Pages: 1 2 :: [one page] |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Evelgrivion
Ignatium. Rote Kapelle
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 09:17:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Evelgrivion on 20/05/2009 09:26:27 Edited by: Evelgrivion on 20/05/2009 09:18:36 Rather than list out creative solutions for why Tech 3 ships are expensive, I'm going to attempt to establish the sources of the high prices. Facts work better than theories for curing problems, after all. Without further ado,
Things that are keeping Tech 3 expensive:
- High demand for particular salvage components (IE Neurovisual Input Matrix)
- High cost of subsystem datacores, between 10 and 24 million ISK each
- Three required subsystem datacores for each Reverse Engineering job
- Generally low overall success rate
- Low desirability for several subsystem varieties
- Six individual job successes required for the production of three Strategic Cruisers
- Very high skill barrier to manufacturing entry
Some of these problems can let market forces work themselves out over time. Others may require more a much more deliberate approach in order to bring prices down to the desired levels.
Please feel free to add other reasons if I have missed them!
|
Dragon Greg
Amarr
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 09:18:00 -
[2]
Spam removed. ~Weatherman |
Ratchman
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 09:24:00 -
[3]
They are also very dependent on wormhole access, and I don't think this has been quite the success CCP were hoping.
Still, prices will reduce with time, but don't expect them to ever be that affordable.
|
Reven Cordelle
Caldari Yamainu-Mirai Heavy Industries
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 09:25:00 -
[4]
Yep, pretty much.
I estimate we're looking at months before we see a drop in price. Further extended by recent gamebreaking developments.
|
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 09:30:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Evelgrivion Things that are keeping Tech 3 expensive:
Yeah, how about this... the current chokepoint is datacores ; if the current chokepoint gets loosened, you get several other chokepoints as price goes down slowly ; the final chokepoint will be the gasses, there's simply too much of them needed (compared to manhours it takes to harvest them) to ever have T3 reach a decent pricelevel... when you compare the income level of L4 highsec missions (and their practical lack of risk) with the income level you can expect in w-space (and its considerable higher risk).
In other words, it's simply too much bother to "farm" wormholes (the logistics of it all, the coordination needed, the risks involved, the less-than-spectacular income level due to the lousy drop and harvest rates), and as long as w-space is not "on farm status", T3 pricess can never reach a respectable level.
EVE issues|Mining revamp|Build stuff|Make ISK |
RiotRick
Black-Sun
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 10:30:00 -
[6]
I also think lot's of people are stockpiling the sleeper loot, while they are waiting for their reverse engineering skills etc. to max out. The t3 stuff has only been ingame for a relative short while, just wait a bit longer until everything stabilizes. -- The future is black.
|
SkyLordUK
Amarr Baptism oF Fire Sons of Tangra
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 10:42:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Evelgrivion Edited by: Evelgrivion on 20/05/2009 09:26:27 Edited by: Evelgrivion on 20/05/2009 09:18:36 Rather than list out creative solutions for why Tech 3 ships are expensive, I'm going to attempt to establish the sources of the high prices. Facts work better than theories for curing problems, after all. Without further ado,
Things that are keeping Tech 3 expensive:
- High demand for particular salvage components (IE Neurovisual Input Matrix)
- High cost of subsystem datacores, between 10 and 24 million ISK each
- Three required subsystem datacores for each Reverse Engineering job
- Generally low overall success rate
- Low desirability for several subsystem varieties
- Six individual job successes required for the production of three Strategic Cruisers
- Very high skill barrier to manufacturing entry
Some of these problems can let market forces work themselves out over time. Others may require more a much more deliberate approach in order to bring prices down to the desired levels.
Please feel free to add other reasons if I have missed them!
Dont forget the Low drop rate of some data cores as well Sky. ---------------------------------------------- Jumping Gates is like a box of sweets
You just dont know were the sour one is |
Siigari Kitawa
Gallente The Aduro Protocol
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 10:46:00 -
[8]
Why are the Neurovisual Input Matrixes worth so much?
