Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Florio
Blue Republic
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 07:42:00 -
[1]
This was an opportunity for a reasoned dissection of Nick Griffin's views to show how ignorant and non-sensical they were. But instead the only points debated in any depth seemed to be relatively trivial ones such as Churchill and the elitist ridiculing of someone for only getting a "2:2" degree.
There are real issues here and I was disappointed they were not debated properly. This is both because they need to be discussed, and also because Mr Griffin's views were not properly shown to be wrong.
Comments? Stick to the issues at hand and the program itself, rather than discussing Politics!
|
KingsGambit
Caldari Knights
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 08:03:00 -
[2]
Edited by: KingsGambit on 23/10/2009 08:06:48
He was quite thoroughly shredded, ol' Mr Griffin. Apart from two well reasoned (pre-planned?) answers, he made such a bad show of explaining himself, stumbling, dodging questions and changing his mind. I think the show concentrated too long on the immigration issue and not enough asking more interesting questions. In the latter part, I wished I was there as I had a burning question, but a muslim chap in the audience asked it for me to deserved applause. ("I was born here, educated here, work and pay taxes here, etc") Straw didn't come across too well either, but I think the panel/audience were simply blaming him for "labour failings" in general. Didn't help that you couldn't pin him down on anything. The lib dem guy was so polished he should consider changing his name to 'Mahogany' and the tory woman was quite confident and came across well. The sad thing is, like you say, Griffin's and his party's views were not really highlighted, but the show did show us something else. What the black lady on the panel said, that we're generally ruled by common sense....surprisingly she was right. Even if the show didn't make it harder for him than it did, you could tell how the audience felt about him. The press today says much the same thing. I loved how that historian/playwright woman answered questions with the most obscure stories..."my mother-in-law had never met a black person before me" or "my dog chased a stick once" or "I had fish for dinner this one time...". LOL, she was brilliant. And that line of hers (not verbatim) "I've got a lot of really interesting and informative books and information. I'll lend it to you Nick, you really should read some". Pure class As it is, I think Griffin was an amateur trying to play with pros, and it showed. The "define indigenous" thing was so badly handled. Oh and the Jewish kid in the audience comes to this school. Shame he wasted his chance to ask a good question. -------------
|
Another Liberthas
Caldari Ha'Menudim
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 08:13:00 -
[3]
MILITANT HOMOSEXUALS. EVERYWHERE, ENGAGING IN ACTS OF AFFECTION AND WHATNOT. ALSO, ISLAM IS REALLY REALLY BAD.
|
KingsGambit
Caldari Knights
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 08:52:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Another Liberthas Edited by: Another Liberthas on 23/10/2009 08:28:49 MILITANT HOMOSEXUALS. EVERYWHERE, ENGAGING IN ACTS OF AFFECTION AND WHATNOT. ALSO, ISLAM IS REALLY REALLY BAD.
Edit: That's basically all I heard from him, that and "No, I didn't say that."
You might want to consider using quotation marks dude. -------------
|
MightyRhinox
Minmatar Red Federation
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 09:14:00 -
[5]
I did enjoy his "My Dad was in the RAF and your Dad was in prison, so neh! " argument.
|
baltec1
Antares Shipyards Phalanx Alliance
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 09:15:00 -
[6]
The BBC have shown what the BNP is and what it stands for and should be thanked for promoting free speech while at the same time ripping these **** thugs apart in front of millions. Once again my licence fee is well spent
|
KingsGambit
Caldari Knights
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 09:23:00 -
[7]
Interesting related news article -------------
|
Hotdrop Bait
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 10:18:00 -
[8]
Well BBC don't direct the questions, so its the audience to blame for the irrelevant questions. I do wish that he was properly treated though so he could destroy himself.
I did laugh though at how much they attacked him, I laughed at how stupid his responses were, and then I laughed whenever the camera panned over the audience - which looks alot more mixed race than usual. |
TimMc
Gallente Brutal Deliverance Extreme Prejudice.
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 10:19:00 -
[9]
Bah that was me. |
Xen Gin
Silurian Operations
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 10:28:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Xen Gin on 23/10/2009 10:30:15 The worst QT ever, with no real political debates, and Dimbleby was extraordinary biased. The BBC did the right thing in giving the fool his air time, but it was squandered away at silly people fainting at the suggestion there might be something as an indigenous Briton.
Problem was, the bully boy attitude everyone had against him was a failure to put him down. The hostile audience was going to be a given, but then to have the panel and the host rip into him only gave the appearance that everyone was out to get him personally and not discredit his political beliefs. Now some in Britain will see this and will now vote for him.
