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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 37 post(s) |
Praerian
FireStar Inc Curatores Veritatis Alliance
0
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Posted - 2011.10.03 13:00:00 -
[121] - Quote
Could we have next to targeted items shield, armour and structure percentage remaining.
i.e. when sov grinding or shooting capitals would be nice to see that are indeed at 50% armour not trying to guess where we are actually at.
I don't think we need the SH, AR & ST just the percentages would be good. |
Salpun
Paramount Commerce Masters of Flying Objects
37
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Posted - 2011.10.03 14:02:00 -
[122] - Quote
LP store Offers filtered by: cuts off the Only in "Show Affordable Only" |
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CCP Affinity
C C P C C P Alliance
6
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Posted - 2011.10.03 14:18:00 -
[123] - Quote
Salpun wrote:LP store Offers filtered by: cuts off the Only in "Show Affordable Only"
Thank you :) CCP Affinity | Quality Assurance | Team BFF |
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Peter Drakon
Independent Traders and Builders MPA
0
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Posted - 2011.10.03 15:34:00 -
[124] - Quote
Hi again!
I have checked the new font on Sisi.
CCP Punkturis wrote:Some people actually like the new font and agree with us on that it's more readable.
I like it very much, it is more readble and much nicer then the old even on huge resolutions.
CCP Punkturis wrote:... there won't be a way to select fontsize. ... UI Scaling would be a better way to sort issues with the fontsize, but that's another project.
Since I have asked just for this feature, I'm a bit dissapointed that we can't change the font size. Please start the UI scale project asap.
What about the font color change option? That would add a whole new way to customize the UI.
Peter |
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CCP Punkturis
C C P C C P Alliance
87
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Posted - 2011.10.03 15:39:00 -
[125] - Quote
Peter Drakon wrote:Hi again! I have checked the new font on Sisi. CCP Punkturis wrote:Some people actually like the new font and agree with us on that it's more readable. I like it very much, it is more readble and much nicer then the old even on huge resolutions. CCP Punkturis wrote:... there won't be a way to select fontsize. ... UI Scaling would be a better way to sort issues with the fontsize, but that's another project. Since I have asked just for this feature, I'm a bit dissapointed that we can't change the font size. Please start the UI scale project asap. What about the font color change option? That would add a whole new way to customize the UI. Peter
I will only add font color change option with different shades of pink
(and no, we won't add that - sorry ) CCP Punkturis | EVE UI Developer |
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CCP Punkturis
C C P C C P Alliance
87
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Posted - 2011.10.03 15:40:00 -
[126] - Quote
Praerian wrote:Could we have next to targeted items shield, armour and structure percentage remaining.
i.e. when sov grinding or shooting capitals would be nice to see that are indeed at 50% armour not trying to guess where we are actually at.
I don't think we need the SH, AR & ST just the percentages would be good.
You're feature creeping!! it is a good idea though. I'll see what I can do with it (not for the font changes though). CCP Punkturis | EVE UI Developer |
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Peter Drakon
Independent Traders and Builders MPA
0
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Posted - 2011.10.03 18:17:00 -
[127] - Quote
CCP Punkturis wrote:(and no, we won't add that - sorry ) Aahhhhhhhh
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Li Mochou
Chien's Noobs
0
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Posted - 2011.10.03 21:57:00 -
[128] - Quote
Just logged in to take a look at the different CQs...
Personally, I don't like the new font - it doesn't work. It looks messy and cluttered, reminds me strongly of late 90s linux desktops. Works best when text is fully capitalised, otherwise looks a bit like a free font.
It also seems much harder to scan, though of course am sure will get used to it.
For me it seems it, in general, would work better with significantly more padding; but then you would not be able to display as much information in the same amount of space (which is worse).
I don't mind it in the new log-in screens and large blocks of text. Just not for tables of information, tabs, etc...
FYI - I have 1400x900 resolution. |
Rhaegor Stormborn
BURN EDEN Northern Coalition.
91
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Posted - 2011.10.03 23:28:00 -
[129] - Quote
Cirage wrote:"You idiots better give us the ability to use the old font. God damn it. Quit ruining our game."
What's up with the language? Reading stuff like this make me wish I had a smaller font in my web browser.
All I see is a majority people telling them the new font is too large, and all they keep saying is well people want it larger, and they can't make everyone happy. They best learn to make all their customer's happy, or at least the majority, or that slope of active subs is going to keep declining faster and faster. It is the idiotic fearless corporate culture we have seen for the past two years that continues to perpetuate these poor game development decisions. Less fearless, more fearful, concerned, discerning, etc.
The font is too large. We do not like how it looks. Do not implement it as it stands. Rework it, redo it, and come back again for approval. Until you have it, do not go live with it.
People have played Eve for over 8 years with the current font. If it was "unreadable" people would not have been able to communicate in-game that entire time. This is obviously not the case. CCP needs to stop misrepresenting player sentiment internally to produce and change things which very few actual paying customers want or not, and moreso, do not want at all.
This font is terrible, and will affect all players way more than the CQ, or any other terrible change CCP has made lately. We can avoid docking, and turn off the CQ, but we will all be forced to see this terrible font wherever I go, whatever I am doing, and I can not stress enough how much I hate it, and many others do as well.
Not many people are currently aware of this new font, so the outrage has been relatively minimal, but almost entirely negative. Just wait until it goes live. It will be just like ship spinning. CCP will buckle after months of complaints and be forced to do what I am suggesting now. Rework it, fix it, and make something MOST people think looks good, is an appropriate size, and is "readable". |
Psychophantic
65
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Posted - 2011.10.04 00:07:00 -
[130] - Quote
To be fair there are a few people who will benefit from the larger font.
Those who are playing in their loungeroom on plasma and lcd tv's, and those playing it on laptops with ridiculous resolutions.
To say that it is a much called for change is a bit strange, I'm up to page 6 in the Issues board and see no mention of it.
I play on a 23" 1680x1050 and a 27" 1920x1080 and have no issues with and much prefer the current font. |
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Grey Stormshadow
Starwreck Industries
196
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Posted - 2011.10.04 02:27:00 -
[131] - Quote
Rhaegor Stormborn wrote:Cirage wrote:"You idiots better give us the ability to use the old font. God damn it. Quit ruining our game."
What's up with the language? Reading stuff like this make me wish I had a smaller font in my web browser.
All I see is a majority people telling them the new font is too large, and all they keep saying is well people want it larger, and they can't make everyone happy. They best learn to make all their customer's happy, or at least the majority, or that slope of active subs is going to keep declining faster and faster. It is the idiotic fearless corporate culture we have seen for the past two years that continues to perpetuate these poor game development decisions. Less fearless, more fearful, concerned, discerning, etc. The font is too large. We do not like how it looks. Do not implement it as it stands. Rework it, redo it, and come back again for approval. Until you have it, do not go live with it. People have played Eve for over 8 years with the current font. If it was "unreadable" people would not have been able to communicate in-game that entire time. This is obviously not the case. CCP needs to stop misrepresenting player sentiment internally to produce and change things which very few actual paying customers want or not, and moreso, do not want at all. This font is terrible, and will affect all players way more than the CQ, or any other terrible change CCP has made lately. We can avoid docking, and turn off the CQ, but we will all be forced to see this terrible font wherever I go, whatever I am doing, and I can not stress enough how much I hate it, and many others do as well. Not many people are currently aware of this new font, so the outrage has been relatively minimal, but almost entirely negative. Just wait until it goes live. It will be just like ship spinning. CCP will buckle after months of complaints and be forced to do what I am suggesting now. Rework it, fix it, and make something MOST people think looks good, is an appropriate size, and is "readable".
To be honest there has been quite a few positive replies also, but they are in different thread than this. However the font isn't live yet and as we all know, majority of players don't even read forums.
I for one have done very excessive testing about pros and cons of this update. I have weighted them and unfortunately there is plenty of more cons than pros on the table. Playing on 20" 1600x1200 resolution and font being too small hasn't been any issue so far - some single fonts have been little too similiar.
After this new font goes live, spinning numbers with variable width font will be horrible experience and I for one have been (and will be) dealing with those numbers on daily basis. Perhaps the ui department havent been playing with market orders too much? Having the wallet tabs as they are in test server at the moment pretty much proves the point... Have you even opened the wallet? That will be game breaker at least for me.
What comes to spaceflight this is how my ui changes from current. Picture isn't really too easy to interpret so lets just say that to keep all the windows what I use to keep open, I'll lose half of visible cargo slots, half of visible local names, all my chat windows will be slightly smaller and have much less and shorter rows in them. I won't be able to keep log open anymore and center "opening" loses about 3cm width. Game will still be playable with these modifications but I can honestly say that this is not an improvement - it is HUGE recession to my overview. This is the main reason why I still believe that when this well thought and executed font update goes to tranq - the reality bites back.
Lets say that half of the players think it is really good, nice or mostly ok. Quarter thinks there is something to fix but will live with it. Remaining quarter thinks that the size and other issues sucks ass. Is that a successful patch? How many percent were complaining about too small font? How many people were ready to write these kinds of "customer feedback forms" to make it better? Are there less sad pandas then? This is what I wait to see... :/
I've written few too many posts related to this already and I am truely sorry that I even have to. I am also sorry that specially you, Katr+¡n, have to be the one reading stuff like this. I'm sure you have done your share really well and without any bad intentions. Sometimes things just end up differently than can be expected. Obviously there is always someone we could point finger to, but that would not solve anything. Stuff go to tree butt ahead and learn that described activity was only recommended while coming down. Regardless of the method of learning and 1 week headache, the lesson has been learned.
I may be the guy in that tree and bark at the wrong reason (font in this case) now. If that is the case I'm twice as sorry about these "feedback"-sessions and will keep my remaining sad pandas to myself. After the head-ahead-ache vanishes I prolly see the font in better and more shining light also. However if this ends otherwise, make sure you got plenty of warm milk, understanding, consolation and place to start a zoo .)
Person can only be as good she thinks she is. Being proud of things she does is a good start. Keep up the work you're doing - that is what we (all?) want in the end.
-grey Forum fix for firefox and chrome Get working images and colored text Classic forum style 2.25final |
Taiwanistan
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
4
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Posted - 2011.10.04 03:22:00 -
[132] - Quote
jesus christ just use Times New Roman, or Calibri it's all wrong, stop trying there are people who do this for a living buy from them,
the new one is worse than the old one the plug needs to be pulled now, pull the plug now or rage later, but it's always rage later right? |
Equto
Rionnag Alba Northern Coalition.
0
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Posted - 2011.10.04 04:34:00 -
[133] - Quote
I too hate the new font as my eve went from something that all the text seemed to "fit" to now everything seems to be creeping into the next windows area and some I think may be over extending out of the window. While I think that having all caps is stupid, at the current its better than this font and if It goes live I am not sure I could continue to play eve as it slightly hurts my eyes to currently look at. |
Kern Hotha
5
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Posted - 2011.10.04 06:00:00 -
[134] - Quote
I reiterate that if you're working this hard to shoehorn one font into the interface then you need to stop and refocus on actually designing a modern UI. There's no sense in putting all this time into an antiquated interface. |
Shahirahh Orgasana
University of Caille Gallente Federation
5
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Posted - 2011.10.04 13:25:00 -
[135] - Quote
A whole lot of this "new font versus old font" angst would be completely avoidable if CCP would just make the whole UI scalable, including the use of industry-standard font rendering APIs with user-selectable fonts and font sizing.
Personally, I like the new font for the most part (yes, including the larger size!), but it does still have issues and I hate to see so many people fret over it. I could actually live with the old font for awhile longer if CCP needed time to rebuild the UI so it could render fonts and windows the right way. |
Bloodpetal
Mimidae Risk Solutions
46
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Posted - 2011.10.04 13:42:00 -
[136] - Quote
I found the official thread \o/
I agree that in some places it is a little too large - overview tables and the selected item panel can use a slight tweak smaller in size - 10% or so. It will save a lot of space overall for UI - I know a lot of pilots already are snug on UI space on smaller screens.
I'm sure some people will want it larger, I think that falls down on CCP working on implementing that into their code for customization. I think the gentleman a few posts above me made a thorough description of where things are clearly issues through images.
I also agree that on some of the tables it is challenging to absorb the information on a quick scan - specifically on larger tables of information. I'm trying to identify why exactly, and I feel it has to do with the negative space. Here's my theory - I think the font's negative space doesn't scale up so well for reading large amounts of table information, when you hit near what I would say is around the 12pt mark, which seems to be used in some important places, like the overview and the selected items. The negative space isn't an issue at smaller sizes, such as in the inventory or in the info panels - but as you get larger, the thinness of the font doesn't work out so well towards providing readability in the flow through the negative space to absorb the information smoothly in areas where a lot of data needs to be processed quickly.
Overview has to be readable in under 1/10th of a second. Seriously.
As a PVP Pilot, I have a lot of information to look at in under 10 seconds - check distance, check hp, check shields, check module cycles, check enemy health, check ally health, give 4 different orders to 10 different people, check local scanner for any incoming reinforcements, check local for population spike for ambush, do manual maneuvering to maintain range, listen to friendly comms about their status.
In the amount of time it takes one rep cycle to go off, I have to do all that - so reading the Overview doesn't mean bigger is better. On the overview I probably have about 10 columns up - Tag, Icon, Name, Type, Distance, Velocity, Radial Velocity, Corp, Alliance, Militia - and I need them to fit in a readable space. I think dropping 1 or 2 points on Overview and Market tables will improve readability even for those who prefer larger fonts. I think this applies to the markets, although the justification for 1/10th second reading time might not apply there. :) NOSTRO AURUM NON EST AURUM VULGI |
Lady SixSkies
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
1
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Posted - 2011.10.04 17:52:00 -
[137] - Quote
I have just updated Singularity client in order to see new changes in effect.
As for the fonts, I just plain and simple don't like 'em. Yes, it is more readable than the previous one, fixes some issues as well, but it somehow looks wrong, and I don't think it has to do with getting used to it. I have 1920 x 1200 resolution and it looks too big. |
McFly
Peanut Factory Good Sax
18
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Posted - 2011.10.04 18:43:00 -
[138] - Quote
CCP Punkturis wrote:Hmm.. actually a lot of players complain about the font being too small. So making it bigger is helping them out. It's mostly people who play on high resolution screens. It makes me a sad panda that you feel like I'm alienating our existing player base when I'm just trying to make them happy Because this font change is mostly for all the players that have complained about the old font (being too small, the letters looking the same etc.) - not to get new people to the game.
i play at 1920x1200, with 5 clients open most of the time, in all shapes and sizes to fit it on screen the way I like it. What I mean by screen real estate is that without the ability to scale the lowest screen res the client allows (1024x768) is horrible to use, windows that smashed down and worked fine are taking too much room. For a detailed overview with this font I'm being forced to dedicate 40% of the horizontal space of the client to fit the new font. Or we just stop using the details like velocity, corp, ally, transversal, etc...
That's where I'm having the issue. because I do play with small clients because I do play in nullsec and need scouts/tacklers/cynos/bridges/gunners on hand regularly. |
Yung Trim
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2011.10.05 01:15:00 -
[139] - Quote
Text changes on POS modules when you are on-lining a module at 1 minute remaining and lower.
Proof |
Lhorkas Thosis
Giza'Msafara
0
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Posted - 2011.10.05 05:07:00 -
[140] - Quote
The problem of the new font is height and spacing. I think you're compelled to adjust the font to the size of each windows, tab, etc. The consequence is the total lack of regularity. Keeping good proportion size is what matter above readability of each letters and numbers which this new font fixes btw
The more you will try to adjust size, height and spacing to fit each window, the more irregular text will look. In the end, the readability will suffer.
For exemple, the overview has too many different sizes, the numbers are really too larges, texts are looking disproportioned. On the contrary, context menus feel nice because size, height, spacing are regular. I guess you have not to modify the font for context menus.
To conclude, the old hangar is going back (double-clic to open the active cargo, drag'n drop to change ship, yeah it is the old hangar!). Isn't it what we call a rollback ? Do not take the same path with your new font. Release a perfect work or do not. Doing a rollback means a fail in a way or another. |
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Tetractys
Falling Stars
0
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Posted - 2011.10.05 07:21:00 -
[141] - Quote
Great work!
NB: New font is perfect under linux with wine 1.3.29 self compiled (any resolution!) |
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CCP Affinity
C C P C C P Alliance
6
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Posted - 2011.10.05 10:27:00 -
[142] - Quote
Yung Trim wrote:Text changes on POS modules when you are on-lining a module at 1 minute remaining and lower. Proof
Awesome, thank you :) I will take a look into this today! CCP Affinity | Quality Assurance | Team BFF |
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CCP Affinity
C C P C C P Alliance
6
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Posted - 2011.10.05 10:27:00 -
[143] - Quote
Tetractys wrote:Great work!
NB: New font is perfect under linux with wine 1.3.29 self compiled (any resolution!)
woo! Good to hear :) Thanks! CCP Affinity | Quality Assurance | Team BFF |
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captain curry
Empyrean Warriors The Obsidian Front
1
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Posted - 2011.10.05 10:45:00 -
[144] - Quote
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/35/20111004023220.jpg/
Someone forgot to add the rounding code, its a minor issue but as seen here it spills over into other boxes. its also seen on displays on the interface if you have some odd buffer (Trimarks on armour, extenders on shields etc).
Having .61068427259 of a hitpoint displaying is needless imo, as seen here: http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/850/20111005104559.jpg/ (Also the text readout is broken, as seen here its actually set to absolute readout. Might not be a font issue exclusively however) DuckSex > my solution to solo pvp: create an alt account. hunt yourself. |
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CCP Punkturis
C C P C C P Alliance
88
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Posted - 2011.10.05 11:37:00 -
[145] - Quote
captain curry wrote:http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/35/20111004023220.jpg/ Someone forgot to add the rounding code, its a minor issue but as seen here it spills over into other boxes. its also seen on displays on the interface if you have some odd buffer (Trimarks on armour, extenders on shields etc). Having .61068427259 of a hitpoint displaying is needless imo, as seen here: http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/850/20111005104559.jpg/ (Also the text readout is broken, as seen here its actually set to absolute readout. Might not be a font issue exclusively however)
This has been fixed CCP Punkturis | EVE UI Developer |
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CCP Punkturis
C C P C C P Alliance
88
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Posted - 2011.10.05 13:51:00 -
[146] - Quote
Bloodpetal wrote:I found the official thread \o/
I agree that in some places it is a little too large - overview tables and the selected item panel can use a slight tweak smaller in size - 10% or so. It will save a lot of space overall for UI - I know a lot of pilots already are snug on UI space on smaller screens.
I'm sure some people will want it larger, I think that falls down on CCP working on implementing that into their code for customization. I think the gentleman a few posts above me made a thorough description of where things are clearly issues through images.
I also agree that on some of the tables it is challenging to absorb the information on a quick scan - specifically on larger tables of information. I'm trying to identify why exactly, and I feel it has to do with the negative space. Here's my theory - I think the font's negative space doesn't scale up so well for reading large amounts of table information, when you hit near what I would say is around the 12pt mark, which seems to be used in some important places, like the overview and the selected items. The negative space isn't an issue at smaller sizes, such as in the inventory or in the info panels - but as you get larger, the thinness of the font doesn't work out so well towards providing readability in the flow through the negative space to absorb the information smoothly in areas where a lot of data needs to be processed quickly.
Overview has to be readable in under 1/10th of a second. Seriously.
As a PVP Pilot, I have a lot of information to look at in under 10 seconds - check distance, check hp, check shields, check module cycles, check enemy health, check ally health, give 4 different orders to 10 different people, check local scanner for any incoming reinforcements, check local for population spike for ambush, do manual maneuvering to maintain range, listen to friendly comms about their status.
In the amount of time it takes one rep cycle to go off, I have to do all that - so reading the Overview doesn't mean bigger is better. On the overview I probably have about 10 columns up - Tag, Icon, Name, Type, Distance, Velocity, Radial Velocity, Corp, Alliance, Militia - and I need them to fit in a readable space. I think dropping 1 or 2 points on Overview and Market tables will improve readability even for those who prefer larger fonts. I think this applies to the markets, although the justification for 1/10th second reading time might not apply there. :)
P.S. Can we maybe get a screenshot of the overview and a variety of objects on it with the current font size and maybe a 1 pt smaller font size to compare? Showing at least most of these columns as well? Tag, Icon, Name, Type, Distance, Velocity, Radial Velocity, Corp, Alliance, Militia
you know what we did? we added a "Use small font" option to your overview settings (appearance tab) for you guys who think the overview is now too big
it'll only be added for the overview though
and no I won't give you screenshots because then more people are going to make fun of me for having crappy setup and "OMG YOU DON'T PLAY EVE" (on my local) - you'll just have to wait until it hits SiSi CCP Punkturis | EVE UI Developer |
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Bloodpetal
Mimidae Risk Solutions
47
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Posted - 2011.10.05 13:53:00 -
[147] - Quote
CCP Punkturis wrote:you know what we did? we added a "Use small font" option to your overview settings (appearance tab) for you guys who think the overview is now too big it'll only be added for the overview though and no I won't give you screenshots because then more people are going to make fun of me for having crappy setup and "OMG YOU DON'T PLAY EVE" (on my local) - you'll just have to wait until it hits SiSi
Will you marry me? NOSTRO AURUM NON EST AURUM VULGI |
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CCP Punkturis
C C P C C P Alliance
88
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Posted - 2011.10.05 13:59:00 -
[148] - Quote
Bloodpetal wrote:CCP Punkturis wrote:you know what we did? we added a "Use small font" option to your overview settings (appearance tab) for you guys who think the overview is now too big it'll only be added for the overview though and no I won't give you screenshots because then more people are going to make fun of me for having crappy setup and "OMG YOU DON'T PLAY EVE" (on my local) - you'll just have to wait until it hits SiSi Will you marry me?
haha! the nicest thing said to me on the forums yet CCP Punkturis | EVE UI Developer |
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Grey Stormshadow
Starwreck Industries
200
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Posted - 2011.10.05 14:03:00 -
[149] - Quote
CCP Punkturis wrote:you know what we did? we added a "Use small font" option to your overview settings (appearance tab) for you guys who think the overview is now too big it'll only be added for the overview though and no I won't give you screenshots because then more people are going to make fun of me for having crappy setup and "OMG YOU DON'T PLAY EVE" (on my local) - you'll just have to wait until it hits SiSi That is one big improvement and very positive news. Thank you. Forum fix for firefox and chrome Get working images and colored text Classic forum style 2.25final |
Simvastatin Montelukast
SACHEN. Mean Coalition
2
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Posted - 2011.10.05 15:10:00 -
[150] - Quote
CCP Punkturis wrote:Bloodpetal wrote:CCP Punkturis wrote:you know what we did? we added a "Use small font" option to your overview settings (appearance tab) for you guys who think the overview is now too big it'll only be added for the overview though and no I won't give you screenshots because then more people are going to make fun of me for having crappy setup and "OMG YOU DON'T PLAY EVE" (on my local) - you'll just have to wait until it hits SiSi Will you marry me? haha! the nicest thing said to me on the forums yet
Excellent idea idea for a "small font button". |
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