I just checked my assets and I have a few hundred of them.
|
Asith
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 10:51:00 -
[9]
Im currently joint leading a corp in wormhole space, with the aims to build t3 ships, atm the biggestest draw back is gas!!!
The high end stuff is far too rare like c320 and c540 and to build t3 we need lot, so atm we have like 20 BPCs sitting around waiting till we build up the supplies of c320 and c540, and even then the cost of the t3 items compared to selling the actual componets, makes me wonder about the viability of stay out in wormhole space.
atm the BPCs seem to produce too little for the input to allow me to lower the prices to around 400 mill for hull and subsystems, i believe ccp, will need to change the system slightly to make is as vaiable as say a commandship.
In the end it might end up causing the industry to collapse if the prices aren't affordable!!!!!!
|
DrefsabZN
Caldari Butterfly Effect Corp.
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 12:54:00 -
[10]
Yup tech 3's main limitations for me have been the high end gas and the data cores.
As you see very little isk return for your output until you have finished products so most people cant be bothered with it in my corp any more :(
|
|
Nol Agnot
Nightwatch Immortal
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 13:03:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Why are the Neurovisual Input Matrixes worth so much?
I just checked my assets and I have a few hundred of them.
That's your answer right there, clueless people not selling them.
Delenda est achura. |
Major Stormer
Caldari MEK Enterprises
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 13:22:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Why are the Neurovisual Input Matrixes worth so much?
I just checked my assets and I have a few hundred of them.
Feel free to send them to me if you dont want them. --- http://www.scrapheap-challenge.com [url=http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1072506]Entire Low Sec Overhaul[/url] |
Xiaodown
Guiding Hand Social Club
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 13:28:00 -
[13]
I'm out of the loop here, do the datacores drop in wormhole space, or do they come from agents? --
|
Armoured C
Gallente Federation of Freedom Fighters Aggression.
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 13:31:00 -
[14]
it expensive because people will pay that, remember it is player run these market yiou know
if you buy eve in a box from my game store i will give you isk (GAME , parkgate rotherham)
|
rodensteiner
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 13:33:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Ratchman They are also very dependent on wormhole access, and I don't think this has been quite the success CCP were hoping.
I think I have to respectably counter that statement. On the occasions that I go out scanning, just to see what I can find, I've been able to find wormholes quite easily. If not in my home system, then usually within 3 or so jumps. I've also had just as much luck in non-0.0 sec systems.
|
Major Stormer
Caldari MEK Enterprises
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 13:44:00 -
[16]
Actual answer: its expensive because by and large the 0.0 alliances arnt paying much attention, which is a very very very good thing, and they are hard to farm, to lazy arse farmers ignore them, and they expose you to the most dangerious pvp around, which requires you being active and interested in defending yourself, so carebears who are scared of anything that doesnt read *0.5 or above* dont go there.
All in all, is fine.
--- http://www.scrapheap-challenge.com |
Dravius Luxor
Minmatar Phoibe Enterprises
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 14:42:00 -
[17]
Originally by: rodensteiner
Originally by: Ratchman They are also very dependent on wormhole access, and I don't think this has been quite the success CCP were hoping.
I think I have to respectably counter that statement. On the occasions that I go out scanning, just to see what I can find, I've been able to find wormholes quite easily. If not in my home system, then usually within 3 or so jumps. I've also had just as much luck in non-0.0 sec systems.
Yeah, me too. Once you have a method you're happy with, wormholes are an extremely viable method of travel, they are absolutely everywhere.
My current record is 4 open wh's in one system, and at one time a wh dropped me from 0.0 to Motsu. Out of curiosity, I scanned Motsu... and lo and behold, another wormhole!
|
Meeogi
Amarr Lone Star Privateers
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 14:50:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Major Stormer Actual answer: its expensive because by and large the 0.0 alliances arnt paying much attention, which is a very very very good thing, and they are hard to farm, to lazy arse farmers ignore them, and they expose you to the most dangerious pvp around, which requires you being active and interested in defending yourself, so carebears who are scared of anything that doesnt read *0.5 or above* dont go there.
