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Bodrul
Caldari Polaris Rising The Spire Collective
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Posted - 2010.06.14 19:09:00 -
[1]
which one gave the most intrest back and didnt have almost all its assets stolen and sold ........ "Accept responsibility for your life. Know that it is you who will get you where you want to go, no one else." - Les Brown# ........ |
SetrakDark
Northstar Cabal R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2010.06.14 19:14:00 -
[2]
None.
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RAW23
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Posted - 2010.06.14 19:16:00 -
[3]
BMBE, I guess. But it depends on how you define "bank".
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Bodrul
Caldari Polaris Rising The Spire Collective
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Posted - 2010.06.14 19:17:00 -
[4]
Originally by: RAW23 BMBE, I guess. But it depends on how you define "bank".
well you have Ebank (i have used them before) but after what happend i am reluctent to use them. so wounder what are the other options
........ "Accept responsibility for your life. Know that it is you who will get you where you want to go, no one else." - Les Brown# ........ |
Dagny Bronstein
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Posted - 2010.06.14 20:02:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Bodrul well you have Ebank (i have used them before)
In Soviet EVE EBank uses you.
(sry, couldn't resist )
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Hexxx
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.06.14 20:08:00 -
[6]
EVE banking is relatively young compared to EVE stocks and bonds...it'll be interesting to see how it continues to develop.
My personal opinion is that banks will appear again. Time will determine how long they survive and how much they succeed. Projects Blog |
Power Sauce
Kenzzoku
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Posted - 2010.06.14 23:15:00 -
[7]
We'll never know until an eve bank actually starts up.
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Dzil
Caldari Caldari Independent Navy Reserve OWN Alliance
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Posted - 2010.06.14 23:42:00 -
[8]
True eve banking could add a really cool meta function to eve. Imagine a system complete with API calls and public keys such that you could authorize another website to withdraw from your account or transfer to another holder. Imagine services for blue print research, faction mods, cap ships, eve hold em, mercenary contracts tied to real time kill board info.
A bank is also the ultimate 3rd party service for escrow/collateral. By streamlining these services interest rates can reach levels where it's realistic and useful to mortgage an asset and take a loan to pursue industrial/trade goals.
The trouble is we're not there yet. We don't have a big enough pool of trustworthy folks to basically own being trusted with trillions of isk. We don't have the in game tools to distribute security/collateral in a way that prevent fraud and protects against someone quitting with the keys to the city. There's an ever looming risk of RMT flushing through your bank and being caught with your drawers down. And the tech to link those web meta game services together is still yet to be effectively developed. And OMG backups/tech security, data base integrity issues crushed both dbank and ebank.
Of these 4 parts, the trust and tech may eventually be overcome. But gaining the tools to truly govern a corp by board, enforced by in game mechanics, is up to CCP. Meanwhile RMT: I'm really not sure how you ever beat that. It's plagued every persistent game from billion dollar successes like WOW to complete failures like HGL. But it's a very real risk: even if Ricdic had not robbed the bank for real cash, there's a good chance ebank assets would have been frozen anyways just for their association with the RMT scandal.
Long and short, we're 0-3 for bank success stories atm, or if you count BMBE, 1-3.
Retired from corp sales. Time to spend some of this on pretty explosions :) |
Bodrul
Caldari Polaris Rising The Spire Collective
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Posted - 2010.06.14 23:49:00 -
[9]
couldnt we get a banking system created and get those that run it agree to keep it scam free or something and ask CCP to enforce it? that said person could agree with CCP aswell to keep the bank under wraps ........ "Accept responsibility for your life. Know that it is you who will get you where you want to go, no one else." - Les Brown# ........ |
Dzil
Caldari Caldari Independent Navy Reserve OWN Alliance
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Posted - 2010.06.14 23:54:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Bodrul couldnt we get a banking system created and get those that run it agree to keep it scam free or something and ask CCP to enforce it? that said person could agree with CCP aswell to keep the bank under wraps
Why would CCP want to take responsibility for cleaning up the next ebank? Retired from corp sales. Time to spend some of this on pretty explosions :) |
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Hexxx
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.06.15 01:24:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Dzil
Originally by: Bodrul couldnt we get a banking system created and get those that run it agree to keep it scam free or something and ask CCP to enforce it? that said person could agree with CCP aswell to keep the bank under wraps
Why would CCP want to take responsibility for cleaning up the next ebank?
They shouldn't and they won't.
Banking should be left to the players to develop, for that matter, so should insurance in my opinion. Projects Blog |
PinkFish
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Posted - 2010.06.15 01:39:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Dzil True eve banking could add a really cool meta function to eve.
Yes, services abstracted from EVE would provide as "meta functions". Thats a nice tautology. Quote:
Imagine a system complete with API calls and public keys such that you could authorize another website to withdraw from your account or transfer to another holder. Imagine services for blue print research, faction mods, cap ships, eve hold em, mercenary contracts tied to real time kill board info.
A bank is also the ultimate 3rd party service for escrow/collateral. By streamlining these services interest rates can reach levels where it's realistic and useful to mortgage an asset and take a loan to pursue industrial/trade goals.
You can't mortgage an asset without a legal definition of ownership that extends beyond possession. Banking in eve fails due to this. Imagine how useful a home loan would be if the bank kept your home and your car (110% collateral) until the house was paid off. These loans are neither realistic nor useful. Quote: The trouble is we're not there yet.
This is why I'm tearing your statement apart. I disagree that we are on a trajectory to ever be "there". EVE is a sandbox game, not a slow movement towards recreating a real market. I don't like being told where I'm going in a sandbox game as it's contrary to the point. Quote: We don't have a big enough pool of trustworthy folks to basically own being trusted with trillions of isk. We don't have the in game tools to distribute security/collateral in a way that prevent fraud and protects against someone quitting with the keys to the city.
See, you support my argument against what you say. Quote: There's an ever looming risk of RMT flushing through your bank and being caught with your drawers down.
RMT will always be an issue for anything that they could conceivably exploit. Their motivation is greater then yours. Quote: And the tech to link those web meta game services together is still yet to be effectively developed.
I'm certain that technology like this exists and has been developed. Quote: And OMG backups/tech security, data base integrity issues crushed both dbank and ebank.
No, incompetence crushed both of these banks. Quote: Of these 4 parts, the trust and tech may eventually be overcome.
Even the real world doesn't function on trust. Quote: But gaining the tools to truly govern a corp by board, enforced by in game mechanics, is up to CCP.
You're disappointed that EVE by its nature is EVE. We have great tools to govern a corp by board, enforced by game mechanics. It's communication. Quote: Meanwhile RMT: I'm really not sure how you ever beat that. It's plagued every persistent game from billion dollar successes like WOW to complete failures like HGL. But it's a very real risk: even if Ricdic had not robbed the bank for real cash, there's a good chance ebank assets would have been frozen anyways just for their association with the RMT scandal.
The RMT scandal was the theft. It was the inevitable conclusion to giving lots of fake money to someone with no clue on what to do with it.
I'm sorry for breaking your post down into pieces to pick at it. I'm severely sleep deprived and bored. I'm just playing the game with you, nothing personal.
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Varo Jan
Caravanserai Consulting
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Posted - 2010.06.15 01:59:00 -
[13]
Originally by: PinkFish
Originally by: Dzil And OMG backups/tech security, data base integrity issues crushed both dbank and ebank.
No, incompetence crushed both of these banks.
This. No different from RL. Managerial incompetence "wins" every time.
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Breaker77
Gallente Reclamation Industries
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Posted - 2010.06.15 02:13:00 -
[14]
Originally by: PinkFish Even the real world doesn't function on trust.
it functions on asshats (lawyers) and ****heads (more lawyers)
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PinkFish
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Posted - 2010.06.15 02:17:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Varo Jan
Originally by: PinkFish
Originally by: Dzil And OMG backups/tech security, data base integrity issues crushed both dbank and ebank.
No, incompetence crushed both of these banks.
This. No different from RL. Managerial incompetence "wins" every time.
I wonder if Lehman Brothers considered freezing all investments for a few years while they regained solvency.
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Hexxx
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.06.15 03:12:00 -
[16]
I wonder how banks functioned hundreds of years ago in Europe, what with no real regulation, auditing, enforcement of law, mechanism for bankruptcy, or even detection of fraud...crazy.
The Medici Bank (1397û1494)
Projects Blog |
Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.06.15 03:21:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Hexxx I wonder how banks functioned hundreds of years ago in Europe, what with no real regulation, auditing, enforcement of law, mechanism for bankruptcy, or even detection of fraud...crazy.
The same way loansharks functioned not so long ago (and some still do)
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Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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Vilgan Mazran
Aperture Harmonics K162
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Posted - 2010.06.15 04:21:00 -
[18]
Big issue in running a bank imo, is finding people who are both A: qualified/intelligent and B: motivated to work multiply money that isn't their own.
Looking at the current ebank board for example. They might hit A (I don't know the people well enough to judge), but judging by all the t2 BPO purchases they aren't interested in B. But who can really blame them? I know I don't have much interest in multiplying other people's money when I could be increasing my own instead. Sure, some people won't have the capital necessary right away. However, it won't be long until they do unless they are lacking in A (imo).
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TornSoul
BIG Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2010.06.15 15:39:00 -
[19]
Originally by: RAW23 BMBE, I guess. But it depends on how you define "bank".
FWIW:
BMBE = BIG Merchant Bank of EVE
I chose the "Merchant" moniker, because the BMBE is not a deposit bank, but strictly a loans bank.
As such it's not something the "general public" would have much use for (they'd prefer to deposit to gain interest - aka the EBANK model), instead it's more for "merchants" who need a quick cash infusing, to take advantage of something on the current markets that their liquidity wouldn't allow them to do elsewise, and if they wait, the opportunity would vanish.
BIG Lottery |
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