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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
Lowbridge
Lone Star Joint Venture Wildly Inappropriate.
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Posted - 2009.11.12 03:31:00 -
[121]
come on CCP any comment on this???
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dracice
R.E.C.O.N.
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Posted - 2009.11.12 04:07:00 -
[122]
not that I do not share your concerns guys, even as a non ms pilot I still like to see them in action.
however, this is a test server, and nothing is final until dominion is released, they are reworkin things everyday and numbers.
I am CONFIDENT, these will not be the final numbers for the super carriers, no matter what comes, it will not be left useless like this.
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Xynosura
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Posted - 2009.11.12 04:48:00 -
[123]
Originally by: dracice not that I do not share your concerns guys, even as a non ms pilot I still like to see them in action.
however, this is a test server, and nothing is final until dominion is released, they are reworkin things everyday and numbers.
I am CONFIDENT, these will not be the final numbers for the super carriers, no matter what comes, it will not be left useless like this.
Well, to be fair the way CCP neglected the Titans for several years concerns us about the current proposed experimental changes. If they went into effect, it just may well be another few years for it to be sorted once again.
For this reason many of us are rightfully concerned and would not like to see our investments into this war machine lay to waste. |
Tarron Sarek
Gallente Biotronics Inc. Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2009.11.12 04:50:00 -
[124]
Edited by: Tarron Sarek on 12/11/2009 04:51:07
Originally by: Agmar Edited by: Agmar on 11/11/2009 20:47:22 I think constructive criticism is more valid than calling CCP and their families ******ed.
Having said that, I'm wondering if we could get CCP's rationality behind this change so that we could have a decent dialogue.
Edit- I'd have to assume that they'd only do this to reduce server load, and they'll be adding in a massive damage bonus per level or a role bonus. Similar to when they nerfed NPC RoF and increased volley damage... right? RIGHT?!?
Jesus, at least one sane, non-whiny and level-headed reply ^^ You, dear sir, are my hero for today.
Yes I agree, some explanation would be nice.
Personally I don't think a supercarrier should deal double or 2.5 times the damage of a dread. 10k+ dps is uncalled-for, but it should at least be 50% more than a dread.
-edit- Why don't people reply to the supercarrier-feedback thread?
___________________________________
Balance is power, guard hide it well
"Ceterum censeo Polycarbonem esse delendam" |
kossaw
H A V O C Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2009.11.12 04:52:00 -
[125]
Edited by: kossaw on 12/11/2009 04:53:35 It's really simple Abathur...
Just tell us it was a typo and we can all relax
because frankly this change sux
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Sea Gate
Caldari Sea Gate Corp
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Posted - 2009.11.12 05:12:00 -
[126]
Originally by: kossaw Edited by: kossaw on 12/11/2009 04:53:35 It's really simple Abathur...
Just tell us it was a typo and we can all relax
because frankly this change sux
Can't be a typo, its in the description and they shrunk the drone bay.
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Chris Rittenhouse
Caldari Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.11.12 06:05:00 -
[127]
What the hell were you thinking? I wanted to fly a supercarrier and had the means to and skills to. If this change is real, honestly, **** that and **** you ccp. Way to ruin something almost worth flying.
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Bobbeh
Minmatar Navy of Xoc Wildly Inappropriate.
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Posted - 2009.11.12 06:31:00 -
[128]
Ummm What happened to MOtherships... I mean Super carriers Being Useful or even Super, not they are just a tough skinned carrier.... Whats the Point? Huge Isk sink.... No Benefits?
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Raeyn
STK Scientific The Initiative.
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Posted - 2009.11.12 06:54:00 -
[129]
Nice one CCP. You are going to cost me more isk in cosmoline to keep my Hel from rusting away from no use.
I really hope this is an error in the database and you are working to fix it.
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Pallidum Treponema
Body Count Inc. Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2009.11.12 07:22:00 -
[130]
Originally by: Tarron Sarek Edited by: Tarron Sarek on 12/11/2009 04:59:35 Personally I don't think a supercarrier should deal double or 2.5 times the damage of a dread. 10k+ dps is uncalled-for, but it should at least be 50% more than a dread.
Dread DPS (short range guns): ~8000 Mothership DPS: 9600 (Nyx, 12000)
This is 20% (non-Nyx) to 50% (Nyx) more DPS than a dread.
However, if these new changes go in effect, the result will be:
Mothership DPS: 4800 (Nyx, 6000)
The motherships will now do 40% LESS DPS than a dread, with the Nyx lucking out at only doing 25% less DPS.
Unlike dreads, motherships have a primary weapon system that can be easily destroyed (smartbombs, shooting the darn FBs etc). Their weapon system has limited range (in effect, since FBs can't be delegated, short range fighting is the only viable option for any fight where DPS needs to be maximized). Their weapon system is not instant-damage (sharing that characteristic with Phoenixes).
Like dreads, motherships have a single purpose. Dreads are high-DPS anti-structure ships, with a secondary role of shooting capital ships. They are inherently unable to kill anything smaller with any degree of success. Motherships on the other hand are pure anti-capital ships. They have the wrong weapon system to shoot structures effectively (Fighters and FBs cannot get close enough to a POS to shoot it, not sure about TCU and other structures though) and against subcapitals, their performance drops hideously - they may be able to kill battleships at short range fairly easily, but this can be countered easily by rotating snipe spots and/or simply shooting the FBs.
Unlike carriers, motherships are NOT designed to be versatile support ships. Let's face it, a carrier has abysmal DPS (the same DPS as a close-range BS) but is able to make up for it with their RRing capabilities, triage function etc. Yes, a mothership can use RR as well, but is far less suited for the task, by not being able to perform it any better than a normal carrier, for ten times the cost.
Bottom line here, CCP. Motherships in the presented form were fine. They were underutilized before, the change was going to bring them back to the frontlines. With this nerf, there's ONCE AGAIN no reason to bring out a mothership. They do less DPS than a dread (which is far more expendable, easier to build, easier to replace, easier to get out of) and are not much better than a standard carrier.
And no, I will not buy into the "10 drones with twice the DPS is better" argument. I've trained carrier 5 for a reason. I want my full 20 FBs, because it's frakking awesome! --
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Thaeus
Black Serpent Technologies R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2009.11.12 07:34:00 -
[131]
You know I can even live with a nerf to how many FIGHTER BOMBERS can be deployed as long as the 20 NORMAL figthers can still be deployed. If you want a Supercarrier to be ANTI CAP give it the damn boost it needs to be ANTI-CAP. 10 fighters doesn't do squat to even a carrier and 10 40% less damage bombers don't do crap either. Oh **** IT'S A TARP! |
Jack Gates
Gallente GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.11.12 07:41:00 -
[132]
Originally by: Chris Rittenhouse What the hell were you thinking? I wanted to fly a supercarrier and had the means to and skills to. If this change is real, honestly, **** that and **** you ccp. Way to ruin something almost worth flying.
aaaahahaha keep crying you baby
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FlashSpawn
Body Count Inc.
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Posted - 2009.11.12 07:44:00 -
[133]
CCP To Whom it may concern:
I have had a NYX BPO sitting in a station for the past 1.5 years doing nothing really, until you told us of the great new changes to MOM's, 2 or so months ago.
I am not much of an industrialist and have built some carriers when they first came out but that is about it. So I think to myself hey lets build some NYX's and sell them as people are now wanting them big time.
So 2 months ago I dig in and spend:
15B ISK on component BPO's 3B ISK on a POS and capital arrays 3B ISK on 4 freighters for my alts to carry the stuff. 24B ISK on 2 lots of minerals for the Nyx's as you need to be building the next comps while the first is in build. 20B ISK Nyx BPO I already own.
That is a investment of 65B ISK of my own ISK, my ISK not anyone else's MINE!
With this change EVE will go back to how it was before, no one will fly them, so no one will buy them.
I have 3 people in my queue, ready to buy them, but now I am just waiting for them to turn around and say they don't want them now.
What am I to do with 65B ISK investment and possibly 3 Nyx's in my possession?? You made statements that changed things in EVE and now you renege on them!
Quite frankly I am getting a little tired of this sort of stupid half baked ideas that you thrust upon us at times.
I have 9 accounts with you CCP and 24 individual chars and have been playing this game for over 4 years, how about treating us players with the respect that we deserve? At the end of the day we are the ones helping you to make your product.
CCP please have a talk to some people in your company that do play in 0.0 with caps and the like and see what they think of this idea? Your guys have made mistakes before and you have corrected them as well (Carrier/Fighter nerf), so please do the same again here.
Thanks
FlashSpawn
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Sworn Absent
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.11.12 08:32:00 -
[134]
Originally by: FlashSpawn CCP To Whom it may concern:
I have had a NYX BPO sitting in a station for the past 1.5 years doing nothing really, until you told us of the great new changes to MOM's, 2 or so months ago.
I am not much of an industrialist and have built some carriers when they first came out but that is about it. So I think to myself hey lets build some NYX's and sell them as people are now wanting them big time.
So 2 months ago I dig in and spend:
15B ISK on component BPO's 3B ISK on a POS and capital arrays 3B ISK on 4 freighters for my alts to carry the stuff. 24B ISK on 2 lots of minerals for the Nyx's as you need to be building the next comps while the first is in build. 20B ISK Nyx BPO I already own.
That is a investment of 65B ISK of my own ISK, my ISK not anyone else's MINE!
With this change EVE will go back to how it was before, no one will fly them, so no one will buy them.
I have 3 people in my queue, ready to buy them, but now I am just waiting for them to turn around and say they don't want them now.
What am I to do with 65B ISK investment and possibly 3 Nyx's in my possession?? You made statements that changed things in EVE and now you renege on them!
Quite frankly I am getting a little tired of this sort of stupid half baked ideas that you thrust upon us at times.
I have 9 accounts with you CCP and 24 individual chars and have been playing this game for over 4 years, how about treating us players with the respect that we deserve? At the end of the day we are the ones helping you to make your product.
CCP please have a talk to some people in your company that do play in 0.0 with caps and the like and see what they think of this idea? Your guys have made mistakes before and you have corrected them as well (Carrier/Fighter nerf), so please do the same again here.
Thanks
FlashSpawn
So what you're saying is that you invested on speculation rather than hard facts, and it didn't work out for you? Sounds like your own stupidity is the problem....
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Mynas Atoch
UK Corp Mostly Harmless
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Posted - 2009.11.12 08:51:00 -
[135]
Edited by: Mynas Atoch on 12/11/2009 08:52:24 Can we have one little buff to balance this nerf .. a reprocessing module for POS that can take a supercap with a reasonable efficiency? Please? That will sort most of the complaints in one go and let a lot of older players disinvest emotionally from this issue. You win, we win, everyone is happy and we all get on with our lives.
And no, I'm not joking.
Myn
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Dri Kulsane
Amarr Body Count Inc. Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2009.11.12 08:52:00 -
[136]
Originally by: Gimora Edited by: Gimora on 12/11/2009 00:30:29 And for once i ccp actaly didd somthing that createt NO COMPLAINTS!
Until you didd this!
Credit where credit is due, CCP's team did come up with some fantastic changes. Now lets face it, no self respecting 0.0 pilot who has been piloting a mothership before would agree to what has now been added to the test server. Whoever is responsible for testing this new amendment out, perhaps they could step forward and help us to understand where he or she is going with this?
As for all of you who are posting here in this thread, commenting about those who have said they will cancel their subscriptions because of this. You seem to fail at understanding why people are posting here If we voice of concern over something which is being tested, and not yet confirmed, at least there is a better chance that it will be reversed. We all sit quiet, then it'll just be assumed we're good with it and they'll move onto the next issue.
So please, continue informing CCP if you are upset about this issue. Let them know that this will have an effect on peoples game play. Let them know if you have had enough of this ridiculous carry on. But, please don't don't bother posting here complaining about someone doing so.
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King Dave
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Posted - 2009.11.12 08:53:00 -
[137]
Yay, inactive mom alt. Staying inactive..
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HeliosGal
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.11.12 08:55:00 -
[138]
only other option is to give a dps boost to the fighter bombers themselves. Signature - CCP what this game needs is more variance in PVE aspects and a little bit less PVP focus, more content more varied level 1-4 missions more than just 10 per faction high sec low sec and 00 |
Dri Kulsane
Amarr Body Count Inc. Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2009.11.12 09:01:00 -
[139]
Originally by: Mynas Atoch Edited by: Mynas Atoch on 12/11/2009 08:52:24 Can we have one little buff to balance this nerf .. a reprocessing module for POS that can take a supercap with a reasonable efficiency? Please? That will sort most of the complaints in one go and let a lot of older players disinvest emotionally from this issue. You win, we win, everyone is happy and we all get on with our lives.
And no, I'm not joking.
Myn
But Mynas, I like my half arsed bestower Even more so, I like the fact that someone has put the time into developing them in a useful way.
Greetings from Finland btw o/
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mineswallower
H A V O C Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2009.11.12 09:06:00 -
[140]
Originally by: dracice not that I do not share your concerns guys, even as a non ms pilot I still like to see them in action.
however, this is a test server, and nothing is final until dominion is released, they are reworkin things everyday and numbers.
I am CONFIDENT, these will not be the final numbers for the super carriers, no matter what comes, it will not be left useless like this.
And thats the reason for this thread, so that they dont make just such a suicidal stealth nerf, and think that the unsuspecting eve community is dumb and wont see it for what it is.
HTFU CCP, get Noah on here to hold his hands up to this mess please
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Bobbeh
Minmatar Navy of Xoc Wildly Inappropriate.
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Posted - 2009.11.12 09:14:00 -
[141]
Honestly is the At least telling us why you did it to much to ask....
CCP: Hey So guys we are gonna Change the Name Make it Cooler, Then Add A New Fighter for you. Which will Allow the New Mothership to be a Cap killer not a Pos Decoration..... And then we are gonna take half them away... No reason just thought it would be fun.
NotsoSuper-carrier Pilot: *Picks Up Gun Hits Self Destruct then shoots himself in the face*
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Chagaline
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Posted - 2009.11.12 09:28:00 -
[142]
/Signed by angry/sad SC pilot =(
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Sokratesz
Rionnag Alba Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2009.11.12 09:37:00 -
[143]
Protest!
Don't know who to vote for? Find out with CSM matchmaker!
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Gneeznow
Minmatar Ship spinners inc
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Posted - 2009.11.12 09:39:00 -
[144]
cancelling my ten accounts and all my friends and their ten accounts and then cancelling my life in RL if this goes through
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Deathbarrage
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Posted - 2009.11.12 09:43:00 -
[145]
Originally by: Pallidum Treponema
Originally by: Tarron Sarek Edited by: Tarron Sarek on 12/11/2009 04:59:35 Personally I don't think a supercarrier should deal double or 2.5 times the damage of a dread. 10k+ dps is uncalled-for, but it should at least be 50% more than a dread.
Dread DPS (short range guns): ~8000 Mothership DPS: 9600 (Nyx, 12000)
This is 20% (non-Nyx) to 50% (Nyx) more DPS than a dread.
However, if these new changes go in effect, the result will be:
Mothership DPS: 4800 (Nyx, 6000)
The motherships will now do 40% LESS DPS than a dread, with the Nyx lucking out at only doing 25% less DPS.
Unlike dreads, motherships have a primary weapon system that can be easily destroyed (smartbombs, shooting the darn FBs etc). Their weapon system has limited range (in effect, since FBs can't be delegated, short range fighting is the only viable option for any fight where DPS needs to be maximized). Their weapon system is not instant-damage (sharing that characteristic with Phoenixes).
Like dreads, motherships have a single purpose. Dreads are high-DPS anti-structure ships, with a secondary role of shooting capital ships. They are inherently unable to kill anything smaller with any degree of success. Motherships on the other hand are pure anti-capital ships. They have the wrong weapon system to shoot structures effectively (Fighters and FBs cannot get close enough to a POS to shoot it, not sure about TCU and other structures though) and against subcapitals, their performance drops hideously - they may be able to kill battleships at short range fairly easily, but this can be countered easily by rotating snipe spots and/or simply shooting the FBs.
Unlike carriers, motherships are NOT designed to be versatile support ships. Let's face it, a carrier has abysmal DPS (the same DPS as a close-range BS) but is able to make up for it with their RRing capabilities, triage function etc. Yes, a mothership can use RR as well, but is far less suited for the task, by not being able to perform it any better than a normal carrier, for ten times the cost.
Bottom line here, CCP. Motherships in the presented form were fine. They were underutilized before, the change was going to bring them back to the frontlines. With this nerf, there's ONCE AGAIN no reason to bring out a mothership. They do less DPS than a dread (which is far more expendable, easier to build, easier to replace, easier to get out of) and are not much better than a standard carrier.
And no, I will not buy into the "10 drones with twice the DPS is better" argument. I've trained carrier 5 for a reason. I want my full 20 FBs, because it's frakking awesome!
please show me a revelation pulse fit or whatever that does 8k dps =/
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Enosh Kerrim
Body Count Inc. Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2009.11.12 10:17:00 -
[146]
many thx CCP we just sunk 100b isk . WTF is the reason for that
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Sarah Norbulk
Dawn of a new Empire The Initiative.
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Posted - 2009.11.12 10:29:00 -
[147]
I've always liked the Nyx, but never wanted to get one as they weren't really useful. Then you guys introduced fighter/bombers and Motherships, or Supercarriers, where actually worth fighting. Then you go and pull this ****. They now have a fraction of the DPS of a Dread at 10 times the cost. Way to go and **** up CCP. I'm happy I waited to buy my Nyx, cuz now, not only are they useless, they are more useless than before you introduced fighter/bombers.
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Sokratesz
Rionnag Alba Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2009.11.12 11:19:00 -
[148]
Originally by: Deathbarrage
please show me a revelation pulse fit or whatever that does 8k dps =/
They're changing the damage figures on sisi FYI.
Don't know who to vote for? Find out with CSM matchmaker!
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Roemy Schneider
Vanishing Point.
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Posted - 2009.11.12 11:32:00 -
[149]
i may hate capitals-online but this is just one of those facepalm-ideas - putting the gist back into logistics |
IAmPrimary
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Posted - 2009.11.12 11:42:00 -
[150]
Would be nice to see a comment from CCP...
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