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Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
2599
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Posted - 2012.06.22 22:32:00 -
[181] - Quote
Veshta Yoshida wrote:Mra Rednu wrote:The issue has been brought to the attention of CCP right from the first week of FW way back when it was obvious that on one side a t1 frigate can run plex's but the other side needed to use more resources to run them, basically saying that Amarr needed twice the numbers to do the same amount of plexing, not a lot of balance there ?
Lets not kid anyone here, CCP knew about this inbalance from day 1 and have not had any interest in putting it right, now it seems a few are taking an interest in it but they should of fixed this issue before moving ahead with any other changes, I wouldn't go as far as a rollback but there are scores of gunless frigates taking all size plex's and bombers running missions where we can't do either, risk/reward has been completely forgotten about in this case as there is no risk for them as they just run.
But also enough with the negative vibes, Amarr militia is far from finished plus we got Fweedit on board which I am loving, good guys on the whole who are learning very fast, we just need to be allowed to fight with some sort of balanced playing field. Quoted for truth and posterity.
Not empty quoting, but +1.
Now that it appears the plexing bug is being sewn up as we speak (they've finally duplicated it after three years. Progress!) I think this needs to be the front-and-center issue to address ASAP. It's what I've been talking to CCP about, its what all of you are talking about, I think its safe to say that another expansion without this issue addressed would be a colossal disservice to the community. Consider it my personal top priority. Vice Secretary of the 7th Council of Stellar Management.
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Har Harrison
Amarrian Retribution Amarr 7th Fleet
210
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Posted - 2012.06.23 12:07:00 -
[182] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Veshta Yoshida wrote:Mra Rednu wrote:The issue has been brought to the attention of CCP right from the first week of FW way back when it was obvious that on one side a t1 frigate can run plex's but the other side needed to use more resources to run them, basically saying that Amarr needed twice the numbers to do the same amount of plexing, not a lot of balance there ?
Lets not kid anyone here, CCP knew about this inbalance from day 1 and have not had any interest in putting it right, now it seems a few are taking an interest in it but they should of fixed this issue before moving ahead with any other changes, I wouldn't go as far as a rollback but there are scores of gunless frigates taking all size plex's and bombers running missions where we can't do either, risk/reward has been completely forgotten about in this case as there is no risk for them as they just run.
But also enough with the negative vibes, Amarr militia is far from finished plus we got Fweedit on board which I am loving, good guys on the whole who are learning very fast, we just need to be allowed to fight with some sort of balanced playing field. Quoted for truth and posterity. Not empty quoting, but +1. Now that it appears the plexing bug is being sewn up as we speak (they've finally duplicated it after three years. Progress!) I think this needs to be the front-and-center issue to address ASAP. It's what I've been talking to CCP about, its what all of you are talking about, I think its safe to say that another expansion without this issue addressed would be a colossal disservice to the community. Consider it my personal top priority. Hans - I am VERY pleased to see this posted. The only things that would make me happier are 1) CCP saying they will look into this and that it IS an issue 2) Them actually then doing something about it Why won't CCP fix the ongoing FW issues? NPC balance, timer bugs etc??? |
Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
203
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Posted - 2012.06.23 13:34:00 -
[183] - Quote
Har Harrison wrote:Hans - I am VERY pleased to see this posted. The only things that would make me happier are 1) CCP saying they will look into this and that it IS an issue 2) Them actually then doing something about it 1. They have indirectly by asking specifically for suggestions to solve the NPC conundrum (F&I thread).
