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Jacqueline McGhee
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2012.06.27 13:32:00 -
[1] - Quote
How does it work? And how do buy and sell orders work?
For example.. Would I be required to buy stuff from rens and then transport it to a system that I could sell it for more.
How do I know what systems I can sell it in for more? |
Major Trant
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
65
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Posted - 2012.06.27 16:30:00 -
[2] - Quote
You are getting mixed up with a general concept and the Eve Marketing mechanics.
The term buy low, sell high is a term that came from the real world stock markets and refers to buying stock when it is cheap and selling it when it is more expensive. Everyone quotes this and nearly everyone does the exact opposite, buying when a stock is hot and selling it when it is crashing. The term has now moved to general usage for all sorts of trading and is in use with normal Eve trading. It this case, it could mean buy the stock in a location where it is cheap and moving it to where it is more expensive. There are tools and sites that you can go to get the prices in various markets within Eve, google is your friend. Or you can use a price checking Alt permanently located in a distant market hub from where your main lives.
Buy and sell order are the mechanics of the Eve marketing system and can grant you enormous flexibility in managing orders as well as allowing you to buy low and immediately sell high(er) in one particular station.
You should be familiar with buying and selling direct. To buy something you simply right click on an order line in the top half of the marketing screen, select buy, enter the quantity and click ok. Assuming you are in the same station or have the trading skills to buy remotely, the money is deducted from your wallet and the item appears in the hanger in the station where the order was set up. To sell you simply right click on an order line in the bottom of the marketing screen, click sell enter the quantity and the item disappears from your station hanger and money is deposited into your wallet. Again there are trading skills to do this remotely from a different station, but in this case the goods you were selling have to be physical delivered to the destination station in advance of you carrying out this transaction.
Those order lines are actually Buy and Sell orders, usually created by other players, but some are NPC created. The orders at the top that you buy from are called Sell Orders, the orders at the bottom that you sell to are called Buy Orders. That might seem confusing, but they are named in relation to the person who set them up:- You Buy from someone else's Sell Order, you Sell to someone else's Buy Order.
Now lets say you want to buy something in a particular place but there are no suitable Sell Orders available. Either because there are none in the station or they are too expensive. Then you set up a Buy Order, by clicking on the button at the bottom of the market screen for the item in question "Create Buy Order". It will open with a default quantity of one and the price set to the cheapest available sell order in station if one exists. If you click Ok at that point, you will immediately buy the goods as if you had clicked on the sell order direct. Change the quantity as necessary, reduce the price to the figure you want and create a buy order. Then you have to wait until someone comes along, hauls the goods in and sells to your Buy order. It might be seconds, it might never happen. It depends on the price you offer in relation to the going rate and the competition from other buy orders. Note the game automatically forces sellers to sell to the best buy order and vice versa.
This brings us to the 'Isk game'. Other people with Buy Orders for the same product in the same station will see your Buy Order, which presumeably you will have set to a price better than theirs. They can then modify their price to get above yours. You have a few choices, continually modify your order to keep on top, wait until their order has been completed, or modify your order to a figure that satisfies the best sell order in the station and turn it into a direct buy.
Sell orders can be set up the same way. Move the goods to the staion, right click on them, select sell, the price of the best buy order comes up. Modify that price to one you want and click Ok, a sell order is created and you wait until something decides to buy it.
Player created Buy and Sell orders can exist for a maximum of 90 days before being cancelled if they are not satisfied in that time.
You will notice that Buy Orders (at the bottom) are always cheaper than Sell Orders (at the top), at least in the same station. It is impossible for a Buy Order to reach the same or higher price than a Sell Order - it would simply satisfy the sell order if you attempted it. Some items for example Battleships have big differences between their Buy and Sell orders and it is possible to set up a Buy order for say 100M and then as soon as you get it, push it back out on a Sell order for 120M. Too good to be true? It is. Where this is possible (Jita), there are a gadzillion people there trying to do just that. But money can be made if you are patient and have the dedication to play the Isk game continuously. |
J'Poll
Pioneer's of the Galantic Wars Ethereal Dawn
302
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Posted - 2012.06.27 16:31:00 -
[3] - Quote
Jacqueline McGhee wrote:How does it work? And how do buy and sell orders work?
For example.. Would I be required to buy stuff from rens and then transport it to a system that I could sell it for more.
How do I know what systems I can sell it in for more?
Buy Order: Person A wants to buy item "x" for price "y". He then waits till person B comes along who is willing to sell him the item for said price. *Demand factor*
Sell Order: Person A wants to sell item "x" for price "y". He then waits till person B comes along who is willing to pay the amount of money to get the item. *Supply factor*
So usually Buy orders are lower then Sell orders, specially within a station, sometimes even in the entire region. In between regions there could be a difference (but then again, sometimes even with a station next door - some people are too lazy to jump that 1 system).
If you right click an item and select sell item you will by default ALWAYS sell to the best possible buy order that you have access too (buy orders can have a said range, so this means they can be bought from others if that person is within the range of the buy order).
If you sell an item and use a manual price (which of course is higher then the highest buy order in your range) you automatically set up a sell order and have to wait till someone buys the stuff from you.
Same with buy orders, you can buy from people who are selling the stuff. But you can also make a buy order (again obviously below the sell orders) for a "x" ISK, this way you have to wait till someone comes along that sells his item too you.
As for Buy Low/Sell High, how much more info do you want. The idea is to buy the item at a low price and sell at a higher price (keep in mind to include the Broker's fee / station tax to make profit). You don't even have to move the stuff around (station trading), just buy an item when the price is low and sell it again after prices started to rise.
As for where to look. http://eve-central.com is a great site. But Traders will never give away where they look etc. It will give away their position and you can undercut them. Inject your skillbook before you leave the station. Neo didnGÇÖt learn Kung-Fu by having it sit in his usb drive.-á If it moves, shoot it. If it doesn't move, poke it with your gun and then shoot it. We are not running, we are advancing in the opposite direction |
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CCP Sisyphus
C C P C C P Alliance
29
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Posted - 2012.06.27 17:42:00 -
[4] - Quote
Major Trant wrote:--lots of good stuff--
This renews my faith in our players trying to help :) A nice well thought out explanation for a new player.
Thank you sir!
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Surfin's PlunderBunny
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
1591
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Posted - 2012.06.27 17:48:00 -
[5] - Quote
I agree with CCP Syphilis, Major Trant's response = best response |
Aeo Kai
Running with Knives Nexus Fleet
0
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Posted - 2012.06.27 18:33:00 -
[6] - Quote
Surfin's PlunderBunny wrote:
I now hate you. |
Lost Greybeard
Fenrir's Dogs of War Union 0f Revolution
89
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Posted - 2012.06.27 19:19:00 -
[7] - Quote
Another thing to remember is to keep things in perspective, just like with the other forms of PvP in the game. Sometimes someone will undercut you and you won't be able to sell things or someone will otherwise mess with your best-laid plans, or it'll just turn out you messed up the math and lost or failed some gain what should have been easy isk.
The main thing I'd advise with day-trading is to just relax. As long as your return on investment is positive according to your personal standards, you're doing fine. |
Nate Nichols
GWA Corp Unified Church of the Unobligated
5
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Posted - 2012.06.28 05:57:00 -
[8] - Quote
Surfin's PlunderBunny wrote:
LOL
Look how small his feet are! I feel sorry for him.
I love the internet. |
Sin Pew
Dakini Rising The Kali Cartel
75
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Posted - 2012.06.28 08:48:00 -
[9] - Quote
Surfin's PlunderBunny wrote: Always expect the worse when clicking on Surfin's links "- You want a sandwich, Bacon?" Support horizontal scrollbars in Eve! Click here, tyvm. |
Lyric Lahnder
Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
66
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Posted - 2012.06.28 16:32:00 -
[10] - Quote
Dont forget to check market history on the item, and check its movement. Dont want to trade something that isn't moving. Noir. and Noir Academy are recruiting apply at www.noirmercs.comI Noir Academy: 60 days old must be able to fly at least one tech II frigate. I Noir. Recruits: 4:1 k/d ratio and can fly tech II cruisers. |
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Pinstar Colton
Sweet Asteroid Acres
150
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Posted - 2012.06.28 16:43:00 -
[11] - Quote
For a newer player just getting into the market game, there is something to be said for "Buy low, haul to trade hub, sell high"
Prices in trade hubs for all goods are generally higher than other stations. If you're willing to do some legwork, you can realize gains by shipping goods. You can practice this with finding trade routes with NPC seeded goods (Like Frozen Food) but the real money is with items players are interested in.
Region trading can, to this extent, be very profitable. Because you only ever see prices for the region you are currently in, many players don't realize that the same goods sell for a much different price in the next region.
A T1 industrial is easy for a new player to get into and can ship a decent amount of goods. In the cat-and-mouse game that is low sec, there is no shame in learning to be a better mouse. |
Kitty Bear
Disturbed Friends Of Diazepam Dark Matter Coalition
0
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Posted - 2012.06.28 17:14:00 -
[12] - Quote
Surfin's PlunderBunny wrote:
Thank you for restoring my faith in humanity.
For the OP, theres several different kinds of trading in eve, and a few ways of getting your product to the buyers.
Buying low and Selling high from the same station, without any hauling at all, relies totally on the laziness of the eve player base [n.b. not all eve players are lazy, but enough are to make money from them]. Lazy players don't like dragging 'stuff' around to get the best price for it, so they will sell locally it at a lower, but still reasonable, rate. In the same way, the lazy player wont fly 7 jumps to buy the cheapest item, but will instead buy it locally at higher, but still reasonable, rate. Determine those 'reasonable rates' and you became a succesful trader.
Watching the prices of 'items of interest' in 2+ regions over time allows you to judge when its good to buy cheaply, and then haul it to a different to resell at a higher price. If you dont want to or cant haul it yourself, contract it out for a courier but remember to set the 'collateral' properly.
Thats just 2 methods, and there are others methods mentioned here and in in the market subforum, |
Tevar
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
3
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Posted - 2012.06.28 19:00:00 -
[13] - Quote
There are real life traders, bankers, financiers, and criminals in eve and there certainly isn't a SEC, Fincen, IRS, FDIC, FBI etc.. to bail you out if you get in over yer head...
Just keep repeating this to yourself:
"Don't undock what you can't aford to lose."
and good luck, trade safe. |
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