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Dragonmede
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Posted - 2010.01.10 00:10:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Dragonmede on 10/01/2010 00:10:49 I know that this may break a few CCP designer hearts out there, but what happened with Caldari Ship Designs? What potentially could have been awesome asthetics on par with Gallenti and Amarr Designs, end up looking even worse than an Ad-Hoc Minmatar Design. Honestly, The Minmatar have a great storyline excuse for why their ships look a little "customized" but at least they are somewhat symmetrical and pleasing to the eye. It would seem to me that those Asymmetrical Abominations known as Caldari Frigates were cobbled together like a Johnny Cash '58, '59, '60, '61, '62 Automobile. The Wings don't match, the Balance is way, way off, and it looks like it was designed as a Senate compromise of a Congressional Committee Spending Bill. My Eyes, My eyes, I just can't stand it. Pick a style will you? Compromise a bit, say use one wing tip design for T1 ships and the other design for T2 ships. Whoever ended up with the low bid got overpaid I tell you. It's embarrassing for me to talk up this game with my friends only to have them laughing at the Scorpion, asking "what happened to the other wing?" or the Cormorant's "What, ran out of spare parts again?"
Please give us Caldari Ships that don't look like Minmatar hand-me-downs.
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I SoStoned
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.01.10 00:16:00 -
[2]
The first generation artistic design team consisted of a lead designer who had only one hand, one leg, and one eye... not all of which were on the same side of his body. Unfortunately this was a thalidomide victim so the poor fellow grew up not having any depth of field or understanding of bilateral symmetry.
And, it has been made abundantly clear by even idiots in the past, ships in space rotate around their center of mass if their drive is askew from that mass. Thus, gallente ships would just sit there and spin madly, going nowhere, if the physics in the Eve universe were even remotely like those in the Milky Way universe. Obviously the Eve-gate transcended not only time and space but branes as well.
Now, if we were to erect the biggest bandsaw in creation then ram those first generation ships across it and mirror one side onto the other everything would be fixed; bilateral symmetry and center of mass thrust angles would actually function as they should.
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Ran Khanon
Amarr The Phantom Acolytes
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Posted - 2010.01.10 00:50:00 -
[3]
It's all a matter of opinion I guess. Personally I really like most Caldari ships; they look like they mean business. Probably the most 'basic military' of all factions. A favorite would be the Falcon, Rook, Blackbird hull; one of the most beautiful ships in EVE in my mind. For the true design atrocities, take a look at the Bellicose hull ... talking about ugly ducklings :) Please re-size your signature to the maximum file size of 24000 bytes. Zymurgist |
Kaylee Juuna
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Posted - 2010.01.10 00:52:00 -
[4]
There are some ships that aren't as appealing (mostly concentrated on the Gallentean side) but every race has good designs. I actually like the Caldarian asymmetry, quite a bit.
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Kalnov
Gallente Problematique Inc.
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Posted - 2010.01.10 01:21:00 -
[5]
Imicus is Gallente.
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Samaritan Azuma
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2010.01.10 01:39:00 -
[6]
Originally by: I SoStoned The first generation artistic design team consisted of a lead designer who had only one hand, one leg, and one eye... not all of which were on the same side of his body. Unfortunately this was a thalidomide victim so the poor fellow grew up not having any depth of field or understanding of bilateral symmetry.
And, it has been made abundantly clear by even idiots in the past, ships in space rotate around their center of mass if their drive is askew from that mass. Thus, gallente ships would just sit there and spin madly, going nowhere, if the physics in the Eve universe were even remotely like those in the Milky Way universe. Obviously the Eve-gate transcended not only time and space but branes as well.
Now, if we were to erect the biggest bandsaw in creation then ram those first generation ships across it and mirror one side onto the other everything would be fixed; bilateral symmetry and center of mass thrust angles would actually function as they should.
that was really good up until you mentioned they had branes....... its spelled "brains" btw
If it weren't for downtime, I wouldn't make stupid posts. |
Hra Neuvosto
The Aduro Protocol
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Posted - 2010.01.10 01:43:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Samaritan Azuma that was really good up until you mentioned they had branes....... its spelled "brains" btw
M-theory
Fail harder.
Also, I like the looks of Griffin and Blackbird that are considered ugly by many. I also like the Imicus.
