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Graelyn
Amarr Deus Imperiosus Acies
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Posted - 2010.05.18 22:06:00 -
[1]
To the Governments of New Eden:
Every major government in the New Eden Starcluster has been under attack.
These attacks have been ongoing, carried out against civilians, and by perpetrators who proudly claim responsibility.
The foe is the VERY SAME one that once before, a hundred years ago, had the combined might of all of our peoples and our fleets hammered down atop them.
Where are the governments who represent these abducted and besieged people?
Where is the Federation President, rallying the citizens in their defense?
Where is the Directive Executor, pooling the vast resources of the Megacorps?
Where is the Emissary of the Republic, rousing the fury of the Tribes?
Where is my Empress, bringing the mighty War Machine of the Empire to bear!?
I understand the reasoning. CONCORD has been designated to perform these tasks.
CONCORD has Failed. They simply do not have the resources to wage war on this scale. People are meeting unspeakable fates in unthinkable numbers. Fear has gripped the cluster.
The only hope currently at hand are....the Capsuleers?
As a Capsuleer myself, I can say what madness lies such a path.
Those of us, from all nations, bending our wills against this threat are but a dedicated few compared to what is arrayed against us.
I have seen an Empire's might presented. The Navies of the 5 Major Powers are numerous and maintained at great cost.
A scenario like this is why those costs are paid!
A fleet of hundreds of battleships can be brought together for a ceremony or a show of force. Rapid response squadrons can pursue an egger militiaman in hi-sec enemy space with impressive mobility.
Why can't a mere handful of such forces be put on alert on a regional level?
The people of EVE need you. They are not citizens of CONCORD. They are Citizens of the State, or the Republic, or the Holy Empire, or the Federation.
Do not fail them.
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Invelious
Amarr Deus Imperiosus Acies
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Posted - 2010.05.18 23:22:00 -
[2]
Well said brother. Pretty much covered every angle there. The citizins of New Eden deserve a answer to these questions.
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Naradak
Minmatar Pineal Squeegee
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Posted - 2010.05.19 00:12:00 -
[3]
Huzzah!
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Casiella Truza
Ecliptic Rift New Eden Research
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Posted - 2010.05.19 00:15:00 -
[4]
This goes once again to show the death of the concept of hierarchically-ordered societies "governed" by the elite, gorging themselves on the efforts and resources of trillions while taking no beneficial actions.
Look to your family, to your neighbors, to your friends: depend on these people. Not on some far-off noble who sees you as a fraction of an entry in a tax roll.
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Graelyn
Amarr Deus Imperiosus Acies
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Posted - 2010.05.19 00:43:00 -
[5]
I fail to see how a planet-bound farmer can be expected to unify a pitchfork brigade in defense of a Sansha dropship attack.
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Herzog Wolfhammer
Gallente Aliastra
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Posted - 2010.05.19 00:53:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Graelyn I fail to see how a planet-bound farmer can be expected to unify a pitchfork brigade in defense of a Sansha dropship attack.
Your failure to see is based not on your lack of understanding how a farmer would fend off Sansha kidnappers with a farm implement, but your blindness to the greater problem.
And that problem is the very government who has seen to it that the only defense the farmer has is that pitchfork. Where is the farmer's blaster? Where is his alloyed armor? Why was he not tasked to muster from time to time for tactical training?
He trusted his government, the one that is bloated, faceless and ugly at the same time, full of itself, and while good at devouring taxes, unable to produce anything without taking.
And in this case, it cannot produce security.
What folly that we give such powers to states to protect us from looters and thieves, and yet over time become those looters and thieves.
If everybody was a hard target, if everybody on every planet had one personal weapon, some training, and the will to make grabbing them comparable to grabbing the reproductive organs of an angry slaver hound, the Sansha would be considering having their own children right about now.
But as long as people allow themselves to be fooled by their states, and those statists who never see wrong in it, they are not safe.
Perhaps the farmer deserves to be whisked away, for his ignorance. But we don't know that. And we never will.
We have guns on our ships. Perhaps we need to learn to do more with them then fire shots for profit.
