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vespuliini
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Posted - 2010.05.07 12:58:00 -
[1]
Rookie Caldari pilot looking for some tips. Im using Merlin frigate at the moment but thinking about buying a new ship soon for Lv1-Lv2 missions. Would Cormorant be a good choice or should i just stick with Merlin and go straight to cruisers?
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BeanBagKing
Ch3mic4l Warfare
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Posted - 2010.05.07 13:07:00 -
[2]
Gallente pilot here, never few caldari ships in lv1/2, but as a general answer, you can go either way. If you lack the isk then feel free to pick up a destroyer and fly it for a while. If you are good on isk then skipping straight to cruisers is fine.
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Lonestar Antares
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.05.07 13:31:00 -
[3]
Personally, I thought Destroyers were the most fun ships I've flown to date.
Theyre manuverable, fast and pack a wicked wallop! I cut my teeth on the gallente catalyst and flown all 4 and thought the least useful was the amaar destroyer, the most useful was the minnie thrasher(7 arties plus dual overdrives, shield, burner and cap booster...I mean, orbiting speed tank with 30km+ range awesomeness =) ). I thought the cormy was useful only in that you could fit a decent active shield tank but its too slow and clumsy.
There's nothing wrong with cross training a bit. But definately fly each class of ship. Dont skip. Each class comes with its own unique experience.
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Louis deGuerre
Gallente Amicus Morte Shock an Awe
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Posted - 2010.05.07 13:44:00 -
[4]
Note that NPC cruisers in L2 missions can sometimes make short work of your destroyer as you have a big signature radius (i.e. are easy to hit) and have little tanking ability. A cruiser in a L2 is definately easier to fly (as it can tank). That said, a dessie has amazing firepower and makes L1 missions a cakewalk. Great for anti-frigate PVP as well. Sol: A microwarp drive? In a battleship? Are you insane? They arenĘt built for this! Clear Skies - The Movie
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Merouk Baas
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.05.07 14:05:00 -
[5]
From what I remember, the Caldari cruisers are a bit specialized - they don't have the equivalent of a Gallente Vexor which can be fitted for anything from mining to several kinds of combat.
So, if you go with cruisers you'll probably need to train up your missile skills and go with a Caracal, as the Moa is really designed for long-range sniping, the Osprey is a mining cruiser, and the Blackbird is an electronics warfare platform.
Some L2 missions can indeed kill a destroyer really fast. Destroyers are glass cannons; they have nice firepower, but their big signature radii mean they take more damage than frigates. Even in some L1 missions you'll see this if you fly a Merlin vs. the destroyer. Signature radius matters a lot in missile combat; you can get 50% damage reduction in the frigate, while the destroyer will take the full blunt of the attack.
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Lonestar Antares
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.05.07 14:22:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Louis deGuerre Note that NPC cruisers in L2 missions can sometimes make short work of your destroyer as you have a big signature radius (i.e. are easy to hit) and have little tanking ability. A cruiser in a L2 is definately easier to fly (as it can tank). That said, a dessie has amazing firepower and makes L1 missions a cakewalk. Great for anti-frigate PVP as well.
If you can get some distance between you and the initial waves when you jump in....and the almost 400 m/s of the thrasher...with A/B, almost 800...helps greatly, then you can easily tank the damage with a small shield booster in conjunction with a cap booster 150 running. Those L2 cruisers are pretty squishy =)
If that fails, do get the cormorant. Put a MEDIUM shield booster on it and 2 mission specific hardeners and the cap booster. Add a small armor repairer and your choice of guns plus a small missle launcher with defender missles (they dont do much but occasionally, they stop some damage). I have done VERY difficult l2 missions in this (those #$%^@$ mercenary missions where you get hit by 10+ missles every few seconds). You cant do much damage but you will also take very little damage at the same time.
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Kaian Voskhod
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Posted - 2010.05.07 14:29:00 -
[7]
Caldaries are simple at the begining.
You can choose between missiles or hybrid. IMO, you should choose missiles for the beginning.
So, first use a Kestrel for L1/L2, then a caracal for L2/L3, then a drake for L3/L4 (great ship); then a raven for L4 and for L4 bashing, use a torp golem.
You have here the next few years of skill planning =)
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Gartel Reiman
The Athiest Syndicate Advocated Destruction
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Posted - 2010.05.07 14:36:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Lonestar Antares I thought the cormy was useful only in that you could fit a decent active shield tank but its too slow and clumsy.
It does get insane bonuses to range, though. You can get 103km optimal with 150mm rails, Spike and three range mods. Admittedly these figures are beyond the reach of newer players, and completely useless in missions, but it does indicate the potential of the Catalyst. Being able to use antimatter from 20km (in a sensible setup) is definitely feasible, and that's a useful ability that makes up for the lack of damage bonus and lowslots.
I agree in general that destroyers are a very fun ship class; plenty of power and mobility, and often a small enough tank that the only sensible way to survive is killing everything that moves!
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Solomar Espersei
Suddenly Ninjas Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
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Posted - 2010.05.07 14:38:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Kaian Voskhod ...So, first use a Kestrel for L1/L2, then a caracal for L2/L3, then a drake for L3/L4 (great ship); then a raven for L4 and for L4 bashing, use a torp golem.
If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Pretty much follow this and you're on your way to carebear billions. Of course, you'll be flying the same ship as everyone else if that means anything to you. As an aside, I see more mission runners upgrading into the Caldari Navy Raven or Tengu rather than the Golem as a step up from the Raven.
all the best, solomar |
Lonestar Antares
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.05.07 14:44:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Lonestar Antares on 07/05/2010 14:45:08
Originally by: Gartel Reiman
Originally by: Lonestar Antares I thought the cormy was useful only in that you could fit a decent active shield tank but its too slow and clumsy.
It does get insane bonuses to range, though. You can get 103km optimal with 150mm rails, Spike and three range mods.
103 KM!
Do tell, wise one. Whats a spike? what range mods? Is there some crazy stack going on with the 50% bonus?
How do you target at that range? Damn....my BC can only do 50km with artilleries. See? Thats why I love this game. Been playing for almost a year and I still have so much to learn
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Cate Fenring
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.05.07 14:49:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Kaian Voskhod IMO, you should choose missiles for the beginning.
So, first use a Kestrel for L1/L2, then a caracal for L2/L3, then a drake for L3/L4 (great ship); then a raven for L4 and for L4 bashing, use a torp golem.
You have here the next few years of skill planning =)
I agree with this, it's the best way to go as missiles are very good for PvE anyway (and most good Caldari ships are missile boats). The Kestrel is the best rookie L1 mission frigate hands down as it's a nice long range ship - missiles always hit and you don't have to train 2 weapon systems as with the Merlin or Rifter. I never understood why CCP made so many dual weapon T1 frigates as it's very skill intensive and also requires a lot of calculating optimal ranges, not really what you'd expect for rookie ships.
Of course let no-one stop you from experimenting a bit. L1 is easy with most ships (especially if you use long range weapons), L2 is doable with a frigate or destroyer but there's some very nasty missions where you spawn in the middle of a group of missile cruisers and then it's really needed to be able to tank a bit.
Good luck!
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Sonya Kranz
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Posted - 2010.05.07 14:50:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Sonya Kranz on 07/05/2010 14:52:51 Spike is tech II long range ammo, and range mods are for example sensor boosters for locking range, tracking enhancers and tracking computers for better tracking and range, and offcourse the damamge mods.
and yeah stick with the kestrel -> raven line of ships, thisll allow you to focus on missile skills and shield tanking in the beginning, getting better results quickly instead of training a bit of everything.
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Louis deGuerre
Gallente Amicus Morte Shock an Awe
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Posted - 2010.05.07 14:54:00 -
[13]
Example of Catalyst awesomeness (my preferred version, not saying this is the ultimate fit) :
T1 Catalyst Destroyer (Solo 'Lone Ranger' Sniper version)
This setup is meant for solo roams and gatecamping. The trick with this setup is engaging at range (45 km is best). With the spike ammo you have an optimal range of 44.4 km and 82 DPS / 203 volley damage. Alternatively use iron ammo (40.4 km and 58 DPS / 127 volley damage). If you get into trouble (enemy manages to close range) switch to javelin ammo for an optimal range of 13.5 km and 130 DPS / 356 volley damage. Alternatively use antimatter ammo (18.4 km and 114 DPS / 305 volley damage). You'll have a small tank to support you for a bit. The sensor booster (without scripts) gives you a targeting range of 51.5 km and about 2.6 sec lock time for a frigate. If you want to increase range even farther with a targeting script you have 63.4 km targeting range and 3.3 sec lock time for a frigate.
With max skills: Effective HP : 5.898 Firepower : 89 (spike, estimated) Volley : 213 (spike, estimated) Speed 320 m/s - 678m/s with AB on. Cap last 1m 2s with everything on.
Low : 1 * Small Armor Repairer II 1 * Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II 1 * Damage Control II
Med : 1 * 1MN Afterburner II 1 * Sensor Booster II (+ optional targeting script)
High : 7 * 125mm Railgun II, Spike ammo
Drones : 1 * Hobgoblin II
Finally, you can turn this into an 'interceptor killer' platform for your fleet. The 125mm guns are very accurate and the destroyer itself gives even more tracking speed bonuses. Change the fit like this :
Low : 2 * Tracking Enhancer II 1 * Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Med : 1 * Tracking Computer (+ tracking speed script) 1 * Sensor Booster II (+ optional targeting script)
It is now an inhumanly accurate sniping platform (in exchange for loss of tank and speed) capable of hitting interceptors at full speed. Sol: A microwarp drive? In a battleship? Are you insane? They arenĘt built for this! Clear Skies - The Movie
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Culmen
Caldari Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2010.05.07 14:59:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Lonestar Antares
Do tell, wise one. Whats a spike? what range mods? Is there some crazy stack going on with the 50% bonus?
Spike is Tech II long range railgun ammo, that does crazy stack.
You increase range by fitting sensor boosters (probably using scripts as well) or signal amplifiers
also Here is a fit for a 103km sniper corm, FOR EXAMPLE USE ONLY, DO NOT FLY INTO COMBAT [Cormorant, Sniper] Micro Auxiliary Power Core I
Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range
150mm Railgun II, Spike S 150mm Railgun II, Spike S 150mm Railgun II, Spike S 150mm Railgun II, Spike S 150mm Railgun II, Spike S 150mm Railgun II, Spike S 150mm Railgun II, Spike S [empty high slot]
Small Algid Hybrid Administrations Unit I Small Ionic Field Projector I Small Ionic Field Projector I
109km targeting, 103 km optimal.
Also suicidal because it lacks BOTH propulsion and tanking mods. On one hand that ceptor pilot won't know what hit him, on the other hand, neither will you. and further more why do i even need a sig? |
Lonestar Antares
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.05.07 15:05:00 -
[15]
Man, this thread makes me want to go back to doing l2's so I can fly destroyers again <sigh>
=)
Nothing like kicking butt and taking names in a cheap, expendable but fast and nimble little ship....especially with 103km range. Wow.
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LonTas 5
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.05.07 23:00:00 -
[16]
Destros are cheap, agile, and strong. Bbbuuttt, they dont have a strong tank compared to cruisers nor the DPS of cruisers. thus, if you can afford a cruiser go for it. Try getting the caracal. One percent people who have useful information. Nintey- nine people who have nothing to do but try and annoy you. Welcome to the forums! |
Assyrinja
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Posted - 2010.05.08 10:56:00 -
[17]
Originally by: LonTas 5 Destros are cheap, agile, and strong. Bbbuuttt, they dont have a strong tank compared to cruisers nor the DPS of cruisers. thus, if you can afford a cruiser go for it. Try getting the caracal.
I made most of my Level 1 missions with a Cormorant and was glad about the superior firepower compared with a frigate. I also started Level 2 missions with it and lost it in the "blockade" mission within minutes. A very good ship for Level 2 missions is the ugly Moa. I prefer that one to a Caracal
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Foxfrost
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.05.10 10:08:00 -
[18]
Well you've probably gone and picked yourself up a new ship by now anyway - but you get a Cormorant (destroyer) as a mission reward for the advanced military tutorial. Don't go wasting money on buying one =3
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Toshiro GreyHawk
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Posted - 2010.05.11 09:34:00 -
[19]
A Destroyer is more capable than a frigate.
The training time for hybrids themselves is trivial and you can get by with fairly crappy gunnery skills - because you're in a Destroyer.
Let see ...
[Cormorant, Cheap]
Low:
Over Drive Injector (cause the Cormorant is slow)
Mids:
AB (preferably Cold Gas Arc Jet) Small Shield Booster Small Shield Exender Whatever - tracking module ... doesn't matter ... a Shield Recharger will fit and improves your recharge rate - so you don't need the booster as much)
High:
150mm (I use Antimater below 20km and Iridium above) 150mm 150mm 150mm 150mm Empty Empty Empty
No rigs.
That fit will own any Level I mission if you kite it.
Get the rats agro Turn on the AB Keep out of their range by turing the AB on and off Blow them up
The Level I missions Gone Berzerk, Worlds Collide, Blockade (kill the stasis tower first) - are all trivial in the above fit.
Orbiting vs. Kiting Faction Schools |
Baneken
Gallente Aseveljet Sev3rance
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Posted - 2010.05.11 10:44:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Lonestar Antares Edited by: Lonestar Antares on 07/05/2010 14:45:08
Originally by: Gartel Reiman
Originally by: Lonestar Antares I thought the cormy was useful only in that you could fit a decent active shield tank but its too slow and clumsy.
It does get insane bonuses to range, though. You can get 103km optimal with 150mm rails, Spike and three range mods.
103 KM!
Do tell, wise one. Whats a spike? what range mods? Is there some crazy stack going on with the 50% bonus?
How do you target at that range? Damn....my BC can only do 50km with artilleries. See? Thats why I love this game. Been playing for almost a year and I still have so much to learn
For short you stuff sensor boosters with scripts then you add up tracking computers to get optimal/fall off far enough which ever is bigger for your guns for rails we fit for optimal range. Then you load in spike which is a long range T2 ammo and rather useless for anything else, most of the time you're better off with navy thorium then with spike because of the draw backs, especially when missioning.
For example this Hyperion here has an optimal of 168km + 49km fall off meaning in can actually try to shoot something as far as 250km (double fall off though) but isn't very effective at it. Current range is for 180km but one more sebo would boost targeting range to 250km's which would be a waste considering the ships actual weapon range.
[Hyperion, Rail hype] True Sansha Armor Thermic Hardener True Sansha Armor EM Hardener True Sansha Armor Kinetic Hardener True Sansha Armor Explosive Hardener 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Damage Control II
Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800
425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L Large Remote Armor Repair System II
Large Ancillary Current Router I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Hammerhead II x5
http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html |
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