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dibblebill
Beyond Our Sins
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Posted - 2010.01.26 03:37:00 -
[1]
Edited by: dibblebill on 26/01/2010 03:41:24 Edited by: dibblebill on 26/01/2010 03:37:59 Beyond Our Sins recently negotiated a mutual non-aggression pact with the Sovereign Hospitaller Order of Saint Katherine. Once the logistics of the operation have been worked out, we will be working in cooperation with the Order to find homes and employment for any slaves that they find in their rescue operations. These jobs will not just be in the Minmatar republic. Through my contacts, we will be able to provide them homes and employment anywhere in New Eden, except for 0.0 regions. We, Beyond Our Sins, will also provide job training to these people, and education if they so wish. It will be as objective an education as possible, based on science and fact, and we will do our best to leave our philosophies, as well as any others, out of it.
We are also announcing Operation Freedom. This is directed to all holders. If you are willing to part with your slaves, we will take them to Minmatar space, and provide them with the same assistance we are providing Miss Dougan's rescued slaves with.
This service will be conducted with complete anonimoty (spelling?) beyond my inbox. Only I will handle the names of those who wish us to provide these slaves a new home, and the names will not pass on beyond me to my corpmates, my contacts, or our allies. Unless you request otherwise, we see no reason to make a public fuss over it. The service is for the people, not about the public approval or disapproval of your actions. You only need to send me a private mail to set up a pickup time and my agent will come to retrieve the people.
We are not seeking to create more soldiers for the Republic, as we will leave it open to the freed men and women as to where we will take them. If they wish to find employment in the State, we will take them there. If it is the Empire, we'll take them there. The Federation? Republic? We'll find them housing and employment.
Please note that at this time, we only wish those willing to do so to participate. We do not want to push this on holders as any form of coercion, and we leave it entirely up to them to decide if they wish to take part in this.
Originally by: The Cosmopolite
We even had an internal debate on the issue of Free Captains holding slaves - one which concluded that it was a private matter for the individual.
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dibblebill
Beyond Our Sins
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Posted - 2010.01.28 15:25:00 -
[2]
Beyond Our Sins has decided to extend this program to include holders among the Angel Cartel and affiliates, Blood Raiders and affiliates, and other slaveholding organizations. We will also helpa ny homeless you find in space with the same anonimoty. *SPLUD* |
BloodBird
Nova Foundry
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Posted - 2010.01.28 16:11:00 -
[3]
Allow me to be the first to publicly wish you luck in this endeavor, Mr. dibblebill. (sp?)
The pursuit of universal, untarnished and equal freedom for all who desire it, is a cause trully worth struggling for.
Best of luck, honourable one.
------------------------------------- Alexander Kamy· Allisieer - CO-founder, NOVAF |
Jakiin
Khanid Provincial Vanguard
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Posted - 2010.01.28 20:51:00 -
[4]
So long as the slaves are freed legally, then I see no issue with this. I will not be outsourcing any slaves to you, however, as mine are already quite well taken care of after given freedom.
* Jakiin Torash Holder Heir of the Kingdom 'Pacifist Reclaimer'
Uncle Jak wants YOU to join the Khanid Provincial Vanguard! |
Lucius Vindictus
Amarr Order of the Black Cross
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Posted - 2010.01.28 21:19:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Lucius Vindictus on 28/01/2010 21:26:34 Any Amarrian owned slaves the Order finds during their rescue operations should be returned to their Holders. However unlikely it seems to me that any true Amarrian would indulge you in this plan, I will none the less remind them that any other course of action, no matter how well-intentioned, is punishable by imperial law.
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Louella Dougans
Amarr Sovereign Hospitaller Order of Saint Katherine
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Posted - 2010.01.28 22:04:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Lucius Vindictus
Any Amarrian owned slaves the Order finds during their rescue operations should be returned to their Holders. Any other course of action, no matter how well-intentioned, is punishable by imperial law.
As I understand things, by Law, I would be their Holder, having rescued them from space.
Be A Space Nun! It's Fun!! |
Graelyn
Amarr Deus Imperiosus Acies
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Posted - 2010.01.28 22:08:00 -
[7]
I, for one, hold slaves for the purpose of eventually re-integrating them into society. As any proper Holder should be doing. *scowls*
This often takes several generations of course. Freedmen candidates are offered several options; Supporting their fellow Matari of the faith in Ammatar space, joining the exploding population of Freedmen in the Empire as an expert journeyman in their chosen trade, or attempting to live in the relative darkness of the Republic.
