i hear goon space is really nice this time of year.

No, but it is relevant to whether or not it's worthwhile to have some way for rookie's to get worked into the snake pit gradually instead of thrown in head first: Here's a ship. Here's some ammo. Here's a gun. Here's how you put the gun on the ship. Here's how you fire it. Bye.

But that's precisely what I liked about EVE, what makes it refreshingly different from other MMOs (even though I also enjoy themepark MMOs, I usually have EVE on the boil as well). And anyway, the starter areas are pretty safe.

TBQH, I've found that the number one rule of surviving in EVE is: don't be an asshat. Just that can take you pretty far.

Sure, occasionally you get ganked by asshats in an asshatty fashion (happened to me, my first Dessy was destroyed in some random high sec noob-killing frenzy) but they're actually pretty rare in EVE because they're usually the ones getting ganked, scammed, etc ., etc.

For the most part, in EVE, a newbie will only get killed if:-

1) they're in the wrong place at the wrong time;
2) they're an asshat.

The first (learning what right and wrong places and times are) is part of the game, the second is part of what makes EVE actually have a community.

The long and the short of it is, nobody would deny that there can always be nice little tweaks and improvements that make a newbie's induction flow better, but you can't do too much because part of this being a sandbox is that you learn the ways of the game from other players, not from the devs.

Its nice during all times, not just a season.

You could make safe zones all you want but it's not going to increase the player base in this game. Granted someone may not like to get 'ganked' but there are other game mechanics here that are far more off putting toward most gamers.

What a joke, who can even understand these people. They would have just loved Shabowbane

Hey guy, don't fly it if you can't afford to lose it.

As I see it, the biggest problem for new players is lack of information.

EVE is truely a PVE game NOT a PVP game! Why else do I have to kill 4,000 battleships to replace my tengu???? True PVP games do not make you work for a week to die once. Anyone who thinks this is a PVP based game is a moron!!! Yeah my character has 50m sp. Lets go gank some miners and noob mission runner corps.... This game is about PVE and Griefing Primarily... everything else is secondary.... As long as you have a game where someone with 6 years of sp can freely kill players with 1 month of sp.... you will have a hard time recruiting new players... Oh wait they can't freely kill. They have to pay 2m first... ROTFLMFAO. I make that in 20 secs! A noob takes a week to make that lol... Seriously. I know nothing about programming but let me throw out a few suggestions. How bout making a character with 1m sp immune to players with 50m sp.... how bout making a sp system like they had in Runescape. The farther you go into low sec the bigger the sp difference can be... There is no love for noobs in eve so I think this games days are truely numbered.

Oh,

EVE is dying again, I see.

I agree.

Add new non-PvP space, or reduce empire to non PvP by eliminating suicide ganking in empire.

Low sec, whs and null can retain their "we live to blow stuff up" lifestyle

Expand on WiS gameplay to allow social areas and pvp areas.

If all you wanna do is blow stuff up, Battlefield 3 is that way ->

EVE is truely a PVE game NOT a PVP game! Why else do I have to kill 4,000 battleships to replace my tengu???? True PVP games do not make you work for a week to die once. Anyone who thinks this is a PVP based game is a moron!!! Yeah my character has 50m sp. Lets go gank some miners and noob mission runner corps.... This game is about PVE and Griefing Primarily... everything else is secondary.... As long as you have a game where someone with 6 years of sp can freely kill players with 1 month of sp.... you will have a hard time recruiting new players... Oh wait they can't freely kill. They have to pay 2m first... ROTFLMFAO. I make that in 20 secs! A noob takes a week to make that lol... Seriously. I know nothing about programming but let me throw out a few suggestions. How bout making a character with 1m sp immune to players with 50m sp.... how bout making a sp system like they had in Runescape. The farther you go into low sec the bigger the sp difference can be... There is no love for noobs in eve so I think this games days are truely numbered.

www.hellokittyonline.com

Second and more: I see the argument the OP is making and have a few comments. I am involved with a wide cirle of gaming friends. We do everything from Team Fortress II to Perpetuum to Black Prophecy, Jump Gate [Classic] when it was around, and even TOR. Two of us, in a circle of about 30 gamers, play EvE. Six of us are tight and often play in the same room.

When we say EvE is a sandbox, the general gaming public hears "EvE attracts greifers". Many who are not EvE players see it as "griefer central". Griefers have been weeded out of almost every other MMO because to sell tickets, you need an "pleasant" environment in terms of group/personal dynamics. This perception, real or otherwise, limits subs.

Many hardcore PvPers don't like EvE's style of PvP. This is no insult, it's a factor of popularity and choices. Some of the best PvPers I know state that EvE is "not real PvP". They quote the Blob vs Blob thing. We say the death penalty gives PvP some meaning; they say it forces them to grind PvE to pay for PvP. EvE is simply not attractive to a lot of existing PvPers who prefer the PvP style and rules of more main stream games. This limits subs.

I find it interesting that EVE is doing just as well as, if not better then, most of those "mainstream" MMO's out there.



You people do understand that most of the MMO's out, that require a subscription, don't actually have more playing them then EVE does.



And yes, I'm aware that there is only one EVE, and hundreds of that other MMO. I don't think it's pvp that makes EVE a niche game, I think it's the sandbox. Not to many of them out there; certainly not any worth paying to play.

CCP are the only guys with the balls to do what they want. Everyone else is just scared to try anything new and keep folding to this preconceved notion that a sandbox game with ffa pvp and full loot that's done right, and well, wouldn't be popular.

I wonder were they get that idea from? Sure isn't from repeated attempts by studios to do it. So if it's not really being attempted, why does the industry seem to think our playstyle isn't viable?

OP?

I can confirm what you say.

There is a VAST amount of PvPers who would not touch EvE with a pole.
Many PvPers are PvE averse or just want to do it as passtime when there's nothing going on.

All my other PvP games you can "level up" / recover from the losses by PvPing, you can find a fight in few seconds not hours, you can select to PvP for a score (and even money prizes), you can find PvP games where everybody starts on same grounds so fights are not decided before the first shoot is taken.

EvE came with the concept it was a sandbox, not forced PvP. One could log in, make his life including whether to play in small / large corps or even solo and generally form his own objectives. There used to be a "butterfy effect" video showing how an individual could change events massively.

Then something happened and now EvE = you WILL play as somebody else decided to.
You WILL have to join a corp, possibly PvP based or you can stay to rot in NPC corp forever and unable to access basic features like wallet divisions and similar.
You WILL have to spam directional scan in hi sec, low sec, wormholes and NPC nullsec. The most ******** and tiresome button mashing ever created in the gaming industry, makes invention look nice and streamlined.
Your most fundamental markets will be manipulated by the same 0.0 entities and cartels.
You will be constantly hammered about doing their way or quit the game or never undock.


All of this, in a game where PvP is for lolmouseclickers, no occlusion system no LOS, blob is so everywhere that they had to implement TiDi and blob is the least skilled farcical form of sheep corraling a "PvP" game can implement.

Add instant force projection, having all the battle objectives (moons) give huge power and being placed so that they can be owned by 1-2 major power blocks so they go in perma-god mode.

EvE turned into a joke, a farce I can't believe it'd rot so hard and so fast.


"But here, content is player made".

Yes and it sucks balls, and is coherced down your throat, have fun calling it "sandbox". It's mammoth alliances sandbox where what you can do is to become an irrelevant warm body in their ranks. YOUR sandbox does not matter.

Proof is the abysmally small playerbase. GW1 sold 6.5M copies and that's THE former PvP MMO (DFO was more like EvE but I quickly found out it was full of cheaters and devs did not fix it in time).
6.5M copies for a pure PvP game vs EvE's 300-350k. No, it's not because EvE is space oriented, it's because it has the best concept but a so lackluster and downright outdated and boring implementation.


Most of all, EvE's butterfly wings have been clipped.

why are you here if GW is that great??

than* (in multiple places)

Also, on what planet do you think there are only 30k people playing WoW?