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Samaritan Azuma
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2010.01.10 02:14:00 -
[8]
ok ok.... but its still only a theory.
but dont you nerds forget that ill still kick your @sses and take your lunch money
If it weren't for downtime, I wouldn't make stupid posts. |
Emperor Cheney
Celebrity Sex Tape
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Posted - 2010.01.10 02:23:00 -
[9]
I love Caldari designs. With the exception of the pointlessly radical asymmetry on the Scorpion and a couple others, Caldari ships look like 'real' spaceships to me.
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Trinity Faetal
Gallente Burn The Witch
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Posted - 2010.01.10 04:07:00 -
[10]
everyone who started this game eventually got fed up with the Caldari designs, goes for me to.
but to change the design now will alienate a lot more old school players then this game already has with it's re-balancing and other issues.
tbh i have grown quite fond of the scorpion and raven design due to their uniqueness and their "stick it to the man with their symmetrical nonsense", the other ships not so much.
in a rp sense i would say that the Caldari being so militarized they spend more time designing stuff that does what it is supposed to do and does it while being cheap rather then looking good and costing a lot of isk while doing it.
----------------------------------- woot, free zephyr, ccp won me back. |
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De'Veldrin
Minmatar Special Projects Executive The Obsidian Legion
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Posted - 2010.01.10 04:09:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Samaritan Azuma ok ok.... but its still only a theory.
So's the theory of gravity. I'm just saying. --Vel
Brand new year, same old attitude. |
Mister LEM0NS
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Posted - 2010.01.10 04:53:00 -
[12]
I resent that! I like caldari ships because they look like death! and theyre boxy! DRAKE AND ROKH FTW!
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Hra Neuvosto
The Aduro Protocol
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Posted - 2010.01.10 05:42:00 -
[13]
Originally by: De'Veldrin So's the theory of gravity. I'm just saying.
In before 5 pages of evolution discussion.
Originally by: Mister LEM0NS and the thrasher looks like... well... lets not get into that... ( 8=====D this)
I think there might be something wrong with your genitalia then
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Dyphorus
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Posted - 2010.01.10 05:50:00 -
[14]
I quite like they Caldari designs as well. They look industrial, like no though was given to aesthetics, just all business. |
Tyrone Bighams
Gallente Auto Lock
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Posted - 2010.01.10 06:26:00 -
[15]
i think that ccp has gotta get to painting gally ships with that dead sex roden coloring. the red works so well with the flowing shapes of the gallente. and can we plaease have some designer love for the imicus?! thing looks like the unholy product of a spaceship and cat poop.
oh yeah and caldari ships do look okay in some iterations. i wouldnt want to fly a bantam thing appears to be the metal cousin of the now extinct dodo bird, with comprable capabilities.
Blackbirds not bad looking in its way, though. if ur gonna make caldari ships appear built purely for functionality, please fix that abortion dubbed the scorpion though. make it look like its built around a big ecm array or something, not like a cardboard stealth bomber that was never fnished due to budget constraints In Actuality What Has Been Stated Applies More Directly To The Former Poster Than to Myself. NO, U!!! Please resize your signature to the maximum allowed of 400 x 120 pixels with a maximum file size of 24000 bytes. Navigator |
Shak'Rah
The Unforgettables Talos Coalition
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Posted - 2010.01.10 08:58:00 -
[16]
the only thing in eve that looks remotely like a 'real spaceship' would definitely be the rokh, the drake or the phoenix. they are boxy and built without wasting room or materials; there are no odd protrusions or misshapen parts.
yeah, some ships look really wierd, but you know the caldari aren't the only ones. take a look at the megathron, for example. it could have looked pretty decent, but it looks like it procured cancer and now it's front arms are massive tumors.... ate too much spinach methinks ---
Imperfection is beauty, madness is genius, and it is better to be absolutely ridiculous than absolutely boring. |
Reem Fairchild
Minmatar Military Research and Manufacturing Corp.
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Posted - 2010.01.10 10:04:00 -
[17]
Whatever... I dislike the look of the Gallente ships the most. Particularly the Dominix. The Caldari ships look cool.
Originally by: Akita T this whole game is just me playing with myself
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Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.01.10 10:06:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Dragonmede
Please give us Caldari Ships that don't look like Minmatar hand-me-downs.
