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Yaris San
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Posted - 2010.02.28 07:40:00 -
[1]
In my regular high sec mining system the offer price for Condensed Scordite is considerably lower than that of Scordite and Dense Scordite.
Why would that be?
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Kytanos Termek
Caldari Perkone
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Posted - 2010.02.28 08:23:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Kytanos Termek on 28/02/2010 08:23:03 Perhaps because whoever put it up there simply didnt care about the price he got. I was a miner a few months back, so I dont know the production/industry/trading side. But I can guess most of it is refined in to minerals and sold. I never knew anyone to actually buy raw ore.
Possibly the dude (or dudes, unrelated people do get the same ideas on occasion). Just got bored and slapped it up there. maybe you need like 10 units of it to refine and he only had 9 and didn't want to trash um. or something like that.
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Zanzbar
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Posted - 2010.02.28 08:29:00 -
[3]
99% of the items sold in game are sold by other players, and all of the items purchased are players buying those items. so if nobody has an active buy order in your station for an item it cant be quickly sold there. in a case like yours the person asking for the condensed scordite is asking a far less reasonable price then the people purchasing the other ores.
also keep in mind that these are just buy orders, they are the quickest way to sell your ore but ussualy no the most profitable, you are paying for the convenience of a quick sale. if you want to get full market value for an item you need to actualy palce a sell order in wich case other people will see your ore for sale when they are browsing the market in your region. to place a sell order you go to sell an item like normal but this time hit advanced at the bottom, this pulls up the sell order window. keep in mind that you can only place as many sell or buy orders s you ahve the skills for, and you have to wait for someone to come along and buy it from you.
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Yaris San
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Posted - 2010.02.28 08:41:00 -
[4]
I understand the order side of it - as well as the demand side. But I'm still curious as to why the offer discrepancy exists. Looking at how Scordite refines per batch of 333:
Scordite - 833 Trit 416 Pye Condensed Scordite - 875 Trit 437 Pye Massive Scordite - 916 Trit 458 Pye
I see no reason why Condensed Scordite should pay less than Scordite.
What am I missing?
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Aesynil
Caldari The Unit...
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Posted - 2010.02.28 08:56:00 -
[5]
Buy orders are like putting out fishing lines. You put up 100 orders at really low prices, that most people won't use. If ten people sell you things at that cheap price, you turn around, and sell them back to somebody else at full price. It won't get filled often, but they -do- get filled by people who don't realize they're getting ripped off, and the buyer profits.
The Unit pursues invention, manufacturing, mining, and research. Evemail us if you need anything related to Science and Industry. |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2010.02.28 09:19:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Aesynil Buy orders are like putting out fishing lines. You put up 100 orders at really low prices, that most people won't use. If ten people sell you things at that cheap price, you turn around, and sell them back to somebody else at full price. It won't get filled often, but they -do- get filled by people who don't realize they're getting ripped off, and the buyer profits.
they can be. although in trade hubs MOST buy orders are rather fair. In Jita I'd rather rightclick sell a lot of items than have to .01 people all day to get it to sell.
but off in the middle of nowhere selling to buy orders is often like just trashing the item.
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ChrisIsherwood
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Posted - 2010.02.28 09:31:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Yaris San
I see no reason why Condensed Scordite should pay less than Scordite.
What am I missing?
I doubt it has much effect, but isn't there a mission where you need to turn in scordite. In that case and station that would be demand for uncondensed but not condensed.
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Zanzbar
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Posted - 2010.02.28 09:59:00 -
[8]
its just that the people who have put up the higher offers on the other materials havent botherd to do the same with the standard scordite, nothing more. your thinking about this too hard.
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Max Godsnottlingson
Amarr MYTHIC Freelance
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Posted - 2010.02.28 12:32:00 -
[9]
One of the things you need t remember about trade in Eve, is that it is perhaps the one thing that is least game skills dependant and most player savvy dependent.
One technique used is 'fishing'. You put up a long term buy order at well below the average price, or conversly a sell at well above, then leave it for a few weeks.
The hope being that you will catch somebody who is either new to Eve and not familier with it's mechanisms, people who are careless or folks who need a quick sale/purchase and are will to take the hit. Then at the end of the sale you hope you have a small stock of whatever 'on the cheap' or sold something at above premium price. The side product of this, as you have seen, is that it can skew local markets somewhat and you end up with the situation you have identified.
This is a viable and often used real life sales technique (try buying an airline ticket at short notice and you will see)
However, what also makes this a 'problem' is that there are a number of players who try to use the technique as an out and out scam.
You often see, for example, an item whos Regional Average price is, say, 1,000,000 isk, and they will put up a buy order for 100,000 isk, in the hope to catch somebody not paying attention to what they are doing.
I'm not going to comment on the rights or wrongs of this, this is Eve after all. But if enough of these 'scam' sales are made they will eventually start to have an effect on overall average sales figue.
People have also tried to manipulate markets by putting up rediculously low buy orders or high sell orders, then have an Alt come in and fullfil the order. This is in the hope that they can deliberatly deflate or inflate a market.
Again, though unsavoury, it's all a part of Eve, and you only need to follow real life financial news to see that it also happens in real life all to often.
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Tau Cabalander
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.02.28 13:49:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Yaris San I understand the order side of it - as well as the demand side. But I'm still curious as to why the offer discrepancy exists. Looking at how Scordite refines per batch of 333:
Scordite - 833 Trit 416 Pye Condensed Scordite - 875 Trit 437 Pye Massive Scordite - 916 Trit 458 Pye
I see no reason why Condensed Scordite should pay less than Scordite.
What am I missing?
Few people bother to do the math. Fewer still bother to check the other prices.
You'll make a fine miner/refiner/trader if you keep that up.
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Khanoonian Singh
Ramshackle Industrial
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Posted - 2010.02.28 13:54:00 -
[11]
Is scordite the ore needed for the materials for war storyline mission, if so that could explain the prices.
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Downtym
Amarr Ajo Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2010.03.01 04:11:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Yaris San In my regular high sec mining system the offer price for Condensed Scordite is considerably lower than that of Scordite and Dense Scordite.
Why would that be?
Because it's called Capitalism?
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Gartel Reiman
The Athiest Syndicate Advocated Destruction
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Posted - 2010.03.01 13:14:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Yaris San In my regular high sec mining system the offer price for Condensed Scordite is considerably lower than that of Scordite and Dense Scordite.
Why would that be?
It's simply the state of the markets at this(/that) moment, nothing more, nothing less.
Chances are, the guy with the current highest order for Condensed (call it 50% of a "fair" price) has similar orders for Dense and regular Scordite too, except that on those other items other players have entered higher bids. Perhaps those players didn't put in orders for Condensed because they ran out of market slots; perhaps they looked at the volumes traded and decided it wasn't worth their time; perhaps they forgot that variant of Scordite existed; perhaps they did put better orders in, which have been completely filled and the player hasn't refreshed them yet.
In any case, it's kind of irrelevant. Right now, the highest amount of money that someone is willing to pay you in that system for Condensed Scordite is whatever you're currently offered. If this is "unfair", and well below the average, then chances are that the market just isn't developed enough there.
Well developed markets are good, simply because more competition between buyers means that there's more chance the price will be pushed up to a fair level. In this example, it means that there's much more chance several people will place "real" buy orders, up to the point they're prepared to pay. Underdeveloped markets typically have massive spreads - great if you're posting sell orders, bad if you're filling other peoples' buy orders.
If your market is underdeveloped you may be better off moving closer to a minor trade hub; making an arrangement with some other entity to buy your ore in bulk at a better price; or stockpiling your ore and then listing a bunch of it on the market (as a sell order) a little bit cheaper than the price at a naerby trade hub. In the latter case someone will likely see your offer as a kind of courier contract, and will buy up your ore, haul it to the hub and resell it.
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Toshiro GreyHawk
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Posted - 2010.03.01 17:01:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Toshiro GreyHawk on 01/03/2010 17:01:38
With hundreds of people buying & selling things it would be a surprise if you DID have a straight, logical progression in price.
That and those ore yield levels aren't all that far apart anyway.
If you are selling your ore in the system you mined it in - unless you chose that system BECAUSE it had the highest buy orders for the ore you were mining - then it probably won't have the best prices on it. Look at your market, sort buy orders by the highest price paid (if you are selling) and sell orders by the lowest price paid (if you are buying). The go to the location with the best price - assuming it isn't in Low Sec ... or ... isn't a lot farther away than you are willing to fly. Orbiting vs. Kiting Faction Schools |
Baka Lakadaka
Gallente Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
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Posted - 2010.03.02 01:16:00 -
[15]
It's little quirks like this that make for big profits.
If the Condensed Scordite is so cheap (and you have the ability to move it or refine it), buy it all up and move/refine it for a profit.
Then put a buy order up and buy more of it at even lower prices. You are NOT ripping people off, you are simply offering to buy - they have option to decline your offer.
______________________ Agony Unleashed Home of the PvP University. |
Tau Cabalander
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.03.02 03:26:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Baka Lakadaka It's little quirks like this that make for big profits.
If the Condensed Scordite is so cheap (and you have the ability to move it or refine it), buy it all up and move/refine it for a profit.
Then put a buy order up and buy more of it at even lower prices. You are NOT ripping people off, you are simply offering to buy - they have option to decline your offer.
Most people hate to haul. I don't. Those people paid for my Charon.
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Yaris San
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Posted - 2010.03.02 11:16:00 -
[17]
Just to be clear - I never said anything about 'fair' prices or any other judgment. I simply observed what I thought was an odd disjunction in the price of an ore.
One of the posters mentioned that the refined result of Condensed Scordite isn't that different from regular and Dense Scordite. Yet, the price was way, way off.
In fact, going with yet another poster's idea, I was able to offer a higher buy price (still much lower than the other Scordite prices), refine the purchased Condensed Scordite, and sell off the ore for a tidy profit.
It seems to me that if Scordite = X, (base price) then the price of Condensed Scordite should always be higher, and Dense Scordite should be higher still.
Most likely this is just a temporary fluke in the system. Someone probably mined the heck out of Condensed Scordite - fulfilled all the higher paying Buy Orders, and left the Buy Orders that are just fishing for a good deal.
Still, to me it looked like going to the pump with 92 octane more than 20 cents less than 87 octane.
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The Grimlife
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Posted - 2010.03.02 12:20:00 -
[18]
Edited by: The Grimlife on 02/03/2010 12:23:30 Yes condensed scordite should cost more than plain scordite. however its is not a iteam that is made and sold in a pos unlike wine. scordite is mined and sold be the players as wine is made and sold be npc corps.Thus players can sell scordite and other stuff at what ever price they want it sold at. like some ships. Badger's can be sold at 200.000.000 when in fact they only cost about 200.000 this is the same as buy orders some r high some r low. Thats EVE o yer one more thing in different space. different price's. If buying and selling u should really go to a market hub like Jita.
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ISellThingz
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Posted - 2010.03.02 12:48:00 -
[19]
In a perfect world, the price of Condensed Scordite should be 5% higher then Scordite, and Dense Scordite should be 10% higher then Scordite.
If they are not, then feel free to abuse it ;) (as long as it makes a profit).
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Slade Trillgon
Endless Possibilities Inc. Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2010.03.02 13:17:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Slade Trillgon on 02/03/2010 13:19:52 Sometimes miners are ready to up and move to a different area of space. They refine all their ore and they have these little bits left over that take to much room for too little profit. So what they do is hit sell item instead of putting up a sell order for a small amount of ore. Sometimes the highest regional buy order that pops up is a really low price that someone put up for these types of situations.
EDIT: Other times it is market players praying on noobs, that do not have refine skills yet so they make more money selling unrefined ore, and exploting their noobishness with how the market system works.
Slade
Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker
Please go sit in the corner, and dont forget to don the shame-on-you-hat!
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