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Math'ra Hiede
Amarr Capital Ships Inc.
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Posted - 2010.05.19 01:22:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Herzog Wolfhammer
Originally by: Graelyn I fail to see how a planet-bound farmer can be expected to unify a pitchfork brigade in defense of a Sansha dropship attack.
Your failure to see is based not on your lack of understanding how a farmer would fend off Sansha kidnappers with a farm implement, but your blindness to the greater problem.
And that problem is the very government who has seen to it that the only defense the farmer has is that pitchfork. Where is the farmer's blaster? Where is his alloyed armor? Why was he not tasked to muster from time to time for tactical training?
He trusted his government, the one that is bloated, faceless and ugly at the same time, full of itself, and while good at devouring taxes, unable to produce anything without taking.
And in this case, it cannot produce security.
What folly that we give such powers to states to protect us from looters and thieves, and yet over time become those looters and thieves.
If everybody was a hard target, if everybody on every planet had one personal weapon, some training, and the will to make grabbing them comparable to grabbing the reproductive organs of an angry slaver hound, the Sansha would be considering having their own children right about now.
But as long as people allow themselves to be fooled by their states, and those statists who never see wrong in it, they are not safe.
Perhaps the farmer deserves to be whisked away, for his ignorance. But we don't know that. And we never will.
We have guns on our ships. Perhaps we need to learn to do more with them then fire shots for profit.
Your arguments about the governments, and particularly your slant towards the Empire are deplorable at this time.
Now is NOT the time to bicker umongst ourselves, we need to stand together as a unified force, to put aside the differences and dislikes as we did one hundred years ago, as Graelyn said CONCORD has failed, and to leave the defense of the entire CLUSTER in the hands of the Capsuleers is pure folly.
To the Governments of New Eden, to the military leaders who direct the mightiest naval forces in our living history. I beg of you to put aside the bitterness for once in your lives, to leave the old demons in the drawer and face the untamed terrors of the resurgent Sansha's Nation together.
To echo Graelyns call.
Where is the Mighty Federation, with its dreaded navies fighting for the freedom of all peoples? Where is the Powerful State, its unstoppable forces ready to deal death to those that would destroy all that they have built? Where is the Raging Republic, the brutal forces of the tribes coming together to protect their people? Where is the Golden Empire, the juggernaught of the Imperial Army being brought to bear on the our foes?
Where are you, leaders of New Eden. Where are you when your people are dying.
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Davanev Hraldirsson
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Posted - 2010.05.19 07:12:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Graelyn
Where are the governments who represent these abducted and besieged people? Where is the Federation President, rallying the citizens in their defense? Where is the Directive Executor, pooling the vast resources of the Megacorps? Where is the Emissary of the Republic, rousing the fury of the Tribes? Where is my Empress, bringing the mighty War Machine of the Empire to bear!?
The people of EVE need you. They are not citizens of CONCORD. They are Citizens of the State, or the Republic, or the Holy Empire, or the Federation.
Do not fail them.
Much as it pains me to agree with an Amarrian on any matter, I must echo Graelyn's sentiment here - just where are the Empire fleets during this crisis ?
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Arline Kley
Amarr
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Posted - 2010.05.19 09:09:00 -
[9]
The fleets of the Empire have been quiet. But we must remember that the nations of New Eden, including our blessed Empire, are far larger than our coalition of capsules.
They are like a battleship, and we are but shuttles. Once they are in place, their power is devestating, but such power is useless if co-ordination cannot be accomplished fully.
________
Lo, though the time is dark, my faith shines and I strike with the wrath of the righteous unto the foes of Mankind. |
Q Zed
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Posted - 2010.05.19 13:20:00 -
[10]
for the state!
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Syn Callibri
Minmatar Blacklight Incorporated
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Posted - 2010.05.19 14:38:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Syn Callibri on 19/05/2010 14:43:08
Originally by: Graelyn I fail to see how a planet-bound farmer can be expected to unify a pitchfork brigade in defense of a Sansha dropship attack.
< chuckles out loud> My dear Graelyn...you have obvioulsy never seen what one of the Matari can do with a pitchfork before...but in general terms your point is valid.
For the moment we capsuleers must face the fact that WE are all that stands between the Sansha and its collaborators and the "mortal" populations of the Empires...lets not forget who and what we are, the most powerful weapons that have ever plied the emptiness of space.
(the views expressed do not nessessarily reflect those of Blacklight Inc.) |
Kor Shivat
Minmatar Republic Military School
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Posted - 2010.05.19 20:39:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Herzog Wolfhammer
Originally by: Graelyn I fail to see how a planet-bound farmer can be expected to unify a pitchfork brigade in defense of a Sansha dropship attack.
Your failure to see is based not on your lack of understanding how a farmer would fend off Sansha kidnappers with a farm implement, but your blindness to the greater problem.
And that problem is the very government who has seen to it that the only defense the farmer has is that pitchfork. Where is the farmer's blaster? Where is his alloyed armor? Why was he not tasked to muster from time to time for tactical training?
Although I suspect it is futile to point this out, the farmer does not have a blaster, alloyed armor, and tactical training because of specialized economic advantage. By concentrating the expertise for defense in one actor, and the expertise of food production in another, both are able to execute their respective tasks more efficiently.
You will now complain that such specialization seems very foolish, now, doesn't it?
However, if all economic actors busied themselves with meeting all of their individual needs, no actor would have the time to develop such gadgetry as blasters and alloyed armor. In your economy, we would all be farmers with pitchforks... no, not even that, we would be hunter gatherers with sharp sticks. No, wait, not even that.
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Casiella Truza
Ecliptic Rift New Eden Research
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Posted - 2010.05.19 21:19:00 -
[13]
Sure, Kor, except that the "specialized economic actors" in this case aren't acting. And we expect most members of society to attain certain core skills: the fact that we have professional chefs in our society doesn't mean that nobody else learns to prepare food, nor even that those chefs prepare most of the meals. Some individuals specialize in operating planetary vehicles, but many other citizens do so on a daily basis despite the fact that they do other things as well.
I suspect that many of these planets do have local defense forces (police, militia, etc.) but evidently their readiness has not met the challenges they've faced. I've begun a project to do what I can for my non-capsuleer employees and their families, but that only goes so far.
The oligopoly on defense authority must change.
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Merdaneth
Amarr Angel Wing.
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Posted - 2010.05.19 21:26:00 -
[14]
Top of the line gear costs a lot of money. If blasters and body armor are affordable to every citizen, then the specialists will confront them with comparatively superior weapons like siege cannons and force shields.
What does a farmer have for a defense against a capsuleer? He would need similar training and a starship too. Giving every civilian a Megathron will do little to have them live in peace. It would completely ruin any current economy though.
Also, consider that having a blaster lying around the house isn't conducive to raising children. ____
The Illusion of Freedom | The Truth about Slavery |
Kor Shivat
Minmatar Republic Military School
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Posted - 2010.05.19 21:46:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Casiella Truza Sure, Kor, except that the "specialized economic actors" in this case aren't acting.
Well, there is no indication the farmers are failing to meet their end of the specialization bargain. What appears to be happening is that those responsible for planetary defense are incompetent. Consequently, we agree on "the oligopoly on defense must change."
My point is that this change should not be in the form of burdening farmers with training gunnery and armor skills at the expense of continuing to improve their ability to harvest (tangent: yes, I concede pew pew is the only specialized skill that ultimately means much of anything in our "sophisticated" economy, but this is a failing of our unique civilization, not of the farmer).
The change should be in the form of replacing incompetent defense specialists with competent ones.
I certainly applaud any project you might be engaged in to take up the slack of our "sleeping" (albeit not "sleeper" - nyuck nyuck) planetary forces. Truth be told, I have no real love for living in goo, and would rather be "down there" with a blaster rifle, myself. At least you don't float off into space when someone breaks a window.