All in all, is fine.
QFT HERE, HERE!!!...Standing ovation
Wax on Wax off |
Braaage
Ministry of Craft
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 14:54:00 -
[19]
Things that are keeping Tech 3 expensive:
Reverse Engineering << this alone - which is caused by high datacore prices and the inability to select the subsystem you want coupled with the fact CCP still will not tell us if any of the skills make any difference to the outcome of Rev Eng jobs.
Material prices are NOT putting up the price of the subsystems or keeping the price up there, it is all down to the reverse engineering part.
If you any proof of that look at the most common reverse engineering successes and the subsystem prices (yep those which are being sold at 40-80M). --
POSs, Outposts, Exploration, Mining, Invention, Boosters, EA EVE Database, T2/T3 production & more |
Space Wanderer
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 14:55:00 -
[20]
As you said most of those reasons will work out themselves in the long run, or they are just an elaboration of the others. The only two things that probably won't sort themselves out are:
Originally by: Evelgrivion
- High demand for particular salvage components (IE Neurovisual Input Matrix)
- High cost of subsystem datacores, between 10 and 24 million ISK each
1) It is not really true that there is high demand for particular salvage components, for instance the neurovisual input matrixes are not in such a demand. It's just that they seem to be more rare (probably they drop much less than other stuff).
2) Same can be said for the datacores. They drop too rarely.
The rest can and will sort itself out.
|
|
Lucias Trask
The White Aces
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 15:21:00 -
[21]
I have noticed that when building components the interfaces are a chokepoint, but not sufficently as to be a major barrier. You just have to go out and kill more sleepers, they really arent HARD to find.
As for the gas, in our wormhole we are limted to what shows up around us and in connecting systems. Its difficult at times to find gas, but when we do we have the reactions waiting and ready to go.
We dont do the entire T3 supply chain, but we get up to components and have debating using our research material, but the cost is high and the chances are low. [PANIC] |
Template Girl
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 16:12:00 -
[22]
There is one more reason why prices are high and will stay high, and I believe this one is the most important because it defies the logic of 'players will decide the price' (aka supply and demand). Producers cannot choose which subsystem they want to build out of the four possible options per category. What this means is producers cannot meet the demand for certain subsystems, they have to 'roll the dice' on the general category of the subsystem and hope they get lucky on their BPC. If they don't, they have to do the work all over again just to get another 'roll' with 1/4 odds. If producers could actually meet the demand for the popular subsystems there wouldn't be a supply choke/spike in prices. Producers would focus on the systems that sell and consumers would get the system they wanted.
This also magnifies the salvage and datacore problem because producers need enough for multiple jobs just to ensure they get the system they want.
|
Some Advisor
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 16:30:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Space Wanderer
As you said most of those reasons will work out themselves in the long run, or they are just an elaboration of the others. The only two things that probably won't sort themselves out are:
Originally by: Evelgrivion
- High demand for particular salvage components (IE Neurovisual Input Matrix)
- High cost of subsystem datacores, between 10 and 24 million ISK each
1) It is not really true that there is high demand for particular salvage components, for instance the neurovisual input matrixes are not in such a demand. It's just that they seem to be more rare (probably they drop much less than other stuff).
2) Same can be said for the datacores. They drop too rarely.
The rest can and will sort itself out.
ya, i can work with the bit of neurovision thingys, other things are more needed like that modified fluid router in my view.
also, a little bit easier access to c320 and c540 would be fine, even if its a very small patch in class 3/4 :P
|
Space Wanderer
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 17:08:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Some Advisor ya, i can work with the bit of neurovision thingys, other things are more needed like that modified fluid router in my view.
