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BolsterBomb
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Posted - 2012.06.04 17:03:00 -
[1] - Quote
I have to 100% disagree,
As a player that have ran both caldari and gallente missions I do know a thing or two about the npcs.
1) Yes you can solo majors (caldari and gallente) in a frigate (not nessacarly t1). The issue is that you will not be able to fight and you will be simply farming (which is the point of the farmer)
2) Farmers are a VERY IMPORTANT part of this new patch. For example the amarrians have tons of plexe avalaible. They need plexers to go out and hit systems that are empty if plays an important part in the contestation of systems. If you change the game mechanic that all npcs must be killed the losing faction will not be able to fight back as easily.
Again the afk plexers are very very very important for a losing faction. It maintains balance.
3) I run majors when im going for LP in a malediction. Even going 5k a sec I still take dings. I know you can do the same in caldari plexes as well. The missions for gallente are always speed tanked with an inty. I haven't seen afk condors running around speed tanking majors. They do speed tank minors and mediums but the gallente can do that as well.
I see zero problems with the current NPC mechanics. Each faction has different effects and each faction is smart enough to figure out how to counter it. We have to put sensor damps on our ships when we run missions, gallente usually use drones, etc Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.04 17:21:00 -
[2] - Quote
Princess Nexxala wrote:You guys can tank/run a gal major in a no skilled alt flying a condor solo, we can most definitely NOT do that. Hence why people are complaining. BolsterBomb wrote: 3) I run majors when im going for LP in a malediction. Even going 5k a sec I still take dings. I know you can do the same in caldari plexes as well. The missions for gallente are always speed tanked with an inty. I haven't seen afk condors running around speed tanking majors. They do speed tank minors and mediums but the gallente can do that as well.
As I said I have not seen condors taking majors yet. If they are out there its few and between. (not going to say they cant it just isn't practical when you are doing it for lp)
But again, does it really matter that a farmer takes a single major in a single system.
What I see more of is people creating alts to defensive plex. Not offensive plex. Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.04 17:33:00 -
[3] - Quote
chatgris wrote:BolsterBomb wrote:2) Farmers are a VERY IMPORTANT part of this new patch. For example the amarrians have tons of plexe avalaible. They need plexers to go out and hit systems that are empty if plays an important part in the contestation of systems. If you change the game mechanic that all npcs must be killed the losing faction will not be able to fight back as easily.
Again the afk plexers are very very very important for a losing faction. It maintains balance.
Here I strongly disagree. AFK plexers are a problem, not a solution. I don't think the design mission of FW is "lets allow plexes to be taken AFK, cause we want a gameplay mechanic that requires alts and AFK play because plexing is boring".
I agree with your statement however as a game mechanic it also helps create balance. An act of retardation improves for the greater good. Example, in Amar. Lets say 90% of systems are minni owned. By farmers coming in and plexing it contest systems higher in greater numbers which allows the pvpers to finish the job. Its kind of like "its the end that matters not the way you get there"
Remember you can shoot them as weill. Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.04 17:46:00 -
[4] - Quote
Dopified wrote:BolsterBomb wrote:2) Farmers are a VERY IMPORTANT part of this new patch. For example the amarrians have tons of plexe avalaible. They need plexers to go out and hit systems that are empty if plays an important part in the contestation of systems. If you change the game mechanic that all npcs must be killed the losing faction will not be able to fight back as easily.
Again the afk plexers are very very very important for a losing faction. It maintains balance.
3) I run majors when im going for LP in a malediction. Even going 5k a sec I still take dings. I know you can do the same in caldari plexes as well. The missions for gallente are always speed tanked with an inty. I haven't seen afk condors running around speed tanking majors. They do speed tank minors and mediums but the gallente can do that as well. I see zero problems with the current NPC mechanics. Each faction has different effects and each faction is smart enough to figure out how to counter it. We have to put sensor damps on our ships when we run missions, gallente usually use drones, etc Bolster you have just proven what i am fighting for. Am i worried about the caldari farming lp NO. Lets say that if the caldari take all the gallente systems and we are now the losing faction could the gallente use afk plexing alts with ease as the caldari do to counter and start winning again. Absolutely not. You have just given us an explanation that is totally one sided. This is a catch 22 statement. For further info take a look at the numbers caldari are outplexing by 200+ plexes a day more then anyone else. This is due to alt plexers that plex with no npc resistence and we as a militia try to kill them but they are to many and reship fast and are back out in seconds. We can not just spend all day chasing these guys. The ones that do stay and want to fight can because the npc's are a joke. My example of this is in my first post.
I understand it is not one sided and if Caldari take all the systems I would expect to see it on the flip side. My point is very simple. People will find a way to afk plex. I do not belive it really is afk plexing, you have to be there. I belive the more pressing reason caldari have more farmers is simply because of the location of jita (which you mentioned)
By having caldari alts it is easier to move lp into isk if you are caldari. You can do it as well for gallente but at this point the caldari have more systems to plex, the lp rewards are basically on the same level as gallente, and logistics is easier.
Once things flip Id expect to see more gallente alts.
Like I said I believe it is a balancing act that will switch as the tides turn.
Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.04 18:04:00 -
[5] - Quote
Dopified wrote:BolsterBomb wrote: Like I said I believe it is a balancing act that will switch as the tides turn.
But i also know you bolster we used to be corp mates and i know that you want to farm the lp and have a system to do so. I know you dont want that system to get harder so that you can keep farming the same way. Just as so many others wanted lp stores to stay the same because they had a system that gave them good income with the mission running. LP stores are much higher and thus you have to run 4 times as much to keep the same.
I read this then remembered you're an idiot
I stopped replying to idiots yesterday Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.04 18:15:00 -
[6] - Quote
Dopified wrote:BolsterBomb wrote:
I read this then remembered you're an idiot
I stopped replying to idiots yesterday
Bolster i call it as it is man you know that about me. This is about farming for caldari as much as it is system control with ease. I know Caldari do not want this advantage to change.
No we don't care. We are winning systems close to our homes not backwater systems where lp farmers target. You cant have afk plexers take systems such as Hikk, Hirri, Halanen, Tama, and Kedama
Morons like yourself post stupid things in which you did. If you want a constructive conversation then I am willing but you sir are an idiot who is mad.
Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.04 19:17:00 -
[7] - Quote
X Gallentius wrote:BolsterBomb wrote:
No we don't care. We are winning systems close to our homes not backwater systems where lp farmers target. You cant have afk plexers take systems such as Hikk, Hirri, Halanen, Tama, and Kedama
It's all about opportunity cost. Time spent securing backwater systems is time not spent defending front lines. Caldari have been doing both - plexing front lines hard with pvp'er, and speed-tanking backwater systems with afk plexing alts. Gallente interested in Occupancy Warfare have had to counter both with active mains. That is slowly changing. You'll see more resistance from Gallente in the near future as their home systems are threatened. Also afk defensive plexing alts will free up more pvp'ers interested in occupancy warfare to move to the front lines. Plus there is little reason to defend non-home systems that hard. Who among you are really all that interested in spending time decontesting Immuri for no reward? I expect the non-station systems to flip back fairly quickly. Station systems will flip back pretty quickly too unless Caldari move into them in full force. We'll see what happens.
100% agree
Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.04 19:42:00 -
[8] - Quote
Joanna Ramirez wrote:Dopified wrote:Personally guys i would like to see you post constructive thoughts and criticizm about this topic of balanceing the FW plexes. And when was the last time you or your corp displayed mental capacity for "constructive thoughts" with your in-game behavior. That's right, you never did. So pardon us when we dont give any respect to another unskilled idiot who wont even fly a t1 frigate without having his booster alt with him on a movable pos.
I almost fell out of my chair laughing at this
And for the record yes I am done working today and am now wasting time Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
64
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Posted - 2012.06.04 20:19:00 -
[9] - Quote
X Gallentius wrote:chatgris wrote:Additionally, I don't see any way to fix it for defensive (unlike offensive) plexing. You can potentially "fix" defensive plexing by manipulating the timer. Insert a rule such as: Plex Timer Rate for Defensive Plex = min(1, Max Ship Class in Plex/(Actual Ship Clas in Plex)), ship class for plex defined by requirements to get into plex. Unrestricted: BS = 8 Level 3: BC, HAC, etc... = 4 Level 2: Cruiser, AF, etc.. =2 Level 1: Destroyer, Frigate = 1 Examples Timer Rates: One T1 frigs in Major Plex = 8x 8 T1 frigs in Major Plex = 1x 16 T1 frigs in Unrestricted Plex = 1x If an afk defensive plexer wants to cap a major unrestricted with a T1 frigate, then it will take him 8x as long as it would currently. Defensive plexing issue solved. (Bring the right ship for the job dammit!) We're done. Time to move on to next issue. /thread (<---- Never works)
So if I go defensive plex by myself I get penalized even though I am not afk?????? Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.04 20:31:00 -
[10] - Quote
X Gallentius wrote:BolsterBomb wrote:
So if I go defensive plex by myself I get penalized even though I am not afk??????
No, you run minors with your frigs, mediums with your T1 cruisers, majors with your T1 BC, and unrestricted plexes with your BS. If you want to stay in one ship, then run the same level plex in several different systems. Just like when you offensive plex (assuming requirement to kill all NPCs was implemented). /thread.
So now I have to go and travel x amount of jumps reship and go back to that said system if I am focusing my efforts on that system.
Believe it or not (Dopified wont) some of us who plex actually plex in certain systems for a specific reason...hint hint hint
Im hoping you can read in between the lines : ie station lock out / travel / reship / problem Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
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BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.04 20:41:00 -
[11] - Quote
X Gallentius wrote:BolsterBomb wrote:So now I have to go and travel x amount of jumps reship and go back to that said system if I am focusing my efforts on that system.
Believe it or not (Dopified wont) some of us who plex actually plex in certain systems for a specific reason...hint hint hint
Im hoping you can read in between the lines : ie station lock out / travel / reship / problem Huh? You're defensive plexing. You own the system. Whatever logistics issues you may have pale in comparison to the entities that are offensive plexing the same system. Unless of course you have flipped a non station system deep within enemy territory (in which case you're going to lose it soon anyways).
I read this wrong, it sounded as if you wanted this for OFFENSIVE plexing.
I dunno if you're going to do this then just make it so only certain ship types can enter period. Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.05 13:19:00 -
[12] - Quote
What I find very humorous is the gals really think they are losing their space due to ask farmers.....I can see the flood of tears now.
*climbs in his boat*
Just wait till we knock you out of nenn. I can hear it now
AFK FARMERS CAUSED STATION LOCKOUOT Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
65
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Posted - 2012.06.05 17:45:00 -
[13] - Quote
chatgris wrote:Joanna Ramirez wrote:Fun & Eve dont really go hand in hand, dont you think? Not since this new patch, this new patch is fantastic fun, it's brought pvp back to plexes. Sure, one day it might lead to Nenna being taken, but then meh, drop militia for a day JF/carrier jump all my ships to some nearby non-FW lowsec system and continue the pew pew. I had already unsubbed my alt and was just waiting for this accounts sub to expire before this patch came out, and grudgingly gave the new patch a go, but DAMN. Eve crack is back!
lol too funny Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
65
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Posted - 2012.06.05 17:47:00 -
[14] - Quote
X Gallentius wrote:chatgris wrote:Julius Foederatus wrote: Was just thinking about this. Maybe a partial solution is that when you leave the button in an offensive plex, the timer starts counting back down to zero by itself. So instead of forcing the defender to run the timer back himself and waste his time after forcing out an attacker, and having the attacker come back after boring him to death, the attacker has to basically start over again if he waits too long and doesn't fight.
That's actually a fantastic idea. Seriously, +1. Not a bad start.
I would endorse Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.05 17:47:00 -
[15] - Quote
Dopified wrote:BolsterBomb wrote:What I find very humorous is the gals really think they are losing their space due to ask farmers.....I can see the flood of tears now.
*climbs in his boat*
Just wait till we knock you out of nenn. I can hear it now
AFK FARMERS CAUSED STATION LOCKOUOT Well all i can say is you dont see things as aparently most people do. It is called a numbers game. If you can field a crap ton more plexers and keep them going as cheap as you guys can then you can do what is happening. Look at the numbers. Caldari are outplexing everyone by 3000-4000+ victory points a day and yes this is due in large to Alts with low sp running timers all over with no resistence. It does not matter if they are in backwater systems or Nenna. Same as any other war it is a numbers game and when you put up larger numbers like that you can not win no matter what. It is going to happen that we will lose our system. Even BM just admitted it in his post that there is something up with low sp toons going to town. But you are the only one that can not see this or as stated before have your isk making machine threatened. I know it feels good to win but doing it without pvp or any resistence is pretty lame. Try getting out of your tanking interceptor and fighting for a change Bolster. Lets see you laugh when we destroy you some more.
you're still here? The funny farm is that way ----------> Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.05 17:51:00 -
[16] - Quote
Cutout Man wrote:sorry for only reading page 1, but:
why should ANYONE be allowed to AFK combat for system control? AFK plexing should be impossible.
why can you afk mine Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.05 20:03:00 -
[17] - Quote
Kuehnelt wrote:Abannan wrote:I can't think of any other way of getting aroudn the afk plexing alts apart from making the plexes progressivly harder. Just have to decide which is the lesser of two evils It's quite easy: require the destruction of the NPCs.
....no one reads..... Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.06 13:14:00 -
[18] - Quote
Once again.....your systems are not being lost to npc types. Dopified might sit and say "you have an advantage" but the truth is no one in gallente side is willing to put the time into capturing systems or defending it.
If you want to complain about NPC differences maybe we should start complaining about LP rewards and them not "being balanced"
The term "afk plexing" cannot be used for mediums and majors. IF someone were truly afk plexing you should have no problem killing them. The fact that they leave when you come in confirms they are not afk plexing.
I do not understand why this is hard to comprehend (for dopified I do understand why he cant comprehend it) but the others.
You are saying you are losing your systems because of a NPC difference......that YOU have nothing in your aresenal of weapons or ideas to counter a condor (which I still have yet to see) taking an entire system all on his own. I forgot those condor pilots are the ones taking ACTIVE systems....... Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.06 13:50:00 -
[19] - Quote
Dopified wrote:BolsterBomb wrote:Once again.....your systems are not being lost to npc types. Dopified might sit and say "you have an advantage" but the truth is no one in gallente side is willing to put the time into capturing systems or defending it. If you want to complain about NPC differences maybe we should start complaining about LP rewards and them not "being balanced" The term "afk plexing" cannot be used for mediums and majors. IF someone were truly afk plexing you should have no problem killing them. The fact that they leave when you come in confirms they are not afk plexing. I do not understand why this is hard to comprehend (for dopified I do understand why he cant comprehend it) but the others. You are saying you are losing your systems because of a NPC difference......that YOU have nothing in your aresenal of weapons or ideas to counter a condor (which I still have yet to see) taking an entire system all on his own. I forgot those condor pilots are the ones taking ACTIVE systems....... Well I can only fault myself for answering this with wasted time. Lets see what AFK Plexing means. Yes it is if you walk away from your keyboard and dont look at it. BUT AFK plexing is also when you hit the orbit button and DO NOTHING for the rest of the time there. If you just fold your arms and watch the screen while your toon orbits and gets the LP then you have AFK Plexed. Yes you can see the enemy coming and warp off. But this is still AFK plexing. We have to manage damage coming in and kill NPC's you just have to click the orbit button and watch. Again funny how NO minmatar militia is commenting on this topic that i have seen but i could be wrong there are alot of post. Funny how ammar are agreeing on this even though they are at war with us. Funny how Caldari say this is not an ISSUE. So to CCP, since we have seen post that the caldari do not think this is an issue as stated here can you just swap NPC's in gallente and caldari plexes. I dont even care if they are still labeled the same lets just switch them if caldari say this is not a problem. If you could also keep track of the Victory points on both offensive and defensive before and after the switch it would be nice to see this. Again caldari might still plex high but lets see how many are offensive compared to defensive and lets see which toons start going from offensive to defensive after this. Again it is ok to do this CCP. Damar BM Bolster and so many others have stated this is not an issue and that this does not matter. PLEASE SWITCH THE NPC's PLEASE post up if you like this IDEA
Ok so you are simply mad at the mechanics and using a disillusioned argument to say that we are "afk plexing" I can also say you afk mission since you use an interceptor to speed tank your missions and a bomber to simply cloak and shoot.
You think caldari can just orbit a button and walk away without watching damage. Hell I was "speed tanking" a major plex last night and hit deep armor. You cant say it is "afk plexing" I am putting my time into plexing a system with a ship that has a disadvantage of not being able to fight and I still have to sit and watch, I also do not have the ability to dock up in a station a repair.
Seriously dude go join Ceaseran and his whining in the other threads. We have no just uncovered that umadbro
I have speed tanked gallente plexes without a problem as well. The problem that the gallente have is jamming not missile spam. I know this because I flew gallente.
Just get some of your own pilots out and actually do something.
BTW thanks for odamia, our afk condors totally did it on their own
Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.06 14:09:00 -
[20] - Quote
Dopified wrote:Again as stated bolster you know how to make it personal and CRAP on those that have been good to you. Any reason for this besides me stating the truth?
just on you Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
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BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.06 14:29:00 -
[21] - Quote
Dopified wrote:BolsterBomb wrote:Dopified wrote:Again as stated bolster you know how to make it personal and CRAP on those that have been good to you. Any reason for this besides me stating the truth? just on you I guess because i was one of the only ones that thought nicely of you over here or was at least nice with how i treated you LMAO. On me. to funny
OMG just stop already....yes dopified you are the master that took "poor ole' bolster in from the cold"
I bow to your presence "bolster sucks and without you I would be nothing"
Oh dopified please privileged us by providing us with your presence......
I fail who wants my stuff Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.06 19:19:00 -
[22] - Quote
Mutnin wrote:X Gallentius wrote:Yuri Szarkhov wrote:X Gallentius wrote:Mutnin wrote: The simple fact is, you are now losing because you are lazy.. Not because of NPC's or noob alts farming plexes.
I'm sorry I can't hear you over the 7 Caldari systems we still dominate. Thought it was twelve? Oh, sorry, that was a few days ago. My mistake. When it gets to minus 1 you can say you're winning. Until then you're still losing. Humm it was 7 now 5.. We will see your 5 and raise you two captured Gallentte systems. Caldari forces have evicted the Gallente president from his slum lord offices in Ladistier, as well as captured Odamia.. (we are now losing by 3) We are winning by losing.. It's like Charlie Sheen is our co-pilot. On the NPC battle front I still see lots of NPC kills in the captured systems Caldari have taken, 1000 in the last 24 hours in Odamia, over 2000 in Ladistier.. Meanwhile in systems like Kehjari that is under attack by the AFK Dramiel coalition, funded by Gallente Militia, there has been only 116 NPC deaths in the last 24 hours., despite plexes being run almost 23/7. Things that make you go hummm. Could it be Gallente are just lazy & want to make excuses or could these 2 week old alts whom are farming Kehjari in AFK Dramiels, just happen to be elite Gallente plexers that are just much better than the rest of Gal Militia?
qft
Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.12 20:12:00 -
[23] - Quote
Mutnin wrote:Dopified wrote:
You are correct in saying you can chose the fight you want in plexes. The arguement i made in my first forum post was that Gallente and Ammar can not do this with ease as the Minmatar and Caldari can. Again as stated and evidence shown we take alot of incoming damage in a fight. This matters when looking for pvp. A t1 frig that is running a major then turns around and is able to fight inside the major is somewhat of an advantage. I actually lost a firetail to a dram this way the npc's did nothing and the other pilot agreed with me. Funny how even alot of caldari are admitting this openly.
You are expecting NPC's to do the work for you when you shouldn't. I attacked a Ishtar in a Gal lvl 4 mission in a Rupture and I died.. This must mean Cal NPC' s are not so over powered right, not that it was a bad fight to take, regardless of NPC's on the field or not? You are expecting to beat a Dram in a Firetail just because of NPC aggro?
Hey he has a booster! Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
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Posted - 2012.06.12 21:01:00 -
[24] - Quote
Alticus C Bear wrote:
Again I can run caldari majors in a frigate or assult ship but cannot be set up to PVP at the same time, it is not the fact that it is not possible it is the fact that it is open to farming and does not result in quality gameplay. .
And this is what we call the give and take
Go run it in a pvp ship then or go into mediums instead.
And there is a thing called burning BEHIND the warpin so you dont get aggro.......... Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
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