2. Like all automotive engineers will tell you then it paramount to have a good strong engine mounted in the chassis before even inventing a wheel for said engine to rotate .. no wai ... They are doing the right things just in a completely illogical order, like inventing the ejection seat before the parachute or the above example
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Har Harrison
Amarrian Retribution Amarr 7th Fleet
210
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Posted - 2012.06.23 13:44:00 -
[184] - Quote
Veshta Yoshida wrote:Har Harrison wrote:Hans - I am VERY pleased to see this posted. The only things that would make me happier are 1) CCP saying they will look into this and that it IS an issue 2) Them actually then doing something about it 1. They have indirectly by asking specifically for suggestions to solve the NPC conundrum (F&I thread). 2. Like all automotive engineers will tell you then it paramount to have a good strong engine mounted in the chassis before even inventing a wheel for said engine to rotate .. no wai ... They are doing the right things just in a completely illogical order, like inventing the ejection seat before the parachute or the above example Except they should not be considering the speed tanking issue as an NPC issue. It is a plexing issue that is a side effect of how NPCs work. As such, it should be solved as a plexing mechanics issue.
"Players are not risking larger ships to run larger plexes so there is no risk vs reward in play. What do we do"
if the answer is rebalance NPCs, it won't get fixed before December and the winter expansion
if the answer is prevent all militias from speed tanking by requiring the destruction of NPCs, then it could be put into a release in the very near future. Note that CCP have added the fix to the borked timer in the patch notes for Inferno 1.1 (text is in green). This means they added it to the release whilst fixing the issue(s) they found that caused the delay.
As I said to Hans today - "This is low hanging fruit. I thought CCP were all about knocking off the low hanging fruit???". Don't make us go and shoot monuments in Jita - the Minmitar and Gallente will get shot by the Caldari Navy!!! Why won't CCP fix the ongoing FW issues? NPC balance, timer bugs etc??? |
Joanna Ramirez
Intaki Militia
17
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Posted - 2012.06.23 17:20:00 -
[185] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Now that it appears the plexing bug is being sewn up as we speak (they've finally duplicated it after three years. Progress!).
Pity they didnt actually ask me. I would have saved them 2 years 364 days, 23 hours and 50 minutes of valuable time...
Just saying.
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Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
203
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Posted - 2012.06.23 17:55:00 -
[186] - Quote
Joanna Ramirez wrote:Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Now that it appears the plexing bug is being sewn up as we speak (they've finally duplicated it after three years. Progress!). Pity they didnt actually ask me. I would have saved them 2 years 364 days, 23 hours and 50 minutes of valuable time... Just saying. Heh.
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Tanaka Sekigahara
United Space Marine Corp
124
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Posted - 2012.06.23 19:13:00 -
[187] - Quote
Duke Dantez wrote:Veshta Yoshida wrote:
All this talk about orbiting buttons and cashing out at tier2 (equal to double pre-'nerf Amarr' expansion rates I believe) is ridiculous to say the least when any plexing done by a gang can be countered/reversed by a single enemy frigate that is enjoying a near perpetual 75% discount in his store thanks to the mechanics.
Ha! Thanks to game mechanics??? We enjoy the 75% discount because of the hard work we put into plexing before the patch. Not because of game mechanics. You sound so pathetic when you say stuff like this. You honestly think it is the game mechanics fault for why you guys lost so many systems before the patch? ....You are the problem with the old guard Amarr. While the Amarr chose to wait to the to the last minute, The Minmatar chose to plex non-stop for a solid 2 months. Both sides knew what the patch was bringing and yet you guys chose the wrong stratagy and now blame it on the mechanics. Pathetic. It has been almost a month since the patch came out and today the amarr have more systems than they did on patch day. You are slowly crawling back despite what you call "hideously imbalanced" game mechanics. You gain a few systems and you lose a few systems but over the time span of a month you have a net gain of systems. I agree that the NPC's need a bit more balancing. I agree that bugs need to be fixed. But these are not the excuses you are looking for to explain your tier 1 position. Honestly they are very minor problems and when they are fixed what will be your excuse then? You enjoy a 75% discount because Goons have been propping you up while they have been scamming the rest of eve.Now that they are done I expect the minmatar will fold like an Albanian suit, assuming the Amarr can at long last, now find their goolies. |
chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
136
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Posted - 2012.06.23 20:02:00 -
[188] - Quote
Tanaka Sekigahara wrote:Now that they are done I expect the minmatar will fold like an Albanian suit, assuming the Amarr can at long last, now find their goolies.