## You got that? Right I'll be back in approximately 300 seconds to retort! ## |
|
dr doooo
University of Caille
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 10:31:00 -
[11]
Originally by: MightyRhinox I did enjoy his "My Dad was in the RAF and your Dad was in prison, so neh! " argument.
And the 'my dad was in the RAF, therefore I'm not a N*Z*!' - What kind of idiot logic is that?
|
Amanda Brighteyes
Caldari Rancer Defence League
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 10:52:00 -
[12]
I don't think the protesters outside see the irony in what they're doing...
"Let's riot and stuff because somebody has different views and beliefs than us!!!"
|
Irida Mershkov
Gallente Black Marsh X
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 10:59:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Irida Mershkov on 23/10/2009 11:01:20 He held his ground, a bit fair play, although his reaction to the American(?) author and playwright was a bit amusing "lol no u cant be right we aint all from africa durr we're white!!".
Admittedly, I'd have preferred if the show was a good two-three hours to get some more out of it really.
Edit: Jack Straw didn't last too well I thought, the other black lady was a lot more head on so good on her. The other chap (forgotten his name)seemed to have very little presence, I was drinking whilst watching it so I need to re-watch on BBC iPlayer really.
Also **** GRIFFIN
|
Xen Gin
Silurian Operations
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 11:02:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Amanda Brighteyes I don't think the protesters outside see the irony in what they're doing...
"Let's riot and stuff because somebody has different views and beliefs than us!!!"
On a similar note, I find this funny in an ironic way!
You're protesting over people protesting about Islamic Extremists!? We're waging war on terrorists and Islamic Extremists. I do just imagine Phil Ken Sebben saying to them, "Do you support the terrorist!?"
Back on topic, I thought it also added to a situation where NG is being attacked for his beliefs, no matter whether or not they were true. And attacking the probably very few truths NG said will have done everyone a lot of harm.
When he says that he and others are disgusted when they see homosexuals openly kissing in public, you can't really attack him on that and call him homophobic. Some people genuinely are disgusted. I know I dislike public displays of kissing by anyone just by the sound, especially when its right behind where you are sitting on the bus trying to read the Metro.
## You got that? Right I'll be back in approximately 300 seconds to retort! ## |
Haldane IV
Einstein's Dreams
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 12:57:00 -
[15]
Nothing that could have been said on the program but wasnÆt would have had any affect on the current core BNP supporters because they actually do share GriffinsÆ views.
I think, however, that the overwhelming condemnation of his position on the questions asked (never mind the answers, just the type of questions asked should speak volumes on what BNP is about) by the regular ômainstreamö panel members, the audience and Dimbleby himself (and all the furore in the papers this week) should have given anyone basically not to far from the social and political ômiddle groundö, but who has been unaware of the extremes the BNP are coming from, or is vaguely interested in voting for them out of frustration for lack of a perceived alternative to represent their views (e.g. the immigration debate), pause for thought.
Maybe the achievement of the program will be that that section of the electorate (who Griffin is currently chasing) will now look into what the BNP stands for more closely and see their true colours.
I usually watch Qustion Time each week; by the end of this particular edition I was getting rather bored with the topic, to be honest.
|
Yiffi
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 13:17:00 -
[16]
Wow what an utter disgraceful excuse for a political debate show Question time is. From the get go the whole show was setup to attack Nick Griffin at every opportunity, the whole audience was clearly hand picked by the BBC with the amount of left wing liberals in there. Hardly any of them had any real questions regarding the politics of the UK it was just insult after insult with a few smartass comments thrown in for good measure.
As for the panel my word, that was clearly another non bias choice from the BBC. Jack Straw was pathetic as always, he had to bring in how heÆs a third generation Jew rofl and waffled on for ages instead of answering a direct question. The Liberal democrat tried to make out they are somehow against mass immigration I chuckled at that too.
Baroness Warsi had some good points but she is a hypocrite trying to claim the moral high ground when she has made it pretty clear that she is opposed to gay relationships. Bonnie Greer oh my she acts as if she has walked out of a Jerry Springer show, she added nothing to any sort of political debate just random sniping at Griffin. Pretty clear she was only picked to interrupt him at any opportunity and just generally make herself out to be a complete waste of space.
