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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
Seven Europa
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Posted - 2010.05.23 05:26:00 -
[541]
Love the PI system, great job, as already mentioned, two things that would make this much much better:
1: Upgradable CC. Possible solution: When a CC is decommissioned the colony is not abandoned immediately, it stops working and the player has a certain amount of time (24 hours?) to replace the old CC with a new one (This way it is still necessary to buy improved CC's etc.)
2: Making it possible to select multiple extractors and giving the same command to all of them. Possible solution: CTRL-SHIFT click on several extractors, the extractors cluster's UI is exactly the same but it shows average values for the survey, and overall values for routing. All the selected extractors will perform the same installed cycle and will route the materials to the same selected pin.
P.S. : point 2 seems very important to me, as it is not a big deal for a small colony, but it gets really frustrating as the colony gets bigger.
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Kaizer Douken
Looney Toons.
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Posted - 2010.05.23 08:10:00 -
[542]
Edited by: Kaizer Douken on 23/05/2010 08:11:12 At 1st I though that the Command Center was upgradable, I spent like 5min. searching the upgrade button how to upgrade it. At the end I concluded that i needed to have the next lvl command center in my cargo and the skills for the option to appear. Now by reading this I know there's no such thing which is a surprise. other than that looks great.
Originally by: Imran Tam if your sausage looked anything like that, you should have checked the expiration date.
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Tub Chil
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Posted - 2010.05.23 09:02:00 -
[543]
upgradable CC would be great. I just don't see reason for not doing so and interconnection between other players colonies, can we make it? one guy extracts, another reprocesses, third one launches..
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ITTigerClawIK
Amarr Galactic Rangers Galactic-Rangers
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Posted - 2010.05.23 15:32:00 -
[544]
i would jsut like to point out that basic command center is compleatly pointless even to try the thing out as the spaceport to bring anything up needs 2 times more CPU than the max CPU useage the center has making one wounder why the thing exists at all.. make it upgradable at least or remove it entirely from the game
Sig space reclaimed in the name of me -courtesy of Tiggy ([email protected]) |
Wezzord
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Posted - 2010.05.23 17:29:00 -
[545]
Originally by: ITTigerClawIK i would jsut like to point out that basic command center is compleatly pointless even to try the thing out as the spaceport to bring anything up needs 2 times more CPU than the max CPU useage the center has making one wounder why the thing exists at all.. make it upgradable at least or remove it entirely from the game
You don't need a spaceport to launch things up, only to send things to a planet. You can launch your stuff from the cc
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Jim Luc
Caldari Rule of Five Lucky Starbase Syndicate
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Posted - 2010.05.23 21:36:00 -
[546]
Originally by: Wezzord
Originally by: ITTigerClawIK i would jsut like to point out that basic command center is compleatly pointless even to try the thing out as the spaceport to bring anything up needs 2 times more CPU than the max CPU useage the center has making one wounder why the thing exists at all.. make it upgradable at least or remove it entirely from the game
You don't need a spaceport to launch things up, only to send things to a planet. You can launch your stuff from the cc
I think his point wasn't exactly spaceport, but rather how useless basic CC units are - which I agree they are pointless without the ability to upgrade.
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SiliconWolf
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Posted - 2010.05.24 02:14:00 -
[547]
Hello?? CCP?? SOMEONE ANSWER THE THREAD!!!
You need: 1. multi-restart extractors ability. Don't care how you do it, just do it. 2. Fix extractor routes so they do not reset. 3. Powergrid and CPU upgrade without losing entire colony. Don't care if it's CC upgrade or some sort of extra structure you buy/upgrade. 4. Colony-at-a-glance status window.
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Snabbik Shigen
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Posted - 2010.05.24 02:48:00 -
[548]
Looks like we're still going to go into launch with the stupid, make it over-complicated for no good reason at all, decision to make the 4 different extractor durations run on different cycle times.
Which means that instead of being able to sensibly estimate your link capacities in cases where you have a desire to use different extractor durations, you're going to have to get really good at simple math.