As you type this, Minnies are back up to T4 and have been for a few hours now. |
Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
475
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Posted - 2012.06.23 20:59:00 -
[189] - Quote
chatgris wrote:Tanaka Sekigahara wrote:Now that they are done I expect the minmatar will fold like an Albanian suit, assuming the Amarr can at long last, now find their goolies. As you type this, Minnies are back up to T4 and have been for a few hours now.
It doesn't take much lp to get to tier five. I would think the goons probably did more to devalue the minmatar store than help them.
It does take a bit of organization to get to level 5 but most of the work is in getting the systems. Get 30 people to drop 200k lp and even if none of the systems had any upgrades they will all be upgraded enough so that your other lp can be cashed in at tier 5. Really minmatar likely only need a few more systems and about 15 people to donate 200k to go from tier 4 to hit tier 5.
After that their lp can be cashed out at half price from level 4.
Assuming ccp does some corrective action so the lp store doesn't crash the goons really didn't do much to effect faction war. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Duke Dantez
T.R.I.A.D Defiant Legacy
19
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Posted - 2012.06.24 07:20:00 -
[190] - Quote
Tanaka Sekigahara wrote:You enjoy a 75% discount because Goons have been propping you up while they have been scamming the rest of eve.Now that they are done I expect the minmatar will fold like an Albanian suit, assuming the Amarr can at long last, now find their goolies. The only thing the goonies did was exploit our LP store and the EVE market in general.. They didnt run plexes or roam space looking for pvp. So now that they are done you think we will suddenly lose the war? Did you even read their post?
Just the members of my corp alone could bump the Minmatar to T5 once a week so we can cash out. |
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Har Harrison
Amarrian Retribution Amarr 7th Fleet
211
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Posted - 2012.06.24 07:41:00 -
[191] - Quote
Duke Dantez wrote:Tanaka Sekigahara wrote:You enjoy a 75% discount because Goons have been propping you up while they have been scamming the rest of eve.Now that they are done I expect the minmatar will fold like an Albanian suit, assuming the Amarr can at long last, now find their goolies. The only thing the goonies did was exploit our LP store and the EVE market in general.. They didnt run plexes or roam space looking for pvp. So now that they are done you think we will suddenly lose the war? Did you even read their post? Just the members of my corp alone could bump the Minmatar to T5 once a week so we can cash out. Did the Goonies run plexes to capture almost all your territory leading up to the new patch? No. If it's not CCP favoritism towards the Minmatar it's the Goonies. Anyone want to take bets on the next scapegoat for why the Amarians fail so badly? 1 week old char speed tanking plexes...
I've been saying it for ages now!!! Why won't CCP fix the ongoing FW issues? NPC balance, timer bugs etc??? |
Duke Dantez
T.R.I.A.D Defiant Legacy
19
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Posted - 2012.06.24 18:40:00 -
[192] - Quote
Har Harrison wrote:Duke Dantez wrote:Tanaka Sekigahara wrote:You enjoy a 75% discount because Goons have been propping you up while they have been scamming the rest of eve.Now that they are done I expect the minmatar will fold like an Albanian suit, assuming the Amarr can at long last, now find their goolies. The only thing the goonies did was exploit our LP store and the EVE market in general.. They didnt run plexes or roam space looking for pvp. So now that they are done you think we will suddenly lose the war? Did you even read their post? Just the members of my corp alone could bump the Minmatar to T5 once a week so we can cash out. Did the Goonies run plexes to capture almost all your territory leading up to the new patch? No. If it's not CCP favoritism towards the Minmatar it's the Goonies. Anyone want to take bets on the next scapegoat for why the Amarians fail so badly? 1 week old char speed tanking plexes... I've been saying it for ages now!!! That was random. What does that have to do with my response to your claim that without the goonies the minmatar militia will fail.
You think the Goonies used plexes to get LP? or you think we used rifters with 1 day alts to gain all that space before the patch? Keep searching for scapegoats fool.