All in all I won't be watching QT again any time soon I'm slowly growing to despise the BBC on the one hand claiming to be neutral in current affairs and the other showing a complete biased opinion when it suits them. Here is Nick Griffins view on yesterdays Question time. He might not of performed to well on there but I will bloody well give him credit for attending it, knowing full well what a hostile hellhole it was going to be.
|
Gibbeous Moon
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 14:52:00 -
[17]
Sadly, Griffin may have got away with it due to the savagery of the audience and the fact that he was clearly set up.
It's not hard to see why he gets support, though. I've watched QT for years and whenever the thorny issues come up the politicians of the three main parties waffle on and say nothing. For example, last night Straw was asked repeatedly to stick to the question on Immigration and all I heard were a load of platitudes and woolly statements.
If after any QT I went to my local and asked the regulars there what the main parties' views on, say, Immigration I would expect that no-one could give me a clear answer. If I asked them what the BNP's policies were then they'd certainly be able to give me an answer.
This is where the BNP are collecting the votes; they're the only ones for the man in the street they are talking to and telling them what they plan to do, no matter how odious it may be.
It's really down to the main three parties to sort themselves out and, for once, give us a clear message about what they are going to do. That way the support for the BNP will wither away. All this is of their own making.
Still, I learned some interesting things last night; for example, there's a non violent branch of the Klu Klux Klan.
|
baltec1
Antares Shipyards Phalanx Alliance
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 15:19:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Yiffi Wow what an utter disgraceful excuse for a political debate show Question time is. From the get go the whole show was setup to attack Nick Griffin at every opportunity, the whole audience was clearly hand picked by the BBC with the amount of left wing liberals in there. Hardly any of them had any real questions regarding the politics of the UK it was just insult after insult with a few smartass comments thrown in for good measure.
As for the panel my word, that was clearly another non bias choice from the BBC. Jack Straw was pathetic as always, he had to bring in how heÆs a third generation Jew rofl and waffled on for ages instead of answering a direct question. The Liberal democrat tried to make out they are somehow against mass immigration I chuckled at that too.
Baroness Warsi had some good points but she is a hypocrite trying to claim the moral high ground when she has made it pretty clear that she is opposed to gay relationships. Bonnie Greer oh my she acts as if she has walked out of a Jerry Springer show, she added nothing to any sort of political debate just random sniping at Griffin. Pretty clear she was only picked to interrupt him at any opportunity and just generally make herself out to be a complete waste of space.
All in all I won't be watching QT again any time soon I'm slowly growing to despise the BBC on the one hand claiming to be neutral in current affairs and the other showing a complete biased opinion when it suits them. Here is Nick Griffins view on yesterdays Question time. He might not of performed to well on there but I will bloody well give him credit for attending it, knowing full well what a hostile hellhole it was going to be.
Actualy the BBC vetted the audience to get rid of people who would do nothing but shout and insult the BNP. What you just saw is what most the britain thinks of this racisist party.
|
Yiffi
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 15:30:00 -
[19]
Originally by: baltec1 Actualy the BBC vetted the audience to get rid of people who would do nothing but shout and insult the BNP. What you just saw is what most the britain thinks of this racisist party.
ROFL! Are you seriously telling me that audience was a clear representation of BritainÆs public??!! Get real. Did you even watch the show? It was a complete farce.
|
Eran Laude
Gallente The Aduro Protocol
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 16:50:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Yiffi
Originally by: baltec1 Actualy the BBC vetted the audience to get rid of people who would do nothing but shout and insult the BNP. What you just saw is what most the britain thinks of this racisist party.
ROFL! Are you seriously telling me that audience was a clear representation of BritainÆs public??!! Get real. Did you even watch the show? It was a complete farce.
It's an audience from London, i.e. the most multicultural city in the world. What the hell were you expecting? Legions of skinheads to show up and go "OI OI UP THE BNP! GET THE MUZZIES AN DARKIES AAAHT!"?
I thought that Griffin got completely dismantled. Like, completely. Chris Huhne's first point was absolutely visceral - good on him! Baroness Warsi made some good points as well, and I enjoyed Bonnie Greer's commentary. Straw was a bit pathetic though. I enjoyed his line about "I'm the justice minister, go ahead and bloody say what you think!", but I think he was the wrong choice from Labour on this one, especially since he dodged the immigration question for about 5 minutes, and never answered it. Frank Field would've been an infinitely better choice, so a wasted opportunity there.
At any rate, Griffin simply came off as a slimy toad, IMHO. It's not a biased reaction - people genuinely do hate him and his politics. -----
Originally by: "CCP Whisper" Boo hoo. Cry some more.
|
|
baltec1
Antares Shipyards Phalanx Alliance
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 16:59:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Yiffi
ROFL! Are you seriously telling me that audience was a clear representation of BritainÆs public??!! Get real. Did you even watch the show? It was a complete farce.
I watch it every week and the BNP get the same responce when mentioned. Did they ask all of the questions I wanted them to? no. Did we see how much of a bastard he is? yes.
|
Bigpimping
Pimp Inc.
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 17:04:00 -
[22]
What Griffin was really wanting to say ________________________________________ He who pimps, is God... |
Yiffi
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 17:30:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Yiffi on 23/10/2009 17:30:49
Originally by: Bigpimping What Griffin was really wanting to say
Wow I've never seen something like that before how very funny and original.
As to the others It's pretty clear you're not interested in seeing the BNP beaten in an open and fair debate. Just to have the old character assassination and dodging of any sort of discussion on real politics. I won't waste my time further with bleeding heart Liberals.
|
Jago Kain
Amarr Ramm's RDI Tactical Narcotics Team
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 17:56:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Jago Kain on 23/10/2009 17:56:28 I watched last nights Question Time specifically because Griffin was appearing on it.
It was a ****ing farce. This had nothing to do with journalism and public accountability, and everything to do with certain panel members trying to boost their flagging public image by playground name-calling the unpopular, oddly-smelling fat kid.
Way too many smart-arses having a pop for the sake of it. OK; the BNP are ****ers, this is a given, but there was a chance here to call their leader to account for his anti-social views and all folk did was go for the easy targets, and there was way to much "rabble rabble" from an obviously partisan audience.
The BNP aren't anywhere near as much of a joke a the National Front were, they're better organised and some of them can spell, and some folk are starting to take them seriously. They didn't manage to get two MEPs by accident did they?
The glib and superficial mauling given Griffin by the panel and audience may garner them more sympathy among the electorate; after all, if they're setting him up like this it must be becasue he has something to say that they don't want us to hear right? QT has given credence to the accusations of bias in the media... and then some.
A missed opportunity. Would have been far better to get a real discussion going and give the bastard enough rope to properly hang himself rather than give him the opportunity to portray himself as a victim of unjustifiable bullying, which is pretty much what was accomplished last night.
Fail QT, and Dimbelby should be ashamed of himself for helping it to happen.
If the BNP are managing to gain support in a supposedly more enlightened and tolerant Britain, what does that say about public confidence in the traditional political parties. Perhaps the efforts of the panelists, and their parties, would be better served listening to the electorate than attacking soft targets like Griffin.
___________________________________________________ The game will never be over, because we're keeping the meme alive. |
Adonis 4174
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 18:07:00 -
[25]
I was disappointed that he wasn't treated fairly by others in the show nor by the media. It's clear to most people that the result wouldn't have been much different but now his apologists get to point at things which were said or done and say "See? That's wrong so we must be right!" and other idiots will fall for it.
Oh, and there's an interesting section in Freakonomics on the ***. They're not violent per se, they are more like vultures looking to profit from pre-existing violence by pretending to help with it. If you chart racial violence in the USA over time and compare it to key points in the ***'s history you will see absolutely nothing. While they were recruiting millions, no change in racial violence. When they closed down, no change in racial violence. But millions of people paying a dollar a month? Oh yes that happenned.
|
Xen Gin
Silurian Operations
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 22:37:00 -
[26]
Unsurprisingly, the panel were politically naive, something that is unfittingly of elected representatives.
## You got that? Right I'll be back in approximately 300 seconds to retort! ## |
Adonis 4174
|
Posted - 2009.10.23 23:19:00 -
[27]
Interesting, a triple-k is now a filtered word.
|
Benco97
Gallente
|
Posted - 2009.10.24 09:39:00 -
[28]
Disappointing, While I don't share the same beliefs as the man or party I still feel that they way he was treated was unfair and frankly embarrassing, It wasn't a political debate it was a personal attack.
Originally by: P'uck
You're a DUMBASS - bold italic underline at the VERY LEAST.
|
Randomness17
|
Posted - 2009.10.24 16:09:00 -
[29]
funny funny funny
|
Adonis 4174
|
Posted - 2009.10.24 17:23:00 -
[30]
Polls taken immediately after this show indicate an increase in the number of people intending to vote BNP, to a new high equal to the size of the increase they also show in Lib Dem voters.
Guess which stat the papers are all over?
|
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |