Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 30 40 .. 41 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
1356
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 09:53:00 -
[61] - Quote
Richard Desturned wrote:Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:Richard Desturned wrote:nuke hisec incursions, make it exclusive to lowsec
done, more people leave hisec, even if it's just daytrips to lowsec Won't happen. Not even if hell froze to Anctartica levels. so you're saying that hisec incursion runners are irrationally risk averse
I am saying that:
1) as you well know they were in for the ISK. Remove pimpmobile efficiency so ISK / hour plummets and they stop doing incursions at all. Oh wait, they already stopped doing them even in hi sec that allows those pimpmobiles, once the ISK / hour stopped being so insane. So imagine how many you'll get in low / null.
2) Incursions are to come extract empire people off their planets. Quite odd to move them away from the place where they were set up to go hit. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
Twitter channel |
Richard Desturned
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1068
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 10:02:00 -
[62] - Quote
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:1) as you well know they were in for the ISK. Remove pimpmobile efficiency so ISK / hour plummets and they stop doing incursions at all. Oh wait, they already stopped doing them even in hi sec that allows those pimpmobiles, once the ISK / hour stopped being so insane. So imagine how many you'll get in low / null.
2) Incursions are to come extract empire people off their planets. Quite odd to move them away from the place where they were set up to go hit.
1) You don't need pimped out faction battleships to run incursions. CFC incursion runners did just fine (120m/hr) with Zealot/Guardian fleets.
2) Lowsec is empire space eh |
Lord Zim
848
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 10:04:00 -
[63] - Quote
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:Because you REALLY were after industrialists only, eh? If nullsec was made much better for industry, we would be.
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:Oh wait I have been there multiple times in multiple corps and alliances (I have a good number of accounts) and the thing all had in common was a general despise for industrialists, seen as "alt worthy, and we already have our industry and research alts and no way we'll let you use the corp POS, else you steal". I guess the corps and alliances you've been in have been more on the "we're hardcore PVPers" side than the well-rounded side, then. Sucks to be you.
As for the "use the corp POS" ... you know that's a direct result of game mechanics, yes? Put a lot of resources in a public place, and allow many people access to it, someone will steal it. Now, if CCP made POSes which could be setup by individuals, for their personal use (or with the possibility of granting access to specific people (no, not through standings, an actual access list)), you'd see less of this protectionism, because it wouldn't be needed.
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:Also, 0.0 is paradise for subsidized / reimbursed PvPers, they really find their thing (in my case it was small roam, for others it's blobs, each his taste). But if you are not one of them, there's really little in for you. I mean, even the few infrastructures that could be put up, aren't. So if you are not a ship PvPer you indeed find only the hardship and little of the rewards. Only stuff I found to be as good as hi sec was trading in NPC nulll. What sort of infrastructure are you talking about? Because we've got JBs, we've got tons of stations we've added all over the place, we've got system upgrades everywhere etc for military indexes and such.
Again, if your alliance didn't have this, then you either didn't have time to setup shop properly, the leadership sucked ass or ... well, I guess if the military and industry upgrades don't do it for you, then I guess nullsec just never will live up to your cushy standards, since you've been comforted too much by hisec. |
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
1357
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 10:14:00 -
[64] - Quote
Richard Desturned wrote:Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:1) as you well know they were in for the ISK. Remove pimpmobile efficiency so ISK / hour plummets and they stop doing incursions at all. Oh wait, they already stopped doing them even in hi sec that allows those pimpmobiles, once the ISK / hour stopped being so insane. So imagine how many you'll get in low / null.
2) Incursions are to come extract empire people off their planets. Quite odd to move them away from the place where they were set up to go hit. 1) You don't need pimped out faction battleships to run incursions. CFC incursion runners did just fine (120m/hr) with Zealot/Guardian fleets. 2) Lowsec is empire space
1) I know you don't NEED pimpboats but YOU want to bring incursions out of hi sec, which as I said will not entice them to move there at all. They are not even enticed to do incursions in hi sec as is, figures outside it.
