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Nabakou
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2012.06.01 03:08:00 -
[1] - Quote
Highsec is dangerous for miners, right?
0.0 is dangerous for miners, right?
You make more money mining in 0.0, right?
Protip: Band together and move to 0.0 and mine.
"Ohnoe but I must pay rent."
Maybe, sort of depends, but get 10-20 mining buddies together, form a corp, and each pay part of the rent fee. After all, you will make 2-5x the isk/hr you make in highsec doing the same thing.
Incidentally, go listen to Mitten's old everadio interviews where he says the death of the 0.0 miner, due to dronelands gunmining and incursions, is what killed small gang 0.0 pvp.
If you want a synopsis of Mitten's logic I will make it short.:
Small gangs hunt miners in 0.0. They show up on intel channels. Generic xyz alliance forms a fleet to kill the small gang hunting the miners. Fight occurs. Reinforcements may occur. More pvp.
Honestly, I kind of agree. |
FeralShadow
Black Storm Cartel
139
|
Posted - 2012.06.01 03:11:00 -
[2] - Quote
Here here. Shift click to open new window. How the Eve Sandbox Works:https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=482176#post482176 "I believe in karma. That's why whenever I do something sh**ty to others, they somehow deserved it." |
Kimmi Chan
Perkone Caldari State
62
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Posted - 2012.06.01 03:11:00 -
[3] - Quote
Nabakou wrote:Highsec is dangerous for miners, right?
0.0 is dangerous for miners, right?
You make more money mining in 0.0, right?
Protip: Band together and move to 0.0 and mine.
"Ohnoe but I must pay rent."
Maybe, sort of depends, but get 10-20 mining buddies together, form a corp, and each pay part of the rent fee. After all, you will make 2-5x the isk/hr you make in highsec doing the same thing.
Incidentally, go listen to Mitten's old everadio interviews where he says the death of the 0.0 miner, due to dronelands gunmining and incursions, is what killed small gang 0.0 pvp.
If you want a synopsis of Mitten's logic I will make it short.:
Small gangs hunt miners in 0.0. They show up on intel channels. Generic xyz alliance forms a fleet to kill the small gang hunting the miners. Fight occurs. Reinforcements may occur. More pvp.
Honestly, I kind of agree.
What? Miners creating player generated content? Say it isn't so! +1
Intelligence shouldn't be free. by Mors Sanctitatis |
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
649
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Posted - 2012.06.01 03:12:00 -
[4] - Quote
But but but - teh riskies.
Most of the miners who whine about infinigeddon are people who are 100% risk averse. Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
1363
|
Posted - 2012.06.01 03:13:00 -
[5] - Quote
Kimmi Chan wrote:Nabakou wrote:Highsec is dangerous for miners, right?
0.0 is dangerous for miners, right?
You make more money mining in 0.0, right?
Protip: Band together and move to 0.0 and mine.
"Ohnoe but I must pay rent."
Maybe, sort of depends, but get 10-20 mining buddies together, form a corp, and each pay part of the rent fee. After all, you will make 2-5x the isk/hr you make in highsec doing the same thing.
Incidentally, go listen to Mitten's old everadio interviews where he says the death of the 0.0 miner, due to dronelands gunmining and incursions, is what killed small gang 0.0 pvp.
If you want a synopsis of Mitten's logic I will make it short.:
Small gangs hunt miners in 0.0. They show up on intel channels. Generic xyz alliance forms a fleet to kill the small gang hunting the miners. Fight occurs. Reinforcements may occur. More pvp.
Honestly, I kind of agree. What? Miners creating player generated content? Say it isn't so! +1
Oh they can't work together long enough to do that and you know it
|
Ituhata Saken
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
211
|
Posted - 2012.06.01 03:15:00 -
[6] - Quote
Sounds logical, but I wonder how much it matters with the NAPS in place. Dunno about the majority of 0.0 pvp players, but I honestly loathed making 20+ jumps looking for targets. You know what an answer is? It's a terminus -- an end. Answers are fine, but questions are where it's at. Questions bring us closer to understanding, -áthey can start a conversation or spark a revolution. So you might as well start asking... now.-á ~See you on the other side 6/6/12~ |
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
1363
|
Posted - 2012.06.01 03:18:00 -
[7] - Quote
Ituhata Saken wrote:Sounds logical, but I wonder how much it matters with the NAPS in place. Dunno about the majority of 0.0 pvp players, but I honestly loathed making 20+ jumps looking for targets.
Join RvB, they live like 2 jumps over |
Price Check Aisle3
44
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Posted - 2012.06.01 03:19:00 -
[8] - Quote
Also, CCP should fix sov null and tech moons ASAP. Then Goonswarm can spend their coffers on their war machine rather than hi-sec miner bounties.
Imagine that, carebears: fixing boring sov mechanics will benefit you in the long run... |
Ituhata Saken
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
211
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Posted - 2012.06.01 03:24:00 -
[9] - Quote
Surfin's PlunderBunny wrote:Ituhata Saken wrote:Sounds logical, but I wonder how much it matters with the NAPS in place. Dunno about the majority of 0.0 pvp players, but I honestly loathed making 20+ jumps looking for targets. Join RvB, they live like 2 jumps over
Ok, I suppose I could give it a shot. You know what an answer is? It's a terminus -- an end. Answers are fine, but questions are where it's at. Questions bring us closer to understanding, -áthey can start a conversation or spark a revolution. So you might as well start asking... now.-á ~See you on the other side 6/6/12~ |
Ocih
Space Mermaids Somethin Awfull Forums
218
|
Posted - 2012.06.01 03:28:00 -
[10] - Quote
Or here is an idea. Let miners have their own Sov, stop trying to play Stalin with the map, support Ally NAP agreements on principle and find out the Industrial players are more than happy to put you in full T2 PvP fleets because it's what they do. Make stuff. |
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Nabakou
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2012.06.01 03:33:00 -
[11] - Quote
Ocih wrote:Or here is an idea. Let miners have their own Sov, stop trying to play Stalin with the map, support Ally NAP agreements on principle and find out the Industrial players are more than happy to put you in full T2 PvP fleets because it's what they do. Make stuff.
As someone who has alliance leadership experience I find that pure industry corps are terrible to deal with, always nagging and wanting more and more.
Most won't "put you in T2 fleets" unless you pay them the market rate... in which case cut having to micromanage nagging whiners and just buy off the market.
Those that might sell for cheaper to you in return for protection, well, eventually if you do your job right they start to believe they shouldn't pay for protection anymore and start exporting or try to renegotiate deals.
Trust me, 99.5% of you who haven't lead an alliance won't get this, but it's true. |
Gealbhan
Used Shuttle Sales Representative
164
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Posted - 2012.06.01 03:41:00 -
[12] - Quote
Been there done the whole 0.0 thing and I agree believe it or not 0.0 mining is SAFER than hi-sec mining. Who-woulda-thunk-it |
Ocih
Space Mermaids Somethin Awfull Forums
218
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Posted - 2012.06.01 03:50:00 -
[13] - Quote
Nabakou wrote:Ocih wrote:Or here is an idea. Let miners have their own Sov, stop trying to play Stalin with the map, support Ally NAP agreements on principle and find out the Industrial players are more than happy to put you in full T2 PvP fleets because it's what they do. Make stuff. As someone who has alliance leadership experience I find that pure industry corps are terrible to deal with, always nagging and wanting more and more. Most won't "put you in T2 fleets" unless you pay them the market rate... in which case cut having to micromanage nagging whiners and just buy off the market. Those that might sell for cheaper to you in return for protection, well, eventually if you do your job right they start to believe they shouldn't pay for protection anymore and start exporting or try to renegotiate deals. Trust me, 99.5% of you who haven't lead an alliance won't get this, but it's true.
I won't argue with you. I suspect there is some mechanical work both sides would need to address but I don't see renter as a solution either. I'd be all in for joining a Null Sec alliance (again - even though I say I won't go back to null) but I refuse to throw Ocih on the meat wall while all my logistics accounts rot in high sec. I'v never seen a Null sec alliance even try to intergrate Industrial in to their alliances. It's "easier" to just bankroll and buy from high sec. Good enough but that's the reason all the Industrialists are in High Sec. it's where the business is. |
SmilingVagrant
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
381
|
Posted - 2012.06.01 03:57:00 -
[14] - Quote
Ituhata Saken wrote:Sounds logical, but I wonder how much it matters with the NAPS in place. Dunno about the majority of 0.0 pvp players, but I honestly loathed making 20+ jumps looking for targets.
Right now the flavor of the day is NIPS not NAPS. I can be poking around in unfriendly space in about 5-10 jumps. Three if we count NPC null. |
SmilingVagrant
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
381
|
Posted - 2012.06.01 04:02:00 -
[15] - Quote
Ocih wrote:I won't argue with you. I suspect there is some mechanical work both sides would need to address but I don't see renter as a solution either. I'd be all in for joining a Null Sec alliance (again - even though I say I won't go back to null) but I refuse to throw Ocih on the meat wall while all my logistics accounts rot in high sec. I'v never seen a Null sec alliance even try to intergrate Industrial in to their alliances. It's "easier" to just bankroll and buy from high sec. Good enough but that's the reason all the Industrialists are in High Sec. it's where the business is.
There are things that are high value that are pretty much only built in nullsec. I'll let you ponder that. It's true we tend to import smaller ships (Actually not too small as we tend to cook all of our own frigates for newbies :V). Now that Nullsec mining is likely to become "A Thing" again you may actually see some alliances encourage industrial work.
As far as integration goes, I'm not really sure what you want. In Goonswarm I'm allowed to pretty much do whatever I want, and if a good enough case is made for it I can often get help doing it. |
Ituhata Saken
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
211
|
Posted - 2012.06.01 04:05:00 -
[16] - Quote
SmilingVagrant wrote:Ituhata Saken wrote:Sounds logical, but I wonder how much it matters with the NAPS in place. Dunno about the majority of 0.0 pvp players, but I honestly loathed making 20+ jumps looking for targets. Right now the flavor of the day is NIPS not NAPS. I can be poking around in unfriendly space in about 5-10 jumps. Three if we count NPC null.
That's not bad, now the question is how good is their intel and how often do your fleets play FC chicken before someone blinks and engages?
Honestly I'm not familiar with the north, I've only ever lived on the old AAA/RA border regions. I didn't realize NPC null was so close. That's where we usually got most of our pvp was from the small 2-3 man roaming gangs out of null hunting us on our downtime ratting and our people picking it up in intel and attempting to defend. You know what an answer is? It's a terminus -- an end. Answers are fine, but questions are where it's at. Questions bring us closer to understanding, -áthey can start a conversation or spark a revolution. So you might as well start asking... now.-á ~See you on the other side 6/6/12~ |
Ioci
Bad Girl Posse
183
|
Posted - 2012.06.01 04:37:00 -
[17] - Quote
http://www.perpetuum-online.com/
On the up side, you can mine until the cows come home and on Alpha Islands, do it with no PvP. On the down side, that's all you will be doing. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cg-_HeVNYOk
Save Derpy! |
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