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Fabian Solaar
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Posted - 2009.08.15 22:45:00 -
[1]
Hello, I'm a fairly new player to Eve and have been looking to rat solo in 0.0, specifically in Providence.
I'm looking for a cheap(ish) but hardy ship to do the job; something that won't get barbequed the moment a Sansha's Lord looks at it. I'm thinking of a Thorax with T2 guns (I am training towards these), but am open to suggestion. Another racial cruiser? Destroyers even?
I have only flown around Providence in a SB which has proved pretty hard to use. It's very difficult to hit but the damage output is quite slow. So I thought I'd ask for other opinions here.
No flak for being new please; I'd rather ask veteran pilots here than on the slightly less popular New Citizens link.
Thanks in advance o7 Thanks in advance
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Zhilia Mann
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Posted - 2009.08.15 22:48:00 -
[2]
How are your drone skills? Vexor is a perennially popular choice for ratting....
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Fabian Solaar
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Posted - 2009.08.15 22:53:00 -
[3]
Well, I'm currently enjoying the 100% training speed boost; which in my mind is a really appealling reason to try out new methods.
Training to fly my purifier was pretty exhausting, so I'm aiming to go the other way. I have used drones on my main (this here is an alt) and found them pretty essential (and therefore ubiquitous).
What I'm mulling over is whether to dedicate those first million of so bonused points towards. It's a real boost and I'm curious as whether to invest them all in gunnery (for example) or something else.
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Cikness
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Posted - 2009.08.15 23:03:00 -
[4]
I don't get it. How can any low skill player 0.0 rat in a cruiser? BC, for sure. I am about to start doing L4's in a Drake. T2 launuchers, T2 tank and T2 drones. Could I do it in a Caracal?
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AstroPhobic
Divine Retribution
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Posted - 2009.08.15 23:05:00 -
[5]
Edited by: AstroPhobic on 15/08/2009 23:05:52
Originally by: Cikness I don't get it. How can any low skill player 0.0 rat in a cruiser? BC, for sure. I am about to start doing L4's in a Drake. T2 launuchers, T2 tank and T2 drones. Could I do it in a Caracal?
You can rat in an inty or well skilled frigate.
The difference is...
Belts: 3 battleships, 2 cruisers TOPS Missions: Several times this amount, no MWDs allowed, triggers, respawns, deadspace..
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Fabian Solaar
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Posted - 2009.08.15 23:09:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Cikness I don't get it. How can any low skill player 0.0 rat in a cruiser? BC, for sure. I am about to start doing L4's in a Drake. T2 launuchers, T2 tank and T2 drones. Could I do it in a Caracal?
That what I want to know. I'm sure you could kite damage in a Rifter but I doubt you'd be able to eat anything larger than a cruiser.
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Darthewok
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.08.15 23:18:00 -
[7]
Basically think of the difficulty level of 0.0 Belt Spawns being between somewhere between Level 3 and Level 4 missions. Sort of Level 3.5 Level 3/ Level 4 mission fits translate quite nicely (with a few modifications) to 0.0 ratting.
In other words, you need a Battlecruiser minimum and a Battleship (Advised). For Gallente, probably Myrmidon for BC and Dominix/Megathron for BS would be effective. Drones rock because of different damage types and sizes to kill different sized ships. You will need around Core Competency Standard Certificate(maybe you can sneak by on Basic), and T2 Drones (and probably guns) and tanking skills.
Lots of new players waste time training for stealth bombers and EWAR frigates and inties and cov ops. But if you quickly want basic ships to survive in 0.0 ratting, you need Battlecruisers, Battleships, T2 weapons and good tanking ASAP.
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AstroPhobic
Divine Retribution
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Posted - 2009.08.15 23:19:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Darthewok In other words, you need a Battlecruiser minimum and a Battleship (Advised).
Sorry, this is completely untrue. With a little bit of nifty flying (or some MWD competency) you can rat just fine in a cruiser.
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Cikness
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Posted - 2009.08.15 23:23:00 -
[9]
I think I could do it in a Navy Issue Caracal. Can't see it in a straight cruiser. A 2 BS spawn would get me.
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AstroPhobic
Divine Retribution
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Posted - 2009.08.15 23:30:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Cikness I think I could do it in a Navy Issue Caracal. Can't see it in a straight cruiser. A 2 BS spawn would get me.
I've ratted in a rupture, arbitrator, vexor, taranis...
Abuse the poor battleship tracking, ???, profit.