I judge from the prices. The higher share it takes in building the stuff, the more rare is that component. Modified fluid routers are ridicoulously cheap and do not affect construction prices relevantly. Neurovisual input matrixes do.
|
Troye
Gallente Intelligent Concepts Inc People for Organised Peace
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 17:14:00 -
[25]
Getting the recources for tec3 production is almost an entirely new game in its self, it will take awhile for corporations to realise and adapt to the new WH enviroment and get stable production lines setup.
Its not at all uncommon for new ships/toys to start off at high prices when they've only realy just been added. Leave it afew more moths and if things are still the same then perhaps its time for some CCP intervention. _______________________________________
|
DigitalCommunist
November Corporation
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 17:22:00 -
[26]
Edited by: DigitalCommunist on 20/05/2009 17:24:00 Too many weak reasons, the answer is a simple one of economics. Tech 3 is expensive because demand is high and the supply is not.
Demand is high because..
- skills are stupid low and everyone can fly it right now - T3 ships themselves are blatantly superior in every way - T3 is new, and pretty
Supply is low because..
- it isn't generated through passive efforts like moon materials are, but grind and manpower, and unlike low end minerals or ice, farmers aren't there to drive prices down - most of the playerbase lives in empire and makes steady, safe income through lvl 4s - the ones that don't have better use of the manpower, like wars and moons - it takes a sizeable gang to tackle the biggest sleeper encounters, and most people don't "do" teamwork even if its obvious that your main + your alt won't cut it
Despite this, price has been dropping hard because the profits are shifting away from manufacturers to suppliers. The low end materials are flooded and dirt cheap because most of the WH stuff that happens is in the shallow end of the pool (empire wh linking to crappy unknown space).
Most of the cost of T3 ships now comes from a select few high end components made from high end gasses, and the hacking/archaeology stuff that is in far less abundance, and far fewer people do.
|
Ventoro Roliata
Caldari
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 17:26:00 -
[27]
OP has some excellent points. Some of the other replies here though are lol clueless. Just FYI you can buy 265 modified fluid routers for the price of one neurovisual input matrices. At the current 8+ million price of the neurovisual matrices the 48 needed for a ship and subsytems are now adding esentially 400 million isk to the cost of the ship. I have built 6 tengu now doing all the ratting/salvaging myself. I have been constantly out of the neurovisuals while I have thousands of pieces of some of the salvage in stock and hundreds of the blue pieces lying around, and dozens of the pyramid pieces. By my experiences it takes several days of normal wormhole exploration to find the rats and complexes to get enough neurovisuals for one ship. There is no way to increase the supply enough to lower the prices of t3 ships. The current game design essentially means we have 13/15 of the sleeper salvage pieces approaching being worthless, while one piece drops so rarely compared with the amount needed the price has risen to astronomical levels. To me this just feels like really sloppy game design. This issue has been brought up many times in several threads and as far as I can tell, CCP has not chosen to address it, now 2 1/2 months after implementing it into the game.
|
NL Nataku
Manson Family
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 17:33:00 -
[28]
When it was introduced i was like awnsome idea. But i knew then that it would be expensive now it has not been that long but DAMN.
I not the poorest in the game but also cerntainly not the richest but if it stays like this i will never ever fly one. Infact truth be told if its going to cost more then 300 mil for everything i will simply never fly it. Its simply not worth loosing that amount of cash in a game where you know you will lost it at some point. And i simply dont make the amount of money to keep myself getting new ships of 300mil and up every week if not within a few days. I mean its more affordeble to fly capitals then these ships since you can insure them. Wich brings me to the point that i still think every ship should be insureble for what its worth not its T1 counterpart, offcourse many will disagree but they are probably sitting on a fat wallet and the things not everybody has acces to. Its also not the only ship that seems a bit overpriced i mean if you get attacked by 10 guys will you survive most likely not. Correct me if i am wrong though about the T3 cruiser but i dont see that happening. So right now the total cost of a t3 is is what 1.5bil so how many people are actually out there that wanna spend that much money on a ship to pvp with and know that they will lose it at one point. I think even the rich people in eve will scratch behind their ears before touching something like that.
|
Some Advisor
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 17:48:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Some Advisor on 20/05/2009 17:49:05
Originally by: Space Wanderer
Originally by: Some Advisor ya, i can work with the bit of neurovision thingys, other things are more needed like that modified fluid router in my view.
I judge from the prices. The higher share it takes in building the stuff, the more rare is that component. Modified fluid routers are ridicoulously cheap and do not affect construction prices relevantly. Neurovisual input matrixes do.
maybe, but it looks to me that input matrix wont be needed in too many parts for the final assembly. but i need modified fluid router for *EVERY* single item i make, and i need quite some "nanowire composites" for a complete hull. This alone adds up, follow up would be "metallofullerene plating".
Gas Reaction T3 Components
but i prolyl have no clue how the market works, for me inputmatrix are "rare", but not as rare for me when i look into production where i only need a bit of those, but alot more of "Modified fluid router" :P spawnrate of everything salvage-like seems almost fine :P (almost)
now i just lack a little bit of c320 and 540 and i should be able to do the very first own t3 ship straight from the ground of harvesting the basics :P
|
James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates The Star Fraction
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 17:50:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Armoured C it expensive because people will pay that, remember it is player run these market yiou know
No, it's not. It's expensive because it takes a lot of man hours to produce one. People will pay absurd prices, but even if they didn't, the price wouldn't necessarily drop - not until there's enough people entering the market, considering it 'worth their time' to produce them faster. I'm voting for Heartstone for the CSM. http://www.eveonline.com/council/voting/Default.asp |
|
Aargh
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 17:56:00 -
[31]
A lot of people who've entered into the manufacturing process don't have the requisite skills yet. Hell, I haven't just yet and I already had Cruiser Construction V.
|
Letri Bimmet
Gallente Estrale Frontiers
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 18:05:00 -
[32]
The stuff you get in w-space is pretty random yeah.
For example I found 11 propulsion datacores in a single plex, The next day I found the same plex...in a system with the same class, and it had almost nothing.
|
Some Advisor
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 18:05:00 -
[33]
Edited by: Some Advisor on 20/05/2009 18:05:44 yep, also an issue.
5 days for the final stuff, then i see how it goes :P
@letri: yep, did 2 radar today, not a single datacore :( but at least finaly +2 more gallentedecryptors to make something out of it :)
|
Driven
Caldari Mass Produced Superior Eve Engineering
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 21:18:00 -
[34]
I've produced over 100B worth of T3 so far and can tell you that anyone who has produced at any decent scale, would within a few hours, have identified built-in manufacturing roadblocks with a simple analysis of drop-rate on salvage and incidence-rate on gas vs. use rate in production.
I did a crude analysis of the use-rate necessary to produce a full set of 1) one hull and 2) 15 subsystems when T3 first came out so I would know what materials would be rare. Given the engineered-in road blocks currently confronting producers, and causing the high prices, I'm willing to bet this was overlooked when drop rates and incidence rates on salvage and gas were determined.
So, take for example a "full-set" production of:
1 hull 3 each of the 5 different subs = 15 subs total
Example #1: C-320 - gas
The use rate in manufacturing to produce a full set as described above is 6,300 units, in order to make all of the Carbon 86 you need, 6X higher use rate than C-540, but the rarity is apparently the same or similar. This is why 540 is so much cheaper usually than 320, and why offensive and defensive subs cost much more than others to make.
Also, has anyone who makes these game design decisions noticed that 320 has the second highest use rate of all gases? Its one of the rarest and used almost as much as 32, which is the only gas with a higher use rate, and both are needed for Carbon 86, which is needed for the Power Conduits and Neurovisual Output Analyzers. Is it any wonder that Carbon 86 costs so much?
