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Anhenka
Renegade.Legion WHY so Seri0Us
0
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Posted - 2012.05.20 00:15:00 -
[1] - Quote
So I just reactivated after a year, and picked up some serious LP missioning.
But now I'm looking at how to best convert that LP into ISK, and it seems that the value of LP has dropped considerably over the past year since I left.
I sort of remember getting around 1.6mil isk/LP for Ministry of War, but now when I start adding up prices for tags and isk to redeem, there does not seem to be anything worth more than about 850k/LP.
Has LP value really dropped that much or is my memory of how much I got a year ago just plain bad? |
Leetha Layne
20
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Posted - 2012.05.20 05:11:00 -
[2] - Quote
It's just changed. |
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
476
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Posted - 2012.05.20 23:56:00 -
[3] - Quote
Tags are pretty variable. Play your buy orders right and you should still be able to get 1200+ ISK/LP (and yes, twice that isn't unheard of still today). Although if you were seriously getting 1.6mil ISK/LP -- well, then that market is shot. But I don't think it ever existed. Certainly never in empire. |
Drakarin
Omnitech Corporation Wonder Kids
7
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Posted - 2012.05.21 05:39:00 -
[4] - Quote
Over a million isk per lp?
There's no way. A single decent level 4 mission would be worth 5 billion isk on that scale. |
Texty
State War Academy Caldari State
22
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Posted - 2012.05.21 08:35:00 -
[5] - Quote
lol |
Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
426
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Posted - 2012.05.21 18:51:00 -
[6] - Quote
Anhenka wrote:So I just reactivated after a year, and picked up some serious LP missioning.
But now I'm looking at how to best convert that LP into ISK, and it seems that the value of LP has dropped considerably over the past year since I left.
I sort of remember getting around 1.6mil isk/LP for Ministry of War, but now when I start adding up prices for tags and isk to redeem, there does not seem to be anything worth more than about 850k/LP.
Has LP value really dropped that much or is my memory of how much I got a year ago just plain bad?
Several changes happened:
Incursions not only pay huge amounts of isk but they give lp that can be used in at lp store at an 80% conversion.
The agent quality went away now all agents are quality 20.
The skills to get more lp were simplified making it easier to get lp.
So yeah missioning is pretty much a dead end. If you want to grind isk you should do incursions or join the minmatar in faction war. They will make lots of isk. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Anhenka
Renegade.Legion WHY so Seri0Us
0
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Posted - 2012.05.21 19:05:00 -
[7] - Quote
Cearain wrote: Several changes happened:
Incursions not only pay huge amounts of isk but they give lp that can be used in at lp store at an 80% conversion.
The agent quality went away now all agents are quality 20.
The skills to get more lp were simplified making it easier to get lp.
So yeah missioning is pretty much a dead end. If you want to grind isk you should do incursions or join the minmatar in faction war. They will make lots of isk.
Thanks for someone finally giving a straight answer.
and yes people above, I meant 1.6k isk per LP not 1.6 million. |
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
478
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Posted - 2012.05.21 19:12:00 -
[8] - Quote
Cearain wrote:Anhenka wrote:Has LP value really dropped that much or is my memory of how much I got a year ago just plain bad? Several changes happened: Incursions not only pay huge amounts of isk but they give lp that can be used in at lp store at an 80% conversion. The agent quality went away now all agents are quality 20. The skills to get more lp were simplified making it easier to get lp. So yeah missioning is pretty much a dead end. If you want to grind isk you should do incursions or join the minmatar in faction war. They will make lots of isk.
No offense, but you clearly haven't taken a serious look at the economics of LP stores. Incursions do in fact provide a greater supply of LP, but that LP isn't optimally used in some random LP store. Incursion runners might cash some out for personal use that way (yay, more MIMAF), but it isn't having a major market effect.
In fact, I'd argue that incursions are actually doing the opposite: they are flooding so much ISK into the system that more people are paying higher prices for faction mods quite happily. And if you look at the actual numbers, this is the case: the market price of faction mods hasn't dropped and in most cases has trended upwards (just like, you know, everything else). The reason that the LP conversion rate has dropped isn't in the sale price, it's in the associated costs: tags.
As more people want to cash out LP, the demand on the limited tag supply is stretched -- in some cases to a breaking point. Most mission runners won't run anti-faction missions because getting cut off from half of high sec is unappealing to them (especially as they consider themselves already cut off from anything outside of high sec). So there they are, churning out LP left and right but buying tags if they actually want to turn it in to something shiny. Tag prices go way up, LP conversions rates go down.
Now, tag pressures are not constant. I already kind of alluded to this. As tag pressures grow on one set of tags (sending conversion rates down), they tend to be alleviated a bit on others (which shifts the "good" conversion rates to new items). Playing tag markets, either independently or in conjunction with LP conversion, is actually quite profitable. But it's something most people don't want to take the time/effort to do (even though you really oughtn't factor it too highly into your ISK/hr ratio as it's something that can easily be done while blitzing missions in your pimped Machariel).
So yeah. Too much LP isn't the proximal cause. Incursion LP most certainly isn't. Tags are. So here's a hint for the enterprising: bulk tags come from FW and L5s. If you want to make a killing, look there. You won't have nearly as much trouble converting your LP and you'll have extras to throw at the greedy L4 masses.
(Disclaimer: this is based on math that I haven't updated in several months, but I can't imagine it's shifted much. Managing tag orders while blitzing missions just isn't my idea of fun at this point and so the whole thing has dropped off of my radar in favor of figuring out how to take advantage of having deadspace mods on market....) |
Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
427
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Posted - 2012.05.21 19:53:00 -
[9] - Quote
Zhilia Mann wrote:Cearain wrote:Anhenka wrote:Has LP value really dropped that much or is my memory of how much I got a year ago just plain bad? Several changes happened: Incursions not only pay huge amounts of isk but they give lp that can be used in at lp store at an 80% conversion. The agent quality went away now all agents are quality 20. The skills to get more lp were simplified making it easier to get lp. So yeah missioning is pretty much a dead end. If you want to grind isk you should do incursions or join the minmatar in faction war. They will make lots of isk. No offense, but you clearly haven't taken a serious look at the economics of LP stores. Incursions do in fact provide a greater supply of LP, but that LP isn't optimally used in some random LP store. Incursion runners might cash some out for personal use that way (yay, more MIMAF), but it isn't having a major market effect. In fact, I'd argue that incursions are actually doing the opposite: they are flooding so much ISK into the system that more people are paying higher prices for faction mods quite happily. And if you look at the actual numbers, this is the case: the market price of faction mods hasn't dropped and in most cases has trended upwards (just like, you know, everything else). The reason that the LP conversion rate has dropped isn't in the sale price, it's in the associated costs: tags. As more people want to cash out LP, the demand on the limited tag supply is stretched -- in some cases to a breaking point. Most mission runners won't run anti-faction missions because getting cut off from half of high sec is unappealing to them (especially as they consider themselves already cut off from anything outside of high sec). So there they are, churning out LP left and right but buying tags if they actually want to turn it in to something shiny. Tag prices go way up, LP conversions rates go down. Now, tag pressures are not constant. I already kind of alluded to this. As tag pressures grow on one set of tags (sending conversion rates down), they tend to be alleviated a bit on others (which shifts the "good" conversion rates to new items). Playing tag markets, either independently or in conjunction with LP conversion, is actually quite profitable. But it's something most people don't want to take the time/effort to do (even though you really oughtn't factor it too highly into your ISK/hr ratio as it's something that can easily be done while blitzing missions in your pimped Machariel). So yeah. Too much LP isn't the proximal cause. Incursion LP most certainly isn't. Tags are. So here's a hint for the enterprising: bulk tags come from FW and L5s. If you want to make a killing, look there. You won't have nearly as much trouble converting your LP and you'll have extras to throw at the greedy L4 masses. (Disclaimer: this is based on math that I haven't updated in several months, but I can't imagine it's shifted much. Managing tag orders while blitzing missions just isn't my idea of fun at this point and so the whole thing has dropped off of my radar in favor of figuring out how to take advantage of having deadspace mods on market....)
Incursions hurt the lp store in at least several ways several ways.
1) brining in a bunch of lp that can be used in the best stores and 2) As you say raising the price of everything including and especially tags.
Why especially tags? 1) the increase of lp is creating more demand for the tags without increasing the supply. 2) Even without the first the tags would be hit by the general inflation caused by incursions. 3) The increase of the amount of lp that can be used at all the stores means that in general the profit margin on all the stores will drop.
Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Mavnas
The Scope Gallente Federation
27
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Posted - 2012.05.21 22:12:00 -
[10] - Quote
If incursions have hurt the LP conversion rate it's by reducing the number of people farming the tags, if anything.
That said, I can still convert a small number of LP at about 2.5k per. (Give or take a couple hundred, which you can argue are actually trade profits from getting the tags cheaper.) No, I won't tell you where because I doubt that market would hold up if a few people got in.
I'd argue though that what you need to do is figure out which missions drop the best tags and try to farm those. I see some tags like the CN Vice Admiral are pushing 7-8m a pop. (No one wants to be cut off from Jita apparently.) I can see how it would be hard to convert Gallente LPs with tag prices like that. |
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Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
427
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Posted - 2012.05.21 22:20:00 -
[11] - Quote
Mavnas wrote:If incursions have hurt the LP conversion rate it's by reducing the number of people farming the tags, if anything..
That would be a 4th thing that they did. (in addition to the 3 effects I mention above) Why run faction missions when you can make 3xs as much isk per hour running incursions? But allot of the tags are farmed by faction war plexes so I don't think it matters.
Mavnas wrote: That said, I can still convert a small number of LP at about 2.5k per. (Give or take a couple hundred, which you can argue are actually trade profits from getting the tags cheaper.) No, I won't tell you where because I doubt that market would hold up if a few people got in.
I'd argue though that what you need to do is figure out which missions drop the best tags and try to farm those. I see some tags like the CN Vice Admiral are pushing 7-8m a pop. (No one wants to be cut off from Jita apparently.) I can see how it would be hard to convert Gallente LPs with tag prices like that.
That would be stupid. The obvious choice for anyone wanting to do high sec pve is to run incursions. Even if the vice admiral tags are pushing that you will still make much more running incursions.
Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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FT Diomedes
The Graduates RAZOR Alliance
98
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Posted - 2012.05.22 05:18:00 -
[12] - Quote
Mavnas wrote:
I'd argue though that what you need to do is figure out which missions drop the best tags and try to farm those. I see some tags like the CN Vice Admiral are pushing 7-8m a pop. (No one wants to be cut off from Jita apparently.) I can see how it would be hard to convert Gallente LPs with tag prices like that.
Well, there are only a couple of missions that drop the CN Vice Admiral tag. I am forced to horde the ones I get to cash out the hundreds of thousands of Gallente LP I earned months ago. I actually had to switch to another faction in order to keep generating useful LP and still try to get enough tags to work off some of my Gallente LP.
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Kara Books
Deal with IT.
130
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Posted - 2012.05.23 01:25:00 -
[13] - Quote
[quote=Anhenka] Incursions are nerfed, Faction good demand has taken a nosedive Faction goods are now on the market, expect prices to stabilize there. Mission running, faction warfare, ratting, plexing and everything else that creates a negetive force against Faction goods has increased. Overall demand across the board has taken a nosedive. Taxes on market are going up, expect a slight dent to your profits there again.
Some reasons that are pushing the prices up.
Bots got a massive banhammer. Less LP flooding the markets. only 1 real top alliance left in the game, Goons, and that only brings in Guristas stuff, so less officer stuff to compete with.
Yhe, expect LP value to drop to 500-700, down from 1000 for the mainstream items, the market is shocked. |
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