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Pulivin Motic
Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2010.02.04 23:48:00 -
[1]
Just wondering if there is an actual political theory that sort of follows their political philosophy.
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Graelyn
Amarr Deus Imperiosus Acies
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Posted - 2010.02.05 01:25:00 -
[2]
Planet Earth?
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yani dumyat
Minmatar Pixie Cats
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Posted - 2010.02.05 01:51:00 -
[3]
Niccol= Machiavelli
Sig_______
"Advice is a form of nostalgia. Dispensing it is a way of fishing the past from the disposal, wiping it off, painting over the ugly parts and recycling it for more than it's worth." |
Culmen
Caldari Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2010.02.05 03:11:00 -
[4]
Its called: State Capitalism
Quote: a society wherein the productive forces are controlled and directed by the state in a capitalist manner
Quote: By that definition, a state capitalist country is one where the government controls the economy and essentially acts like a single giant corporation.
Mega corps anyone?
and further more why do i even need a sig? |
Toshiro GreyHawk
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Posted - 2010.02.05 04:06:00 -
[5]
At one time in Japan as the Daimyo of the past became the Zaibatsu of pre WWII Japan - it could be argued that Japan was something like this.
Of course a lot of your socialist countries are like this to a degree.
The National Socialists of the Third Reich also come to mind.
The thing is ... in most cases the military was a greater power base than the industrialists. As Mao said "Power grows out of the barrel of a gun." If the industrialists get out of line - the military can just shoot them and put someone else in their place.
Thus, the back story to EVE is some what lame.
As a GAME, EVE works well ... but ... the chances of any person or group with real military - and therefore political power - to allow corporations, especially player corporations, to act as they do in EVE is absurd.
The purpose of government is to provide stability to promote internal economic growth and protect against external aggression. Allowing Corporations to go to war with each other would not happen, at least in Hi Sec, though a Wild West area like 0.0 could still exist beyond that part of space the Faction Navies patrolled.
The thing here is that you have these multitude of Neutral, unconquerable NPC corporation Space Stations. That wouldn't happen. Either the NPC Corporations would take sides or the Player Corporations, especially in 0.0 would occupy all their facilities.
*shrug*
In reality, events evolve from one thing to another, cause brings about effect, giving you a linear progression through time.
In a game - the developers create their game mechanics - and then develop a back story to explain them. Thus, the effect comes first - and then some thing is thrown together to "explain" it in the fantasy world of the game.
The situation in EVE makes a good game - but it would never happen in reality so it is difficult to come up with a nation in reality that closely resembled anything in EVE.
Orbiting vs. Kiting Faction Schools |
Intense Thinker
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.02.05 04:43:00 -
[6]
The Caldari are Americans
Originally by: a51 duke1406 The girls just dont understand that sunday is pvp night, not cuddle on the couch watching tv night.
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Thuranni
Eldjotnar
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Posted - 2010.02.05 05:45:00 -
[7]
The Caldari State is pretty much exactly how the rest of the world sees the United States of America.
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Foodpimp
Gallente Heaven's Harvesters Shadow of xXDEATHXx
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Posted - 2010.02.05 06:06:00 -
[8]
Wow, it's been a while since a thread has taken this turn. Everything that follows is pretty much predictable at this point.
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Marz Ghola
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2010.02.05 06:47:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Thuranni The Caldari State is pretty much exactly how the rest of the world sees the United States of America.
Look at this guy speaking for the planet.
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Chaos Incarnate
Faceless Logistics
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Posted - 2010.02.05 07:57:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Culmen Its called: State Capitalism
Quote: a society wherein the productive forces are controlled and directed by the state in a capitalist manner
Quote: By that definition, a state capitalist country is one where the government controls the economy and essentially acts like a single giant corporation.
Mega corps anyone?
State capitalism is inverse caldari. State capitalism is socialist, where the government controls the industries; the caldari state is ultra capitalist, where the industries (megacorporations) control the government. My wikipedia-fu would suggest something more like a corporate republic or corporatocracy, although the latter topic is filled with some mild tinfoil about how the US is doooooooooooomed _____________________ Horrors! Demons in the deep! |
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Magnus Nordir
Caldari Nordir Industries
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Posted - 2010.02.05 11:00:00 -
[11]
As Musollini said:
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power."
But I don't know of any RL examples. Italy and Japan in WWII-era were on a good way to that state (Germany was more socialist), but both had governmental militaries and huge governments that were in no way controlled by the corporations. Think Ron Paul meets Ayn Rand, a system where you've got a government so small it basically cedes all power to the corporations. The system in Snow Crash (by Neal Stephenson) is probably a pretty close approximation of how it'd look if it were implemented in the USA. --------------------------- Only those who surrender are lost |
VanNostrum
Tigers Of Anatolia
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Posted - 2010.02.05 11:52:00 -
[12]
State capitalism = communism
Caldari is opposite of state capitalism. Instead of state running the business, business is running the state. Big corporations have high influence on government politics, they basicly run the government. This...frighteningly reminds of an existing country in today's world.
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Magnus Nordir
Caldari Nordir Industries
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Posted - 2010.02.05 11:59:00 -
[13]
Originally by: VanNostrum State capitalism = communism
Caldari is opposite of state capitalism. Instead of state running the business, business is running the state. Big corporations have high influence on government politics, they basicly run the government. This...frighteningly reminds of an existing country in today's world.
Well, you don't exactly see corporations claiming whole towns, using their own currency instead of the dollar, organising their own military and police forces etc, and the congress at least pretends to be a democratic entity and not a bunch of corporate agents.
But yeah, the difference is basically that the USA can't afford to admit it's a fascist state and not a democracy. --------------------------- Only those who surrender are lost |
VanNostrum
Tigers Of Anatolia
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Posted - 2010.02.05 12:06:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Magnus Nordir
Originally by: VanNostrum State capitalism = communism
Caldari is opposite of state capitalism. Instead of state running the business, business is running the state. Big corporations have high influence on government politics, they basicly run the government. This...frighteningly reminds of an existing country in today's world.
Well, you don't exactly see corporations claiming whole towns, using their own currency instead of the dollar, organising their own military and police forces etc, and the congress at least pretends to be a democratic entity and not a bunch of corporate agents.
But yeah, the difference is basically that the USA can't afford to admit it's a fascist state and not a democracy.
They don't have to claim whole towns or countries, the government does it for them so they can spread their businesses local or abroad. And they don't have to have their own currencies, having a common currency is a good medium for trade between corporations. They don't have to have their own police or military force, instead they supply the state army with weapons (for a price) and in return get to decide where the government should bring peace and wealth (democracy) next. Weapons manufacturing corporations run the government. I'm talking about Caldari, ofc...
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KPPA
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Posted - 2010.02.05 12:19:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Magnus Nordir Think Ron Paul meets Ayn Rand, a system where you've got a government so small it basically cedes all power to the corporations.
If this where to happen the government would not have the power to make laws that affect the market. What "power" would the gov be handing over? The corporations couldn't make laws and they couldn't initiate force. All power cedes back to the people and the decisions they make in the free market.
I'd also say that Italy and Japan in the WWII-era was much like caldari if I understand caldari correctly.
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ceaon
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.02.05 12:39:00 -
[16]
State capitalism china anyone ? Signature removed, it needs to be more EVE related. Zymurgist dude u get a ship in game named crow and my sig have crows |
Yesh
SandStorm.
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Posted - 2010.02.05 12:49:00 -
[17]
I was once in a corp where every American was Caldari so I guess there is something in the caldari philosophy that attracts people from the US. Something about military might in the description of the character creation screen probably.
One of them said I chose Amarr as my race through word association of the Amarr 'EMPIRE' because I was from Britain and was angry about the fact that my ****ty little country no longer controls 1/4 of the earth. True story.
The REAL reason I chose Amarr is considerably worse. The T1 ammo is free
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Magnus Nordir
Caldari Nordir Industries
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Posted - 2010.02.05 13:03:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Yesh I was once in a corp where every American was Caldari so I guess there is something in the caldari philosophy that attracts people from the US. Something about military might in the description of the character creation screen probably.
One of them said I chose Amarr as my race through word association of the Amarr 'EMPIRE' because I was from Britain and was angry about the fact that my ****ty little country no longer controls 1/4 of the earth. True story.
The REAL reason I chose Amarr is considerably worse. The T1 ammo is free
Well, if we're playing American stereotypes,
-Caldari: America, **** yeah! laser-guided-democracy types. Don't misunderestimate these guys. Favourite quote: Whatever Glenn Beck spouted off on his last show, since their memory doesn't reach much further back than that. -Amarr: Racists and religious nuts, notice all the southern accents on Amarr corp chats. Favourite quote: "Atheists can not be considered patriotic citizens" - Bush II. To arms in Dixie! -Gallente: let-freedom-reign types, either hippies or American patriots who actually realise what our country was funded on and what it's turning into. Favourite quote: "Those who sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither and will lose both." - Franklin. -Minmatar: Junkyard wars/Scrapheap challenge fans.
--------------------------- Only those who surrender are lost |
Sokratesz
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Posted - 2010.02.05 13:05:00 -
[19]
On a related note, minmatar = somalia??
Want to test a supercap on SISI but don't have one? |
Magnus Nordir
Caldari Nordir Industries
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Posted - 2010.02.05 13:21:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Sokratesz On a related note, minmatar = somalia??
Hisec - classroom in an American college Lowsec - Somalia Nullsec - international waters --------------------------- Only those who surrender are lost |
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ceaon
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.02.05 13:22:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Sokratesz On a related note, minmatar = somalia??
y Signature removed, it needs to be more EVE related. Zymurgist dude u get a ship in game named crow and my sig have crows |
Deviana Sevidon
Gallente Panta-Rhei Butterfly Effect Alliance
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Posted - 2010.02.05 13:28:00 -
[22]
Chimerica
Quote: Disclaimer: All mentioned above contains my opinion and is therefore an absolute truth (for me anyway, my universe, muhahaha.....ok, done
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Culmen
Caldari Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2010.02.05 14:52:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Chaos Incarnate
State capitalism is inverse caldari. State capitalism is socialist, where the government controls the industries; the caldari state is ultra capitalist, where the industries (megacorporations) control the government. My wikipedia-fu would suggest something more like a corporate republic or corporatocracy, although the latter topic is filled with some mild tinfoil about how the US is doooooooooooomed
The Caldari state is an example of state capitalism because the individual Megacorps take the role of the state. So perhaps it would be more accurate to call the Caldari state a confederation of State Capitalistic States.
Notice how you only hear about the megacorps, you don't really hear about a Caldari start up or Caldari small business. There are also references, that if you are fired from your megacorp, you wind up starving to death or going into crime, pretty much like a socialist state.
Furthermore from the back story -> caldari ->introduction
Quote: All land and real estate is owned by a company which leases it to the citizens,
Note the word lease, not sell.
The thus as everything is owned by a megacorp, and the megacorp is the only entity working capitalistically, it is state capitalism.
and further more why do i even need a sig? |
Chaos Incarnate
Faceless Logistics
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Posted - 2010.02.05 15:46:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Culmen
The Caldari state is an example of state capitalism because the individual Megacorps take the role of the state...
Nay, it's still backwards. The megacorporations are both, but they're corporations first, states second; they're corporate governments, not government corporations.
State capitalism is the government deciding to build a factory to make widgets; Caldari capitalism is a widget factory owner forming his own town for his workers and proclaiming himself mayor _____________________ Horrors! Demons in the deep! |
Slade Trillgon
Endless Possibilities Inc. Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2010.02.05 17:43:00 -
[25]
Originally by: yani dumyat Niccol= Machiavelli
My opinion is that too many current politicians have not read or retained the knowledge that brilliant man put to paper.
Slade
Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker
Please go sit in the corner, and dont forget to don the shame-on-you-hat!
≡v≡ |
Reem Fairchild
Minmatar Military Research and Manufacturing Corp.
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Posted - 2010.02.05 20:06:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Reem Fairchild on 05/02/2010 20:06:38
Originally by: Intense Thinker The Caldari are Americans
The Gallente are the equivalent to the USA.
http://wiki.eveonline.com/wiki/Gallente
Quote: The Gallenteans. Self-righteous, meddling, pompous and tiresome, or virile liberalists and defenders of the free world. Love them or hate them, you simply can't ignore them. Everybody has an opinion on the Gallente Federation, it all depends from which side of the table you view them. For many, it is the Promised Land, where any dream can become a reality. The Gallenteans remain strong believers in free will and human rights, despite numerous setbacks in their long history.
Quote: Few societies display such stark contrasts. Many of the wealthiest people in the world are Gallenteans, creating a constant demand for luxury goods. At the same time, the ranks of the poor number millions, because while the liberal market-driven economy and individual freedom may allow everybody the chance to advance to the top, they make it just as easy to plummet to the very bottom of the social ladder.
In the world of EVE, the Gallentean are the kings of entertainment, mass-producing everything from cheap ****-flicks to elaborate stage-shows for an ever-hungry public. They boast the most elaborate luxury space yachts, and the most glittering hotel reservoirs. Anything your mind or body could ever crave, the Gallenteans have plenty of it.
----- 'In Eve, as in real life, if you are bored it's your own fault.' |
Joshu Sizu
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Posted - 2010.02.05 21:14:00 -
[27]
Originally by: VanNostrum Instead of state running the business, business is running the state. Big corporations have high influence on government politics, they basicly run the government.
you mean like this??
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Jago Kain
Amarr Ramm's RDI Tactical Narcotics Team
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Posted - 2010.02.06 02:37:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Yesh ...The REAL reason I chose Amarr is considerably worse. The T1 ammo is free
So; which part of Yorkshire are you from then?
___________________________________________________ The game will never be over, because we're keeping the meme alive. |
Viktor Fyretracker
Caldari Fyretracker Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2010.02.06 14:46:00 -
[29]
with the new ruling from our Supreme Court here in the US, we will become the Caldari. they have allowed uncapped donations by corps into the political system. so get ready for "Sol 3 Moon 1 General Electric Research Station"
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Mal Kuni
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Posted - 2010.02.06 21:07:00 -
[30]
The way I see it: Caldari = USA Amarr = traditional European cultures Minmatar = numerous tribal cultures united Gallente = funny space French
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