Example #2: Neurovisual Input Matrix - salvage
There are only 3 salvage components - Electromechanicals, Modified Fluids, and Powdered C-540s - with a higher use rate, yet the drop rate on these items must be 2 or 3 orders of magnitude lower than those 3 items, given availability spectrum on the market.
Example #3 - Fulleroferrocene Power Conduits
The conspiratorial issue is these need both 1) high levels of C-320 and 2) large numbers of Neurovisual Input Matrix for producing the power conduits, and power conduits are used in 4 out of the 5 subsystem types, and in the hulls, making them both very necessary and simultaneously exorbitantly expensive.
As long as this built in requirement for high volumes of rare materials remains as is, T3 prices will not drop to affordable levels for the average player.
This is an economic fact of life that can only be fixed by:
Changing the requirements for producing either the Carbon 86 or the power conduits to use other more common materials
Increasing the drop rate of the Neurovisual Input Matrix, perhaps in combination with the above, and perhaps also tweeking the needs for the melted nanoribbons, which are bordering on out-of-whack
It would also benefit affordability for T3 if perhaps the need for the power conduits in one more of the other subsystem types were eliminated.
I need a sig |
Amateratsu
Caldari The Pegasus Project
|
Posted - 2009.05.20 21:49:00 -
[35]
Building T3 Cruisers is so not worth the time and effort involved currently.
Due to the bottlenecks on some of the materials needed, those materials are worth more than you can sell the completed ships for...
Add to that, that every failed reverse engineering attempt for a Cruiser Hull will burn over 300m isk in materials, you will end up loosing isk in the long run.
Untill the bottleneck materials are opened up, forget it....
á
|
Baillif
|
Posted - 2009.05.22 04:05:00 -
[36]
The only thing that needs to happen that would cause T3 prices to drop like a rock is the increase in the value of the tags that drop off sleepers to bring them more into line with the ISK/hr of level 4 missions or ratting in null sec. More people would be in WH's, and more sites would be run, and more gas would be harvested, and more spaceship ninja/delayed local ganking would occur and it would be glorious!
|
eFart
Minmatar
|
Posted - 2009.05.22 04:18:00 -
[37]
cuz their loot is expensve make loot cheeper
|
OffBeaT
Caldari Caldari Provisions
|
Posted - 2009.05.22 04:23:00 -
[38]
Edited by: OffBeaT on 22/05/2009 04:24:47 these ships should stay what they are as high end priced solo attack ships.. for the players who wont to risk the most with a very versatile ship.
a nit-ch ship not a common everyday used ship.
|
Intense Thinker
Minmatar
|
Posted - 2009.05.22 04:28:00 -
[39]
T3 is still in the OMFG NEW!!!! phase and that's why it's so expensive
Pomp FTW!!! |
Kendar
Gallente Disney inc
|
Posted - 2009.05.22 06:01:00 -
[40]
i dont think anything should be changed atm, its only a few months since it was released and as more people develop good strategies to deal with the sleepers more components will go to market, and as soon as the large alliances get a steady productionline of ships the price will drop
IMO T3 ships should not be the new bs
|
|
Miyamoto Uroki
Caldari Katsu Corporation
|
Posted - 2009.05.22 07:43:00 -
[41]
There are way better spreadsheets out there for tech3 production, but for everybody who just wants a quick oversight of the resources needed for one tech3 cruiser and one type of each subsystem without having to download something:
Click me
|
MukkBarovian
|
Posted - 2009.05.22 08:42:00 -
[42]
All hail Siigari who has pioneered the role t3 ships have in today's environment.
Hopefully the price goes down and the role shifts to something other than uber pimp lolmail.
|
Space Wanderer
|
Posted - 2009.05.22 09:05:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Some Advisor but i prolyl have no clue how the market works,
I tend to agree with this statement. Let me clarify.