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Darthewok
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.08.15 23:35:00 -
[11]
Ah yes, also not all 0.0 space has rats of the same difficulty. 0.0 space actually has a negative number for a security rating called the truesec (eg. -0.5) which determines how fierce the rats are and how good the bounty and loot is. Perhaps it is possible in the shallower parts of 0.0 with crappier rats to get away with less than a BC. But in the good space, its BC/BS(mostly) and sometimes HACs.
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Fabian Solaar
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Posted - 2009.08.15 23:56:00 -
[12]
Hmm, there seems to be a general concensus here, i.e cruisers can't really hack it. I'm guessing the Coercer pilot I flew past today was a full blown ninja salvager.
Hmm. Well in light of this, would anyone care to comment on what skills to spend those buffed first million on? I'm pretty bummed about the SB I spent so much time on; something like a blasterboat is (now) much more appealing, even if lasers seem to be in fashion.
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AstroPhobic
Divine Retribution
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Posted - 2009.08.16 00:04:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Darthewok Ah yes, also not all 0.0 space has rats of the same difficulty. 0.0 space actually has a negative number for a security rating called the truesec (eg. -0.5) which determines how fierce the rats are and how good the bounty and loot is. Perhaps it is possible in the shallower parts of 0.0 with crappier rats to get away with less than a BC. But in the good space, its BC/BS(mostly) and sometimes HACs.
Anything that's not in blood raider space is doable. I haven't been to guristas space recently and it may be more difficult.
You can rat triple battleship spawns in a t1 cruiser. I've done triple battleship spawns in a taranis.
There's two conditions for minimum ratting:
1. Tank enough to survive the spawn by any means (This includes sig tanking, speed tanking, range tanking, shield buffer tanking...) 2. Do enough DPS to break NPC tanks
To the OP: You CAN do it in a cruiser. It's not efficient, but possible.
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Darthewok
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.08.16 00:38:00 -
[14]
The "long-term view" and "correct" answer on what to spend your buffed training period on is to train Learning and the attribute enhancement skills and cybernetics so you can plug in +3/+4 implants as soon as possible.
The "can't wait to get some decent ratting ship" answer is to go for the Myrmidon as soon as you can. It's a decent ratting ship that can sport a good tank and have multiple damage types via drones. Vexor is along the way. If it works for you, cool. But not recommended IMO. Whatever ship you use, check not only the prerequisite skills but the recommended certificates in the description. You'll also need T2 weapon (especially drone) skills.
I went to live in 0.0 on something like my 15th day in EVE and it sucked as I couldn't rat decently till I got a BC/BS. For BCs, Myrmidon/Drake are great as they have switchable damage types so you can rat in most regions. Then later, you can upgrade to Dominix/Raven for faster ratting.
Useful ship guide: http://www.eve-wiki.net/index.php?title=Gallente_ships
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Kessiaan
Minmatar DEATHFUNK Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2009.08.16 01:51:00 -
[15]
Belts are nothing like missions. Belts have like 3 BS, 3 cruisers, and maybe a couple tackle frigs, at the absolute maximum.
Small ships (sub-BC) can tank the little stuff and effortlessly speedtank the BS. Bigger ships can just tank it.
T1 cruisers are popular cheap-o rat ships because they're cheap. I've seen it done (and done it myself) in AFs, but the problem with AFs is they lack enough DPS to easily break some of the bigger BS tanks.
Your biggest worry when ratting in nullsec is not the rats, it's neuts and hostiles coming into your system and tackling you before you have a chance to warp out. That's why HACs are popular - they're agile. At least more agile than a BC.
Still though, for low-SP ratting fits I'd stick with a BC. Drake has great range, great tank, OK-ish DPS and doesn't need millions of skillpoints to work. Ravens are popular as well.
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ChickenOfDoom
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Posted - 2009.08.16 02:01:00 -
[16]
if you're going to rat in providence you want an economy fit armageddon with a cloak. Cruisers/BC aren't going to be efficient and you can make isk better other ways. Plus if you have to fit t2 you're just going to lose it which will cut into your profits.
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Fabian Solaar
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Posted - 2009.08.16 12:36:00 -
[17]
Well, as a SB pilot I have everything I need to cloak, plus I'm well into Amarr ship training anyway.
I've always loved the Apocalypse (looks wise), but I'm hesitant to shell out/ train for one as I'm a relatively new player (3m sp), and even though providence seems peaceful; I'm mature enough to see that a pirate gang could easily fly by. Perhaps I've just been lucky so far and Providence is really much more dangerous than I've been led to believe. Time will tell.
