Pages: 1 2 [3] :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE Limitless Inc.
91
|
Posted - 2011.09.19 06:42:00 -
[61] - Quote
Zey Nadar wrote:quickshot89 wrote:Archy Mayaki wrote:I always though that NEX stuff could be acquired through PLEX / in-game currency. It can, people just dont seem to understand this concept. People don't seem to understand that PLEXes are paid by real money. I might be more understanding if it was possible for other people to see actually what kind of pants your avatar is wearing..
This. Everytime you buy a PLEX and use your "isk" to buy stuff from the NeX store, someone else is paying RL money for that. And by doing this you also support CCP's lies and poor treatment of players as well, which is all well and fine (your choice). But don't argue you didn't pay for it, because you are sponsoring the market and involved in the process. |
Kryss Darkdust
Darkdust Industries Empire
4
|
Posted - 2011.09.19 07:33:00 -
[62] - Quote
Misanth wrote:Zey Nadar wrote:quickshot89 wrote:Archy Mayaki wrote:I always though that NEX stuff could be acquired through PLEX / in-game currency. It can, people just dont seem to understand this concept. People don't seem to understand that PLEXes are paid by real money. I might be more understanding if it was possible for other people to see actually what kind of pants your avatar is wearing.. This. Everytime you buy a PLEX and use your "isk" to buy stuff from the NeX store, someone else is paying RL money for that. And by doing this you also support CCP's lies and poor treatment of players as well, which is all well and fine (your choice). But don't argue you didn't pay for it, because you are sponsoring the market and involved in the process.
hmmm im not sure I get that to be honest. I mean I understand the link between real money and ISK via PLEX and how that converts to AUR, but strictly speaking since you are not required to do it and can make ISK to buy PLEX without paying a cent to me personally as a player who knows how to earn ISK, PLEX effectively has no real value at all. I pay a monthly fee every month and if I happen to earn enough ISK to buy a PLEX I usually don't. I use it for what it is intended, buying in game stuff like ships.
I suppose where it breaks down for me is that I don't play Eve to make money, I play Eve because I like to play Eve.. I make ISK as a side effect of doing what I want, but I'm not doing calculations like "how many hours of game time equals how much ISK which equals how much RL money". That kind of math is just silly to me and makes no sense. You play a game for the game. If you are trying to work out if you are earning enough RL money per hour to determine if the game is worth playing, you're an idiot. |
Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE Limitless Inc.
91
|
Posted - 2011.09.19 07:43:00 -
[63] - Quote
Kryss Darkdust wrote:hmmm im not sure I get that to be honest. I mean I understand the link between real money and ISK via PLEX and how that converts to AUR, but strictly speaking since you are not required to do it and can make ISK to buy PLEX without paying a cent to me personally as a player who knows how to earn ISK, PLEX effectively has no real value at all. I pay a monthly fee every month and if I happen to earn enough ISK to buy a PLEX I usually don't. I use it for what it is intended, buying in game stuff like ships.
I suppose where it breaks down for me is that I don't play Eve to make money, I play Eve because I like to play Eve.. I make ISK as a side effect of doing what I want, but I'm not doing calculations like "how many hours of game time equals how much ISK which equals how much RL money". That kind of math is just silly to me and makes no sense. You play a game for the game. If you are trying to work out if you are earning enough RL money per hour to determine if the game is worth playing, you're an idiot.
PLEX does not magically appear ingame, nor is created by industrialists or some other manufacturing. It spawns from RL isk, one way or another. |
Jita Alt666
209
|
Posted - 2011.09.19 07:59:00 -
[64] - Quote
Akita T wrote: So, you mean, you want to hire me to sort rice grains by size for 2 bil ISK/hour ? I'd gladly take that deal if that would be allowed by the EULA. Barring that, ok, I'll do that for, oh, say, 60$/hour (pretty hefty discount right there). Do we have a deal ? You still want to hire me to sort your rice grains ? No ? Why not ?
2 bil an hour. What am I doing wrong I struggle to get over 1.0bil an hour before I get depressed by micromanagement |
Trolls Troll
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
21
|
Posted - 2011.09.19 09:05:00 -
[65] - Quote
CCP Zulu wrote:A sock puppet!
Is that your way of saying that you think nex store items are cheap? |
Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE Limitless Inc.
91
|
Posted - 2011.09.19 09:08:00 -
[66] - Quote
Trolls Troll wrote:CCP Zulu wrote:A sock puppet! Is that your way of saying that you think nex store items are cheap?
Icelandic money has no value anymore, it's fish trading that matters. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Industrial Complex Cosmic Consortium
73
|
Posted - 2011.09.19 09:25:00 -
[67] - Quote
Misanth wrote:This. Everytime you buy a PLEX and use your "isk" to buy stuff from the NeX store, someone else is paying RL money for that.
The key for me is that someone else is paying the RL money.
Misanth wrote:GǪ But don't argue you didn't pay for it, because you are sponsoring the market and involved in the process.
But you just told me someone else is paying for it!
If I'm particularly good at making ISK from the style of game I play in EVE, why shouldn't I use that ISK to get someone else to pay my subscription for me? And if I happen to have a lot of surplus ISK hanging around, why shouldn't I use that ISK to get someone else to pay the real dollars required to allow me to wear fancy jeans, boots or eyewear?
|
Kunming
T.H.U.G L.I.F.E Xenon-Empire
8
|
Posted - 2011.09.19 09:34:00 -
[68] - Quote
"Television is free since advertisement agencies are paying." Same flawed arugement as "PLEX is free since I buy it with ISK".
|
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
206
|
Posted - 2011.09.19 09:38:00 -
[69] - Quote
Kunming wrote:"Television is free since advertisement agencies are paying." Same flawed arugement as "PLEX is free since I buy it with ISK".
"Someone else is paying" is what free means when it comes to manufactured goods and services. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Apollo-Moor
xHELLonEARTHx Rookie Empire
7
|
Posted - 2011.09.19 09:46:00 -
[70] - Quote
quickshot89 wrote:Archy Mayaki wrote:I always though that NEX stuff could be acquired through PLEX / in-game currency. It can, people just dont seem to understand this concept.
They been using real money to buy GTCs for so long they've forgotten |
|
Apollo-Moor
xHELLonEARTHx Rookie Empire
7
|
Posted - 2011.09.19 09:53:00 -
[71] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Misanth wrote:This. Everytime you buy a PLEX and use your "isk" to buy stuff from the NeX store, someone else is paying RL money for that. The key for me is that someone else is paying the RL money. Misanth wrote:GǪ But don't argue you didn't pay for it, because you are sponsoring the market and involved in the process. But you just told me someone else is paying for it! If I'm particularly good at making ISK from the style of game I play in EVE, why shouldn't I use that ISK to get someone else to pay my subscription for me? And if I happen to have a lot of surplus ISK hanging around, why shouldn't I use that ISK to get someone else to pay the real dollars required to allow me to wear fancy jeans, boots or eyewear?
They fail to see that isk places vaulted on EVERYTHING in game. but they'll go to Character Bazaar and pump $300, $400 and more into some pixels some else was paying for.. LOL.. There is no difference.. Only the Value of the item in game can affect what people are willing to pay.. and they don't seem so disinclined to buy those Nex items and then turn around to sale them at inflated isk prices..
Something a Vet has the funds, patience, and incentive to do.. I mean how stupid do you take players for.. Even new ones. It's not hard to see. If you taken the time to do that, you're just as bad as someone who's wears Nex..
A bunch of half-commited sellouts.. lol |
Cyprus Black
Perkone Caldari State
33
|
Posted - 2011.09.19 10:50:00 -
[72] - Quote
Trolls Troll wrote:CCP Zulu wrote:A sock puppet! Is that your way of saying that you think nex store items are cheap? Lol chill out. This is all just in good fun by taking a poke at the NEX. Dumb discussions over "the monetary value of isk" completely miss the point.
Also, 30 minutes on an adult chat phone line.
|
Apollo-Moor
xHELLonEARTHx Rookie Empire
7
|
Posted - 2011.09.19 11:07:00 -
[73] - Quote
Cyprus Black wrote:Trolls Troll wrote:CCP Zulu wrote:A sock puppet! Is that your way of saying that you think nex store items are cheap? Lol chill out. This is all just in good fun by taking a poke at the NEX. Dumb discussions over "the monetary value of isk" completely miss the point. Also, 30 minutes on an adult chat phone line.
4 separate subscriptions to EVE |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
334
|
Posted - 2011.09.19 12:35:00 -
[74] - Quote
Sir Substance wrote:Akita T wrote:Sir Substance wrote:I'd like to hire you, at the amount per hour you clearly value your time at, to sort my rice grains by size. So, you mean, you want to hire me to sort rice grains by size for 2 bil ISK/hour ? I'd gladly take that deal if that would be allowed by the EULA. Barring that, ok, I'll do that for, oh, say, 60$/hour (pretty hefty discount right there). Do we have a deal ? You still want to hire me to sort your rice grains ? No ? Why not ? If your time is valued at 2bil an hour, how can macrotransactions possibly be free? The purchase of MT items via plex represents a trading of time from your life rather then out of game money (in the smaller picture, someone else has already explained how you are wrong about the bigger picture). Hence, if MT costs you zero, then your time is worthless. That's not how that particular math works The value of things is not the same in both directions, and some directions are best avoided at all, and it's most likely not a set of linear functions either.
There's three separate relevant valuations: one is cash->ISK, the other is time->ISK, and from the RL side, also time->cash. Due to the EULA, you can not have ISK->cash (not without a ban), and alongside the other two (ISK->time and cash->time) only make sense from an opportunity cost viewpoint (as long as you "keep it legit").
What I was saying is that for me, time->ISK yields a very high ISK/hour number, while time->cash (as in, RL job) yields a much more moderate amount compared to a lot of the player base, due to my geographical location ; cash->ISK is something I would not bother using but is at least somewhat universal across the game (barring that USD/EUR debacle most can sidestep anyway by ordering from an USA site). Of course, this does not scale very well in either direction, but for very different reasons which are not worth going into detail about for now.
What you need to take out of this is that "cash->ISK" might be highly variable in time but only slightly variable from person to person, while the other two ("time->ISK" and "time->cash", independently) are HIGHLY variable from person to person and still also variable in time.
In other words, again, FOR ME, there is a STRONG discrepancy in the "cash value of time" when taking reality on one hand (moderate) and the one derived from the "savings" value of ISK (very high). For me, ISK has very little value, but cash and RL time has a relatively high value. And because I WILL NOT exchange ISK for cash (EULA), and NEED NOT exchange time for ISK ("sunk cost"), the perceived//relevant cost of MT is negligible, while time still being valued very high.
If you earn very little ISK per time spent playing (less than the cash->PLEX->ISK route equivalent at your RL hourly rate), yes, you do need to use that cash route when you value the "cost of MT" for you. And this is where most of EVE players stand. But if you actually SAVE time/money by making ISK ingame instead of buying it with cash obtained spending time on your job, then you need to use THAT route when valuing the "cost of MT". This is where a few EVE players stand (me included). http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Contributor_name:Akita_T#Contributions_link_collection |
Apollo-Moor
xHELLonEARTHx Rookie Empire
7
|
Posted - 2011.09.20 10:08:00 -
[75] - Quote
If someone does a DED gets faction BPC valued @ 850mil isk. The site if done right is done in just around an hour..
Translate sale of BPC (not even considering bounties). Said person could use that is to buy 2-3* PLEXs after its all said and done..
Plexes are valued @ $17.51 or something like that. $17.51 * 3 = $52.53. That's bank for an hourly wage.. Save on gas for the drive to work and lunches at home. You're in the game. Literally...
Of course this situation isn't really plausible. Since there is no RL value to isk (Keep convincing yourselves of that) and that even the thought of this is blasphemy.
Should we go ahead and really put a "value" on all that stuff sitting in your hanger.. Nah, that's just nuts.. But interesting to really consider it. When taking that PLEX into account for that $17.51 |
David Grogan
The Motley Crew Reborn Warped Aggression
43
|
Posted - 2011.09.20 11:52:00 -
[76] - Quote
Feligast wrote:Cyprus Black wrote: Filling up my gas tank.
You obviously don't live in Britain
same goes for ireland
|
London
8
|
Posted - 2011.09.20 12:08:00 -
[77] - Quote
Dalmont Delantee wrote:A night with a lady of ill repute!
lol, the way you worded that made my morning...
|
J Kunjeh
75
|
Posted - 2011.09.20 12:18:00 -
[78] - Quote
I see that pointless "NEX is sooooo spensive!" threads keep popping up endlessly...like rabbits in springtime when the bunnies are screwing like, well, bunnies. "The world as we know it came about through an anomaly (anomou)" (The Gospel of Philip, 1-5)-á |
Tenchi Sal
DeathStar Systems
5
|
Posted - 2011.09.20 14:18:00 -
[79] - Quote
im going to halloween horror nights at universal studios in a few weeks. my ticket costs less then a monacle. |
Arnst Atram
Broski Federation Elite Space Guild
0
|
Posted - 2011.09.20 14:31:00 -
[80] - Quote
Quote:Mailing a package to Australia from the United States.
This is in fact untrue. As an Aussie, i regretfully inform you my last purchase from Amazon was worth $44, and cost $56 to get shipped. It was a book, a DVD, and an Ethernet cable ($12 inc. Shipping to import, $50 locally, ugh i hate being regional).
