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Arthur Frayn
V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N
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Posted - 2009.09.26 12:18:00 -
[1]
But they praise the Rupture. What makes the Muninn (which should be a better Rupture) so terrible? Is it because one is cheap to replace and the other isn't? -- Eventus stultorum magister. |
BiggestT
Caldari Amarrian Retribution
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Posted - 2009.09.26 12:22:00 -
[2]
The rupture isn't supposed to snipe. EVE Trivia EVE History
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Arthur Frayn
V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N
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Posted - 2009.09.26 12:25:00 -
[3]
Originally by: BiggestT The rupture isn't supposed to snipe.
That was totally meaningless. The Muninn doesn't have to snipe either. It gets an extra turret and slightly better range and tracking which should allow for more breathing room. -- Eventus stultorum magister. |
Intigo
Amarr Rionnag Alba Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2009.09.26 12:28:00 -
[4]
The Muninn is crap. Compare it to a Zealot or a Cerb.
Yeah... ___________________
HELLO! My name is Inigo Mont...oh f' it. |
Juliette DuBois
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Posted - 2009.09.26 12:36:00 -
[5]
Because it¦s expensive, very niche ship. Pointless for close range where you risk your ship every time, rupture is cheap and durable. And it¦s beaten by best sniper HAC (zealot) anyway for most part.
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rubico1337
Caldari Mnemonic Enterprises
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Posted - 2009.09.26 12:37:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Originally by: BiggestT The rupture isn't supposed to snipe.
That was totally meaningless. The Muninn doesn't have to snipe either.
what else would you do with it other than make a glorified 100mill rupture?
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debbie harrio
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Posted - 2009.09.26 12:40:00 -
[7]
The Muninn is crap with A/C's, period, use a Rupture.
sniping Muninn,
5*720mm arty, tremor 2* drone link augmenter. 2*sensor Booster T2, 10MN MWD T2 2* gyro T2, 3*Tracking Enhancer T2
5*warriors.
This will snipe @ 130km and deliver a good Alpha.
Rigs depends on required range, if you want more fit Ambits, or 1 Ambit/1 targeting system controller or 2 targeting controllers for super quick lock.
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BiggestT
Caldari Amarrian Retribution
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Posted - 2009.09.26 13:05:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Originally by: BiggestT The rupture isn't supposed to snipe.
That was totally meaningless. The Muninn doesn't have to snipe either. It gets an extra turret and slightly better range and tracking which should allow for more breathing room.
Hint: If you're using AC's on a munin, you're doing it wrong.
Use a hurri if you want to go with AC's (me awaits Astro's approval ) EVE Trivia EVE History
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Beverly Sparks
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Posted - 2009.09.26 13:25:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Beverly Sparks on 26/09/2009 13:33:16
Originally by: BiggestT
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Originally by: BiggestT The rupture isn't supposed to snipe.
That was totally meaningless. The Muninn doesn't have to snipe either. It gets an extra turret and slightly better range and tracking which should allow for more breathing room.
Hint: If you're using AC's on a munin, you're doing it wrong.
Use a hurri if you want to go with AC's (me awaits Astro's approval )
Not sure about Astro, but I agree with you. Hurricane/Rupture is the way to go for an AC boat.
Edit: Oh right, why would you use a Muninn over a Vagabond if you want to fit AC's?
FOr me, the problem with the muninn is that CCP think that 1 utility high = 1 low/mid slot. Take a Muninn and make it 7/3/6 or 7/4/5 and then you have something. Utility highs on a sniping Hac are almost totally useless, and yet they are the reason that we have less combined mid/lows then every other Hac. That is why the muninn is inferior.
Edit: Oh I should also add that, although the Muninn has it's short comings, it is a sniper HAC, so that in itself makes it useful.
Zealot is better, but really I consider it to be the 2nd best sniper HAC in the game, since, well, there are only 3 of them and one of them is a missile boat.
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Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.09.26 13:32:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Arthur Frayn But they praise the Rupture. What makes the Muninn (which should be a better Rupture) so terrible? Is it because one is cheap to replace and the other isn't?
I for one dislike rupture as well, since the cane exist the rupture has no purpouse.
And as the others said, it is pretty obvious why it sucks (its a sniping HAC you know) since there are better ships for that role out there.
The reason why many prase rupture is price really. So comapring HACs and T1 cruisers you are doing it wrong. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html |
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Zarnak Wulf
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Posted - 2009.09.26 14:10:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Sidus Isaacs
Originally by: Arthur Frayn But they praise the Rupture. What makes the Muninn (which should be a better Rupture) so terrible? Is it because one is cheap to replace and the other isn't?
I for one dislike rupture as well, since the cane exist the rupture has no purpouse.
And as the others said, it is pretty obvious why it sucks (its a sniping HAC you know) since there are better ships for that role out there.
The reason why many prase rupture is price really. So comapring HACs and T1 cruisers you are doing it wrong.
Sacrilege. The Rupture is a nasty beast of a cruiser. And with smaller, cheaper rigs - you have alot more options. You can get 400-500 dps and a great armor buffer at the same time.
The muninn is looked down upon b/c its bonuses are for sniping and yet other sniping HACs are better then it. Projectiles are getting some love so this might change.
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TimMc
Gallente Brutal Deliverance Tactical Narcotics Team
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Posted - 2009.09.26 14:17:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Arthur Frayn But they praise the Rupture. What makes the Muninn (which should be a better Rupture) so terrible? Is it because one is cheap to replace and the other isn't?
People praise thorax but hate the deimos. Its a cost thing with close range hacs. Munin has sniping bonuses though, which at least gives it a long range role which it is ok at.
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Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.09.26 14:18:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Zarnak Wulf
Originally by: Sidus Isaacs
Originally by: Arthur Frayn But they praise the Rupture. What makes the Muninn (which should be a better Rupture) so terrible? Is it because one is cheap to replace and the other isn't?
I for one dislike rupture as well, since the cane exist the rupture has no purpouse.
And as the others said, it is pretty obvious why it sucks (its a sniping HAC you know) since there are better ships for that role out there.
The reason why many prase rupture is price really. So comapring HACs and T1 cruisers you are doing it wrong.
Sacrilege. The Rupture is a nasty beast of a cruiser. And with smaller, cheaper rigs - you have alot more options. You can get 400-500 dps and a great armor buffer at the same time.
The muninn is looked down upon b/c its bonuses are for sniping and yet other sniping HACs are better then it. Projectiles are getting some love so this might change.
Cane uses the same sized rigs as rupture...
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http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html |
Lili Lu
Purveyors of Uber Research Valuables and Ships
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Posted - 2009.09.26 14:23:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Zarnak Wulf The muninn is looked down upon b/c its bonuses are for sniping and yet other sniping HACs are better then it. Projectiles are getting some love so this might change.
This.
Also there is some marginal survivability with the Muninn as opposed to being in a Zealot in an unfortunate unforeseen solo situation. The two extra high slots can be a neut and lancher. One to try to shake a tackler the other to shoot drones. Also, unlike the zealot, you have your own set of drones to aid in both those chores.
Also, some people, ok me, have bad memories of being in an omen hull as a noob and just can't get over it enough to fly a Zealot. No such bad memories for the rupture hull, and the Muninn is more aesthetically pleasing, well to me.
Anyway fly what you want to fly, even if the prevailing opinion is that the ship is weak(er). Then plead for buffs on the forums
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Alsyth
Astromechanica Maxima
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Posted - 2009.09.26 14:46:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Beverly Sparks Edited by: Beverly Sparks on 26/09/2009 13:33:16 Zealot is better, but really I consider it to be the 2nd best sniper HAC in the game, since, well, there are only 3 of them and one of them is a missile boat.
Hum...
Zealot - check Munnin - check Cerberus - check, it's the missile boat Eagle - it seems you forgot this one... Which happens to outclass Zealot & Munnin by far after 140 km.
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BiggestT
Caldari Amarrian Retribution
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Posted - 2009.09.26 15:42:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Alsyth
Originally by: Beverly Sparks Edited by: Beverly Sparks on 26/09/2009 13:33:16 Zealot is better, but really I consider it to be the 2nd best sniper HAC in the game, since, well, there are only 3 of them and one of them is a missile boat.
Hum...
Zealot - check Munnin - check Cerberus - check, it's the missile boat Eagle - it seems you forgot this one... Which happens to outclass Zealot & Munnin by far after 140 km.
I would never use the word "outclass" and "eagle" in the same sentence (unless an "ed" was relating to it).
The extra range means jack, hitting at 200km means nothing when you have crap capacitor for guns, and terrible dps (as in 150-200 dps terrible). Sure you can pop inties that are too 'tarded to realize they've been locked, but it really is not a useful ship in any practical circumstance. EVE Trivia EVE History
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AstroPhobic
Brutor tribe
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Posted - 2009.09.26 15:52:00 -
[17]
Originally by: BiggestT Hint: If you're using AC's on a munin, you're doing it wrong.
Use a hurri if you want to go with AC's (me awaits Astro's approval )
Yes.
Originally by: Beverly FOr me, the problem with the muninn is that CCP think that 1 utility high = 1 low/mid slot. Take a Muninn and make it 7/3/6 or 7/4/5 and then you have something. Utility highs on a sniping Hac are almost totally useless, and yet they are the reason that we have less combined mid/lows then every other Hac. That is why the muninn is inferior.
6/4/5 That's one of it's issues. Others include artillery, EHP, etc..
Quote: Zealot is better, but really I consider it to be the 2nd best sniper HAC in the game, since, well, there are only 3 of them and one of them is a missile boat.
Eagle is much better than the muninn at 100km (currently), Ishtar will do more DPS but doesn't fit that will in typical sniper HAC gangs. Deimos isn't a slouch either.
The arty fix won't do nearly anything at 100km, but it may make it much more reasonable as a frig popper in a gatecamp (Especially with a ~65% alpha increase).
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Zarnak Wulf
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Posted - 2009.09.26 15:58:00 -
[18]
Originally by: AstroPhobic
The arty fix won't do nearly anything at 100km, but it may make it much more reasonable as a frig popper in a gatecamp (Especially with a ~65% alpha increase).
~65%?? Are you including the ammo changes in that number?
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AstroPhobic
Brutor tribe
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Posted - 2009.09.26 16:06:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Zarnak Wulf
Originally by: AstroPhobic
The arty fix won't do nearly anything at 100km, but it may make it much more reasonable as a frig popper in a gatecamp (Especially with a ~65% alpha increase).
~65%?? Are you including the ammo changes in that number?
Yeah, the ~10% ammo change should stack with the 50% alpha change, unless I fail with maths.
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Katarlia Simov
Minmatar Cowboys From Hell
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Posted - 2009.09.26 16:07:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Arthur Frayn But they praise the Rupture. What makes the Muninn (which should be a better Rupture) so terrible? Is it because one is cheap to replace and the other isn't?
In all honesty, you are pretty much spot on. The muninn sucks because it costs so muchmore for almost no extra survivability, and tbh not even much more damage. Its the same problem that the deimos has. The same role, comparable damage, but one costs like 25x more.
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1600 RT
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Posted - 2009.09.26 16:32:00 -
[21]
the muninn is the minmatar sniper HAC. it is crap because high utility slot are less useful on sniper so if you compare it to a zealot it have 2 less slot.
if CCP would move 2 high to 1 mid +1 low the munnin will become ALOT better
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Liang Nuren
The Hull Miners Union Gentlemen's Club
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Posted - 2009.09.26 17:02:00 -
[22]
Originally by: AstroPhobic
Originally by: Zarnak Wulf
Originally by: AstroPhobic
The arty fix won't do nearly anything at 100km, but it may make it much more reasonable as a frig popper in a gatecamp (Especially with a ~65% alpha increase).
~65%?? Are you including the ammo changes in that number?
Yeah, the ~10% ammo change should stack with the 50% alpha change, unless I fail with maths.
HELLLOOOOOOO Hurricane!
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
debbie harrio
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Posted - 2009.09.26 17:04:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Katarlia Simov
In all honesty, you are pretty much spot on. The muninn sucks because it costs so muchmore for almost no extra survivability, and tbh not even much more damage. Its the same problem that the deimos has. The same role, comparable damage, but one costs like 25x more.
Lol, another one that doesn't understand roles, the muninn is a sniper and is second best to the zealot at it's job, actually better if you take into consideration that the zealots in your gang are going to get primaried before the muninns and by that time the job is done.
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Dramaticus
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.09.26 19:17:00 -
[24]
ships better at anti-support than the muninn
zealot pulse apoc harbinger hurricane
Please don't use RL pictuers of players in Sig without permission. - WeatherMan |
Roemy Schneider
Vanishing Point.
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Posted - 2009.09.26 20:28:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Liang Nuren
Originally by: AstroPhobic
Originally by: Zarnak Wulf
Originally by: AstroPhobic
The arty fix won't do nearly anything at 100km, but it may make it much more reasonable as a frig popper in a gatecamp (Especially with a ~65% alpha increase).
~65%?? Are you including the ammo changes in that number?
Yeah, the ~10% ammo change should stack with the 50% alpha change, unless I fail with maths.
HELLLOOOOOOO Hurricane!
-Liang
errrt that'd be the boost to emp and phased plasma...? and clip sizes? don't see that affecting snipers in this scenario... - putting the gist back into logistics |
Xcen
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Posted - 2009.09.26 20:35:00 -
[26]
Lets go over the ships Muninns bult to be a sniper (expensive) Ruptures bult to be w/ autocannons/close range (cheap) ok cool they can do their roles well w/e Then if you take muninn vs hurricane close range...
The fact that the hurricane can do a better job at close range with a cheaper fit basically makes it the close range muninn pointless.
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Liang Nuren
The Hull Miners Union Gentlemen's Club
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Posted - 2009.09.26 20:43:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Liang Nuren on 26/09/2009 20:44:29
Originally by: Roemy Schneider
Originally by: AstroPhobic
The arty fix won't do nearly anything at 100km, but it may make it much more reasonable as a frig popper in a gatecamp (Especially with a ~65% alpha increase).
errrt that'd be the boost to emp and phased plasma...? and clip sizes? don't see that affecting snipers in this scenario...
I underlined it. ;-)
-Liang
Ed: FFS, I suck at quoting. -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
Removal Tool
Two Minutes Hate
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Posted - 2009.09.26 21:04:00 -
[28]
Most people are cattle.
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Draeca
Tharri and Co.
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Posted - 2009.09.26 21:58:00 -
[29]
Muninn sucks because the scan res is too low to lock pods before someone else pops them :( Wtb another midslot for second sensorbooster.
Also, it has only one single role that it can fill, which is sniping. If you're fitting ACs, you're doing it horribly wrong because you could just buy a hurricane.
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rubico1337
Caldari Mnemonic Enterprises
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Posted - 2009.09.26 22:08:00 -
[30]
Originally by: TimMc Munin has sniping bonuses though, which at least gives it a long range role which it is ok at.
source?
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