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tow bogdan
Gallente THORN Syndicate Controlled Chaos
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Posted - 2010.05.20 00:05:00 -
[16]
I think you all miss the point about CONCORD. CONCORD don't have infrastructure to operate against masive enemy activity in low security space. CONCORD is in high sec, that's where their power can be felt. The only CONCORD force that could react quickly in systems like Tama are D.E.D squads, and those are very good in clearing small criminal compounds, but not in full-scale battles. Because they are made for chasing criminals, not fighting a war.
The thing is, we can't ask CONCORD to move into low sec, it's not their space, not their responsibility. It's defence is only in power of Empires, also their militias (and those participated greatly in the fight). I think if Sansha fleets tried any large scale attack on high security systems, they would be crushed easily by CONCORD forces. Quality and organization of Concord battleship fleets is in fact superior to any of empire navies. Do not underestimate them.
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tow bogdan
Gallente THORN Syndicate Controlled Chaos
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Posted - 2010.05.20 00:17:00 -
[17]
And what's more, many of you overestimate the power of the empires. They ideed have great fleets, with numbers that no capsuleer fleet would match. But one good capsuleer pilot in bs is worth more than 4 standard caldari navy battleships. I can give 100 mln isk that Northern Caolition combined fleet could massace the large part of 3th Elder Fleet within half an hour. Empires have the power, but we have it too. If we have to st5op Sansha mostly by ourselfs, still we can do it.
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Sophie Starsparrow
Minmatar Starfish Operating Syndicate Annwn Matari
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Posted - 2010.05.20 00:18:00 -
[18]
Originally by: tow bogdan I think if Sansha fleets tried any large scale attack on high security systems, they would be crushed easily by CONCORD forces.
You are assuming they aren't infiltrated by more than the one Sansha operative that they already caught. The art of the conversation shouldn't be present amongst friends. The skill of the conversation is in the listening. |
tow bogdan
Gallente THORN Syndicate Controlled Chaos
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Posted - 2010.05.20 00:44:00 -
[19]
Edited by: tow bogdan on 20/05/2010 00:45:24
Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow You are assuming they aren't infiltrated by more than the one Sansha operative that they already caught.
How many true slaves you can use as spies? Or how many people that aren't those would work for the Nation? CONCORD is entity not smaller or weaker than State or Federation. A few enemy agents can make some problems, but they can't do much to weaken CONCORD's military might. There are many things we could be worried about when fighting Sansha, but spies aren't one of these...
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Sophie Starsparrow
Minmatar Starfish Operating Syndicate Annwn Matari
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Posted - 2010.05.20 00:54:00 -
[20]
Originally by: tow bogdan Edited by: tow bogdan on 20/05/2010 00:45:24
Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow You are assuming they aren't infiltrated by more than the one Sansha operative that they already caught.
How many true slaves you can use as spies? Or how many people that aren't those would work for the Nation? CONCORD is entity not smaller or weaker than State or Federation. A few enemy agents can make some problems, but they can't do much to weaken CONCORD's military might. There are many things we could be worried about when fighting Sansha, but spies aren't one of these...
I hate to disagree with you when you are basically right but...spies have already been an issue, both within CONCORD and within capsuleer organizations. I have to say I am a little surprised at just how many seem willing to aid the Nation. The art of the conversation shouldn't be present amongst friends. The skill of the conversation is in the listening. |
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Kor Shivat
Minmatar Republic Military School
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Posted - 2010.05.20 04:14:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow I hate to disagree with you when you are basically right but...spies have already been an issue, both within CONCORD and within capsuleer organizations. I have to say I am a little surprised at just how many seem willing to aid the Nation.
It's the New Thing, so it is bound to have some trendy appeal.
My dearest hope is that the dark powers manipulating Sansha succeed in reopening the EVE Gate soon, precipitating an apocalypse on the order of that which followed the Gate's closing. Civilization everywhere reduced to plagued rubble, where only isolated pockets of primitive beings huddle in caves for warmth - until one day in the distant future it all starts again.
In that time, they will look upon the ancient civilizations of Quaffe and Ishukone with wonder. How marvelously fascinating!
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