Though that's nothing compared to the parts i imported for my computer. $246 shipping in total for that. |
|
London
8
|
Posted - 2011.09.20 17:39:00 -
[81] - Quote
Bit-tech.net recently did an article, "The Microtransaction Investigation"
Check out where Eve falls under The average cost of an in-game microtransaction, by game... yikes! |
Lord Ryan
Derailleurs
16
|
Posted - 2011.09.20 17:52:00 -
[82] - Quote
I pay with ISK, quit using $ when they started banning me. -á
I want to fly a badass Mon Calamari stlye-ácruiser painted to match my Tron clothes. |
Obsidian Hawk
RONA Corporation RONA Directorate
89
|
Posted - 2011.09.20 18:01:00 -
[83] - Quote
Also notice that they only reviewed very few games on that list.
Who else has MT?
until a more full list is made that investigation is the tip of the iceberg. |
Bloodpetal
Mimidae Risk Solutions
22
|
Posted - 2011.09.20 18:55:00 -
[84] - Quote
Akita T wrote:Cyprus Black wrote:Things that cost less than CCP's Micro Transactions Well, let's see... I can't sell ISK for cash (not without risking a ban), but I can buy AUR with it (indirectly), and I have craploads of ISK. So... CCP's MTs cost me... a whooping ZERO. Not much else is that cheap.
Average cost of ONE NEX item on the store are around 350M ISK in PLEX to AUR Value Conversion.
This is the average wallet of the average EVE Player according to a 2010 EVE EQN.
So, to the average EVE Player, even when paying with ISK, it's their WHOLE wallet in ISK to buy one item. Or a 1/2, or a 1/3 of their wallet. That's not "Zero".
TO anyone who doesn't have the in game ISK to buy the NEX Items, it costs them real money. That's not "Zero".
Having to spend a 1/3 of your ISK on a NEX Shirt is stupid. The Precision Boots have already shown there is an interest in trading the NEX items but not at the current prices. So their Value is Greater than Zero and Lower than 100M ISK.
NOSTRO AURUM NON EST AURUM VULGI |
Poastmortem
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 21:45:00 -
[85] - Quote
CCP Zulu wrote:A sock puppet!
How expensive are your sock puppets? And... what in the hell ... never-mind. |
Vertisce Soritenshi
Varion Galactic Tragedy.
230
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 22:01:00 -
[86] - Quote
Bloodpetal wrote:Akita T wrote:Cyprus Black wrote:Things that cost less than CCP's Micro Transactions Well, let's see... I can't sell ISK for cash (not without risking a ban), but I can buy AUR with it (indirectly), and I have craploads of ISK. So... CCP's MTs cost me... a whooping ZERO. Not much else is that cheap. Average cost of ONE NEX item on the store are around 350M ISK in PLEX to AUR Value Conversion. This is the average wallet of the average EVE Player according to a 2010 EVE EQN. So, to the average EVE Player, even when paying with ISK, it's their WHOLE wallet in ISK to buy one item. Or a 1/2, or a 1/3 of their wallet. That's not "Zero". TO anyone who doesn't have the in game ISK to buy the NEX Items, it costs them real money. That's not "Zero". Having to spend a 1/3 of your ISK on a NEX Shirt is stupid. The Precision Boots have already shown there is an interest in trading the NEX items but not at the current prices. So their Value is Greater than Zero and Lower than 100M ISK.
If you don't have enough ISK on a monthly basis to pay for your sub and then some...you are playing EvE wrong.
If you can't afford a PLEX with ISK to buy NEX items...you are playing EvE wrong.
If you can't afford the 40mil ISK for the stupid pants in the NEX store...you are playing EvE wrong.
If you use any real money for anything in EvE at all...you are playing EvE wrong.
In short...you are playing EvE wrong. Support our boobies!-áLINKY! |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
457
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 22:04:00 -
[87] - Quote
RougeOperator wrote:Bane Loppknow wrote:Aurum CAN be paid for with nothing but isk, which CAN be earned through sheer diligence.
However, they can also be purchased with real money, giving them a dollar equivalent. Just because it's irreversible doesn't mean the equivalent ceases to exist.
re: OP
My car insurance! At some point to get NEX money someone had to spend IRL cash to convert to Aur. When you buy stuff from the nex store it costs IRL cash money one way or another. It might not be you that paid CCP the money but that plex has a definite cash value associated with it. If someone does not put up the money to begin with there is no access to the nex store.
The person that put up that money to buy the PLEX got what they wanted out of it the moment you purchased it. They received the equivalent in ISK, courtesy of YOU. That transaction for cash is done at that point, what you chose to do with the PLEX is seperate and completely up to you. To kill the enemy and break their toys!
It's not so much a mission statement,-áit's more like a family motto. |
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 [3] :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |