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Lego Maniac
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2010.04.26 03:15:00 -
[1]
looking at the two ships, I've come to the conclusion that it makes more sense if they traded their optimal/falloff bonus
the wolf is slower, has a longer targeting range, only has two mids which means it cannot fit full tackle, and has more grid - all of which suggest that it is artillery oriented, but it gets a falloff bonus
CCP HERP DERP moment? __________________________________________________________
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Last Wolf
Rage For Order
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Posted - 2010.04.26 03:29:00 -
[2]
What a new and exciting idea that no one has ever suggested before! Oh no you don't! Incoming witty reply, ETA: 300 seconds! |
Lego Maniac
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2010.04.26 03:55:00 -
[3]
well for chrissake if you agree then stop making non-witty attempts at sarcasm and help me whine about it __________________________________________________________
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Eighties Special
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Posted - 2010.04.26 04:19:00 -
[4]
WARNING:
This thread has been found to violate the EVE-O Whine Act. All whines must be directed against the FOM.
Please rectify this.
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Zeba
Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company
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Posted - 2010.04.26 04:35:00 -
[5]
I would gleefully trade the optimal bonus on my jag for a tracking bonus. Oh and a falloff bonus as the mythical 4th bonus.
Originally by: CCP Zymurgist Get off the forums and go kill someone!
Originally by: Amarr Supremacist Yeah, it(Jaguar) almost has cruiser level tank and gank!
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Taja Calaren
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Posted - 2010.04.26 08:33:00 -
[6]
Actually neither of the ships needs an optimal bonus seeing the fact that the only ship that gets any use out of small artillery is the Trasher. Even if you may as well use Arties with an Falloff bonus.
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Zarnak Wulf
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Posted - 2010.04.26 12:11:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Taja Calaren Actually neither of the ships needs an optimal bonus seeing the fact that the only ship that gets any use out of small artillery is the Trasher. Even if you may as well use Arties with an Falloff bonus.
This is mostly due to the lack of a tracking bonus on the AF. If you had a ship that was capable of half the alpha of a Thrasher AND could apply most of it w/ tracking I'd fly it. Especially when you consider the signature radius is less then half and the ship has T2 resists.
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Lugalzagezi666
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Posted - 2010.04.26 12:21:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Eighties Special WARNING: This thread has been found to violate the EVE-O Whine Act. All whines must be directed against the FOM.
Haha, so true. You guys really want to make frig pvp dramiel and jaguar online?
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Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.04.26 12:52:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Zeba I would gleefully trade the optimal bonus on my jag for a tracking bonus. Oh and a falloff bonus as the mythical 4th bonus.
Would make me a new super rifter :). --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html |
Lubomir Penev
interimo
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Posted - 2010.04.26 14:37:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Lego Maniac looking at the two ships, I've come to the conclusion that it makes more sense if they traded their optimal/falloff bonus
the wolf is slower, has a longer targeting range, only has two mids which means it cannot fit full tackle, and has more grid - all of which suggest that it is artillery oriented, but it gets a falloff bonus
CCP HERP DERP moment?
Wolf doesn't need more mids because it operates with autos outside of med neuts and web range. -- 081014 : emoragequit, char transfered to a friend, 090317 : back to original owner blog |
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VanNostrum
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Posted - 2010.04.26 14:42:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Lego Maniac looking at the two ships, I've come to the conclusion that it makes more sense if they traded their optimal/falloff bonus
the wolf is slower, has a longer targeting range, only has two mids which means it cannot fit full tackle, and has more grid - all of which suggest that it is artillery oriented, but it gets a falloff bonus
CCP HERP DERP moment?
And if Wolf was changed the way you proposed, how do u expect a slow, tackleless wolf to counter other frigs that just get under the guns (arties)? How would wolf be any useful? please explain
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Pheusia
Gallente The Initiative.
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Posted - 2010.04.26 14:53:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Zeba I would gleefully trade the optimal bonus on my jag for a tracking bonus. Oh and a falloff bonus as the mythical 4th bonus.
DO WANT! Signed, Pheusia |
Lego Maniac
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2010.04.26 16:11:00 -
[13]
Originally by: VanNostrum And if Wolf was changed the way you proposed, how do u expect a slow, tackleless wolf to counter other frigs that just get under the guns (arties)? How would wolf be any useful? please explain
gangmates? you have friends right? __________________________________________________________
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Tarn Reis
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Posted - 2010.04.26 18:28:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Lego Maniac you have friends right?
Wait... Oh I get it. You're new, aren't you?
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Trader20
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Posted - 2010.04.26 18:53:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Tarn Reis
Originally by: Lego Maniac you have friends right?
Wait... Oh I get it. You're new, aren't you?
nah it sound like u are
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VanNostrum
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Posted - 2010.04.26 19:01:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Lego Maniac
Originally by: VanNostrum And if Wolf was changed the way you proposed, how do u expect a slow, tackleless wolf to counter other frigs that just get under the guns (arties)? How would wolf be any useful? please explain
gangmates? you have friends right?
uhhh by that logic, whatever the jag is lacking have your gangmate do it DURRR
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Cpt Branko
Retired Pirate Club
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Posted - 2010.04.26 19:08:00 -
[17]
Wolf would be a sortof nice arty ship IF it had non-******ed fitting (mainly CPU) and tracking for 4th bonus. I mean, the idea of fitting 280s, mwd, disruptor, a couple of gyros, a TE and a DC is just lovely.
Until you realise you're 70 CPU over limit Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
Zarnak Wulf
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Posted - 2010.04.26 19:33:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Zarnak Wulf on 26/04/2010 19:35:10
Originally by: Cpt Branko Wolf would be a sortof nice arty ship IF it had non-******ed fitting (mainly CPU) and tracking for 4th bonus. I mean, the idea of fitting 280s, mwd, disruptor, a couple of gyros, a TE and a DC is just lovely.
Until you realise you're 70 CPU over limit
The tracking is the main thing. I agree some CPU love would be nice. Enough at least to fit a scrambler. As is this is the best I can get:
Arty Wolf:
High: 280mm II x 4 Small Unstable Power Fluctuator Mid: MWD II SB II w/ Scan Resolution Low: MAPC OD II Gyro II TE II Rigs: Ancillary Current Router Projectile Collision Rig
1253 Alpha. 182 DPS. 2860 m/s. Just shy of 4k EHP but with the signature radius of 33m it's a hell of alot more survivable then the arty thrasher. Not really disagreeing with you. I'm just saying the potential is there.
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Cpt Branko
Retired Pirate Club
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Posted - 2010.04.26 20:51:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Cpt Branko on 26/04/2010 20:51:33
Originally by: Zarnak Wulf Edited by: Zarnak Wulf on 26/04/2010 19:35:10
Originally by: Cpt Branko Wolf would be a sortof nice arty ship IF it had non-******ed fitting (mainly CPU) and tracking for 4th bonus. I mean, the idea of fitting 280s, mwd, disruptor, a couple of gyros, a TE and a DC is just lovely.
Until you realise you're 70 CPU over limit
The tracking is the main thing. I agree some CPU love would be nice. Enough at least to fit a scrambler.
Some CPU would be nice is the understatement of the year tbh
But I think that's the sort of fix (tracking + say, 50 CPU and I'm not joking here) which would make the Wolf viable/useful without making it instantly better then the Jaguar, just different. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
VanNostrum
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Posted - 2010.04.26 23:12:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Zarnak Wulf
1253 Alpha. 182 DPS. 2860 m/s. Just shy of 4k EHP but with the signature radius of 33m it's a hell of alot more survivable then the arty thrasher. Not really disagreeing with you. I'm just saying the potential is there.
Except you can get 50% higher alpha with a Thrasher which is like 650-700k as opposed to Wolf being 20-25 mil. The 33m sig is irrelevant when you're paying that much money to land on 2-3 alphas on a frig. And money gone down the drain if you can't.
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Zeba
Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company
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Posted - 2010.04.26 23:14:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Zarnak Wulf Edited by: Zarnak Wulf on 26/04/2010 19:35:10
Originally by: Cpt Branko Wolf would be a sortof nice arty ship IF it had non-******ed fitting (mainly CPU) and tracking for 4th bonus. I mean, the idea of fitting 280s, mwd, disruptor, a couple of gyros, a TE and a DC is just lovely.
Until you realise you're 70 CPU over limit
The tracking is the main thing. I agree some CPU love would be nice. Enough at least to fit a scrambler. As is this is the best I can get:
Arty Wolf:
High: 280mm II x 4 Small Unstable Power Fluctuator Mid: MWD II SB II w/ Scan Resolution Low: MAPC OD II Gyro II TE II Rigs: Ancillary Current Router Projectile Collision Rig
1253 Alpha. 182 DPS. 2860 m/s. Just shy of 4k EHP but with the signature radius of 33m it's a hell of alot more survivable then the arty thrasher. Not really disagreeing with you. I'm just saying the potential is there.
Jesus Christ Superstar Do Eet CCP. Frig roams are the moast fun I have evah had pvping with others in eve and this would make it sooooooo much funner. And its not even op considering the lulz 4k ehp.
Originally by: CCP Zymurgist Get off the forums and go kill someone!
Originally by: Amarr Supremacist Yeah, it(Jaguar) almost has cruiser level tank and gank!
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Guillame Herschel
Gallente NME1
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Posted - 2010.04.26 23:37:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Lego Maniac all of which suggest that it is artillery oriented, but it gets a falloff bonus
And what makes you think that a falloff bonus is not useful for an artillery platform? It increases damage at extreme range.
You want to kite things in your Jaguar? It's not for kiting, it's for tackling in web/scram range. Kite with a AC Wolf. Then you only need a disruptor and two mids is no handicap.
The bonuses are just right, and make perfect sense for each ship.
-- Nah, that's just my Asperger's kickin' in.
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Cpt Branko
Retired Pirate Club
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Posted - 2010.04.27 00:04:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Guillame Herschel Then you only need a disruptor and two mids is no handicap.
Too bad CPU is a huge problem with the Wolf.
Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
Omara Otawan
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Posted - 2010.04.27 02:39:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Cpt Branko
Too bad CPU is a huge problem with the Wolf.
Frankly, the wolf is somewhat like a minmatar retribution. Just slap a shield buffer and suitcase on it, fill lows and rigs with damage / range mods, and let someone else do the tackle.
Having 2 resist holes just doesnt go well with the lack of cpu, and if you do get a halfdecent armor buffer dps is in the toilet.
Some ships are just made for gangs.
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Lego Maniac
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2010.04.27 03:00:00 -
[25]
Originally by: VanNostrum uhhh by that logic, whatever the jag is lacking have your gangmate do it DURRR
logic fail, I have not mentioned the Jag lacking anything
you're clearly too stupid to argue with, GTFO __________________________________________________________
˄ ____________ ˄ |
Cartheron Crust
Krazny Oktyabr Revolyutsiya
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Posted - 2010.04.27 03:57:00 -
[26]
Give jaguar and wolf their missing rifter hull tracking bonus. Then do the same for missing bonus on other AF respective hulls.
EASY ****ING FIX CCP. |
VanNostrum
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Posted - 2010.04.27 07:08:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Zeba
Originally by: VanNostrum
Except you can get 50% higher alpha with a Thrasher which is like 650-700k as opposed to Wolf being 20-25 mil. The 33m sig is irrelevant when you're paying that much money to land on 2-3 alphas on a frig. And money gone down the drain if you can't.
fail solo argument logic is fail
Who said anyhing about solo? With that suggested wolf you'll get blown in under 15 seconds. Cruiser/BC will 1-2 volley you, ceptors/fast frigs will get under your guns before you take a 2nd shot, 5xsmall drones will eat you as you have no tank. 4k ehp on a 35 mil ship with no insurance for 1-2 successive shots? No thanks Fail game experience is fail. You fail.
Originally by: Lego Maniac
Originally by: VanNostrum uhhh by that logic, whatever the jag is lacking have your gangmate do it DURRR
logic fail, I have not mentioned the Jag lacking anything
you're clearly too stupid to argue with, GTFO
Oh look, the OP admits there's nothing wrong with the ship but it just appeared to him that the Jaguar can be better. What, you just trained minnie frigs V? What a stupid dooosh. GTFO.
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Cpt Branko
Retired Pirate Club
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Posted - 2010.04.27 07:46:00 -
[28]
Edited by: Cpt Branko on 27/04/2010 07:46:22
Originally by: Omara Otawan
Frankly, the wolf is somewhat like a minmatar retribution. Just slap a shield buffer and suitcase on it, fill lows and rigs with damage / range mods, and let someone else do the tackle.
Having 2 resist holes just doesnt go well with the lack of cpu, and if you do get a halfdecent armor buffer dps is in the toilet.
It still has terribad CPU even for that. Sure, if you fit ACs you can cram a gyro, a TE and a named DC (and you're out of CPU after this), if you fit arties then you're going to need a co-pro.
Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
Lego Maniac
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2010.04.27 08:49:00 -
[29]
Originally by: VanNostrum Oh look, the OP admits there's nothing wrong with the ship but it just appeared to him that the Jaguar can be better. What, you just trained minnie frigs V? What a stupid dooosh. GTFO.
the point of the thread is to adjust the two ships so that the wolf has a different role instead of the current situation in which neither ship can fit artillery in a satisfactory manner; you clearly have no comprehension skills even though it was laid out very clearly in the first post
seriously, go back to school kid __________________________________________________________
˄ ____________ ˄ |
VanNostrum
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Posted - 2010.04.27 09:09:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Lego Maniac
Originally by: VanNostrum Oh look, the OP admits there's nothing wrong with the ship but it just appeared to him that the Jaguar can be better. What, you just trained minnie frigs V? What a stupid dooosh. GTFO.
the point of the thread is to adjust the two ships so that the wolf has a different role instead of the current situation in which neither ship can fit artillery in a satisfactory manner; you clearly have no comprehension skills even though it was laid out very clearly in the first post
seriously, go back to school kid
And what other frig can fit full rack of highest tier long range guns with tackle and tank? Just cos Jag has good tank and speed it has to have falloff too now? Perhaps you don't understand the game mechanics at all and nothing was laid out clearly in the first post except that it just seemed to you that Jag should swap bonuses with wolf, without thinking how stupid it would leave the Wolf to fit. OP is nothing but a silly "buff the ship i want" post.
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