry out 'DEATH TO MISSION FARMING" on the internal forums and clearly understands the need to do something about this in subsequent releases. Vice Secretary of the 7th Council of Stellar Management.
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Vanessa Vansen
Cybermana
23
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 20:19:00 -
[298] - Quote
A bold way to make datacores "active" ...
- Remove T2 BPOs -> provide isk replacement
- Remove R&D agents -> reimburse all skill points in R&D skills unless they are a requirement for another trained skill
- Sell BPOs (yes, BPOs not BPCs) for datacores -> now, researcher can produce what they need -> more need for minerals or ring minerals, just don't tie them to something like faction warfare
- done
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Toronto Mohican
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
0
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 20:24:00 -
[299] - Quote
Zakurai wrote:Unless your ultimate goal is to have people just buy plexes to cash in to fund their PVP, leave the RP alone.
This is there ultimate goal.
They couldn't squeeze the money they wanted out of us with the nex store so they are taking eve's most fun feature PVP, and turning it into an additional pay to play feature.
I was hoping one day Id be able to buy plex with isk to play this game for free. Seems like Ill have to be paying cash to sell plex on the market to replace ship losses since tech II will shoot through the roof.
Well done soundwave your making us pay a sub and pay more in cash to replace our ships. Glad my years of loyalty to this game is being rewarded with, give us more of your money its not enough.
***** the datacore changes.
Yes in the interview Soundwave mentioned that he wanted to do away with RP agents all together and didn't mention what mechanic could replace them. How are we supposed to get datacores? Solely from FW?
Who owns the tech II BPOs? Who owns them? Think.
People should have choices on what they want to do in this game. More and more it seems your only goal is to get more of us to join some massive blob alliance and grind in null sec.
EVERY ONE DOESNT WANT TO LIVE IN NULL SEC. Get that through your thick skulls! |

Tiger's Spirit
Troll Hunters INC.
75
 |
Posted - 2012.05.10 20:38:00 -
[300] - Quote
Grady Eltoren wrote:blabla
Do you know what is mean FW ? Don't cry about datacores go and fight with your milicia.
Those pilots crying who just want easy money in the FW, but when the FW need them to fight, they just carebearing and not help for the other FW members. |
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