2) Where shall a zerg overlord go take people and spread his propaganda: in the densely inhabitated systems full of people and communication media, or in a desert with 4 cats that don't give a crap? Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
Twitter channel |
Lord Zim
848
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 10:17:00 -
[65] - Quote
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:1) I know you don't NEED pimpboats but YOU want to bring incursions out of hi sec, which as I said will not entice them to move there at all. They are not even enticed to do incursions in hi sec as is, figures outside it. Not to worry, they've more or less stopped being run in its entirety because they weren't frothing forth ISK anymore. So much for their initial "YOU SHALL NOT NERF INCURSIONS THEY ARE SO SOCIAL WE LOVE HOW SOCIAL WE ARE WHILE MAKING ISK" defense.
Oh well so sad. vOv |
ElQuirko
Protus Correction Facility Inc.
747
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 10:20:00 -
[66] - Quote
Anchorable cyno jammers and interdiction nullifiers. Allow new corps to set up without being curbstomped by supercaps. This way, new corps/alliances can create chokepoints on gates that they can keep a hold of while they get permanent cyno jammers, stations etc. in place. CISPA - Readin' your secret corptheft mails since 2012 |
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
1357
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 10:20:00 -
[67] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote: If nullsec was made much better for industry, we would be.
As for the "use the corp POS" ... you know that's a direct result of game mechanics, yes? Put a lot of resources in a public place, and allow many people access to it, someone will steal it. Now, if CCP made POSes which could be setup by individuals, for their personal use (or with the possibility of granting access to specific people (no, not through standings, an actual access list)), you'd see less of this protectionism, because it wouldn't be needed.
Then put all those fresh forces you got to work. Instead of breaking the balls to hi seccers or others who don't care about the far west, break the CCP balls so that they put in a minimum of living standards. And not just for the NAPsters but for every 0.0 citizens.
Lord Zim wrote: What sort of infrastructure are you talking about? Because we've got JBs, we've got tons of stations we've added all over the place, we've got system upgrades everywhere etc for military indexes and such.
Again, if your alliance didn't have this, then you either didn't have time to setup shop properly, the leadership sucked ass or ... well, I guess if the military and industry upgrades don't do it for you, then I guess nullsec just never will live up to your cushy standards, since you've been comforted too much by hisec.
Sorry, not everybody are in for the lame ass blobbers with all the comfortabilities. Smaller alliances or corps have an hard time to get all the stuff you pull out without thinking. Better to join a low sec corp and use the facilities in there than to be a blobber. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
Twitter channel |
Lord Zim
848
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 10:26:00 -
[68] - Quote
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:Then put all those fresh forces you got to work. Instead of breaking the balls to hi seccers or others who don't care about the far west, break the CCP balls so that they put in a minimum of living standards. And not just for the NAPsters but for every 0.0 citizens. I'm going to go with "nah, I'll do both".
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:Sorry, not everybody are in for the lame ass blobbers with all the comfortabilities. Smaller alliances or corps have an hard time to get all the stuff you pull out without thinking. Better to join a low sec corp and use the facilities in there than to be a blobber. So uh, you've just been in lowsec corps/alliances, and you're making comments about how it is to live in nullsec?
I see. |
Russell Casey
Goldbug Inc.
161
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 10:27:00 -
[69] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:1) I know you don't NEED pimpboats but YOU want to bring incursions out of hi sec, which as I said will not entice them to move there at all. They are not even enticed to do incursions in hi sec as is, figures outside it. Not to worry, they've more or less stopped being run in its entirety because they weren't frothing forth ISK anymore. So much for their initial "YOU SHALL NOT NERF INCURSIONS THEY ARE SO SOCIAL WE LOVE HOW SOCIAL WE ARE WHILE MAKING ISK" defense. Oh well so sad. vOv
When was EVE ever not social?
Also, Incursions left a bad taste in my mouth, too similar to the themepark MMOs I came here to get away from. |
Lord Zim
848
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 10:28:00 -
[70] - Quote
ElQuirko wrote:Anchorable cyno jammers and interdiction nullifiers. Allow new corps to set up without being curbstomped by supercaps. This way, new corps/alliances can create chokepoints on gates that they can keep a hold of while they get permanent cyno jammers, stations etc. in place. Pretty certain "supercaps" isn't the major problem of "new corps".
And there are anchorable cyno jammers in the game already. They just require SOV first. |
|
Malphilos
State War Academy Caldari State
109
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 10:49:00 -
[71] - Quote
Nuke everything in null and start over.
It's the only way to be sure. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Industrial Complex Cosmic Consortium
1543
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 11:17:00 -
[72] - Quote
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:I have this great news for you: null sec is the apex of player generated, emergent content.
Make your player generated content less sh!tty and maybe you'll convince someone to go there.
This is a huge part of the puzzle, but there is also the poor state of industry locking out an entire class of players.
To make null sec more attractive, here are some ideas:
- Move mining to grav sites
- Improve the performance of POS refineries
- Nerf NPC/station refineries
- Reshuffle distribution of ore: tighter banding to hi/low/null
- Remove the sheer volume of structure bashing required for sov (I would remove sov altogether)
- Make logistics harder: ammo should be ammo sized, not wafer biscuit sized, modules should be bigger than the sum of the volumes of the minerals that make them
The changes to POS refineries and station refineries would ensure that the player-driven economy becomes more player-driven. If station refining takes an hour to reprocess a Raven,
The changes to module and item size would ensure that having production close to consumption is important: if it takes forty times as many freighter loads of junk to build your super capitals, you want the source to be very close by! No more mass buying of 425mm rail guns in Jita to reprocess them in Branch. Instead it will make more economic sense to get more miners into Branch and actually defend them, or move the manufacturing base to low sec where you build carriers which you fly to null sec to break down for parts to make the supercapitals.
Just the rabid intellectual onanism of a hisec care bear.
Day 0 advice for new players: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=77176 |
Lord Zim
848
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 11:22:00 -
[73] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote: Improve the performance of POS refineries They can't just "improve the performance of POS refineries", they would have to drastically revamp them from the cockstabby state they're in now. Have you tried using one with, say, 10-15 hulks? |
pussnheels
417
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 11:33:00 -
[74] - Quote
If you want to revive null sec you need a reason to compete and fight over resources that is the solution In my opinion there are 2 things that need change
First moongoo , make it depletable after x months so alliances need to protect their income , sure t2 ships and items will go up in price but they mostly overrated anyway and too specilzed to be very common and make moongoo extraction more pi like it will givethe dust bunnies something to fight over Sure all you nullsecdwellers will flame this idea but just you FO with your whines it is about time you lazy do no gooders learn that ittakes time and effort to keep their sandcastles intact
Second thing that needs to look at is. Industry in null sec Even a slight buff in production research and refining and a counter to afk cloaking will go along way to help alliances to a second major source of income I do not agree with what you are saying , but i will defend to the death your right to say it...... Voltaire |
Lord Zim
848
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 11:42:00 -
[75] - Quote
pussnheels wrote:First moongoo , make it depletable after x months so alliances need to protect their income 1) Have you ever scanned a whole region? Even once? 2) I hope you like high prices on your T2 stuff.
pussnheels wrote:sure t2 ships and items will go up in price but they mostly overrated anyway and too specilzed to be very common Which eve are you playing? Because where I'm at, T2 is pretty much the only way to roll
pussnheels wrote:Sure all you nullsecdwellers will flame this idea but just you FO with your whines it is about time you lazy do no gooders learn that ittakes time and effort to keep their sandcastles intact Heh. Implying living in nullsec is a dance on a bed of no effort. That's precious. |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3528
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 11:53:00 -
[76] - Quote
As a highsec publord with no friends and no actual idea about living in null, here are my solutions to fixing null:
1)make it more like highsec 2)make it so that people aren't allowed to be friends
that is all thanks |
Kimmi Chan
Illuminatus Reforged The Revenant Order
130
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 11:53:00 -
[77] - Quote
Forgive my ignorance of null sec and jump freighters and feel free to correct me but as I understand the current mechanics a jump freighter jumps from Null Sec to Low Sec and then gate jumps the rest of the way to a market hub to sell commodities like Technetium. My idea is based on this assumption. Again, if it is incorrect please let me know.
Why not allow a jump freighter to only jump within Null and then gate jump through several systems in Low Sec before getting to High Sec and the market hub?
It could potentially increase the population in Low Sec by giving PvP enthusiasts and pirates nice targets to shoot at. It could give Null Sec residents something to do by forcing them to put together escort fleets (likely Drakes and Logistics) for their Freighter Convoys - Small gang PvP in Low Sec - Fun for Null Sec residents.
Just theorycrafting out loud here.
-á"Miners mine so I don't have to." ~Metal Icarus |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3528
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 11:54:00 -
[78] - Quote
i also enjoy that morons keep thinking "moon moving" would nerf goonswarm
i have news for you guys, guess who the only alliance is that has enough bodies to throw at the problem |
Arrgthepirate
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
37
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 12:24:00 -
[79] - Quote
All I got from this is "I'm too bad of a player to join even a terrible 0.0 renter corp" |
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
748
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 12:29:00 -
[80] - Quote
Kimmi Chan wrote:Forgive my ignorance of null sec and jump freighters and feel free to correct me but as I understand the current mechanics a jump freighter jumps from Null Sec to Low Sec and then gate jumps the rest of the way to a market hub to sell commodities like Technetium. My idea is based on this assumption. Again, if it is incorrect please let me know.
Why not allow a jump freighter to only jump within Null and then gate jump through several systems in Low Sec before getting to High Sec and the market hub?
It could potentially increase the population in Low Sec by giving PvP enthusiasts and pirates nice targets to shoot at. It could give Null Sec residents something to do by forcing them to put together escort fleets (likely Drakes and Logistics) for their Freighter Convoys - Small gang PvP in Low Sec - Fun for Null Sec residents.
Just theorycrafting out loud here.
I personally would love to see a JF nerf. In fact, jump logistics needs to get out of my EVE.
Jump drives have done more to ruin lo/nullsec industrialists than anything else. Things are only impossible until they are not. |
|
Dalziel Erata
DinoDoggy Inc
0
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 12:31:00 -
[81] - Quote
I'm a newb in terms of "what sec I make my living in", which seems to be the dividing factor here.
I've tried to make a few runs out into null-sec, just for some laughs. Lost every ship I've went in there with, without a single kill to my name. As someone who likes playing this game with a group of casual real life friends, I don't really want to use the option of joining a null-allaince, which makes null the most unprofitable region for me to be in. I'm not saying that ISK/hour is the only reason I play this game, but I can achieve the same cool pew-pewing with my alt in Red vs Blue, and keep my main funding that, plus extra.
No incentives for moving to null means that I, and a lot of other players won't be going there (regardless of the carebear label, it's just water off a ducks back to me)
|
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3532
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 12:32:00 -
[82] - Quote
0.0 is about empire building. That's why there's sov, that's why there's alliances, that's why you get your name on the map. Scrublord 'guudfitz' lowsec roamers, friendless highsec nobodies, and anyone who bleats about "blobbing" lacks any understanding of null. Null is about building empires, massive wars, and the like. A good null design includes a place for you - as serfs - because people with the will to power to create a nullsec empire needs peasant villages to raze and plunder. But with your narrow-minded concerns over scraping isk from rocks, you lack the vision to have any meaningful input on the design of null, aside from suggesting what sort of salt lick would attract you. |
Greyscale Dash
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
63
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 12:34:00 -
[83] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:0.0 is about empire building. That's why there's sov, that's why there's alliances, that's why you get your name on the map. Scrublord 'guudfitz' lowsec roamers, friendless highsec nobodies, and anyone who bleats about "blobbing" lacks any understanding of null. Null is about building empires, massive wars, and the like. A good null design includes a place for you - as serfs - because people with the will to power to create a nullsec empire needs peasant villages to raze and plunder. But with your narrow-minded concerns over scraping isk from rocks, you lack the vision to have any meaningful input on the design of null, aside from suggesting what sort of salt lick would attract you.