Some of these once-slaves have amazed me. While religious indoctrination is the obvious goal of 'proper' slave programs, I have known slaves who are true scholars of the scriptures, who have astounded me with fundamental understandings of the Word, and most importantly the true meanings behind it, that rival even some priests and advisors to the Theology Council I have known.
To these in particular I encourage the choice of the Republic: not to proselytize or convert their biological brethren, but just to live a pure life, guided by God's teachings, and being a strong example to others. Such individuals can often spread the Truth of God's light in ways where other more aggressive strategies may fail, or even cause undue resentment.
Right, back to the point...While I've had no need for a reliable handlers for setting up folks in the Republic for a few years, I am always on the lookout for good ones. Handing these fine folk over to the wrong Matari can be disastrous, as terrorist recruiters or tribalist religious figures attempt to sway them, and sometimes even make their lives miserable when they do not immediately conform to the normal customs. The rage some Matari have toward their own brethren who are True Believers can be murderous and cruel, as I have learned the hard way... *Graelyn looks sad for a brief moment*
Should the claims of your corporation be proven as genuine and benevolent, I shall keep your contact information on hand for when it may be needed in the future.
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Graelyn
Amarr Deus Imperiosus Acies
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Posted - 2010.01.28 22:14:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Louella Dougans As I understand things, by Law, I would be their Holder, having rescued them from space.
I believe you are correct in this very specific case, as slaves jettisoned can be considered abandoned, and 'rights of salvage' apply to their property status.
However be advised that these laws vary greatly from area to area. It really is a patchwork of legal overlaps. I would contact the civil affairs office of the local solar Holder to make sure everything is in good order to avoid needless and annoying potential litigious issues.
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Darina Rea
Sovereign Hospitaller Order of Saint Katherine
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Posted - 2010.01.28 22:25:00 -
[9]
Aye. Contacting who the owner is and then shooting them in the face generally helps to reduce the number of slaves being dumped into space. And as bonus, if you miss them by chance they've learned a valuable lesson. _________
_________ Time is on our side. |
Graelyn
Amarr Deus Imperiosus Acies
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Posted - 2010.01.28 22:39:00 -
[10]
While that would not be my preferred course of action, I wouldn't exactly mourn the loss of such individuals.
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Jakiin
Khanid Provincial Vanguard
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Posted - 2010.01.28 22:59:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Darina Rea Aye. Contacting who the owner is and then shooting them in the face generally helps to reduce the number of slaves being dumped into space. And as bonus, if you miss them by chance they've learned a valuable lesson.
I expected more from the nuns of the Order. If you miss them by chance shoot again. A little hard work never killed anyone. Except, you know, the guy you're shooting at.
Holders that simply jettison their slaves into space are murderers and should be killed.
* Jakiin Torash Holder Heir of the Kingdom 'Pacifist Reclaimer'
Uncle Jak wants YOU to join the Khanid Provincial Vanguard! |
Louella Dougans
Amarr Sovereign Hospitaller Order of Saint Katherine
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Posted - 2010.01.28 23:04:00 -
[12]
Less than 15% of the individuals I've identified throwing people overboard are True Amarr.
Be A Space Nun! It's Fun!! |
Merdaneth
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2010.01.28 23:36:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Louella Dougans As I understand things, by Law, I would be their Holder, having rescued them from space.
Salvaged is the right term where it concerns goods ms. Dougans. Concord Law is simple om this respect: its theft. Amarr law isn't that simple. There are many preferential rights, jurisdiction issues, holder tithes to be paid, and a myriad of other procedures concerning the salvaging of slave livestock.
All records must be in correct order for you to be granted full ownership. ____
The Illusion of Freedom | The Truth about Slavery |
Jakiin
Khanid Provincial Vanguard
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Posted - 2010.01.29 01:10:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Louella Dougans Less than 15% of the individuals I've identified throwing people overboard are True Amarr.
Could you give us a complete racial breakdown please? This sounds like it could be hilarious. In a gallows humour sort of way.
* Jakiin Torash Holder Heir of the Kingdom 'Pacifist Reclaimer'
Uncle Jak wants YOU to join the Khanid Provincial Vanguard! |
Louella Dougans
Amarr Sovereign Hospitaller Order of Saint Katherine
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Posted - 2010.01.29 01:26:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Louella Dougans on 29/01/2010 01:26:59
Originally by: Jakiin
Originally by: Louella Dougans Less than 15% of the individuals I've identified throwing people overboard are True Amarr.
Could you give us a complete racial breakdown please? This sounds like it could be hilarious. In a gallows humour sort of way.
As of 19/01 this year, so about 10 days ago when I last surveyed things:
Of 128 individuals:
Achura 14 Amarr 18 Brutor 8 Civire 16 Detei 10 Gallente 18 Intaki 9 Jinmei 3 Khanid 10 Nikunni 12 Seibestor 5 Vherokior 5
Keep in mind, this is almost all from the Niarja-Kaaputenen area.
And there were several more incidents since.
Be A Space Nun! It's Fun!! |
Jakiin
Khanid Provincial Vanguard
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Posted - 2010.01.29 01:50:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Louella Dougans As of 19/01 this year, so about 10 days ago when I last surveyed things:
Of 128 individuals:
C Achura 14 A Amarr 18 M Brutor 8 C Civire 16 C Detei 10 G Gallente 18 G Intaki 9 G Jinmei 3 A Khanid 10 A Nikunni 12 M Seibestor 5 M Vherokior 5
Keep in mind, this is almost all from the Niarja-Kaaputenen area.
And there were several more incidents since.
So...
Amarr 40
Caldari 40
Gallente 30
Matari 18
Considering the fact that this is Domain there are probably more Amarr than bloodlines would suggest, but I'm still surprised that the Gallente managed to account for a fairly large portion of the drops and Caldari managed to break even.
I'll have to keep an eye on the population ratio next time I'm in the area.
* Jakiin Torash Holder Heir of the Kingdom 'Pacifist Reclaimer'
Uncle Jak wants YOU to join the Khanid Provincial Vanguard! |
dibblebill
Beyond Our Sins
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Posted - 2010.01.29 13:13:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Lucius Vindictus Edited by: Lucius Vindictus on 28/01/2010 21:33:32 Any Amarrian owned slaves the Order finds during their rescue operations should be returned to their Holders. Any other course of action, no matter how well-intentioned, is punishable by imperial law.
As Miss Dougan has stated, they were abandoned in space. It is perfectly within her rights to take and free them if it is her wishes. Maybe you should speak to CONCORD on this matter, as well as your own government.
Quote: It seems rather unlikely to me that any true Amarrian is going to hand his slaves over to you if you just ask them. You should have asked yourself first why we have them in the first place. Their education and enlightenment is not something we take lightly, no matter how distasteful it is to you. For comparison: would you hand over your children to me if I posted a message on the IGS?
I would politely refuse doing so, and I did ask myself why. I am merely opening the way for those who volunteer to do so. Unless, of course, you are worried that in doing this we may uncover something some holders wish to hide.
Which brings to another interesting point. Putting someone at gunpoint and telling them to believe something does not make them believe it. It coerces them into making a decision to preserve their lives. I am not saying that you are putting them at gunpoint, merely pointing out a fact of life. Certainly it is an extreme example, perhaps too much so. But. Telling them that they must believe or never be freed, or go to hell, so on so forth, does not make them a better person. Would you rather not they truly come to believe in your faith of their own free will? There is nothing at all stopping those that are released to us to being returned to the Empire as free people, and pursuing a religious life. If that is what they wish to believe, then I encourage it, so long as it is their independent decision. I do not pretend to understand your religion, or your God, so this is just a personal opinion on this last part. Personally, I would much rather a single loyal ally who came to be my ally of his own volition rather than a dozen who came to be through some form of coercion. I do not pretend to know what your God would think of such a situation, but would he rather have them come willingly and freely, or dragged? If you have an answer, please, share it.
Do not take this last word as a metaphor for the condition of slaves today, it was merely the most fitting word for the analogy.
In any case, we are merely offering the service to any who wish to partake in this. If they do not do so, we aren't going to come to Amarr to take them ourselves. I wish to show that some of the "Republic Loyalist" corporations are not simply after blood like so many of the others. Unfortunately, too many of the corporations on both sides of the war, as Bloodbird has said, are merely here for the combat, and have lost sight of their cause. *SPLUD* |
dibblebill
Beyond Our Sins
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Posted - 2010.02.03 18:16:00 -
[18]
Edited by: dibblebill on 03/02/2010 18:19:03 Edited by: dibblebill on 03/02/2010 18:16:40 I would like to announce that we have received the first freed men for our program. Some have chosen, in fact, to return to the Empire as thus, and to pursue, to my surprise, religious goals. Some chose to work in the Republic. Of all the places nobody wished to go, nobody wished to go to the State. I find it most unusual, though I attribute it to the extreme xenophobic atmosphere instilled among the State's population in the last year and nine months.
We hope to have them trained for their new occupations and find them housing within the month. They have been given their freedom, they were not forced to earn it as some others believe. Not all freedom must be fought for with blood and guns, I hope other larger entities take heed to this effort and realize this as well. Pointing a gun at one's head and telling him to "Free your slaves or else" does not make him a better person, nor will it encourage education and rational thought. It certainly is easier than trying other routes, though.
I had a discussion with a pilot last night in Sifilar. He asked, if all I wanted was for holders to free their slaves, why fight the Empire's foot soldiers, so to speak? Why not take a more direct route? I offer you my solution, pilot, to show that I am trying to take a route that will more directly affect lives than simply destroying hostile ships in space. *SPLUD* |
Lord Maximullis
Amarr Universal Army Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2010.02.22 15:47:00 -
[19]
I would like to offer my personal support and well wishes to Beyond Our Sins in light of this operation. I am also glad to offer any financial and logistical assets that I can to aid this operation.
Libertas Victor
Marius Mullis |
Silas Vitalia
Khanid Provincial Vanguard
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Posted - 2010.02.22 17:41:00 -
[20]
Dibblebill,
Please -do- publish this list of 'holders' willing to part with their slaves.
By the way how is your Khanid race-traitor of a founder, Amanda, doing these days? Apparantly still wallowing in the gutter with the rest of this 'operation freedom' trash. Dispicable for someone who by right of birth was given such a precious blessing. Consider her and your whole group KOS to any of my pilots.
-Silas
Silas Vitalia CEO Khanid Provincial Vanguard Open for Recruitment!
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Lord Maximullis
Amarr Universal Army Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2010.02.22 18:15:00 -
[21]
Typical racist slaver, how immature.
Libertas Victor |
Tainted Purity
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Posted - 2010.02.22 18:47:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Tainted Purity on 22/02/2010 18:47:57
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Kyara Armaros
Amarr Khanid Provincial Vanguard
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Posted - 2010.02.22 21:55:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Kyara Armaros on 22/02/2010 21:56:44
Personally I dont own slaves. Though I may procure some to drop off somewhere, and then message you with clues to their locations. Call it a little slave scavenger hunt. I wonder if you would make it to them in time?
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dibblebill
Beyond Our Sins
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Posted - 2010.02.23 13:16:00 -
[24]
I would like to thank the last two holders who have bumped this topic for the additional attention. I can't argue with free, additional attention. I will be sure to set your standings accordingly, Silas and Kyara. *SPLUD* |
dibblebill
Beyond Our Sins
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Posted - 2010.02.23 14:44:00 -
[25]
An update. The total number of slaves freed by this program now numbers at 107. *SPLUD* |
Banichi Malguri
Amarr Quest Shipping
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Posted - 2010.02.24 02:34:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Kyara Armaros Edited by: Kyara Armaros on 22/02/2010 21:56:44
Personally I dont own slaves. Though I may procure some to drop off somewhere, and then message you with clues to their locations. Call it a little slave scavenger hunt. I wonder if you would make it to them in time?
It is statements like this that make me glad that I was born on Athra. -- Banichi Malguri. |
Jianni Sotaku
Eleutherian Guard
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Posted - 2010.02.24 02:53:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Jianni Sotaku on 24/02/2010 02:53:31
Originally by: Jakiin
Originally by: Louella Dougans As of 19/01 this year, so about 10 days ago when I last surveyed things:
Of 128 individuals:
C Achura 14 A Amarr 18 M Brutor 8 C Civire 16 C Detei 10 G Gallente 18 G Intaki 9 G Jinmei 3 A Khanid 10 A Nikunni 12 M Seibestor 5 M Vherokior 5
Keep in mind, this is almost all from the Niarja-Kaaputenen area.
And there were several more incidents since.
So...
Amarr 40
Caldari 40
Gallente 30
Matari 18
I preferred Sister Dougans' breakdown. I'm sure you can figure out why.
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dibblebill
Beyond Our Sins
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Posted - 2010.02.24 17:14:00 -
[28]
The freed number now stands at 162. While this is less than a tenth of a percent of the non-criminal slaves still kept in the Empire, every single one counts. *SPLUD* |
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