The 1 day old Rifter pilot is just your avg eve player trying to jump on the FW bandwagon and has nothing to do with what the Goonies did or why the Minmatar took all your systems before the patch. it's a problem but it's not why the Amarr are in their current situation. |
Har Harrison
Amarrian Retribution Amarr 7th Fleet
211
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Posted - 2012.06.24 23:26:00 -
[193] - Quote
Quote:Anyone want to take bets on the next scapegoat for why the Amarians fail so badly?
Quote:1 week old char speed tanking plexes...
I've been saying it for ages now!!! Why won't CCP fix the ongoing FW issues? Fix the speed tanking of plexes |
Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
206
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Posted - 2012.06.25 04:51:00 -
[194] - Quote
Duke Dantez wrote:The 1 day old Rifter pilot is just your avg eve player trying to jump on the FW bandwagon and has nothing to do with what the Goonies did or why the Minmatar took all your systems before the patch. it's a problem but it's not why the Amarr are in their current situation. You are right of course. All plexing in the month up to the patch was done in gangs (like Amarr has to) and rats were all killed (like Amarr usually has to) .. the single frigate never played a role in that great achievement
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Duke Dantez
T.R.I.A.D Defiant Legacy
19
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Posted - 2012.06.25 05:47:00 -
[195] - Quote
Veshta Yoshida wrote:Duke Dantez wrote:The 1 day old Rifter pilot is just your avg eve player trying to jump on the FW bandwagon and has nothing to do with what the Goonies did or why the Minmatar took all your systems before the patch. it's a problem but it's not why the Amarr are in their current situation. You are right of course. All plexing in the month up to the patch was done in gangs (like Amarr has to) and rats were all killed (like Amarr usually has to) .. the single frigate never played a role in that great achievement There is a difference between a 3 year old toon flying a T2 fit rifter that can fight back and a 1 day old alt created to speed tank for LP. Honestly, no one in my corp has used a low SP alt to plex. Before or after the patch. Then again TRIAD are pvp oriented and i cant expect the whole of militia to have the same mindset. That being said, we did work together with the majority of active Minnies leading up to the patch to snatch up as many systems as possible. We all used our mains (plus booster alts, etc, etc.). why would we use anything else? But that is just my experience.
Would you say that there has been an increase of the use of a 1 day alt rifter pilot?
Are you implying that the Minmatar created dozens of alts to do what our mains could easily do before the patch?
Are you saying the the plex mechanics are the main reason why you lost so many systems before the patch? (hint there are multiple reasons) If yes, what percentage would you say that would be? 50%? 90%? 10%?
I'm not saying CCP shouldn't fix the NPC imbalance. I'm with you on that. |
Dheeradj Esil
Antwerpse Kerels The Skeleton Crew
0
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Posted - 2012.06.25 08:31:00 -
[196] - Quote
As Minmatar, I approve. |
Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
208
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Posted - 2012.06.25 12:08:00 -
[197] - Quote
Duke Dantez wrote:Are you saying the the plex mechanics are the main reason why you lost so many systems before the patch? (hint there are multiple reasons) If yes, what percentage would you say that would be? 50%? 90%? 10%? Percentages on the internet is like arseholes, everyone has one so won't go there.
The main reason why you were able to go anywhere beyond Arzad/Huola really is that the majority of the Amarr plexing crew withdrew from the uphill battle that plexing is for us .. the drop-off happened just prior to or maybe just after Crucible .. so it is actually curious that you didn't manage to do more as you had more or less free reign for 5 months or so, but reckon the push/plans weren't made until after FF where CCP ****** up and spilled the exploitable beans Gallente, Caldari and Minmatar all have characters like Sasawong/Damar/Etc. simply because it is possible to be a plex-a-holic for all but Amarr, I tried but quite literally burned out after nearly two years of needing to put in 3-4x the effort to achieve the same as my counter parts (I was top VP total/earner up until then, 50/50 offensive/defensive) .. I do not know of a single Amarr that has been able to keep up plexing steam for more than a few months at a time (pre-patch).
Duke Dantez wrote:I'm not saying CCP shouldn't fix the NPC imbalance. I'm with you on that. We all want game to be challenging as well as rewarding, if instant gratification was the only thing then most of us would be elsewhere (or I should hope so ).
The cluster-**** that is FW at present won't be playable (for me) for at least six months or more as practically all facets needs iteration and since it has "launched" any changes will have to be scheduled in whatever gaps are in between other major changes, first and foremost null sovereignty.
You FW monkey's (I am no longer in, so just a vanilla monkey) are in for 3-4 months of frigate alt hell when eWar is removed and unless we can somehow make CCP apply some conscious thought to the winter iterations then that may become even worse and FW as a whole ultimately broken for everyone without a farmer mentality .. so get your arse to the Feature&Ideas and have your say in the designated threads that we may have some Good TimesGäó in FW once again! |
Jones Bones
Heretic Army Heretic Nation
113
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Posted - 2012.06.25 18:14:00 -
[198] - Quote
If Amarr were smart they'd all join Caldari and just reap the rewards of them slowly grinding Gal down. |
Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
476
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Posted - 2012.06.25 18:21:00 -
[199] - Quote
Jones Bones wrote:Ex-Amarr are seriously the biggest group of crybabies. Why are you posting on a forum that no longer concerns you? Go post on the RP forums baddies.
I couldn't resist. Did you have to post so soon? I mean this is just on the page right before your post.
Come on back Jones, there are more minmatar to kill. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Super Chair
Project Cerberus Caldari State Capturing
285
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Posted - 2012.06.25 18:24:00 -
[200] - Quote
Jones Bones wrote:If Amarr were smart they'd all join Caldari and just reap the rewards of them slowly grinding Gal down.
Better yet, they could join caldari, move to caldari space, and grind the gallente down with us
Caldari Militia still recruiting more amarr |
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BolsterBomb
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
99
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Posted - 2012.06.25 18:30:00 -
[201] - Quote
Super Chair wrote:Jones Bones wrote:If Amarr were smart they'd all join Caldari and just reap the rewards of them slowly grinding Gal down. Better yet, they could join caldari, move to caldari space, and grind the gallente down with us Caldari Militia still recruiting more amarr
QFT need more people to bust down 14 available bunkers Brig General of The Caldari State
Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation |
Jones Bones
Heretic Army Heretic Nation
113
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Posted - 2012.06.25 18:37:00 -
[202] - Quote
Cearain wrote:Jones Bones wrote:Ex-Amarr are seriously the biggest group of crybabies. Why are you posting on a forum that no longer concerns you? Go post on the RP forums baddies. I couldn't resist. Did you have to post so soon? I mean this is just on the page right before your post. Come on back Jones, there are more minmatar to kill.
LOL you think not being in Amarr FW is going to stop me from killing Minnies? I'm freed from the shackles of Amarr ineptitude brother. Free at last, free at last.
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Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
477
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Posted - 2012.06.25 19:05:00 -
[203] - Quote
Jones Bones wrote:Cearain wrote:Jones Bones wrote:Ex-Amarr are seriously the biggest group of crybabies. Why are you posting on a forum that no longer concerns you? Go post on the RP forums baddies. I couldn't resist. Did you have to post so soon? I mean this is just on the page right before your post. Come on back Jones, there are more minmatar to kill. LOL you think not being in Amarr FW is going to stop me from killing Minnies? I'm freed from the shackles of Amarr ineptitude brother. Free at last, free at last.
LOL I won't even ask what particular ineptitude you are refering to. I am staying in the militia because the little orange dots help me remember who to shoot. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
477
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Posted - 2012.06.25 19:11:00 -
[204] - Quote
BolsterBomb wrote:Super Chair wrote:Jones Bones wrote:If Amarr were smart they'd all join Caldari and just reap the rewards of them slowly grinding Gal down. Better yet, they could join caldari, move to caldari space, and grind the gallente down with us Caldari Militia still recruiting more amarr QFT need more people to bust down 14 available bunkers
I was hoping you weren't busting those bunkers due to strategy as opposed to an inability to get enough people to bust them down.
I am doing my bit on the amarr front.
I am hoping we will give caldari a breather by forcing some of those minmatar alts back over to the amarr front in order to protect their prized egg.
Hopefully soon it will be the gallente that has to deal with hordes of amarr alts doing caldari plexes for our lp.
We do have allied interests.
Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
136
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Posted - 2012.06.25 19:25:00 -
[205] - Quote
Cearain wrote: I was hoping you weren't busting those bunkers due to strategy as opposed to an inability to get enough people to bust them down.
I regularly see 40-50 man squid gangs out nightly (60-70 isn't rare either), if not more often. They have plenty of people to bust bunkers. It's either disinterest, strategy, or a combination of the two. |
Ash Stewart
The Tenori Tigers Zombie Ninja Space Bears
5
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Posted - 2012.06.27 02:45:00 -
[206] - Quote
Shylari Avada wrote:Aya Hekki wrote: you mean that pro elite pvper bigbigsomething that fly with 2 falcons "solo"? yeah he is a pro and he is kicking our asses badly, the war is lost we might just pull back to high sec and let you guys take all the warzone.
We don't want all of the War Zone. Hell- on the Amarr side there isn't really even a 'We'; there are those that do things and those that sit in a station complaining that 4 people are stopping them from LP farming (these are the same people that have alts in the Minmatar Militia to farm LP with). Then there are those of us that are here for PvP. We don't care about systems, plexing, loyalty points or running missions; we log in to blow things up. So far- things are going better than expected; continue flying your wtfits Minmatar guys, everytime one of you die- our entire Militia laughs. Seriously.
DONT class all of us in the same boat!
we dont ALL fly dual tank ships...............
and yea.... we love fighting you guys. You are the only ones actually giving us a fight (apart from a few others -- added as a disclaimer----). .................It's the eye of the tiger, it's the thrill of the fight Risin' up to the challenge of our rival And the last known survivor stalks his prey in the night And he's watchin' us all with the eye of the tiger............... |
Lexar Mundi
EVE Pilots for the Ethical Treatment of Asteroids
13
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Posted - 2012.06.28 02:14:00 -
[207] - Quote
Azami Nevinyrall wrote:So........let me get this straight.
Instead of doing something about your situation, and putting some sort of effort to make your situation better. You're Essentually relying on CCP to come in do it for you...
I find it awesome that the bible thumpers in game and out of game are Essentually doing the same thing. Just replace CCP with god. (no offense meant to the religious type, it's just the same story.)
It's called the United States of America syndrome.
"I know i have the same chance as everyone else but it's not fare because I'm not winning!" *stomps feet* |
Sokor Loro
Fweddit I Whip My Slaves Back and Forth
55
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Posted - 2012.06.28 05:10:00 -
[208] - Quote
Lexar Mundi wrote:Azami Nevinyrall wrote:So........let me get this straight.
Instead of doing something about your situation, and putting some sort of effort to make your situation better. You're Essentually relying on CCP to come in do it for you...
I find it awesome that the bible thumpers in game and out of game are Essentually doing the same thing. Just replace CCP with god. (no offense meant to the religious type, it's just the same story.) It's called the United States of America syndrome. "I know i have the same chance as everyone else but it's not fare because I'm not winning!" *stomps feet*
Hardly limited to Americans :P |
Emily Florence Nightingale
Uskudar
1
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Posted - 2012.06.28 15:53:00 -
[209] - Quote
and the award for the most uses of the word tard in a pointless "i'm mad thread" goes to....
some usless mindless "tard" |
Scar'sun Sunji
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2012.06.28 18:15:00 -
[210] - Quote
well speaking from a lore perspective karma's a cold hearted *****.
but also speaking from a lore perspective didn't these wars stop because they were far too costly in human life to justify any of their causes? at least that's I could remember from the old Intro cinematic. |
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