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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Musical Fist
Gallente The Unknown Bar and Pub Elysium Alliance
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Posted - 2010.05.27 18:14:00 -
[61]
Originally by: beautyispain Edited by: beautyispain on 27/05/2010 00:51:08 Well guys... If you take a POS module and reprocess it, then what happens? :) Check the newly seeded POS module bpo's for details
I am pretty shocked at Akita out of all people not only not knowing this but not even doing it
REALLY SHOCKED!!
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Gnulpie
Minmatar Miner Tech
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Posted - 2010.05.27 18:14:00 -
[62]
From then price of some npc sold modules (cyno system jammer) you can figure that the average costs for the planetary raw materials (like felsic magma) IN AVERAGE are around 0,70 isk per unit. That doesn't include costs for import/export, setting up PI and running it etc.
Assuming 0,70 isk per unit you can come up that pos fuel like enriched uranium and mechanical parts are around 2000 isk, oxygen 100 and robotics like 12000.
Doesn't seem that unreasonable to me.
The only bad thing is that you can't reprocess the p4 items and get the lower level materials. |
mechtech
SRS Industries SRS.
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Posted - 2010.05.27 18:36:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Gnulpie From then price of some npc sold modules (cyno system jammer) you can figure that the average costs for the planetary raw materials (like felsic magma) IN AVERAGE are around 0,70 isk per unit. That doesn't include costs for import/export, setting up PI and running it etc.
Assuming 0,70 isk per unit you can come up that pos fuel like enriched uranium and mechanical parts are around 2000 isk, oxygen 100 and robotics like 12000.
Doesn't seem that unreasonable to me.
The only bad thing is that you can't reprocess the p4 items and get the lower level materials.
It's totally unreasonable. At .7 isk per unit (of basic materials), a skilled character producing 24 P4s a day (takes 1-2 hours per day), and assuming no margins for higher level reactions (as in P4s sell for strictly the cost of their P1 components), he will be making 6.4m isk a day. At that level, nobody will do PI.
We would then have a strange scenario where the lower level products sell for far more than the end P4 product's component costs, but even then stocks won't last forever and eventually P4s would be worth much more given enough time (look at technetium).
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Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.05.27 18:42:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Musical Fist I am pretty shocked at Akita out of all people not only not knowing this but not even doing it
Well, who the bloody hell thought to even TRY to reprocess POS structures anyway ? Their mistake was getting greedy and putting them up on the market so I could notice and "investigate". BTW, that was the best well-spent 2 mil ISK for one item, and I am probably the first proud buyer of P4 stuff in EVE
As for not doing it... hey, it's "not doing it YET" Shockingly, I do have a semblance of moral-like standards when it comes to making ISK off of CCP's oversights. But they're incredibly lax
Originally by: Gnulpie From then price of some npc sold modules (cyno system jammer) you can figure that the average costs for the planetary raw materials (like felsic magma) IN AVERAGE are around 0,70 isk per unit. That doesn't include costs for import/export, setting up PI and running it etc. Assuming 0,70 isk per unit you can come up that pos fuel like enriched uranium and mechanical parts are around 2000 isk, oxygen 100 and robotics like 12000. Doesn't seem that unreasonable to me. The only bad thing is that you can't reprocess the p4 items and get the lower level materials.
Yeah, except that cyno system jammers yield via reprocessing P4s at nearly 1/10 of the "cost" compared to, say, reprocessing towers. So, take those numbers, and bump them UP one order of magnitude... 20k mechanical parts, 1k oxygen, 120k robotics, etc. Ok, maybe not quite that much, but half of that, very likely.
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Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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Steve Thomas
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.05.27 18:50:00 -
[65]
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Musical Fist I am pretty shocked at Akita out of all people not only not knowing this but not even doing it
Well, who the bloody hell thought to even TRY to reprocess POS structures anyway ?
actualy I did, simply because I wanted to run diferent Bpos and getting the mats was a royal pain in the ass so I would scrap any finsished modules as soon as I got them Quote: Their mistake was getting greedy and putting them up on the market so I could notice and "investigate". BTW, that was the best well-spent 2 mil ISK for one item, and I am probably the first proud buyer of P4 stuff in EVE
As for not doing it... hey, it's "not doing it YET" Shockingly, I do have a semblance of moral-like standards when it comes to making ISK off of CCP's oversights. But they're incredibly lax
Originally by: Gnulpie From then price of some npc sold modules (cyno system jammer) you can figure that the average costs for the planetary raw materials (like felsic magma) IN AVERAGE are around 0,70 isk per unit. That doesn't include costs for import/export, setting up PI and running it etc. Assuming 0,70 isk per unit you can come up that pos fuel like enriched uranium and mechanical parts are around 2000 isk, oxygen 100 and robotics like 12000. Doesn't seem that unreasonable to me. The only bad thing is that you can't reprocess the p4 items and get the lower level materials.
Yeah, except that cyno system jammers yield via reprocessing P4s at nearly 1/10 of the "cost" compared to, say, reprocessing towers. So, take those numbers, and bump them UP one order of magnitude... 20k mechanical parts, 1k oxygen, 120k robotics, etc. Ok, maybe not quite that much, but half of that, very likely.
pff make money however you want. in the end it will disapear in one of the sinks sooner or later
*.* *.* *.* *.* *.* *.* *.* *.* a (Long) Guide to Pi
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Emperor Cheney
Celebrity Sex Tape
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Posted - 2010.05.27 19:37:00 -
[66]
whether PI goods crash or skyrocket in price in the long term depends mostly on how hard it is to macro PI. The secondary factor is how much CCP messes with it after, but I think the smart money there is definitely on "once or twice soon and then never again"
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Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.05.27 20:22:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Steve Thomas pff make money however you want. in the end it will disapear in one of the sinks sooner or later
That assumes I'm spending it on stuff instead of using it to make more My wallet is an EVE ISK sink
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Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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Chaos Incarnate
Faceless Logistics
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Posted - 2010.05.27 20:33:00 -
[68]
Edited by: Chaos Incarnate on 27/05/2010 20:36:03 i've officially gone from 'intrigued and amused' to 'horrified'
even if the prices aren't sustainable at 200-300k/unit, the prices could hover there or worse for a very long time if this bug/featurette gets overused, which could result in a corresponding drop in POS and outpost costs...10x or so? deathstars for under 100m? a 3b isk outpost in every other system?
the apocalypse has come _____________________ Horrors! Demons in the deep! |
Steve Thomas
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.05.27 23:05:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Chaos Incarnate Edited by: Chaos Incarnate on 27/05/2010 20:36:03 i've officially gone from 'intrigued and amused' to 'horrified'
even if the prices aren't sustainable at 200-300k/unit, the prices could hover there or worse for a very long time if this bug/featurette gets overused, which could result in a corresponding drop in POS and outpost costs...10x or so? deathstars for under 100m? a 3b isk outpost in every other system?
the apocalypse has come
this is EvE
Akita has basicaly just waves the red flag of how to make a ****load of money now from the Developers latest screwup in everyones face.
Now the betting is how long its going to take *THIS* FUBAR to work itself out of the system.
Ironicaly theres another FUBAR that the developers have left in. but thank the evil gods that ones fairly small.
*.* *.* *.* *.* *.* *.* *.* *.* a (Long) Guide to Pi
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Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.05.27 23:17:00 -
[70]
Originally by: The Breadmaster You dont even have to do the math... its blatantly obvious from the forge volumes on the hot-to-reprocess bits : Moon miner, Rapid equip, cyno sys jammer Those are the three to mix and match for building towers. Key ingredients are integrity response drone, nano factory, and sterile conduits. And no 100M is way off the mark per tower. You can build them at 100M and have oodles of leftovers... more like 100M for large tower + ALL bits (guns, reactors, whatever). +1 for server roll back I doubt they have the manpower to rework their entire economic model for Tyrannis to account for it at this point.
He didn't mention several other options (like cyno gens, for instance), but those he named are pretty much the "nicest" ones anyway.
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Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.05.27 23:23:00 -
[71]
Originally by: Steve Thomas Akita has basicaly just waves the red flag of how to make a ****load of money now from the Developers latest screwup in everyones face.
It's like "ZOMG Tractor Beams!!!" all over again, but this time it's actually happening
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Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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Vaal Erit
Science and Trade Institute
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Posted - 2010.05.27 23:23:00 -
[72]
Can you give it like a week before posting this type of information so I can bleed the market dry and make a fortune, Akita T? I swear, my profits go down the more Akita T posts. Thankfully you were slow on the nocx/isogen change - It's not "Play through a pre-set story, become stronger, do endgame". Gameplay is open ended, and you make your own story. Unless you're too afraid of 'pvp grief' to do anything relevant |
Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.05.27 23:28:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Vaal Erit I swear, my profits go down the more Akita T posts.