Originally by: Some Advisor for me inputmatrix are "rare", but not as rare for me when i look into production where i only need a bit of those, but alot more of "Modified fluid router" :P
Yes. But if you compare how much easier is to get the fluid routers and the input matrix you notice that the ratio is the opposite. To clarify more: I build components, subsystems and ships. Usually don't harvest prime or reacted materials myself, so I go on the market to buy them. By doing so I noticed that buying the input matrixes alone is usually on the whereabouts of 40m per subsystem. Conversely, buying all the required fluid routers is about 2m per subsystem.
If you think that means that fluid routers are a bottleneck in production please go ahead.
|
KiloAlpha
Southern Cross Trilogy
|
Posted - 2009.05.22 09:42:00 -
[44]
someone will eventually write a macro for gathering WH loot dont worry lol
|
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
|
Posted - 2009.05.22 09:49:00 -
[45]
Originally by: KiloAlpha someone will eventually write a macro for gathering WH loot dont worry lol
Why do that and get less ISK/hour after the unavoidable loss of time searching for wormhole entries and the occasionall PVP loss... when you can write one for L4 highsec mission-running, waste zero time and be for most intents and purposes practically invulnerable ? Somebody with the brains to code a "WH exploitation bot" would have long before reached the conclusion that there's no point in writing it, when better alternatives exist. NOT EVEN BOTS would farm WH-space.
EVE issues|Mining revamp|Build stuff|Make ISK |
KiloAlpha
Southern Cross Trilogy
|
Posted - 2009.05.22 09:55:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: KiloAlpha someone will eventually write a macro for gathering WH loot dont worry lol
Why do that and get less ISK/hour after the unavoidable loss of time searching for wormhole entries and the occasionall PVP loss... when you can write one for L4 highsec mission-running, waste zero time and be for most intents and purposes practically invulnerable ? Somebody with the brains to code a "WH exploitation bot" would have long before reached the conclusion that there's no point in writing it, when better alternatives exist. NOT EVEN BOTS would farm WH-space.
indeed
|
Misanth
The Glenn Quagmire Finishing School for Young Ladies Eternal Rapture
|
Posted - 2009.05.22 10:31:00 -
[47]
Originally by: James Lyrus
Originally by: Armoured C it expensive because people will pay that, remember it is player run these market yiou know
No, it's not. It's expensive because it takes a lot of man hours to produce one. People will pay absurd prices, but even if they didn't, the price wouldn't necessarily drop - not until there's enough people entering the market, considering it 'worth their time' to produce them faster.
He forgot half of the 'supply and demand', only looking at the demand-part. The supply currently is limited. What part of the supply that is coming short, well that's being discussed in this thread.
For the main part it'll be hard to know, CCP got most stats, and we players don't know how much things that arn't in stock/not on market. CCP got the cards on the table, we can only make qualified guesses.
The gas is one thing mentioned here, and it does make sense on multiple aspects. Look at how people have been making isk; years ago corp ops and cooperation actually was a part of the game. Last few years most gone the 'self-supportive' route. Mining has been macroed in Empire, loots from drones, or in 0.0, several players run their own little mining ops. Higher end wormholes, and gas mining, suddenly benefit alot more from teamwork.
If CCP would make these things have a lower requirement on build, drop more frequent, etc, it would make the balance between lower/higher wormholes a tad poor, and teamwork would again be a bit useless. Same time, if CCP keeps it as it is, it might either keep the T3 prices up, or make players work better as team. And PvPers might actually get tighter alignment to the industrialists again.
That's just my view of this, but as I said, we're pretty much down to guesstimations at this point. - I'd tell you why but then I'll have to kill you. And to kill you I'd have to log in. And to log in I'd have to stop browsing these forums. Both you and me knows that'll never happen. |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
|
Posted - 2009.05.22 10:51:00 -
[48]
The myriad reason T3 is the failure that it is
Somebody else's thread over in GDF that explains it in painstaking detail.
EVE issues|Mining revamp|Build stuff|Make ISK |
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 :: [one page] |