We went through almost a month worth of beta testing where the extractor cycles were *always* 15 minutes in duration and only the amounts changed if you picked different durations. This made things nice and straightforward so that you could easily manage your colony links. At the last minute, someone decided to change the cycle times?
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Wezzord
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Posted - 2010.05.24 13:40:00 -
[549]
Originally by: SiliconWolf Edited by: SiliconWolf on 24/05/2010 02:44:55 Hello?? CCP?? SOMEONE ANSWER THE THREAD!!!
You need: 1. multi-restart extractors ability. Don't care how you do it, just do it. 2. Fix extractor routes so they do not reset. 3. Powergrid and CPU upgrade without losing entire colony. Don't care if it's CC upgrade or some sort of extra structure you buy/upgrade.
You can count on my support for those
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Zedia Zhane
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Posted - 2010.05.24 14:58:00 -
[550]
Originally by: Snabbik Shigen Looks like we're still going to go into launch with the stupid, make it over-complicated for no good reason at all, decision to make the 4 different extractor durations run on different cycle times.
I have a hard time believing CCP could *possibly* be this incredibly stupid. If this goes live, then all the planetary production will be run by macros which restart the extractors every half-hour. Macro planet management will become 100x more common than macro ice-mining... which is already rampant.
Instead I choose to believe that CCP is currently working on some resource deposit functionality that is not yet in game. My guess would be they haven't finished the code to actually make resource deposits deplete over time and go away. Until that code is ready, they are leaving the current deposit system in place. At least the current system gives testers a lot of flexibility when it comes to resource and production planning.
Remember that PI has been delayed until June 8th. Which is a good thing, since they're not giving us CC upgrade capability. That way you can train Command Center Upgrades before CCs are available and not have to worry about upgrading. It also means they've got until June 8th to implement actual resource deposits into the game. I advocate patience until we get closer to that date. What we're seeing on SiSi is still 2 weeks away from finished.
On the other hand, I also advocate canceling account subscriptions if they do go live with the current system. Something that ridiculously stupid, which encourages cheating that much, isn't something I'm readily willing to put up with. If they do frack things up that badly, I'll probably sell off all my alt characters, convert the ISK into PLEX for my main, and cut back to just that one account... And stop paying for any more game time.
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Minuki Zedra
Omega Engineering Inc. R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2010.05.24 15:49:00 -
[551]
As others have stated above, Extractor deposits are something I don't feel are currently finished. The different Extractor times and durations do over-complicate things.
My suggestion would be to remove the deposit durations - the 30 minute, 5 hour, 23 hour and 96 hour - and just have four 30 minute cycle durations with increasing amounts of resource gathered, which the player can change at will (perhaps with a cool-down timer), representing how aggressively that resource is being depleted. Or, a type-in box of x resources gathered per cycle out of y maximum that can be gathered per cycle.
Every 30 minute cycle, the amount each Extractor gathers would be deducted from the deposit maximum value(s) on the planets surface, and the Extractor would recalculate what it gathers. The Routing of Resources from Extractors is also automatically adjusted.
Every 30 minutes, the deposit minimum/maximum values across the planets surface recover at whatever rate is deemed appropriate.
The player would need to keep an eye on the amount being extracted to determine whether they should be cutting back on how fast they are gathering that resource unless they run out and need to relocate their extractors.
Perhaps a graph could be called up from each extractor showing the change in resource deposit amount per cycle, over a set length of time (such as over the last 24 hours.)
This would mean a certain level of micro-management would be necessary, so you could adjust the Extractors to the level of Resources you (and those nearby) are gathering, but not being able to log in every evening, day, or week won't mean you are completely shut down unless something changes unexpectedly.
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Zedia Zhane
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Posted - 2010.05.24 16:26:00 -
[552]
What I'd like to see is this:
Each planet has a certain number of deposits. Each deposit has a certain amount of resources. The richer the deposit, the more resources it has, and the faster the base extraction rate is.
Each extractor has a very short 'optimal range' and a much longer 'falloff' for the distance from which it can extract resources from a deposit. Within optimal, it can extract resources at the base rate for the deposit. Once you go into falloff, the rate of extraction drops off from that maximum to zero - just like the hit probability for turrets in their falloff ranges. When you scan for a deposit, it shows you all deposits that the extractor can use and the net extraction rate for each deposit, for that extractor. You just pick one. Cycle time is fixed at 30 minutes. (Having a really short optimal would make the Planetology skills very useful.)
As a resource gets harvested from a deposit, not only does the remaining amount of resources drop, but the base extraction rate also drops. Base extraction rates should range from X to Y (depending on the remaining resources in the deposit). X, the minimum rate, should be a reasonable rate, to give players an incentive to completely exhaust a deposit. At that point, it would despawn, cleaning up the planet for new deposits to form.
Each planet has a maximum cap of the total amount of each resource on it. From time to time, if the actual amount of a particular resource on the planet is sufficiently below the cap, a new deposit will spawn at an appropriate location on the planet. The spawn rate should be fixed, independent of the number of colonies or extractors on a planet. That way a heavily harvested planet can actually be stripped bare of certain resources. People would then have to wait for new deposits to spawn - and when they do, they are likely to be stripped clean very quickly.
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asdfadfadsf
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Posted - 2010.05.24 19:54:00 -
[553]
Originally by: Kaizer Douken Edited by: Kaizer Douken on 23/05/2010 08:11:12 At 1st I though that the Command Center was upgradable, I spent like 5min. searching the upgrade button how to upgrade it. At the end I concluded that i needed to have the next lvl command center in my cargo and the skills for the option to appear. Now by reading this I know there's no such thing which is a surprise. other than that looks great.
Yes please make the CC upgradable
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PandaStratton
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Posted - 2010.05.24 20:18:00 -
[554]
is their any way to shut off the halographic image of the structure when you click on it... its good looking and all but it gets in the way...
another idea is to be able to select all extractors or shift click on the extractors you want and make it so i can turn all my extractors on without taking 20 min to turn every individual one on.. sence im mining the same thing...
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Doomed Predator
GK inc. Panda Team
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Posted - 2010.05.24 20:19:00 -
[555]
Things that would make PI way easier to use: -mouse hover over the scan button shows what's currently being scanned for -mouse hover over extractors show what is being extracted and how long until depletion -mouse hover over processor shows what's being made
And a question;can you have more than 1 CC per planet? The 'Fendahlian Collective' strikes again |
Maewei Balducci
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Posted - 2010.05.25 02:10:00 -
[556]
a thing i didn't think about before, as i done all my test on systems where there is noone ; we can know if a planet is occupied when there is a customs office (so when at least 1 player have a launchpad on it), but we have no way telling HOW MANY people use this planet. if a planet don't have any customs off. then it's really good but... if it has only one player on it it's also good. but if it has 7 players it's not. but we can't see the difference for now. but knowing that will be really important in 2 weeks. so you need to add something like "command center on this planet : XX" on the planet view.
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menacemyth
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Posted - 2010.05.25 07:11:00 -
[557]
I don't really wanna guess what's gonna be part of Tyrannis. But here is my final wishlist:
1. If you have the resources in storage to build 4 tier 3 products, once routed you still only get 3. I just tested this again today. I anticipated 66 total, 22 hourly cycles. I only got 63 when my processor went "waiting for resources" Houdini stole the other!