No, I rather like Caldari designs, they are imo the most space-ish designs of all the races. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html |
Lord CH0w
Caldari Xenogenics
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Posted - 2010.01.10 10:29:00 -
[19]
CCP could however increase resolution of textures that are put on some ships like: Raven, and Scorpion, and change the green camo design for faction to steel-blue/black(or white) :)
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Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.01.10 10:36:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Lord CH0w CCP could however increase resolution of textures that are put on some ships like: Raven, and Scorpion
This i do agree on. Raven needs an update in its skin. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html |
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Davina Braben
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Posted - 2010.01.10 10:54:00 -
[21]
lol. 8/10 for a Cash reference.
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Platoon Sergeant
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Posted - 2010.01.10 11:49:00 -
[22]
Fly amarr if your OCD demands symmetry. Leave Caldari alone. Ironically, Minmatar is very close behind Amarr for symmetry count and Gallente is almost as predominantly asymmetrical as Caldari. If anything has to pick a style, it should be Gallente, with 3-4 different "styles".
Symmetrical:
Amarr -12 Impairor* Executioner* Inquisitor* Punisher* Magnate* Tormentor* Augoror* Arbitrator* Maller* Armageddon* Apocalypse* Abaddon*
Minmatar -9 Breacher Rifter Slasher Thrasher Bellicose Rupture Scythe Stabber Maelstrom
Gallente -4
Maulus Vexor (it's technically asymmetrical if you count the little hose on the back) Dominix Hyperion
Caldari -2 Merlin Caracal
Not Symmetrical:
Amarr
Crucifier Coercer Omen
Minmatar
Burst Probe Vigil Tempest Typhoon
Gallente
Tristan Incursis Navitas Imicus Atron Catalyst Exequror Thorax Celestis Megathron
Caldari
Bantam Condor Griffin Kestrel Heron Cormorant Blackbird Moa Osprey Rokh Raven Scorpion
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Asestorian
The Debonair
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Posted - 2010.01.10 14:34:00 -
[23]
I quite like most Caldari ships. My only issue with them is the textures on some ships, like the Raven, just don't seem of high enough quality/resolution and could be improved.
At the end of the day they are as they are and they aren't going to change. There are people who like them and people who don't.
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Battlingbean
Heaven's Gate
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Posted - 2010.01.10 19:03:00 -
[24]
I like the Tengu's style. That's the way Caldari ships should look IMO.And guess what, it's symmetrical. Please redo the Moa/Eagle/Onxy/Gila model!
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Xavier Maroquin
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Posted - 2010.01.10 19:26:00 -
[25]
Pretty much every Caldari ship (besides some frigs and the Moa, and the Wyvern carrier) are pretty cool looking. My only problem with them is that their "command section" with the big window is always out on a spire, looking like it could be snapped of with the slightest impact. They also have the coolest t2 color schemes. Amarr come in a close second, Minmatar in third, because of their cool "pieced together" look. If anything is ugly, its the Gallente designs. Even the better looking ones still are a bit too bubbly and bloated looking (brutix comes to mind, cool, but a bubbly whale ), however, there are a few that are very nice, like the Megathron, and the Nyx, but really, Gallente wins the ugly ship contest.
X-Tra Cool Caldari ships: 1) Rokh: long boxy and tough looking 2) Drake: 3) Ferox: Despite sucking at it, it actually looks like its going to eat you. 4) Caracal: its got wing things! 5) Condor/Kestrel/Merlin/Heron 6) Cormorant: actually one of the coolest looking dessies
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Psiri
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Posted - 2010.01.10 22:59:00 -
[26]
Condor, Kestrel, Drake, Ferox, Moa (yes Moa, it's pretty now!)... Caldari have plenty of great looking ships.
If you think the Raven looks bad now, woah you should've seen it before. I'm not a fan of the Rokh (even if it looks shiny with hardeners on) or Scorpion (I used to be until someone pointed out that what seems to be the command center is placed in its stinger) and I' fairly neutral towards the Blackbird, Caracal and Raven.
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RenegadeChemist
Caldari Universal Exports Cult of War
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Posted - 2010.01.10 23:38:00 -
[27]
Caldari rocks
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Wendi Watson
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Posted - 2010.01.11 01:04:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Platoon Sergeant
Symmetrical: Minmatar -9 Stabber
The Stabber is not symmetrical. And you forgot the Hurricane.
Originally by: Platoon Sergeant
Not Symmetrical: Minmatar
Vigil
The Vigil is quite symmetrical
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Airborne Ninja
Minmatar Virtual HitMen
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Posted - 2010.01.11 05:47:00 -
[29]
And the Cyclone.
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Denuo Secus
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Posted - 2010.01.11 14:07:00 -
[30]
If I had to guess about CCP's opinion regarding the "correct" Caldari ship design I'd look at the Tengu and the Caldari fighter bomber (on Sisi for a while).
The design of these both ships is (was) very consistent and very shiny imho. The texture and model quality and the richness of details. It's quite an improvement compared to the other models. If the whole Caldari fleet would get a revamp into this direction (with variations for T2 and faction ofc) I'd never ever fly another race's ship again ^^ Just imagine a Drake or Raven in the Tengu's look! But this would be a lot of work for all 4 races I guess...
-
Save the missiles from the glowing blob :S
R ----------> * A --------> * V --------> * E -------> * N ---------> *
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Skex Relbore
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Posted - 2010.01.11 15:07:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Platoon Sergeant Symmetrical:
Gallente -4
Maulus Vexor (it's technically asymmetrical if you count the little hose on the back) Dominix Hyperion
You forgot the Brutix and Myrmadon as well as the Comet.
Quote:
Gallente
Tristan Incursis Navitas Imicus Atron Catalyst Exequror Thorax Celestis Megathron
The Mega is pretty close to symmetrical if it wasn't for that dumb little pod it has hanging off the bridge area. The Incursus is similar with only the stupid lance thing ruining it's symmetry.
That said cutting every ship in EVE in half and mirroring the remaining side (either one to be honest) would improve the aethetics of the game immensely. Well save for the Imicus hull there really is no help for that design.
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chaosjj
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Posted - 2010.01.11 17:50:00 -
[32]
Edited by: chaosjj on 11/01/2010 17:50:24 i realy like (most) caldari ships, they have a no-nonsens look
exeptions: moa (gives the word ugly a whole new meaning) scorpion ( no look for a battleship, if you asked me ) griffin ( side engines fail )
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Meredith Midnight
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Posted - 2010.01.11 21:11:00 -
[33]
How about they cut all assymetrical ships in half, (named Part A and Part B), and you can have up to 4 designs you can choose to fly.
AA (Scorpion Mk I) AB (Scorpion Mk II) BA (Scorpion Mk III) BB (Scorpion Mk IV)
I wouldnt mind flying a scorpion that looks like a giant antenna with stubby wings
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Battlingbean
Heaven's Gate
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Posted - 2010.01.12 00:13:00 -
[34]
I don't get a no-nonsense look from Caldari ships. If they were no nonsense they wouldn't look like the designers of the ships were cutting corners worrying about the bottom line. Warfare is not the place to cheap out, unless you have to like the Minmatar. Guess that explains why Caldari seem weaker at pvp.
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MSC Darklord
Minmatar The United Federation of Planets
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Posted - 2010.01.12 00:38:00 -
[35]
Well, you should have seen the abomination that the Scythe was before they changed the model.
I kind of miss it though, I used to fly it when I needed to do long empire trips, just for the ugliness factor.
Originally by: CCP Tuxford my bad.
Rest assured I'm being ridiculed by my co-workers.
Said after a 60 second shut down notice that was then canceled. |
Metal Beak
Minmatar Bolt Zero
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Posted - 2010.01.12 01:01:00 -
[36]
symmetrical does not mean good design. granted there are some ugly ships in eve, but it really boils down to personal preference. based on the number of ships in eve and the size of the design team I think they've done a pretty decent job.
just remember it's pretty easy to critique someones art without having to put your own ideas to the "appeal" test. if you really think your ideas are better then sketch something out and show them to the public. I'm guessing most of you wouldn't last 20 minutes as a designer.
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Skex Relbore
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Posted - 2010.01.12 21:35:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Metal Beak Edited by: Metal Beak on 12/01/2010 01:32:40 symmetrical does not mean good design (for those that don't believe that search Cosmic Motors in google images - almost none of his designs are symetrical -and he is one of the best spaceship designers out there). granted there are some ugly ships in eve, but it really boils down to personal preference. based on the number of ships in eve and the size of the design team I think they've done a pretty decent job.
just remember it's pretty easy to critique someones art without having to put your own ideas to the "appeal" test. if you really think your ideas are better then sketch something out and show them to the public. I'm guessing most of you wouldn't last 20 minutes as a designer.
BS. I did search Cosmic motors his designs are hopelessly impractical. Consider the racecar on the entry page the CM Gravion the driver can't see anything to the left of the right front wheel. His motorcycle has no seat nor foot pegs as such isn't even practical enough to accomidate a rider.
Want too see some aethetically pleasing spacecraft? try here
A basic reality is that symmetry is a key factor in what humans find attractive it's a sign of health and vitality.
It's also a useful thing in engineering in that symmetrical systems are naturally more stable than asymetrical designs. Don't believe me take the weights they use to balance your tires off and see how your car behaves. Or build a stool with diferent length legs.
The problem I see with EVE's spaceship design is it seems that the artists went to far with the idea of asymmetrical spacraft. They heard the hole there is no air in space (not that it stopped the game designers from making the physics operate as if space were filled with water) and forgot that we still had innertia and mass.
Yes symmetry is less important in space when it comes to shape, but it still maters when it comes to distribution of mass.
A couple of ship designs being assymetrial would be one thing some designers are quirky afterall and there are cases where practical considerations require a break from symmetry, such as an aircraft carrier which ends up with an assymetrical design because of the need to accomidate a flight deck.
But the EVE art department took the concept way too far and I think it detracts from the game not enough to stop me from playing obviously but enough that it always kind of annoys me.
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Metal Beak
Minmatar Bolt Zero
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Posted - 2010.01.13 00:48:00 -
[38]
I'm fully aware of the conceptships blog. I also know that Daniel Simon is a very well respected designer in the entertainment industry - he just finished up as the lead designer on Tron. I still stand by my point. Cutting a model in half and making it perfectly symmetrical doesn't make it an appealing design and there are plenty asymmetrical designs out there that have appeal.
You seem to think you know a lot about design so lets see your sketches.
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Xavier Maroquin
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Posted - 2010.01.13 01:18:00 -
[39]
Though the asymmetry can look stupid at times, when you see the ships moving and turning, it doesn't look half bad.
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MrBinary
Minmatar Binary Systems
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Posted - 2010.01.13 02:13:00 -
[40]
Love the Amarr and Caldari designs. The Scorpion and Raven are simply great! imho
Like the Minmatar. Some are great, some are horrific.
Hate the Galente designs. Especially the cruiser designs.
"[ 2004.05.20 20:11:42 ] Hodal Xibur > Die MrBinary" |
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Hoodat Bee
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Posted - 2010.01.13 03:36:00 -
[41]
Yeah, and talk about that moron Picasso. LEARN TO DRAW A FACE YOU ******!!! OMG!!
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Salen Kane
Amarr Ginnungagaps Rymdfarargille Blade.
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Posted - 2010.01.13 14:39:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Xavier Maroquin Pretty much every Caldari ship (besides some frigs and the Moa, and the Wyvern carrier) are pretty cool looking. My only problem with them is that their "command section" with the big window is always out on a spire, looking like it could be snapped of with the slightest impact.
That's because being shield tanked, the caldari dont care much for solid hulls. Once the shields are knocked down, they DO break appart at the slightest impact. I think the real question is, why do ships flown by pod pilots even NEED windows?
I generally think the racial designs make sense:
Amarr- massive lumbering things with solid armor plates. Caldari- stripped down hulls, more concerned with fitting the required technology than providing protection. Minmatar- put together by chewing gum and wire coathangers.
Gallante doesn't make much sense at first (sort of a 'Mr Potatohead'/robocop crossover thing), but I suppose that might make sense as the gallante design philosophy is likely to change more over time than other races. If the gallante fashion blogs proclaim that this years spaceship should look like giant genetalia, it would be sooooo uncool to not have atleast one military ship with that look. Real men dont kiss and tell, we **** and exaggerate!
That's not a titan, its the flying **** I dont give about your opinions. |
Skippermonkey
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Posted - 2010.01.13 15:12:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Salen Kane I think the real question is, why do ships flown by pod pilots even NEED windows?
Know your game, each ship has non-caspuleer crew.
Just think of the millions of crew deceased in the service of capuleers Look at me, im using the INTERNETS! |
Skanufacturing
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Posted - 2010.01.13 18:10:00 -
[44]
Edited by: Skanufacturing on 13/01/2010 18:10:50 Edited by: Skanufacturing on 13/01/2010 18:10:30 Some say that there is no friction in space, and it doesn't matter where the engines are. Wrong.
Take, for example, the raven class hull. The way the engines are placed on that pice of crap should have it flying in cicles. I don't care if there is friction, if you put more thrust on one side than the other, you have a ship that flies in circles.
-Skan
*edit* also, they are ugly as home-made sin.. so is the scorpion :p
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