Not empty quoting. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Industrial Complex Cosmic Consortium
1543
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 12:36:00 -
[84] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Mara Rinn wrote: Improve the performance of POS refineries They can't just "improve the performance of POS refineries", they would have to drastically revamp them from the cockstabby state they're in now. Have you tried using one with, say, 10-15 hulks?
Look, there's a lot of noise on the forums at the moment about tin foil and histrionics. I'm trying to not get caught up in it all. Apologies if I have understated just how painful it is to wait hours for a cycle of a refinery to finish just so you can repeat the process over again.
Anyone who hasn't used a refinery: head to Singularity. Erect a POS, mine an Orca full of ore (all of ONE TYPE). Stick the ore in the refinery. Wait. Wait. Wait. Wait. Wait. Get your minerals. Oh, BTW, POS refinery is also hard-capped at 75% efficiency, so that Beancounter implant? Useless. Refinery Efficiency? Don't waste your time. Veldspar Processing? DON'T MAKE ME LAUGH AT YOU.
Contrast that to station refineries where you can "select all" in your hangar, click "refine", and accidentally reprocess your fleet of T2 ships with T2 ammo in the blink of an eye (BLINK OF AN EYE! MILLIONS OF UNITS OF EVERYTHING).
It takes days to manufacture a Raven, less than a second to turn it back into a pile of tritanium and scratchings. Unless you reprocess it in a POS refinery. But you can't, so it's pointless trying: POS refineries can only process ore. Of one type.
Day 0 advice for new players: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=77176 |
Jenn aSide
Smokin Aces.
124
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 12:38:00 -
[85] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:0.0 is about empire building. That's why there's sov, that's why there's alliances, that's why you get your name on the map. Scrublord 'guudfitz' lowsec roamers, friendless highsec nobodies, and anyone who bleats about "blobbing" lacks any understanding of null. Null is about building empires, massive wars, and the like. A good null design includes a place for you - as serfs - because people with the will to power to create a nullsec empire needs peasant villages to raze and plunder. But with your narrow-minded concerns over scraping isk from rocks, you lack the vision to have any meaningful input on the design of null, aside from suggesting what sort of salt lick would attract you.
Stop making me agree with Goons. STOP IT,
While maybe not diplomatic, this is true. Just like the issues I have with high sec "casual/solo players" playing against the nature of the game but trying have ccp to make the game more friendly to them, well, this is really the same thing.
Everything just isn't for everybody. Null should NOT be casual/solo/small group friendly. Lowsec, sure. Low end wormholes, maybe. high sec, who gives a damn (lol). But null is player empire big fleet space, and should be.
|
Lord Zim
848
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 12:39:00 -
[86] - Quote
Well, I guess that pretty much covers it all with how awesome POS refineries are. :P |
Gun Gal
Dark Club
2
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 12:40:00 -
[87] - Quote
Nullsec is the new carebear land.
90% of o.o is blue's
Massive titan, mothership blobs preclude anything being done.
Look how dynamic nullsec was until this last year or so.
That's why you hate highsec now. Your bored,
|
Greyscale Dash
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
63
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 12:42:00 -
[88] - Quote
Gun Gal wrote:Highsec is the old carebear land.
90% of o.o is blue's
Massive orca, golem blobs preclude any mission being hard.
Look how quiet highsec was until this last year or so.
That's why you hate nullsec now. Your bored,
Fixed. |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1085
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 12:42:00 -
[89] - Quote
isn't there that 'statistic' that states that there isn't enough manufacturing capability in all of nullsec to manufacture the ammo that nullsec, in general, uses? |
Ohanka
Aggressive Narcissists SpaceMonkey's Alliance
115
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 12:45:00 -
[90] - Quote
masternerdguy wrote:Tyberius Franklin wrote: As low already has lvl 4's, where is the carrot in this?
L4 Missions removed from hi - stick More L4 Mission agents added to lo - carrot Its a zero sum transaction.
people will just stop doing level 4's.
No one wants to go to lowsec. Its pointless. Even with this new "no level 4" mission idea |
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 30 40 .. 41 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |