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Carolyn Siward
Minmatar Amarres Eunt Domus
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Posted - 2009.10.27 16:46:00 -
[1]
Those slaves you "save" from space.
"Rescuing" them, just means their enslavement.
Spreading your Amarr Lies to them as well.
Amarrians Go Home |
DeadRow
Caldari Veto Corp
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Posted - 2009.10.27 16:49:00 -
[2]
And with that stern message they will be packing their bags as we speak.
You could try picking up these ejectees? A little healthy competition never hurt anybody. Norrin Ellis > What?! Boobs aren't inappropriate! They feed children! For God's sake, think of the children!
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Cheiftan
Minmatar Shinryaku Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
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Posted - 2009.10.27 16:52:00 -
[3]
oh so let our Kin die rather than save them so that they can one day return to their fammilys, not all ammaerains are evil but then again lets just let our kin freeze in deadspace... Freedom will come through respect not the barrel of a gun |
Graelyn
Amarr Deus Imperiosus Acies
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Posted - 2009.10.27 16:58:00 -
[4]
You'd be surprised how many of the more militant Matari encourage that very type of behavior, Mr. Chieftain -------
Cardinal, Deus Imperiosus Acies |
Carolyn Siward
Minmatar Amarres Eunt Domus
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Posted - 2009.10.27 17:04:00 -
[5]
The Starkmanir and Nefantir have said they would prefer to live in the Mandate.
So why should we "rescue" slaves?
Amarrians Go Home |
Louella Dougans
Amarr Sovereign Hospitaller Order of Saint Katherine
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Posted - 2009.10.27 19:12:00 -
[6]
No
Be A Space Nun! It's Fun!! |
Jakiin
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Posted - 2009.10.27 19:39:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Louella Dougans No
I don't know, Sister Dougans. It seems a shame for you to rescue these people from death and then... What do you do, set them free?
As far as I'm aware, the Order does not believe that Slavery is an effective method of Reclaiming. They, like me, are 'Pacifist Reclaimers': They believe that the Reclaiming can best be accomplished by showing the cluster God's everlasting Love rather than his Wrath.
Of course, I personally still see slavery as a viable means of converting people. I'd just prefer we stop enslaving the innocent, as it's terrible PR. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Jakiin Holder Heir of the Kingdom 'Pacifist Reclaimer' |
Cer'ana
Minmatar Sovereign Hospitaller Order of Saint Katherine
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Posted - 2009.10.27 22:26:00 -
[8]
Carolyn, sweety, why don't you come by the abbey some time to see for yourself our methods of Reclamation? Promise we'll be gentle.
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Vikarion
Caldari Chorus of Nephilim
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Posted - 2009.10.28 00:21:00 -
[9]
Hmm. Apparently, even the best cause will have its critics.
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Eran Mintor
Minmatar Valklear Guard
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Posted - 2009.10.28 04:13:00 -
[10]
I for one support the Space Nuns. I see nothing wrong with their work. If capsuleers are too careless with the lives in their hands, then something should be done about it. Miss Siward, you need to stop being so close-minded. ------------------------------------------------
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Darina Rea
Sovereign Hospitaller Order of Saint Katherine
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Posted - 2009.10.28 11:01:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Carolyn Siward Those slaves you "save" from space.
"Rescuing" them, just means their enslavement.
Spreading your Amarr Lies to them as well.
Not rescuing them means their death.
Generally slaves mean much more work for us then non-slaves, because you have to track down the owner and discern wether or not is was the owner that spaced them in the first place. And then you get into legal business because spacing slaves on purpose is willfull destruction of sentient property and violation of several religious laws.
The easy solution is actually to bring them to a Minmatar station and let them handle it further. The people there are always fond of throwing law suits at Holders for mistreatment of slaves. It gives them the perfect proof for it and it gets the Empire rid of a stupid Holder.
Look at it that way and we're doing everyone a favour. _________
_________ Time is on our side. |
Hooch Flux
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.10.28 11:33:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Hooch Flux on 28/10/2009 11:33:08
Originally by: Cer'ana Carolyn, sweety, why don't you come by the abbey some time to see for yourself our methods of Reclamation? Promise we'll be gentle.
I once saw a holo in Luminaire that began like this!
I say prep for dustoff, nuke the site from orbit...
Only way to be sure! |
Darina Rea
Sovereign Hospitaller Order of Saint Katherine
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Posted - 2009.10.28 12:43:00 -
[13]
In which district? _________
_________ Time is on our side. |
Hooch Flux
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.10.28 13:09:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Darina Rea In which district?
30 years ago and I was mashed, can't remember...
It's Luminaire, does it matter?
I say prep for dustoff, nuke the site from orbit...
Only way to be sure! |
Carolyn Siward
Minmatar Amarres Eunt Domus
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Posted - 2009.10.28 13:16:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Eran Mintor I see nothing wrong with their work.
They preach their Amarr faith words. The faith that justifies slavery.
The Amarr have many of our people enslaved. This is unacceptable.
Yet, when freed, those enslaved ones do not want to live in the Republic, as evidenced by the Starkmanir and Nefantir, who want to live in the Mandate, of all places. This is unacceptable.
Why then, should we squander free Minmatar lives, attempting to rescue such Minmatar-in-body-but-not-in-spirit? The Elder War was a waste of free Minmatar lives, to rescue people who have no desire to be Minmatar. This is unacceptable.
How then can we bring freedom to the enslaved Minmatar-in-body?
Amarrians Go Home |
Esna Pitoojee
Amarr TalCorp Enterprises
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Posted - 2009.10.28 13:17:00 -
[16]
You know, it seems to me I've heard this before. Ah yes, here it is. Someone objects to Ms. Louella's doings, even goes to declare war on her. Then she actually begins to talk to Louella, and - oh, horror of horrors - finds out that Louella isn't such a bad person after all. And promptly ends the war.
Could we please skip to the "sit down and talk" bit of this? It would allow us to skip so much of the sillyness that led up to it.
Besides, I can tell you from experience that Louella isn't some sort of whip-wielding, fire breathing, hard-core preacher trying to enslave everyone in site. She's rather... er... different? Unusual? You just need to talk to her. ----------------------------------------------
Say "Amarr ships suk, lol." I dare you.
My statments do not represent the opinions, views, or actions of my corp. |
Kasuko Merin
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Posted - 2009.10.28 13:34:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Esna Pitoojee She's rather... er... different? Unusual?
She'd probably prefer fabulous.
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Stitcher
Caldari ForgeTech Industries
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Posted - 2009.10.28 13:49:00 -
[18]
There's also the small factor that she's doing all of this in Amarr space anyway. Meaning that she already IS home.
Seriously, that cliched old "X Go Home!" thing only works if X is abroad somewhere. - Verin "Stitcher" Hakatain. |
Eran Mintor
Minmatar Valklear Guard
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Posted - 2009.10.28 23:48:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Carolyn Siward
They preach their Amarr faith words. The faith that justifies slavery.
The Amarrian faith does not justify slavery, nor does it even mention it in their scripture. The Amarrian Theology Council is what justifies their holding of slaves and superiority over other races. The religion is just used as a tool to convince their masses by only preaching one interpretation of their texts; labeling and persecuting those who disagree as 'heretics'. The problem here is that you view religion as the problem when it is not the religion, but the Amarr regime and the propaganda espoused by the Theology Council that keep slavery thriving.
Originally by: Carolyn Siward
Yet, when freed, those enslaved ones do not want to live in the Republic, as evidenced by the Starkmanir and Nefantir, who want to live in the Mandate, of all places. This is unacceptable.
Why? The whole point of the fight for Minmatar liberation is to allow them freedoms they never had. If they don't want to live in the Republic because they don't don't feel welcome nor receive much of any support from their "brothers", why then would they want to stay? They are free to live where they want, practice what religion they want, and speak what they want.
Yet if what you're saying is that the state of the Republic and it's peoples treatment of refugees and ex-slaves is unacceptable, then I am in complete agreement with you. The Republic needs to change, and one of those changes will have to be the tolerance of world religions and beliefs. Are your minds ready and open for a social revolution of the Minmatar people?
Originally by: Carolyn Siward Why then, should we squander free Minmatar lives, attempting to rescue such Minmatar-in-body-but-not-in-spirit? The Elder War was a waste of free Minmatar lives, to rescue people who have no desire to be Minmatar. This is unacceptable.
Indeed, the loss of free Minmatar for the freedoms of the enslaved is often an ironic and coincidental situation. Some wish not to be freed, and others cannot stand the tyranny of Amarr rule. There is a wide range of feelings towards the Amarr Empire among their slave population; some still hold Minmatar culture dear to them, and others are completely indoctrinated. A lot of slaves aren't even Minmatar, but they will gain their freedoms as well if god wills it so.
However, it is not a waste of a life when one dies in the struggle to unshackle the bonds of another. If there was any better way for a free Minmatar to die, please enlighten me. The act of freeing slaves serves god's very purpose and is seen as a form of making amends for past sins.
I know the blood runs fast through the veins of all Minmatar, sister. I too can be very passionate and irrational at times, but I ask for you, and all Minmatar, to sit and meditate on past history and previous events some more. ------------------------------------------------
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Selkie Lochlan
Caldari United Systems Navy Zenith Affinity
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Posted - 2009.10.29 00:58:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Kasuko Merin
Originally by: Esna Pitoojee She's rather... er... different? Unusual?
She'd probably prefer fabulous.
It's always such a pleasure to be around her comforting presence.
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Kasuko Merin
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Posted - 2009.10.29 01:58:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Selkie Lochlan
It's always such a pleasure to be around her comforting presence.
Except when said presence is in a shopping mall...
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Herzog Wolfhammer
Gallente Aliastra
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Posted - 2009.10.30 07:08:00 -
[22]
So much energy wasted on caring what others think and do.
Your worst problem can be found in the mirror.
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Carolyn Siward
Minmatar Amarres Eunt Domus
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Posted - 2010.01.24 13:33:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Stitcher There's also the small factor that she's doing all of this in Amarr space anyway. Meaning that she already IS home.
Seriously, that cliched old "X Go Home!" thing only works if X is abroad somewhere.
They have been spotted in Minmatar space.
It Begins.
Amarrians Go Home |
dibblebill
Beyond Our Sins
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Posted - 2010.01.24 13:48:00 -
[24]
*sighs and rubs his temples*
I've been to the abbey. I did not see one single slave there. If I had, I would have departed immediately. Perhaps you should talk to Louella in person, on a calm, rational ground? I've yet to meet her but I have talked to Darina, and the Space Nuns are a quite pleasant and level-headed group. ------------------------------------------- The only true cause left is rational self interest. |
Louella Dougans
Amarr Sovereign Hospitaller Order of Saint Katherine
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Posted - 2010.01.24 14:04:00 -
[25]
We are now at war.
Niarja patrol is suspended.
Be A Space Nun! It's Fun!! |
Norrin Ellis
Heritage Foundation
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Posted - 2010.01.24 19:58:00 -
[26]
Declaring war on a group of nuns whose sole purpose is to rescue people from imminent death seems a bit unreasonable. While some of those rescued may indeed be converted to a different faith by Ms. Dougan's message, I would imagine more are simply grateful for her actions. In any event, is it such a crime for a Matari to adopt the Amarr faith of his own accord, particularly Ms. Dougans most peaceful interpretation of it?
Ms. Siward, I encourage you to reconsider your hostilities.
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Graelyn
Amarr Deus Imperiosus Acies
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Posted - 2010.01.24 22:42:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Graelyn on 24/01/2010 22:42:23
Some Matari seem to aspire to behave like the animals their detractors paint them as.
Way to support the stereotype.
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Sviw D
Caldari Ataraxia Pharmacies
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Posted - 2010.01.25 11:35:00 -
[28]
I do not believe this case is related to Minmatar mentality specifically, but more another case of capsuleer moral and emphatic degeneration. It is so easy to be the master of life and death, when it is not you who will be doing the dying and the value of life has lost its meaning to you.
It is common knowledge that the Space Nuns do not practice slavery themselves and that they sometimes even send rescued slaves to the Republic instead of the Empire. None of their actions suggest that they militaristic in their approach, but I suspect, them being long term capsuleers, to be more than enough capable to handle any hostility they might encounter.
This whole affair could of course also be a simple PR stunt from a minor radical terrorist group.
Ms. Sviw Deeanna Psychological and Social Studies, Ataraxia Pharmacies ATAP Humanitarian aid effort |
dibblebill
Beyond Our Sins
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Posted - 2010.01.25 13:20:00 -
[29]
Ms. Dougan, you have a mail. Let me know what you think when you have the opportunity. Best of luck with your current predicament. ------------[Signature]-------------------- Rational self interest. |
Carolyn Siward
Minmatar Amarres Eunt Domus
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Posted - 2010.01.25 17:02:00 -
[30]
I engaged the Space Nuns in glorious battle.
As I destroyed one of their ships, they had the audacity to hurl my own corpse at me as I returned for a third assault.
That outrage is, I believe, why I lost control of my Rifter in the wreckage field above the Empress's home world.
Amarrians Go Home |
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Rachel Voegel
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Posted - 2010.01.25 17:38:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Norrin Ellis Declaring war on a group of nuns whose sole purpose is to rescue people from imminent death seems a bit unreasonable.
Thank you for my new signature.
Originally by: Norrin Ellis Declaring war on a group of nuns whose sole purpose is to rescue people from imminent death seems a bit unreasonable.