2. Resources need to deplete. There should be pros and cons of the various extraction options that provide balance. Extractors cost much more but can be moved. Shorter extraction times increase risk of extractor having a "mishap". Chance of this happening can be tweaked or mathematically calculated for balance. Would love to see someone doing all 5hr cycles and an extractor breaks that everything was routed through
I know it's a little late for wishes, but issue #1 was posted toward the beginning of this thread
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Anela Cistine
Amarr GoonWaffe SOLODRAKBANSOLODRAKBANSO
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Posted - 2010.05.25 22:09:00 -
[558]
Originally by: Jim Luc
Originally by: Wezzord
Originally by: ITTigerClawIK i would jsut like to point out that basic command center is compleatly pointless even to try the thing out as the spaceport to bring anything up needs 2 times more CPU than the max CPU useage the center has making one wounder why the thing exists at all.. make it upgradable at least or remove it entirely from the game
You don't need a spaceport to launch things up, only to send things to a planet. You can launch your stuff from the cc
I think his point wasn't exactly spaceport, but rather how useless basic CC units are - which I agree they are pointless without the ability to upgrade.
They aren't useless any more than Civilian guns are useless, they just have very limited use. They are dirt cheap and require no skills to use, so if you are mildly curious about PI they are a low-effort, nearly free way to try out the interface and see if you hate it or not. If you hate it, at least you didn't waste so much as a single skill point on it.
I can also imagine them adding PI Career Agents, who might give out a Basic CC and the Remote Sensing skillbook as part of the tutorial. ("Remote" is a misnomer, if you don't have that skill you can't scan at all, even if you are in orbit and have already dropped a CC. If you don't have that skill you have to drop your extractors completely blind.) This would let newbies try it out for free, the same way other Career Agents give them ships and equipment to let them try out combat, mining, production and exploration for free. A basic CC is less worthless than, say, the Civilian Salvager they give you.
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Gil Warden
Gallente Priory of Empire Wayfarer Stellar Initiative
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Posted - 2010.05.26 00:49:00 -
[559]
Originally by: Jim Luc
Originally by: Wezzord
Originally by: ITTigerClawIK i would jsut like to point out that basic command center is compleatly pointless even to try the thing out as the spaceport to bring anything up needs 2 times more CPU than the max CPU useage the center has making one wounder why the thing exists at all.. make it upgradable at least or remove it entirely from the game
You don't need a spaceport to launch things up, only to send things to a planet. You can launch your stuff from the cc
I think his point wasn't exactly spaceport, but rather how useless basic CC units are - which I agree they are pointless without the ability to upgrade.
It takes only a few hours to get that skill to 3, then you can have fun.
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SiliconWolf
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Posted - 2010.05.26 01:55:00 -
[560]
Edited by: SiliconWolf on 26/05/2010 01:55:41 Ok, patch notes says that there is a CC upgrade skill. So CCP has been listening to us...they just didn't want to TALK to us. Fine, whatever.
Also added are Planetology and Advanced Planetology... Dunno if this means that resources will move, and/or extractors move, and/or the gave up and turned this into a hybrid of asteroid and moon mining. My guess is that they went with door #3.
Would a dev PLEASE get back to us and tell us what has been locked down and what we can still give feedback on???
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Minuki Zedra
Omega Engineering Inc. R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2010.05.26 11:14:00 -
[561]
Originally by: SiliconWolf Ok, patch notes says that there is a CC upgrade skill. So CCP has been listening to us...they just didn't want to TALK to us. Fine, whatever.
Also added are Planetology and Advanced Planetology... Dunno if this means that resources will move, and/or extractors move, and/or the gave up and turned this into a hybrid of asteroid and moon mining. My guess is that they went with door #3.
Would a dev PLEASE get back to us and tell us what has been locked down and what we can still give feedback on???
Command Center Upgrades, Planetology and Advanced Planetology are not recent additions... they have been available skills on Test for quite some time.
Whether you can upgrade already placed Command Centers on planets without demolishing your entire previous network first... that is the question.
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Xoair
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Posted - 2010.05.26 15:36:00 -
[562]
planetology and adv planetology have been on the test server a long time. Patch notes say they add more bands to the resource density map. So you can get better accuracy on where the dense deposits are really.
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Cadde
Gallente 221st Century Warfare
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Posted - 2010.05.27 02:48:00 -
[563]
There seems to be two things that people are commonly mistaken about as of late...
Cycle times that complicates things and makes PI a macro only activity.
First and foremost, what makes PI less macro friendly by making all cycle times 15 minutes long? Even at 15 minute cycles you are going to have macros running for people who only care about making isk rather than playing the game. A macro doesn't care about cycle times, they could be 10 second or 24 hour cycle times. Macros would work either way.
The real benefit of having shorter cycle times is that those who want resources NOWÖ can get them faster (5 minutes i assume?) and get a production going. In cases where you need a higher rate of production shorter cycle times are going to be beneficial, it also includes more work to maintain the production line and that is where a macro would benefit but that doesn't detract from the fact you run the cycle time that you can afford to run timewise. Mining asteroids is just as bad as you have to make sure all your lasers are munching the rocks and your cargohold has enough room for the next cycle. When rocks pop you have to target new rocks and you might need to fight off belt rats and in 0.0 you need to keep an eagle eye on local. Macros shine just as much in this field as they would in PI.
The only real danger here is PI can't be monitored by us players to determine if the player is using a macro so we can whack him because he's AFK.
Are deposits gonna run dry?
The first iteration of PI i tested on SISI had resources running out. In fact, they ran out after a single cycle at any rate! That's how little resource there was on the highsec planet i initially tested. Then came a change to resources that gave us what seemed an endless supply of resource, but they are depleting... Currently it seems that the best deposits can give you a few weeks of hardcore PI stripmining and in my opinion that's a bit much. Maybe from a profitability perspective planets need to have these huge deposits but if that is the case they might wanna increase the yield from extractors so these deposits dry out faster. It feels rather pointless to have a good hotspot that will last you for several weeks of gameplay and makes PI even more boring and macro friendly.
So yes, the deposits are affected already but you barely notice it because they are so huge. The only thing that needs changing is so that even the best of all deposits in the known eve universe will run dry after some 4-5 days if you put EVERYTHING you can on it extractor wise and run the shortest cycles.
My opinions belong to me, you can't have them!
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Zedia Zhane
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Posted - 2010.05.27 06:28:00 -
[564]
VERY SIMPLE QUESTION:
There is a column on the extractor interface that is labeled "Resource Depletes In". What do the times listed in that column represent? Do they have anything to do with the rate at which resources actually deplete?
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CptVugla
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Posted - 2010.05.27 08:09:00 -
[565]
I was wondering... when command centers will be available on market?
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HeadWar
Gratuitous Corp
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Posted - 2010.05.27 15:01:00 -
[566]
Originally by: Zedia Zhane VERY SIMPLE QUESTION:
There is a column on the extractor interface that is labeled "Resource Depletes In". What do the times listed in that column represent? Do they have anything to do with the rate at which resources actually deplete?
That is the time until the extractor stops working, and you need to do a new survey.
I guess you could say that they have some connection to the depletion rate, since a lower time there generally means a faster extraction rate, but as far as I know we have no details on exactly how this depletion works. --- Не поговорите русского. F1, F2, F3... |
Rell Mayer
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Posted - 2010.05.27 17:09:00 -
[567]
Please make white ice planets darker.
It's such a pain to use PI on this type of planet. Can't tell if stuff is linked or not at first glance.
Trying to work on top of a darkened heat map doesn't really help at all.
-R
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Khaymann Draven
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.05.28 05:19:00 -
[568]
does anyone know if there is a planet respwn and if so how often
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Oculi Magni
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Posted - 2010.05.29 15:07:00 -
[569]
What about PI in w-space ? Will there be orbiting planetary customs office's ? Or how will we be able to import stuff onto planets.
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Anela Cistine
Amarr GoonWaffe SOLODRAKBANSOLODRAKBANSO
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Posted - 2010.05.29 23:56:00 -
[570]
Originally by: Oculi Magni What about PI in w-space ? Will there be orbiting planetary customs office's ? Or how will we be able to import stuff onto planets.
Customs offices appear as soon as anyone builds a spaceport.
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