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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Upde
Upde Harris Industries
0
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Posted - 2012.06.18 17:16:00 -
[31] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Alexa Coates wrote:Jesus christ, stop trying to MAKE people fight you. Go shoot some other miners you freaks. This is not a question of making people fight, this is a question of fariness. Newbies should be protected to a point yes, but players who can affect the game in any way AFTER a newbie period (as in my other post, I suggest 6 months) should be liable to experiance the negative aspects of the game in full. One of those negative aspects is being invovled in a war.
You shouldn' t have to be forced to be involved in a War if you don't want to. Players already face the negative prospects the minute they undock. If hisec ganking did not exist I would say yes to Wardecing NPC corps. but as there is a mechanic in game already that allows for blowing greenhorns out of the sky already its a bit OTT.
Remember jut because the galaxy is at war not everyone needs to be in it. Switzerland managed to avoid a pretty big war afterall and they were snadwiched in the middle of it as the **** unflded and somehow managed to avoid engaging in it..............
Yes eve is harsh and so is real life, but hey in real life you can avoid war even when its on your front door step so as to speak |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
866
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Posted - 2012.06.18 17:19:00 -
[32] - Quote
Mia Restolo wrote:Donte wrote: you're right about them not being safe. but they are, without a doubt, the safest. which says a lot. What do they sacrifice for that added safety?
11% tax, being forced to share a corp with lots of random idiots, difficulty finding a group of trustworthy players to tackle challenging or boring content or to pvp with. No ship replacement policies, organized corp activities, or anything else that comes from being in a good corp. Not being able to run a POS, POCO, etc... If they were wardeccable people would simply make tons of 1 person or alt only corps to avoid people like you who are too chicken to engage a competent opponent. If you really want to shoot them, go ahead and gank them and deal with the consequences. You say that NPC corp members suffer from a lack of organized activities. Why is that? I'm in a corp with a bunch of idiots, in an alliance with a bunch of idiots, in a coalition with a bunch of idiots. That doesn't keep us from organizing. Far from it! If anything, we're overorganized.
One wonders what might motivate the worst corps in Eve to organize themselves better than them being subject to war.
Doesn't one wonder? He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Jenn aSide
Smokin Aces.
120
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Posted - 2012.06.18 17:21:00 -
[33] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:Alexa Coates wrote:Jesus christ, stop trying to MAKE people fight you. Go shoot some other miners you freaks. This is not a question of making people fight, this is a question of fariness. Newbies should be protected to a point yes, but players who can affect the game in any way AFTER a newbie period (as in my other post, I suggest 6 months) should be liable to experiance the negative aspects of the game in full. One of those negative aspects is being invovled in a war. Rookie Corps are not the same as Bittervet NPC Corps. Make NPC corps dec-vulnerable. Leave Rookie corps alone. All semblance of ill-intent vanishes, because a rookie cannot be in an NPC corp without having first joined a player corp to get out of the Rookie corp. Clear as mud, right? I can go for that, with the exception that once a player passes a certain point even in the rookie corp (say, 5 or 6 mil SP), they too should become deccable. If you don't do that, people just stay in rookie corps forever, suffering no real consequence in game other than a few high fees for things (which, after you get to the point where you can do lvl 4 missions, become moot). I agree that those players (above a certain SP limit) don't really belong in rookie corps. But, ostensibly, they could be self-appointed "teachers" who "help" newbies by "indoctrinating them" into Eve. While I feel the overwhelming majority of such players actually provide misinformation (knowingly or otherwise), I think it would be a disservice to CCP to not allow players an opportunity to interact almost solely with Newbies. For this reason, I think players should be allowed to stay indefinitely in rookie corps and thus be protected from war declarations. However, once any player sheds the umbrella protection of a rookie corp for any reason, that player should be subject to war declaration from that point forward. Barring this, all non-rookie NPC corps should be automatically enrolled in FW, like it or not.
That a few people might be doing some form of in-game service is simply not a good reason to allow what amounts to a truck size loop hole.
people in npc corps or anywhere else could help new players along, you don't need corp chat for that.
And saying that people who leave the rookie corp for any reason can be war-dec'd simply means people will NEVER leave the rookie corp is all. So instead of npc corp freighters in jita, it would just be rookie corp frieghters.
Now, one work around to that is extending the trial account training prohibition. If you want to stay in a rookie corp forever, that's fine, but you can't train lots of things like freighters or cynos, nor could you (for example) accept anything higher than a lvl 3 mission.
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BearJews
Android Arms And Industrial Corporation Tenth Legion
40
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Posted - 2012.06.18 17:22:00 -
[34] - Quote
Leave it alone? Find other targets? Seriously some people just complain to complain.
The eve universe is HUGe yet you have to complain about NPC corps. lol. |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1258
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Posted - 2012.06.18 17:24:00 -
[35] - Quote
ban npc corps
Replace them with a shared chat channel and make individuals wardecable as 'freelancers'.
good thread by good poster |
Jake Warbird
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1398
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 17:25:00 -
[36] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:One wonders what might motivate the worst corps in Eve to organize themselves better than them being subject to war.
Doesn't one wonder? Darth,you're the only one that's made good posts throughout this thread. +1
The only thing I'm not for is subjecting new players who are hardly hours old to a wardec. Rest seems alright really.
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Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1258
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 17:26:00 -
[37] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Donte wrote:i have to say this again.
Its not about forcing people to fight, that is simply impossible.
its about removing unnecessary immunities.
There is no good reason that non-noobcorp NPC corporations should be immune to incoming wardecs. But all the NPC corp freighters out of Jita ... How much does it cost to make a new corp ? not much but the new wardec system has helped alleviate the decshield problem
all that remains is the npc corp problem |
Upde
Upde Harris Industries
0
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 17:29:00 -
[38] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:
Now, one work around to that is extending the trial account training prohibition. If you want to stay in a rookie corp forever, that's fine, but you can't train lots of things like freighters or cynos, nor could you (for example) accept anything higher than a lvl 3 mission.
untill you start paying those players monthly subs thatidea is unworkable. providing they are paying their monthly's they can do what ever the **** they choose. If they choose to be in an NPC corp thats their business and they shouldn't be limited from doing and training what ever they want. They acept all the risks as soon as they undock, so if they want to undock in nullsec in a 2 billion ship and get ass raped by an organised nullsec deathsquad then so be it. But saying they should be restricted as to what they can train and what they can do in game when they are fully paid is bullshit |
Jake Warbird
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1401
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Posted - 2012.06.18 17:30:00 -
[39] - Quote
How is NPC corp exactly a problem? And what would you suggest? |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
867
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 17:31:00 -
[40] - Quote
Upde wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:
Now, one work around to that is extending the trial account training prohibition. If you want to stay in a rookie corp forever, that's fine, but you can't train lots of things like freighters or cynos, nor could you (for example) accept anything higher than a lvl 3 mission.
untill you start paying those players monthly subs thatidea is unworkable. providing they are paying their monthly's they can do what ever the **** they choose. If they choose to be in an NPC corp thats their business and they shouldn't be limited from doing and training what ever they want. They acept all the risks as soon as they undock, so if they want to undock in nullsec in a 2 billion ship and get ass raped by an organised nullsec deathsquad then so be it. But saying they should be restricted as to what they can train and what they can do in game when they are fully paid is bullshit I agree. NPC corp players should not be limited from experiencing the joys of the war declaration content of Eve Online.
I believe that's a /thread. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
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FireT
Royal Advanced Industries Imperial Hull Tankers
24
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Posted - 2012.06.18 17:34:00 -
[41] - Quote
Donte wrote:EVE is a harsh, cold, angry, bitter, mean, and many more malignant adjectives. None of which include "Safe". So why is it that NPC corporations are immune to wardec's? Individuals who fly for these companies are the "safest" people in EVE and i don't like it. I think you should be able to wardec NPC corps. Im sure considerations can be made with rules already in place about "safe havens" for brand new players in starter systems (perhaps even a starter constellation). but once they leave... Thoughts?
My thoughts are that you don't actually have intelligent thoughts. Why do idiots keep demanding the right, yes an actual right, to harass people whenever they wish? This is a sandbox game, meaning you can do whatever you wish and so can we. If you wish to fight, go fight. Lots of fights out there. But real fights is not what you are after. You want to be a bully in the sandbox on the internet out of all places. What a laughable tough guy. Go join the military or a fight club instead of bullying some random casual players.
What a sad life. And your 'idea' proves that you are not smart enough to be considered stupid. |
Upde
Upde Harris Industries
0
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Posted - 2012.06.18 17:39:00 -
[42] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:Upde wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:
Now, one work around to that is extending the trial account training prohibition. If you want to stay in a rookie corp forever, that's fine, but you can't train lots of things like freighters or cynos, nor could you (for example) accept anything higher than a lvl 3 mission.
untill you start paying those players monthly subs thatidea is unworkable. providing they are paying their monthly's they can do what ever the **** they choose. If they choose to be in an NPC corp thats their business and they shouldn't be limited from doing and training what ever they want. They acept all the risks as soon as they undock, so if they want to undock in nullsec in a 2 billion ship and get ass raped by an organised nullsec deathsquad then so be it. But saying they should be restricted as to what they can train and what they can do in game when they are fully paid is bullshit I agree. NPC corp players should not be limited from experiencing the joys of the war declaration content of Eve Online. I believe that's a /thread.
no you missed the part of where they choose. If they choose to not be exposed to the potential of war dec they choose to stay in an NPC corp. That doesn't limit their danger exposure because they are still open to gank squads, con artists and scamers same as player run corps. The only difference is that they don't choose to be targets however they are still open game by anyone who wants to suicide run them. |
Donte
Celestial Janissaries Curatores Veritatis Alliance
5
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Posted - 2012.06.18 17:39:00 -
[43] - Quote
FireT wrote:Donte wrote:EVE is a harsh, cold, angry, bitter, mean, and many more malignant adjectives. None of which include "Safe". So why is it that NPC corporations are immune to wardec's? Individuals who fly for these companies are the "safest" people in EVE and i don't like it. I think you should be able to wardec NPC corps. Im sure considerations can be made with rules already in place about "safe havens" for brand new players in starter systems (perhaps even a starter constellation). but once they leave... Thoughts? My thoughts are that you don't actually have intelligent thoughts. Why do idiots keep demanding the right, yes an actual right, to harass people whenever they wish? This is a sandbox game, meaning you can do whatever you wish and so can we. If you wish to fight, go fight. Lots of fights out there. But real fights is not what you are after. You want to be a bully in the sandbox on the internet out of all places. What a laughable tough guy. Go join the military or a fight club instead of bullying some random casual players. What a sad life. And your 'idea' proves that you are not smart enough to be considered stupid.
if you cant attack the argument, attack the person making it! i like your strategy!
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Romar Agent
Ishukone Regional Headquarters
58
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 17:40:00 -
[44] - Quote
God, you must really be bored out there in Nullsec if you're feeling the need to disassemble Highsec.
Just leave those players alone. Regardless of what type of game EVE is supposed to be, or how the game is supposed to be played, everyone is free to play the way they want. It's not like NPC corp-members are choosing an option that isn't open to anyone. It's not like NPC corps are without consequences.
NPC corps are an intended mechanic - Highsec is supposed to be safer - Highsec is also supposed to be less profitable - NPC corps fit right in that concept. |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
867
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 17:40:00 -
[45] - Quote
FireT wrote:Why do idiots keep demanding the right, yes an actual right, to harass people whenever they wish? This is a sandbox game, meaning you can do whatever you wish and so can we. If you wish to fight, go fight. Lots of fights out there. But real fights is not what you are after. You want to be a bully in the sandbox on the internet out of all places. What a laughable tough guy. Go join the military or a fight club instead of bullying some random casual players. I'd just like to comment that this is a game. We don't really have "rights" we have "rules".
The rules allow my character(s) to shoot your character(s) any time I like. Which I just may. That is not a threat, it is the nature of Eve. Shooting at another character or declaring war upon another group of players is not harassment. It is playing the game the way it was designed to be played. Eve is driven by conflict according to CCP's professional economist Dr. E.
There is no valid reason that NPC corp members are not subject to war declarations. They are not newbies, as they have left the rookie corp. They are legion, so numbers should not be a problem. Statistically, they all can't be idiots, so there is no "special needs" reason.
The mechanics that make them immune to war decs appear dated with the new ally system.
The rest of your post was 100% personal attack and need not be commented upon. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
867
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 17:42:00 -
[46] - Quote
Upde wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:Upde wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:
Now, one work around to that is extending the trial account training prohibition. If you want to stay in a rookie corp forever, that's fine, but you can't train lots of things like freighters or cynos, nor could you (for example) accept anything higher than a lvl 3 mission.
untill you start paying those players monthly subs thatidea is unworkable. providing they are paying their monthly's they can do what ever the **** they choose. If they choose to be in an NPC corp thats their business and they shouldn't be limited from doing and training what ever they want. They acept all the risks as soon as they undock, so if they want to undock in nullsec in a 2 billion ship and get ass raped by an organised nullsec deathsquad then so be it. But saying they should be restricted as to what they can train and what they can do in game when they are fully paid is bullshit I agree. NPC corp players should not be limited from experiencing the joys of the war declaration content of Eve Online. I believe that's a /thread. no you missed the part of where they choose. If they choose to not be exposed to the potential of war dec they choose to stay in an NPC corp. That doesn't limit their danger exposure because they are still open to gank squads, con artists and scamers same as player run corps. The only difference is that they don't choose to be targets however they are still open game by anyone who wants to suicide run them. No you missed the part where they chose, to be 100% honest with you. The NPC corps are not the rookie corps.
Any player who leaves a rookie corp makes a choice to be a participant.
NPC corps are not rookie corps. You cannot use them synonymously. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
flakeys
Arkham Innovations Paper Tiger Coalition
306
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 17:45:00 -
[47] - Quote
Bloody hell do you guys have to whine all da long about not having enough targets?Maybe i dunno actually have balls and fight each other for a change instead of blueballing half of null and/or sticking with empire wardeccing instead of going to low/null?
If i go to a gaybar i can complain alll day about not having ******* there but fact would remain that the issue was mostly created by myself. |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
867
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 17:48:00 -
[48] - Quote
flakeys wrote:Bloody hell do you guys have to whine all da long about not having enough targets?Maybe i dunno actually have balls and fight each other for a change instead of blueballing half of null and/or sticking with empire wardeccing instead of going to low/null?
If i go to a gaybar i can complain alll day about not having ******* there but fact would remain that the issue was mostly created by myself. The point is that NPC corps aren't even a "choice." You only wind up in them by default.
A default condition should not make anybody who is not a newbie impervious to war decs.
End of story, to be honest with you. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Cutter Isaacson
Peace N Quiet
516
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Posted - 2012.06.18 17:49:00 -
[49] - Quote
Make it possible for one individual to war dec another individual? Make NPC corps open to war decs?
:facepalm: Numbers of terminally stupid people seem to be on the increase, I suggest we have a real life Stupidageddon to rectify this issue. |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1258
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 17:53:00 -
[50] - Quote
Cutter Isaacson wrote:Make it possible for one individual to war dec another individual? Make NPC corps open to war decs?
:facepalm: Absolutely. You want to play single-player, you should be able to deal with a wardec as a single player. I am against NPC corps being wardecable, as NPC corps shouldn't exist altogether in any way, shape, or form. |
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Savage Angel
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
94
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Posted - 2012.06.18 17:53:00 -
[51] - Quote
An NPC corp cannot:
GÇóDeclare war on anyone GÇóMake a wardec mutual GÇóAdd allies using the in-game mechanics GÇóSet the status of another corp to red (or anything) GÇóUse their taxes to fund a war GÇóJoin an alliance GÇóRecruit new members GÇóKick a member, even if a spy GÇóChose who is in it
Probably a few others, but that is enough to show that you are really asking for a punching bag for your tiny epeen, not a real war. Go bully real corps with a real chance to respond and not one hobbled by game mechanics.
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Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1258
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 17:56:00 -
[52] - Quote
Romar Agent wrote:God, you must really be bored out there in Nullsec if you're feeling the need to disassemble Highsec. EVE is a closely interconnected game, you should go play on a game with sharded servers if you don't want to hear discussions about risk/reward balance across various secstatus. |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
867
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 17:56:00 -
[53] - Quote
Savage Angel wrote:An NPC corp cannot:
GÇóDeclare war on anyone GÇóMake a wardec mutual GÇóAdd allies using the in-game mechanics GÇóSet the status of another corp to red (or anything) GÇóUse their taxes to fund a war GÇóJoin an alliance GÇóRecruit new members GÇóKick a member, even if a spy GÇóChose who is in it
Probably a few others, but that is enough to show that you are really asking for a punching bag for your tiny epeen, not a real war. Go bully real corps with a real chance to respond and not one hobbled by game mechanics.
You know what? I hadn't considered the spy part. That's 100% my bad.
Oh wait that doesn't matter. My coalition is riddled with them too, congratulations.
Oh and in high-sec NPC corp awoxers always die to CONCORD. So your point is what, exactly? He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks
1777
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 17:56:00 -
[54] - Quote
Five months ago, I wrote a blog post that addressed this as a larger part of the then-broken wardec system. Some of what I wanted came about, some more is mired up in CrimeWatch, but NPC corps are still being left alone.
I'm not against the existence of NPC corps and I don't want them to be subject to wardecs. However, they shouldn't be a viable safe haven for people simply looking to circumvent the wardec system. Imagine an Eve where it became a lot more difficult to hide neutral haulers in NPC corps. But how?
My solution was, and still is, to introduce a level of role-playing to the NPC corps. Give them variable standings to each other and routinely change them. What happens when your NPC corp is suddenly denied docking access to the station in which you stored your ships? What about when the Caldari Navy becomes hostile and you lose access to their L4 missions that you've been relying on?
Of course this would create the "problem" of hundreds of one-man corps...but that could be dealt with by making corporate ownership a non-trivial cost. Creating your own corp is essentially free today. Perhaps it's time CCP raises the price to the point that players are more inclined to seek a place in an existing player corp and possibly establish their own once they have more cash. It's time to put an end to CCP's war on piracy. Fight your own battles and stop asking CCP to do it for you. |
Josef Djugashvilis
The Scope Gallente Federation
319
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 17:56:00 -
[55] - Quote
Posting in yet another pixel hardman thread, which lacks any sort of original thought whatsoever.
In short, the op is acting like a troll just for the sake of it. You want fries with that? |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1258
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 17:57:00 -
[56] - Quote
Savage Angel wrote:An NPC corp cannot:
GÇóDeclare war on anyone GÇóMake a wardec mutual GÇóAdd allies using the in-game mechanics GÇóSet the status of another corp to red (or anything) GÇóUse their taxes to fund a war GÇóJoin an alliance GÇóRecruit new members GÇóKick a member, even if a spy GÇóChose who is in it
Probably a few others, but that is enough to show that you are really asking for a punching bag for your tiny epeen, not a real war. Go bully real corps with a real chance to respond and not one hobbled by game mechanics.
If NPC corps were eliminated and replaced by "freelancer" de facto one-man player corps, they would have none of these 'limitations'.
lol @ spying on an npc corp btw |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
422
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 17:58:00 -
[57] - Quote
totally agree those ***** high sec alts thinking they are safe hiding behind their ambiguity... PLEX FOR PIZZA!
tech III industrial ships! |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
867
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 17:59:00 -
[58] - Quote
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Savage Angel wrote:An NPC corp cannot:
GÇóDeclare war on anyone GÇóMake a wardec mutual GÇóAdd allies using the in-game mechanics GÇóSet the status of another corp to red (or anything) GÇóUse their taxes to fund a war GÇóJoin an alliance GÇóRecruit new members GÇóKick a member, even if a spy GÇóChose who is in it
Probably a few others, but that is enough to show that you are really asking for a punching bag for your tiny epeen, not a real war. Go bully real corps with a real chance to respond and not one hobbled by game mechanics.
If NPC corps were eliminated and replaced by "freelancer" de facto one-man player corps, they would have none of these 'limitations'. I disagree, Nicolo.
Bring back the old vote mechanics - but only for NPC corps.
Allow each member to vote on all matters of war. Mutuality, allies, you name it.
The best simulation of a true command structure we can give them is the old functionality, which is actually fairly in-keeping with the concept of an NPC megacorp.
Plus just think of the numbers these guys could bring to a fight once properly motivated... He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Victoria Sin
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
15
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Posted - 2012.06.18 18:00:00 -
[59] - Quote
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote: I'm not against the existence of NPC corps and I don't want them to be subject to wardecs. However, they shouldn't be a viable safe haven for people simply looking to circumvent the wardec system..
Why not? Party B doesn't want to fight party A. Party B pays his subs like everyone else. So let him be in his NPC corp. What's it to you? Get a life!
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MaxxOmega
Temporal Mechanics
4
|
Posted - 2012.06.18 18:00:00 -
[60] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:End of story, to be honest with you. Wrong. Not end of story. Wardeccing NPC Corps is a waste of time, It will accomplish nothing close to getting the players to fight, they will more likely quit playing...
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