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Norrin Ellis
Heritage Foundation
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Posted - 2010.01.25 17:46:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Rachel Voegel
Originally by: Norrin Ellis Declaring war on a group of nuns whose sole purpose is to rescue people from imminent death seems a bit unreasonable.
Thank you for my new signature.
Normally I would charge royalties, but I'm always inclined to make an exception for such a lovely young lady. Fly safely, friend.
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Ze'ev Sinraali
Ataraxia Pharmacies
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Posted - 2010.01.26 21:06:00 -
[33]
Maybe I'm reading the implications of the nomenclature 'space nun' incorrectly, but...if one is encountering them in space, then aren't they already at home?
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Graelyn
Amarr Deus Imperiosus Acies
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Posted - 2010.01.27 03:46:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Carolyn Siward As I destroyed one of their ships, they had the audacity to hurl my own corpse at me as I returned for a third assault.
Now THAT'S Style!
*breaks a rare grin*
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Lief Siddhe
Siddhean Inc.
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Posted - 2010.01.27 04:50:00 -
[35]
Eran, I gotta admit you're one of the most reasonable posters on Galnet. I applaud your perception.
I was somewhere around Old Man Star, on the edge of Essence, when drugs began to take hold... |
Louella Dougans
Amarr Sovereign Hospitaller Order of Saint Katherine
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Posted - 2010.01.27 13:34:00 -
[36]
The war is ineffective.
Niarja patrol will resume.
Be A Space Nun! It's Fun!! |
Graelyn
Amarr Deus Imperiosus Acies
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Posted - 2010.01.27 16:43:00 -
[37]
That's good to hear, Ms. Dougans.
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Carolyn Siward
Minmatar Amarres Eunt Domus
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Posted - 2010.01.28 17:58:00 -
[38]
I engaged at Niarja. It was a trap.
My Hurricane was jammed by drones while the enemy ship drained my energy reserves. I was unable to manouvre or fire consistently. My ship was doomed.
Then, inexplicably the space nun broke off and warped to the Kaaputenen gate. I followed. She picked up a container, then warped out of system.
I retract the war. I made a mistake.
Amarrians Go Home |
Stratio
Minmatar Mirkur Draug'Tyr Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2010.01.29 21:51:00 -
[39]
_____________________
For Tribe and Honour! |
Graelyn
Amarr Deus Imperiosus Acies
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Posted - 2010.01.30 04:24:00 -
[40]
Edited by: Graelyn on 30/01/2010 04:26:37
Quote: I made a mistake.
The capability of uttering this sentence is seemingly, for a capsuleer, more difficult that completing Titan training.
I can respect that.
Now then, about your corp name.... "people called Amarrians, they go, the House?" Conjugate the verb!
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Boadiccea Iceni
Minmatar The Burning Path
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Posted - 2010.01.31 11:06:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Carolyn Siward I retract the war. I made a mistake.
I could have told you that. Why didn't you ask?
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dibblebill
Beyond Our Sins
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Posted - 2010.02.03 20:52:00 -
[42]
I have amazingly hilarious this image in my head after Carolyn's last post of women in robes flying about space with their fists before them like holoreel superheroes. I'm not sure why I thought of it, though.
This is of no comment on Carolyn herself, just the strange imagery that gets into my head sometimes. *SPLUD* |
Daevonar
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.02.09 13:50:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Eran Mintor
The Amarrian faith does not justify slavery, nor does it even mention it in their scripture. The Amarrian Theology Council is what justifies their holding of slaves and superiority over other races. The religion is just used as a tool to convince their masses by only preaching one interpretation of their texts; labeling and persecuting those who disagree as 'heretics'. The problem here is that you view religion as the problem when it is not the religion, but the Amarr regime and the propaganda espoused by the Theology Council that keep slavery thriving......
Unfortunately, the theology council's (not to mention the Emperess herself) version of their Faith is so widely accepted within the Empire, by people unwilling, or incapable of questioningtheir actions for themselves, that to all practical extents it can be considered the faith itself.
The most widely accepted interpretation of the scriptures includes slavery, so in a very real sense slavery is a part of the religion. I'm well aware that there are a minority of Amarrians who hold different opinions, but the effect they have on the overall picture is marginal to put it generously, and the exclusion of slavery is such a large departure I wouldn't say they follow the same faith at all. They may share the same God, but surely they can't hold the same ideal of what he is and expects? Does this even make him the same God? Will we not always call our interpretation of God the God?
The Empire will never, collectively, practice their religion without slavery, we need to look outside its borders for that to happen. Ironically, the best shot at creating a 'version' of the faith that excluded slavery was on our very home soil, and it ended in tragedy because of this very issue. Dae.
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