So yes, I'm sure an Amarr BS would be relatively secure; I'll just have to get over the amount of time it will take to fit it well!
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Bomberlocks
Minmatar Icarus Prime
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Posted - 2009.08.16 14:15:00 -
[18]
I've done some lvl 4s in a Wolf (Assault Frigate), with a perma-run AB, used a NOS - which still works fine against NPCs - for cap, but one could rig it for CCCs I suppose. The general rule, I think, is that npc BS/BCs that fire missiles are harder on small ships than turrets, since a small ship can simply keep out of their tracking, and I've read numerous people talking about doing it in interceptors. I think the hardest ships to do it in would be cruisers or poorly tanked BCs, but it will only get easier as your skills improve, I think.
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Speshtard
Amarr Malevolent Intentions
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Posted - 2009.08.16 14:44:00 -
[19]
You can rat 0.0 in a cruiser just fine. I ratted Sanshas in an arbitrator where my only DPS was from 5 Hammer II's, and my highs were simply tractors/salvagers, with a DC, 2 hardeners and a MAR 2 in the lows, and cap rechargers/battery + AB in the mids, tanked verything like a dream, just slam on the AB and orbit 500. _________________________________________________ If you're tired of all this 'Paste this into your signature' crap, paste this into your sig.... Oh crap. |
Yarinor
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Posted - 2009.08.16 15:13:00 -
[20]
How the <bad word here> can you fly a SB with 100% training bonus?
Frigate V 512k Torps V 1024k
That already puts you over the top.
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Beverly Sparks
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Posted - 2009.08.16 15:43:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Fabian Solaar Edited by: Fabian Solaar on 15/08/2009 23:15:07 Hello, I'm a fairly new player to Eve and have been looking to rat solo in 0.0, specifically in Providence.
I'm looking for a cheap(ish) but hardy ship to do the job; something that won't get barbequed the moment a Sansha's Lord looks at it. I'm thinking of a Thorax with T2 guns (I am training towards these), but am open to suggestion. Another racial cruiser? Destroyers even?
I have only flown around Providence in a SB which has proved pretty hard to use. It's very difficult to hit but the damage output is quite slow. So I thought I'd ask for other opinions here.
No flak for being new please; I'd rather ask veteran pilots here than on the slightly less popular New Citizens link.
Thanks in advance o7
I used a Pulse Harbinger. Worked fine. Might want a web in the mids though, so you can track the frigs.
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Amanitar
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Posted - 2009.08.16 18:15:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Yarinor How the <bad word here> can you fly a SB with 100% training bonus?
Frigate V 512k Torps V 1024k
That already puts you over the top.
-Don't know if this has been fixed!- If you put on a 1024k skill when you have 1.599.999Sp (1Sp before the 1.6mil marker) it should still get the 100% training buff. However, when you pause/reaply/switch skills the buff will fade (as it reloads).
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Speshtard
Amarr Malevolent Intentions
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Posted - 2009.08.16 20:02:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Amanitar
Originally by: Yarinor How the <bad word here> can you fly a SB with 100% training bonus?
Frigate V 512k Torps V 1024k
That already puts you over the top.
-Don't know if this has been fixed!- If you put on a 1024k skill when you have 1.599.999Sp (1Sp before the 1.6mil marker) it should still get the 100% training buff. However, when you pause/reaply/switch skills the buff will fade (as it reloads).
Fixed.
Also you don't need torps V for an SB, so he's probably got the bare minimum with cloaking IV and maybe a few support skills, which is why he's having trouble. _________________________________________________ If you're tired of all this 'Paste this into your signature' crap, paste this into your sig.... Oh crap. |
Waci
Southern Cross Empire Flying Dangerous
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Posted - 2009.08.16 21:26:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Darthewok The "long-term view" and "correct" answer on what to spend your buffed training period on is to train Learning and the attribute enhancement skills and cybernetics so you can plug in +3/+4 implants as soon as possible.
The "can't wait to get some decent ratting ship" answer is to go for the Myrmidon as soon as you can. It's a decent ratting ship that can sport a good tank and have multiple damage types via drones. Vexor is along the way. If it works for you, cool. But not recommended IMO. Whatever ship you use, check not only the prerequisite skills but the recommended certificates in the description. You'll also need T2 weapon (especially drone) skills.
