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Klandi
Consortium of stella Technologies
68
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Posted - 2012.06.13 20:37:00 -
[1] - Quote
Was passing through a ice system the other day and caught a subject in local that intrigued me. The locals were getting bolchie and clubbing together to guard against the continuing ganking. They were discussing how to fit out a Mackinaw so it wouldn't be such an easy kill. I did some research on the subject - saw some terrible fits and have not managed to come up with a good answer. So forum warriors - here's the task
If profit is the key to maximizing income (admit it, grinding is a boring necessity) then you need to spend as little time doing it as possible. That means an ice miner needs to keep the basics which are: 2 x ice harvester II in high slots 2 x ice harvesters (II as the meta 4 are 360mil ea) in the low slots
You have 9.59 to play with CPU wise and 23.94 PG (plus two medium rig slots) to get a half decent tank AND you must get 4 blocks every three minutes...
Consider that a dessy with t2 stuff puts out 680dps and takes down a Mack in under 10sec in .7 sec space ...
What can you come up with? I am aware of my own ignorance and have checked my emotional quotient - thanks for asking |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1153
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Posted - 2012.06.13 20:38:00 -
[2] - Quote
join irc |
Mr LaForge
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
280
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Posted - 2012.06.13 20:38:00 -
[3] - Quote
Be blown up? Stuff Goes here |
Russell Casey
One Ton
149
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Posted - 2012.06.13 20:40:00 -
[4] - Quote
Go to lowsec, it's dead once you get past the border systems. And as all the pirates moved to highsec long ago, you can probably pay off the locals by offering to fuel their POS. |
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
346
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Posted - 2012.06.13 20:41:00 -
[5] - Quote
Mine ice.
Oh, there was more to the thread! TL;DR. Nothing Found |
Graic Gabtar
The Lemon Party
251
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Posted - 2012.06.13 20:44:00 -
[6] - Quote
Klandi wrote:What can you come up with? Alpha.
EVE shall be purged by fire - please Gods let them ALL burn in Jita. |
Calfis
The Dark Tribe Against ALL Authorities
115
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Posted - 2012.06.13 20:45:00 -
[7] - Quote
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:join irc
Or FAIL |
Torneach
Viziam Amarr Empire
241
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Posted - 2012.06.13 20:47:00 -
[8] - Quote
Erm.
Miners need to realize that maximizing yield and tank simultaneously is impossible.
You have to choose one. |
Vicky Somers
Rusty Anchor
103
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Posted - 2012.06.13 20:50:00 -
[9] - Quote
A: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3SlKedQg5O8 |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
7920
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Posted - 2012.06.13 20:53:00 -
[10] - Quote
Klandi wrote:If profit is the key to maximizing income (admit it, grinding is a boring necessity) then you need to spend as little time doing it as possible. That means an ice miner needs to keep the basics which are: 2 x ice harvester II in high slots 2 x ice harvesters (II as the meta 4 are 360mil ea) in the low slots First step: ditch the idea of maintaining maximum yield while at the same time maintaining a good tank. Everything comes at a costGǪ GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
CONCORD spawns: quick enough to save you?
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Kiteo Hatto
The Fiction Factory Blue Nation
207
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Posted - 2012.06.13 20:57:00 -
[11] - Quote
Move to a quiet system and then you can optimize your mining efficiency. |
Morganta
Peripheral Madness The Midget Mafia
1426
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Posted - 2012.06.13 20:57:00 -
[12] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:
Edit: Excessive lines removed - ISD Stensson
really?
and to the OP, no, there's nothing you can do, and don't listen to bait talk in local
The American public's reaction to the change was poor and the new cola was a major marketing failure. The subsequent reintroduction of Coke's original formula, re-branded as "Coca-Cola Classic", resulted in a significant gain in sales, leading to speculation that the introduction of the New Coke formula was just a marketing ploy |
Cyprus Black
Ascension Corporation
221
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Posted - 2012.06.13 20:58:00 -
[13] - Quote
Klandi wrote:Was passing through a ice system the other day and caught a subject in local that intrigued me. The locals were getting bolchie and clubbing together to guard against the continuing ganking. They were discussing how to fit out a Mackinaw so it wouldn't be such an easy kill. I did some research on the subject - saw some terrible fits and have not managed to come up with a good answer. So forum warriors - here's the task
If profit is the key to maximizing income (admit it, grinding is a boring necessity) then you need to spend as little time doing it as possible.
What can you come up with? We came up with this:
1) Everyone carry ECM drones. Any attempt by a would-be ganker will only get one volley (maybe two) before the ECM drones kick in and put the ganker out of commission until Concord arrives.
Or everyone carry remote rep drones and have everyone target another fleet member to rep. It may not be super effective, but it buys you precious time before Concord arrives.
2) Mine using tech 1 mining barges. Yes they're less efficient than their T2 counterparts, but far cheaper to replace and far less interesting as a target if and when gankers roll in.
3) Have everyone huddle up near an Orca and when a ganker rolls in, have everyone stow their ships in the Orcas ship hanger bay. Be sure that everyone doesn't have any implants because the ganker may choose to shoot a pod or two instead.
To go along with point 3, fit the Orca for tank instead of cargohold optimization to further protect everyones ships stowed within.
Regardless of the method you choose to say safe, all of them require constant attention. AFK mining puts you at far more risk in these dangerous times. You wouldn't complain about needles when you get a tattoo. So why would you complain about PvP when you play EVE? |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1153
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Posted - 2012.06.13 21:03:00 -
[14] - Quote
Calfis wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:join irc Or FAIL he said he wanted a place to safely icemine we don't offer safety sry |
Roll Sizzle Beef
Space Mutiny
499
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Posted - 2012.06.13 21:04:00 -
[15] - Quote
Even at max tank, takes very little to kill. The only way to stay alive is to just always be staring at your screen and not afk. Then you can (almost) max yield and jump when more than 1 bad standing is about, and jump when d-scan picks up a destroyer or two from max distance. Start paying attention to common locals. Use intel, mark known gankers. etc and so on. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
7920
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Posted - 2012.06.13 21:05:00 -
[16] - Quote
GǪanyway, it means filling every other slot with fitting mods and rigs, but it's possible to squeeze highest-meta MSE, 3+ù Invuln, and a suitcase in there for nearly 21k EHP, just as a first attempt. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
CONCORD spawns: quick enough to save you?
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Jacob Holland
Weyland-Vulcan Industries Alliance not Found
52
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Posted - 2012.06.13 21:06:00 -
[17] - Quote
It breaks the rules (the 2 Harvester upgrades in the lows) and it requires a 3% CPU upgrade to fit but the best I've been able to come up with is:
2 x Ice Harvester II
Medium Regolith Extender, Named EM Hardener, Named Invuln, Named Thermal resist amp,
Damage Control II Power Diagnostic II
2 x Overclocker I
Almost 18k EHP
Of course 40 more CPU would mean the Overclocks could be replaced with extenders and 22k EHP... Not that that would stop an ice miner from being despised of course.
Hulk: 3MW PG Mack: 40TF CPU Covetor: 20TF CPU |
Trollin
80
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Posted - 2012.06.13 21:06:00 -
[18] - Quote
unsub? You are your own worst enemy. |
Kijo Rikki
Killboard Padding Services
92
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Posted - 2012.06.13 21:10:00 -
[19] - Quote
The rules are a bit unfair. As an example, I would like to have the highest DPS drake without sacrificing its tank, and still be able to run the last room of an extravaganza solo. Compromise is king. |
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
1228
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Posted - 2012.06.13 21:12:00 -
[20] - Quote
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Calfis wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:join irc Or FAIL he said he wanted a place to safely icemine we don't offer safety sry How could anyone feel in danger when they have evildead's eleet pee vee pee fleets protecting them?
"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"-á-á-MXZF |
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Jacob Holland
Weyland-Vulcan Industries Alliance not Found
52
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Posted - 2012.06.13 21:15:00 -
[21] - Quote
Tippia wrote:GǪanyway, it means filling every other slot with fitting mods and rigs, but it's possible to squeeze highest-meta MSE, 3+ù Invuln, and a suitcase in there for nearly 21k EHP, just as a first attempt. How much are IFFAs these days? Last I checked they were really crazy money and almost equivalent to putting Gistii hardeners on the thing...
And I get 19k EHP out of it, not 21k...
Edit: And again it requires a 3% CPU Implant... |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
7921
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Posted - 2012.06.13 21:23:00 -
[22] - Quote
Jacob Holland wrote:How much are IFFAs these days? Last I checked they were really crazy money and almost equivalent to putting Gistii hardeners on the thing...
And I get 19k EHP out of it, not 21k... Overheating is your friend. Oooh, and with Orca backup, it's almost up to 23k EHP. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
CONCORD spawns: quick enough to save you?
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Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E. Comic Mischief
717
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Posted - 2012.06.13 21:25:00 -
[23] - Quote
Rigs: 2 overclocking units Mid slot: 2 'Langour' drive disruptors.
Method: everyone double webs someone else. Everyone aligns to a station and gets to speed. With the webs on you, you go quite slow and will remain in range of the ice long enough to fill up. If a hostile shows up the fleet commander does a fleet warp. As everyone is already moving fast enough to enter warp, the warp out happens immediately, even before the hostile completes dropping out of warp (meaning he cannot even target you).
http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/ |
RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
1879
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Posted - 2012.06.13 21:41:00 -
[24] - Quote
Klandi wrote: 2 x ice harvesters (II as the meta 4 are 360mil ea) in the low slots
You don't need these to mine Ice. If you want to ask safely, you'll need to lose some income. If you want safety and maximum income, you'll need to be actively flying your ship. This is EVE. -á Everybody Versus Everybody. |
Bossy Lady
Aliastra Gallente Federation
69
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Posted - 2012.06.13 22:07:00 -
[25] - Quote
Klandi wrote:Was passing through a ice system the other day and caught a subject in local that intrigued me. The locals were getting bolchie and clubbing together to guard against the continuing ganking. They were discussing how to fit out a Mackinaw so it wouldn't be such an easy kill. I did some research on the subject - saw some terrible fits and have not managed to come up with a good answer. So forum warriors - here's the task
If profit is the key to maximizing income (admit it, grinding is a boring necessity) then you need to spend as little time doing it as possible. That means an ice miner needs to keep the basics which are: 2 x ice harvester II in high slots 2 x ice harvesters (II as the meta 4 are 360mil ea) in the low slots
You have 9.59 to play with CPU wise and 23.94 PG (plus two medium rig slots) to get a half decent tank AND you must get 4 blocks every three minutes...
Consider that a dessy with t2 stuff puts out 680dps and takes down a Mack in under 10sec in .7 sec space ...
What can you come up with?
It's pretty much impossible to tank a Mack in a worthwhile way. It's a legitimate issue IMO.
If anything, the Mack should have more tankability than the Hulk, because the mining cycle is longer.
On further thought, I can't really see a reason to have a specialised ice-miner at all. My proposal would be to fold the Mackinaw's role into that of the Hulk (and upgrade the Hulk's PG/CPU so that it can fit a meta 4 LSE if it sacrifices both MLUs), and repurpose the tier 2 Exhumer role to something more appropriate like Gas mining.
Posting on this character because apparently some people get upset when they're asked difficult questions. M. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1027
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Posted - 2012.06.13 22:13:00 -
[26] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Klandi wrote:If profit is the key to maximizing income (admit it, grinding is a boring necessity) then you need to spend as little time doing it as possible. That means an ice miner needs to keep the basics which are: 2 x ice harvester II in high slots 2 x ice harvesters (II as the meta 4 are 360mil ea) in the low slots First step: ditch the idea of maintaining maximum yield while at the same time maintaining a good tank. Everything comes at a costGǪ Sounds like the standard approach to things.
Hulk must have its three strips and T2 MLUs in the low, right? Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
7922
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Posted - 2012.06.13 22:13:00 -
[27] - Quote
Bossy Lady wrote:It's pretty much impossible to tank a Mack in a worthwhile way. It's a legitimate issue IMO. 21k EHP is meaningful, and nicely protects the Mack against that much-maligned solo destroyer. In slightly higher sec than 0.5, you'll probably even survive two of themGǪ GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
CONCORD spawns: quick enough to save you?
|
RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
1879
|
Posted - 2012.06.13 22:15:00 -
[28] - Quote
Bossy Lady wrote:Klandi wrote:Was passing through a ice system the other day and caught a subject in local that intrigued me. The locals were getting bolchie and clubbing together to guard against the continuing ganking. They were discussing how to fit out a Mackinaw so it wouldn't be such an easy kill. I did some research on the subject - saw some terrible fits and have not managed to come up with a good answer. So forum warriors - here's the task
If profit is the key to maximizing income (admit it, grinding is a boring necessity) then you need to spend as little time doing it as possible. That means an ice miner needs to keep the basics which are: 2 x ice harvester II in high slots 2 x ice harvesters (II as the meta 4 are 360mil ea) in the low slots
You have 9.59 to play with CPU wise and 23.94 PG (plus two medium rig slots) to get a half decent tank AND you must get 4 blocks every three minutes...
Consider that a dessy with t2 stuff puts out 680dps and takes down a Mack in under 10sec in .7 sec space ...
What can you come up with? It's pretty much impossible to tank a Mack in a worthwhile way. It's a legitimate issue IMO. If anything, the Mack should have more tankability than the Hulk, because the mining cycle is longer. On further thought, I can't really see a reason to have a specialised ice-miner at all. My proposal would be to fold the Mackinaw's role into that of the Hulk (and upgrade the Hulk's PG/CPU so that it can fit a meta 4 LSE if it sacrifices both MLUs), and repurpose the tier 2 Exhumer role to something more appropriate like Gas mining.
Why does the Hulk need more grid to fit more tank if it can already tank plenty to make it unprofitable to gank it? Use the t2 resists, fit an MSE and tank the resists with an eye for blaster damage and you'll make it fairly expensive to gank you. This is EVE. -á Everybody Versus Everybody. |
Ris Dnalor
Black Rebel Rifter Club
350
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Posted - 2012.06.13 22:29:00 -
[29] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote: Edit: Excessive lines removed - ISD Stensson
wtf?
oh wait, I remember now... Excessive lines are a forum violation. shame on you karl. You're ruining my foruming experience!
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=118961
EvE = Everybody Vs. Everybody
- Qolde |
Professor Elos
Operation Neo-Tokyo Hashashin Cartel
104
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Posted - 2012.06.13 22:54:00 -
[30] - Quote
How to tank your miner against suicide ganks -
1) don't afk mine 2) align out toward anything 3) stop mining in highsec
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