Unlike a pirate, I'm a bit of a carebear, but I still collect the other kind of carebear tears
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Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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Steve Thomas
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.05.27 23:35:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Steve Thomas Akita has basicaly just waves the red flag of how to make a ****load of money now from the Developers latest screwup in everyones face.
It's like "ZOMG Tractor Beams!!!" all over again, but this time it's actually happening
people wonder why I play EvE
In part its days like this.
in part its days like that.
Honestly the real game is PvD
theres days when its fish in barrel
and theres days when its Fish in a barrel of raw Nitroglycerin
the best thing to do is have fun while you have a blast trying to figure out which sides actualy in the barrel
*.* *.* *.* *.* *.* *.* *.* *.* a (Long) Guide to Pi
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Bellum Eternus
Gallente Death of Virtue MeatSausage EXPRESS
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Posted - 2010.05.27 23:36:00 -
[75]
With even just a few people dumping 1-200 bil into this it could permanently damage the viability of the PI economy. This is hilarious. -
Originally by: Bellum Eternus That is the beauty of Eve, it's a crucible in which great minds are formed and the rest are ground to dust.
Bellum Eternus Inveniam viam aut faciam. |
Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.05.27 23:40:00 -
[76]
Edited by: Akita T on 27/05/2010 23:40:59
Originally by: Bellum Eternus With even just a few people dumping 1-200 bil into this it could permanently damage the viability of the PI economy.
Just like with technetium, I shall await until last minute to also jump in and multiply my ISK If they fix it before, well, no big loss... if they somehow revert/nerf it... loss avoided.
Originally by: Steve Thomas // Bellum Eternus Honestly the real game is PvD // This is hilarious.
Player vs Developer, that's golden Should we add "CCP dev tears" to the list of things people collect ?
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Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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JitaEspion
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Posted - 2010.05.27 23:44:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Bellum Eternus With even just a few people dumping 1-200 bil into this it could permanently damage the viability of the PI economy. This is hilarious.
If you look at the Forge market volume for today 200B has ALREADY been dumped into this. Just wait for the weekend.
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Steve Thomas
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.05.27 23:48:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Bellum Eternus With even just a few people dumping 1-200 bil into this it could permanently damage the viability of the PI economy. This is hilarious.
well not permanently
but
EvE online account 19.95 Ongoing subscription to EvE online 1 Month EVE Subscription (14.95 USD) 3 Month EVE Subscription (38.85 USD) 6 Month EVE Subscription (71.70 USD) 12 Month EVE Subscription (131.40 USD)
One-Year Subscription E-ON Magazine:$55.95
Watching a 10 year old game development company continue to make newbi developer mistakes year after year?
Priceless!
*.* *.* *.* *.* *.* *.* *.* *.* a (Long) Guide to Pi
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Bellum Eternus
Gallente Death of Virtue MeatSausage EXPRESS
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Posted - 2010.05.27 23:54:00 -
[79]
Originally by: JitaEspion
Originally by: Bellum Eternus With even just a few people dumping 1-200 bil into this it could permanently damage the viability of the PI economy. This is hilarious.
If you look at the Forge market volume for today 200B has ALREADY been dumped into this. Just wait for the weekend.
Yeah, I'm just saying how little ISK it would take to ruin PI for the near future (12 months at least). I can see alliances easily dumping half a TRILLION ISK EACH into this if it's allowed to continue, which it will be, because CCP isn't fast enough to fix it. This could well end up being one of the worst CCP f*ck ups in the history of the game. Again, hilarious. -
Originally by: Bellum Eternus That is the beauty of Eve, it's a crucible in which great minds are formed and the rest are ground to dust.
Bellum Eternus Inveniam viam aut faciam. |
Blane Xero
Amarr The Firestorm Cartel
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Posted - 2010.05.27 23:56:00 -
[80]
Chances of this being reverted/calles a sploit/not being touched and destroying PI, in order of chance of happening please? Need to see if its worth jumping into this only to find out 19h later its been plugged and i now have a few assets i don't need. _____________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008
Originally by: CCP Fallout Been there. Done that. Need antibiotics.
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Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.05.27 23:59:00 -
[81]
Edited by: Akita T on 28/05/2010 00:01:26
Originally by: Bellum Eternus I can see alliances easily dumping half a TRILLION ISK EACH into this if it's allowed to continue, which it will be, because CCP isn't fast enough to fix it. This could well end up being one of the worst CCP f*ck ups in the history of the game. Again, hilarious.
I nominate PIPOCALYPSE-NOW! for the "Worst CCP Screwup EVER" Award Let's recap : lowering value of most POS/outpost/sov related things almost one order of magnitude PLUS almost one entire expansion rendered pointless.
Any other contenders ? Maybe boot.ini, but that one wasn't nearly half as bad.
Originally by: Blane Xero Chances of this being reverted/calles a sploit/not being touched and destroying PI, in order of chance of happening please? Need to see if its worth jumping into this only to find out 19h later its been plugged and i now have a few assets i don't need.
Not being touched and PI gone up in flames : 55% Reprocess freeze and/or component makeup altering : 25% Being lightly altered so PI gets barely by : 15% (it's quite difficult at this point) Server rollback : 5% (never happened before, doubt it will ever happen)
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Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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Bellum Eternus
Gallente Death of Virtue MeatSausage EXPRESS
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Posted - 2010.05.28 00:08:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Akita T Edited by: Akita T on 28/05/2010 00:01:26
Originally by: Bellum Eternus I can see alliances easily dumping half a TRILLION ISK EACH into this if it's allowed to continue, which it will be, because CCP isn't fast enough to fix it. This could well end up being one of the worst CCP f*ck ups in the history of the game. Again, hilarious.
I nominate PIPOCALYPSE-NOW! for the "Worst CCP Screwup EVER" Award Let's recap : lowering value of most POS/outpost/sov related things almost one order of magnitude PLUS almost one entire expansion rendered pointless.
Any other contenders ? Maybe boot.ini, but that one wasn't nearly half as bad.
Originally by: Blane Xero Chances of this being reverted/calles a sploit/not being touched and destroying PI, in order of chance of happening please? Need to see if its worth jumping into this only to find out 19h later its been plugged and i now have a few assets i don't need.
Not being touched and PI gone up in flames : 55% Reprocess freeze and/or component makeup altering : 25% Being lightly altered so PI gets barely by : 15% (it's quite difficult at this point) Server rollback : 5% (never happened before, doubt it will ever happen)
They could simply delete any/all PI materials generated before the official release of the PI command centers, but that wouldn't really fix the problem of all those POS mods if they're not reprocessed yet.
Either way this is a huuuge mess (I'm not really complaining, as I don't care one way or the other). This is the best entertainment yet. Frankly, I'm just staying completely out of it myself. I can't be bothered to worry about it one way or the other. -
Originally by: Bellum Eternus That is the beauty of Eve, it's a crucible in which great minds are formed and the rest are ground to dust.
Bellum Eternus Inveniam viam aut faciam. |
Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.05.28 00:20:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Bellum Eternus Either way this is a huuuge mess (I'm not really complaining, as I don't care one way or the other). This is the best entertainment yet. Frankly, I'm just staying completely out of it myself. I can't be bothered to worry about it one way or the other.
I'm letting others remove the hot potatoes Watching the drama unfold is reward enough.
To be honest, at this point, the sheer mass of people that will be doing it pretty much implies trade profitability is mostly down the drain (not gone, just lower, and it will go MUCH lower as soon as alliances get into it), the only people that will actually make a "profit" from this is the end-users of POS/sov structures... and not so much profit, just reduced cost. P.I. will still be profitable to some degree, but almost exclusively for POS fuel. Everything else will be a waste of time. Plasma planets FTW (you can build "Robotics" on-site).
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Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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Steve Thomas
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.05.28 00:20:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Bellum Eternus
Originally by: Akita T Edited by: Akita T on 28/05/2010 00:01:26
Originally by: Bellum Eternus I can see alliances easily dumping half a TRILLION ISK EACH into this if it's allowed to continue, which it will be, because CCP isn't fast enough to fix it. This could well end up being one of the worst CCP f*ck ups in the history of the game. Again, hilarious.
I nominate PIPOCALYPSE-NOW! for the "Worst CCP Screwup EVER" Award Let's recap : lowering value of most POS/outpost/sov related things almost one order of magnitude PLUS almost one entire expansion rendered pointless.
Any other contenders ? Maybe boot.ini, but that one wasn't nearly half as bad.
Originally by: Blane Xero Chances of this being reverted/calles a sploit/not being touched and destroying PI, in order of chance of happening please? Need to see if its worth jumping into this only to find out 19h later its been plugged and i now have a few assets i don't need.
Not being touched and PI gone up in flames : 55% Reprocess freeze and/or component makeup altering : 25% Being lightly altered so PI gets barely by : 15% (it's quite difficult at this point) Server rollback : 5% (never happened before, doubt it will ever happen)
They could simply delete any/all PI materials generated before the official release of the PI command centers, but that wouldn't really fix the problem of all those POS mods if they're not reprocessed yet.
Either way this is a huuuge mess (I'm not really complaining, as I don't care one way or the other). This is the best entertainment yet. Frankly, I'm just staying completely out of it myself. I can't be bothered to worry about it one way or the other.
Deleting would be literaly the worst idea they have ever had, after all people spent isk to get them. Rolling back individualy would be a nightmare that increases in scope with every hour that goes by because you end up ****ing on all the people who made legit purchases
(oh and define legit in this case shesh)
*.* *.* *.* *.* *.* *.* *.* *.* a (Long) Guide to Pi
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Lhun
Amarr Senex Legio Get Off My Lawn
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Posted - 2010.05.28 00:22:00 -
[85]
lollercoaster.
Man, I'm not sure, but I bet we'll see a lot of new stations going up soon.
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Catari Taga
Centre Of Attention Rough Necks
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Posted - 2010.05.28 00:24:00 -
[86]
Edited by: Catari Taga on 28/05/2010 00:26:44
Originally by: Blane Xero Chances of this being reverted/calles a sploit/not being touched and destroying PI, in order of chance of happening please? Need to see if its worth jumping into this only to find out 19h later its been plugged and i now have a few assets i don't need.
Chances are 0. This by design and there's really no way they could prevent it other than make NPC products and player products distinct. I'm frankly surprised people are surprised by this now, this has been on the test server like that long enough. All you market guys should probably go over there once in a while so you know what's coming...
--
Originally by: Zeke Mobius I swear the catholic church was faster at admitting the earth was round than CCP at fixing stuff.
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Bellum Eternus
Gallente Death of Virtue MeatSausage EXPRESS
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Posted - 2010.05.28 00:24:00 -
[87]
Originally by: Steve Thomas Deleting would be literaly the worst idea they have ever had, after all people spent isk to get them. Rolling back individualy would be a nightmare that increases in scope with every hour that goes by because you end up ****ing on all the people who made legit purchases
(oh and define legit in this case shesh)
I'm not saying it's a *good* idea lol. All of the 'solutions' at this point are bad. It just depends on which one is the least worst. I'm sure whatever CCP comes up with will be something totally unexpected by everyone and very unique, but whatever it is, I'm sure it will be universally disliked and be far worse than anything anyone can currently think of. I can't wait. \o/ -
Originally by: Bellum Eternus That is the beauty of Eve, it's a crucible in which great minds are formed and the rest are ground to dust.
Bellum Eternus Inveniam viam aut faciam. |
Claire Dupont
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Posted - 2010.05.28 00:31:00 -
[88]
Edited by: Claire Dupont on 28/05/2010 00:31:49
Originally by: Lhun lollercoaster.
Man, I'm not sure, but I bet we'll see a lot of new stations going up soon.
Not sure about this, their is no space left in the northern regions to deploy any new stations. Well, I don't know anything about the remaining space. |
Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.05.28 00:32:00 -
[89]
Originally by: Bellum Eternus I'm sure whatever CCP comes up with will be something totally unexpected by everyone and very unique, but whatever it is, I'm sure it will be universally disliked and be far worse than anything anyone can currently think of. I can't wait. \o/
How can something this bad feel so good ? Damn, it's fun watching Rome burn !
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Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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mental maverick
Duty. Duty. Private Security
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Posted - 2010.05.28 00:33:00 -
[90]
Imagine if stockpiles last as long as the launch of dust 514. The poor grunts wont have anything to shoot at
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