I went to live in 0.0 on something like my 15th day in EVE and it sucked as I couldn't rat decently till I got a BC/BS. For BCs, Myrmidon/Drake are great as they have switchable damage types so you can rat in most regions. Then later, you can upgrade to Dominix/Raven for faster ratting.
Useful ship guide: http://www.eve-wiki.net/index.php?title=Gallente_ships
As advice to a new player asking about 0.0, you tell him to get to the most expensive ship he can fly and to plug in a set of +4 implants? Excuse me, but do we play the same game here? (Damn I'm going to be embarrassed if I'm in the wrong forum!) -------------------------------------------------
SCE |
Joe Starbreaker
The Fighting Republicans
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Posted - 2009.08.17 14:25:00 -
[25]
It could be done in a cruiser, but you'd need a lot of skillpoints, and why slow yourself down so much, anyway? One of your goals is to maximize income, and nothing does that quite like a battleship.
Sanshas are weak to EM and Thermal, meaning Amarr ships are ideally designed to fight them. A nice benefit of being Amarr is that your guns don't need to reload, so you can rat for a long time without docking. I'd suggest getting a Prophecy, Harbinger, or any Amarr battleship, fitting lasers on it, tanking against EM/thermal, and go to town.
= the GOP is recruiting = |
Darthewok
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.08.17 15:06:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Waci As advice to a new player asking about 0.0, you tell him to get to the most expensive ship he can fly and to plug in a set of +4 implants? Excuse me, but do we play the same game here? (Damn I'm going to be embarrassed if I'm in the wrong forum!)
additional advice. jump into an implantless jump clone when you rat in 0.0 in case you get podded. otherwise be training with the +4s because if you are still in the training speed buff period, you have a long way to go before becoming proficient in BC/BS. i could say get in a cheaper ship, but, even if they could do it, they are just not as efficient in ratting as a BC/BS.
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Mike Voidstar
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Posted - 2009.08.17 16:04:00 -
[27]
I rat in Providence in a Myrmidon.
The thing has a passive sheild tank in the 700DPS range, and does around 250dps in drones and a couple of guns.
I also run out of gas warping sometimes since my cap recharge resembles the performance of a 1940's black cat AA battery.
I'm crazy though, and after my first few days of ratting, rigged the ship for sheild recharge, and will be a sad monkey when someone blows it up---total ISK sunk into the ship is around 120 million ISK.
I don't have a problem with the rats though. :) And these days I earn enough isk to buy a new one about once a week if I stop to salvage my wrecks.
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Lego Maniac
Minmatar Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2009.08.17 19:00:00 -
[28]
Edited by: Lego Maniac on 17/08/2009 19:02:56
Originally by: AstroPhobic Anything that's not in blood raider space is doable. I haven't been to guristas space recently and it may be more difficult.
You can rat triple battleship spawns in a t1 cruiser. I've done triple battleship spawns in a taranis.
There's two conditions for minimum ratting:
1. Tank enough to survive the spawn by any means (This includes sig tanking, speed tanking, range tanking, shield buffer tanking...) 2. Do enough DPS to break NPC tanks
To the OP: You CAN do it in a cruiser. It's not efficient, but possible.
no, as a matter of fact the OP cannot (you might be able to, but not the OP at this stage)
he is still getting the training boost, which means his support skills are next to nil
furthermore, he is planning on ratting in a turret cruiser against sansha - TDs are going to ruin his day and when he encounters a spawn of both battleships and hacs, those that he is not orbitting will orbit HIM
tl;dr he will be be barbequed
edit: advice to the OP, while working on getting your skills up there you can play as a secondary tag-along when your corp members go ratting, or salvage wrecks for income (lots of these get left behind, but be sure to ask first) __________________________________________________________
˄ ____________ ˄ |
Dex Atherton
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.08.19 04:49:00 -
[29]
All I can say is you can't solo rat 0.0 flying a Slasher. Believe me, I tried...
I went sight seeing with my ~2 weeks old character down to Tenerifs back when Goonswarm opened their stations to the public. My poor Slasher got webbed by a rat.
Then I learned a solo rookie ship was even more useless than a solo Slasher.
Turned out fine in the end. Got slaughtered by Atlas guys at gatecamp, saving the trouble of flying back to empire.
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Salvatore Chang
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Posted - 2009.08.19 08:32:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Fabian Solaar Well, I'm currently enjoying the 100% training speed boost;
Originally by: Fabian Solaar but I'm hesitant to shell out/ train for one as I'm a relatively new player (3m sp)
*scratches head*
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