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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
45thtiger 0109
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Posted - 2010.06.26 07:45:00 -
[1]
Hey Eve Community
As i have been in this game for about 4 years and i have seen allot of changes.
As we all know that 3D TV`s have been released and some Monitor`s might be 3D also.
Would EVE online go 3D ?
And would CCP update to DX10 or DX11 as well?
Well i think its time ccp upgrade to DX 11 as allot of us have gone to Windows 7.
Another thing also would EVE online allow the users to use Touch screen Monitor`s to play eve ?
If The EVE Community wants to comment on these things please do so.
Thanks
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Terminal Insanity
Minmatar Gith Industries
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Posted - 2010.06.26 07:52:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Terminal Insanity on 26/06/2010 07:53:15 and drop the subscriptions of everyone who didnt bother with win7? Sounds like a good plan.
Also, eve works in 3d right now, via nvidia's 3d glasses or others also. Has zero to do with DirectX versions...
~ ° ° ° ~ Non-Gameplay Enhancements! |
Denaris Aschanna
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Posted - 2010.06.26 07:59:00 -
[3]
And a lot of us haven't gone to Win7, but have stuck with WinXP.
I dislike this whole new 'fad' of 3D - everything. It didn't work that well in the 70's/80's and it still doesn't work that well now.
I tried watching a movie in 3D, ended up with a migrane!
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Swidgen
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Posted - 2010.06.26 08:01:00 -
[4]
No, no, no and no. |
TriadSte
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.06.26 08:04:00 -
[5]
3d has come ALONG wat from the 80s -90s Going to the cinema and watching a 3d movie is a real treat. I love it personally.
Eve to go dx10-11 - nope
3D already can as a previous poster mentioned with the stupidly priced 3d glasses.
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Terminal Insanity
Minmatar Gith Industries
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Posted - 2010.06.26 08:10:00 -
[6]
I highly recommend not getting nvidia's expensive set (which also requires a really expensive 120hz refresh monitor)
There are better ways to get 3d, like 3d LCD glasses. They almost completely remove you from your enviroment and place you infront of what appears to be a 60 foot screen.
Then when you hook up a cheap 15$ webcam, 5$ infared LED's and a baseball hat... oh my. You'll have full head motion tracking, so you can look around, just like VR. Its pretty badass
And none of it requires dx11... dx10/11 introduced very very little, and would give virtually no benifit to eve, especily considering how slow their graphics team cranks out updates (although when they do put em out, they rock!)
~ ° ° ° ~ Non-Gameplay Enhancements! |
Phaese
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Posted - 2010.06.26 08:19:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Phaese on 26/06/2010 08:26:45 Edited by: Phaese on 26/06/2010 08:23:53 The OP may be referring to the monitors that do 3D without requiring glasses. Regardless, I don't want to look up how the nvidia glasses work, but if they already work with eve I suspect the same software could link into the new monitor technology.
Of course CCP will update at some point, unless they decide that new subscribers are no longer part of their business model. They'll release two clients for the transition if they need to.
I doubt CCP will add in any touchscreen-specific features, there just aren't enough gaming PCs with touchscreen monitors to bother.
Edit: I accidentally the whole grammar
Double Edit: I didn't know that about DX11.
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AterraX
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.06.26 08:22:00 -
[8]
Edited by: AterraX on 26/06/2010 08:22:24 Edited by: AterraX on 26/06/2010 08:21:58
Originally by: Terminal Insanity Edited by: Terminal Insanity on 26/06/2010 07:53:15 and drop the subscriptions of everyone who didnt bother with win7? Sounds like a good plan.
Also, eve works in 3d right now, via nvidia's 3d glasses or others also. Has zero to do with DirectX versions...
You REALLY need to read up.
Coding in DX11 has the benefit of an automatic fallback path to DX10.1, DX10 or DX9.
That manes you don't need to code for several API's, but can code for just one (DX11) and the compiler will make fallback codepaths for lesser version of DX11. ____________________________________________________________________________________________________ Fact of EVE forums: They will always come an anounomys alt-toon and question someones character... |
TheLordofAllandNothing
Caldari NailorTech Industries RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2010.06.26 08:23:00 -
[9]
Edited by: TheLordofAllandNothing on 26/06/2010 08:23:22 People who are still using xp are idiots, true story. More exploitable holes than a cheap hooker(business users sort of have an excuse)
But i think ccp should move up to dx11 and 10. Dx11 is a brilliant piece of programming, and is worth it in every way and its backwards compatible.
So even the special snowflakes using xp and a dx9 gpu won't be hurt by it.
_______________________ Fix rockets in '09 =( |
dexington
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Posted - 2010.06.26 08:31:00 -
[10]
The linux and mac version of EVE are not going to support any new version of DX anytime soon, which may be one of the reasons CCP is hesitant to switch to a newer version of DX. You properly also have alot of people playing eve on xp, making it even harder to upgrade DX.
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Wendi Watson
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Posted - 2010.06.26 08:32:00 -
[11]
Originally by: TheLordofAllandNothing
People who are still using xp are idiots, true story. More exploitable holes than a cheap hooker(business users sort of have an excuse.
Right, I'll upgrade just as soon as you pay for several copies of Win7 for my machines. I'll be expecting your check in the mail.
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Terminal Insanity
Minmatar Gith Industries
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Posted - 2010.06.26 08:40:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Terminal Insanity on 26/06/2010 08:41:12
Originally by: AterraX Edited by: AterraX on 26/06/2010 08:22:24 Edited by: AterraX on 26/06/2010 08:21:58
Originally by: Terminal Insanity Edited by: Terminal Insanity on 26/06/2010 07:53:15 and drop the subscriptions of everyone who didnt bother with win7? Sounds like a good plan.
Also, eve works in 3d right now, via nvidia's 3d glasses or others also. Has zero to do with DirectX versions...
You REALLY need to read up.
Coding in DX11 has the benefit of an automatic fallback path to DX10.1, DX10 or DX9.
That manes you don't need to code for several API's, but can code for just one (DX11) and the compiler will make fallback codepaths for lesser version of DX11.
Not true.
That used to be true before dx10, however dx10's DDI has been modified so heavily that there it can not. Also the cap bits were removed.
The only benifit you gain from dx11 is hardware tesselation and sm5.0. both of those require dx11-specific hardware to function.
So, again, why upgrade? They cant use tessellation or sm5.0 due to 90% of the player base not having the latest videocards. So they could upgrade to dx11, and there would be absolutely zero benefit to anyone in eve.
~ ° ° ° ~ Non-Gameplay Enhancements! |
AterraX
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.06.26 08:42:00 -
[13]
Edited by: AterraX on 26/06/2010 08:42:32
Originally by: dexington The linux and mac version of EVE are not going to support any new version of DX anytime soon, which may be one of the reasons CCP is hesitant to switch to a newer version of DX. You properly also have alot of people playing eve on xp, making it even harder to upgrade DX.
Last I checked Mac-users make out ~6% of all computer users and Linux-users <1% of all computer users. That they picked the wrong platform for gaming is their problem.
And again coding for DX11 per auto makes fallback paths for those IT-mongols still running XP and DX9
____________________________________________________________________________________________________ Fact of EVE forums: They will always come an anounomys alt-toon and question someones character... |
Fikreta
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Posted - 2010.06.26 08:54:00 -
[14]
Originally by: TheLordofAllandNothing Edited by: TheLordofAllandNothing on 26/06/2010 08:23:22 People who are still using xp are idiots, true story. More exploitable holes than a cheap hooker(business users sort of have an excuse).
I'm using XP I don't even know for how many years and never had problems. It works just fine, assuming that you know what you're doing. New OS must be either significantly better performance-wise (which Win7 is not, tried it for a week or two and did not see any difference), or I'd have to be literally forced to upgrade because upcoming apps or games strictly requires such thing.
Vast majority of people don't have a slightest clue anyway - they are buying Win7 (Vista before) only because it's OMG SHINY & TRENDY. However, if you ask me Win7 is ugly and unbelievable impractical comparing to XP... I admit it is more idiot-proof, though.
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Tavin Aikisen
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2010.06.26 08:55:00 -
[15]
Not any time soon. I love 3D but EVE does not support it. Some people claim they get it working when they disable HDR, bloom and anti-aliasing but what's the point in sacrificing quality graphics for 3D?
3D is great at first but then it just becomes one of those effects that you no longer notice. Just like in real life we don't walk around appreciating the fact that everything has depth.. we expect it.
The other issue is hardware. Current 3D TVs will not provide 3D in games thanks to every 3D solution being exclusive. If you choose NVIDIA's 3D Vision, you won't be gaming on those new Samsung 3D TVs. If you choose the checkerboard 3D solution, forget playing any game except Avatar and a couple others.
Let it become mainstream first. One hit movie and a few "3D Ready" games is not enough. ôRemember this. Trust your eyes, you will kill each other. Trust your veins, you can all go home in peace.ö
-Cold Wind |
AterraX
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.06.26 08:58:00 -
[16]
Edited by: AterraX on 26/06/2010 09:00:10
Originally by: Terminal Insanity Not true.
That used to be true before dx10, however dx10's DDI has been modified so heavily that there it can not. Also the cap bits were removed.
The only benifit you gain from dx11 is hardware tesselation and sm5.0. both of those require dx11-specific hardware to function.
So, again, why upgrade? They cant use tessellation or sm5.0 due to 90% of the player base not having the latest videocards. So they could upgrade to dx11, and there would be absolutely zero benefit to anyone in eve.
You can choose not to include a DX9 path like in "the Stonegiant Demo"
Stone Giant is a DirectX 11 demo produced by Fatshark in collaboration with BitSquid using BitSquid Tech. It has primarily been developed to test the BitSquid tools and technology in a real-world production environment. The demo showcases how DX11 hardware tessellation can be used to achieve a high level of geometry detail in close-up shots. For users lacking a DX11 compatible GPU the demo also supports a DX10 fallback path with tessellation disabled.
But you can also choose to support the full path: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DirectX#Compatibility
Direct3D 11 runtime introduces Direct3D 9, 10, and 10.1 "feature levels", compatibility modes which only allow the use of hardware features defined in the specified version of Direct3D. For Direct3D 9 hardware, there are three different feature levels, grouped by common capabilities of "low", "med" and "high-end" video cards; the runtime directly uses Direct3D 9 DDI provided in all WDDM drivers.
Like I said...you REALLY need to read up...even Wikipeida would be able to educate you on this topic.
More fail you want to post?! |
Terminal Insanity
Minmatar Gith Industries
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Posted - 2010.06.26 09:03:00 -
[17]
fair enough, i'm not completely up to date with dx11. However, my point still remains
Why upgrade the graphics engine to use dx11 when only 5% of the eve population will benifit from it?
~ ° ° ° ~ Non-Gameplay Enhancements! |
Afrodite Draconis
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Posted - 2010.06.26 09:05:00 -
[18]
WinXP LOL, like a flashback from last decade.
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Br41n
Amarr Pinky and the Brain corp
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Posted - 2010.06.26 09:07:00 -
[19]
And what would exactly be worth using dx10/dx11 for?
Its not a 1st person FPS or something that has a lot of nice enviromental crap.
They dont even use the max graphical capacity of DX9 yet so theres no point at al.
and no eve in 3D wont be an addition ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Pinky: Gee, Brain. What are we going to do tonight?
Brain: The same thing we do every night, Pinky. Try to take over the world. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ |
Fikreta
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Posted - 2010.06.26 09:10:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Afrodite Draconis WinXP LOL, like a flashback from last decade.
Aha. So... why exactly did you move to W7?
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Terminal Insanity
Minmatar Gith Industries
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Posted - 2010.06.26 09:24:00 -
[21]
win7 imo is really nice... i'm just waiting another year for it to mature more before i move over =P
Vista was another half-assed flop like WindowsME. Win7 is what vista should have been.
~ ° ° ° ~ Non-Gameplay Enhancements! |
dexington
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Posted - 2010.06.26 09:29:00 -
[22]
Edited by: dexington on 26/06/2010 09:30:01
Originally by: Terminal Insanity Why upgrade the graphics engine to use dx11 when only 5% of the eve population will benifit from it?
Because that 5% is the really angry whining trolls that refuse to go back into the cave?.
I'm sure that CCP is looking at the 'time/money/effort vs. profit' curve, and once that says go ahead they will start to switch eve to a never version of DX. Eve properly got alot of hacks and tweaks that makes it not so easy to just switch DX version, i can't understand if they don't want to rush into something just to please a few whining trolls with fancy graphics card and the shiny new windows
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Naomi Halloran
Gallente Disciples of Night DEFI4NT
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Posted - 2010.06.26 09:45:00 -
[23]
Eh, I use Win7, and I think this game looks fine as it is. Nice suggestion, but if things do change, it'll probably happen in little bits and pieces over time. Nothing to get too terribly worked up over. ---
"Ye Gods, Mardonius, what men have you brought us to fight against? Men that fight not for gold, but for glory." |
Aera Aiana
Amarr
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Posted - 2010.06.26 09:53:00 -
[24]
Originally by: TheLordofAllandNothing People who are still using xp are idiots, true story. More exploitable holes than a cheap hooker(business users sort of have an excuse)
I tried Win7, didn't do it for me. Too much stuff in there that I could potentially need if they had done it right - but they haven't - again. Like the library feature which is really great, or would be if it worked on network drives (got all my stuff on a server, makes it easier to keep pc and laptop in sync). Or the screwed up explorer that won't delete a directory because it can't deal with the fact that there are thumbs.db files on my old win-xp networkserver (which I cannot upgrade to win7 - it's a 10 year old machine that would probably explode in my face if I even came close to it with the win7 dvd).
So no thanks. XP is fine for me. Win7 had some great ideas and if they polish those a bit in win8 or whatever will be next, I might consider that.
Originally by: TheLordofAllandNothing But i think ccp should move up to dx11 and 10. Dx11 is a brilliant piece of programming, and is worth it in every way and its backwards compatible.
So even the special snowflakes using xp and a dx9 gpu won't be hurt by it.
Admittedly I can't comment on version 11. When I had to work with a couple of years back it was a real pain in the ass. Like 100 lines of code to get a context. But I guess if you compare that to some of the more ancient parts of the windows API it's great, yea... -
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AterraX
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.06.26 10:09:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Terminal Insanity fair enough, i'm not completely up to date with dx11. However, my point still remains
Why upgrade the graphics engine to use dx11 when only 5% of the eve population will benifit from it?
Because DX11 was mostly about the making stuff easier to program. It also removes a lot of overhead and allows for more multithreading. It's what DX10 should have been. And because it will make eg. HDR + AA work, without stupid hacks....giving better I.Q.
So more esay for the developers to code. Better I.Q. for players Better performance due to better multithreading.
Add to that the XP is droppong like a rock, Win7 and DX11 and X10 is on the rise (the fall back path thingy): http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/ Infact XP/DX9 is now less than half the numbers amongst gamers. The only question that makes sense is: Why not?! ____________________________________________________________________________________________________ Fact of EVE forums: They will always come an anounomys alt-toon and question someones character... |
45thtiger 0109
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Posted - 2010.06.26 10:12:00 -
[26]
Also i like to add that windows XP is end of its use by date or already is & windows 7 is getting an service pack 1 update later on this year.
There could be allot of fixes for windows 7.
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AterraX
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.06.26 10:22:00 -
[27]
Originally by: 45thtiger 0109 Also i like to add that windows XP is end of its use by date or already is & windows 7 is getting an service pack 1 update later on this year.
There could be allot of fixes for windows 7.
SP1 to Win7 won't be like other SP's in the past.
It will contain the already relased updates for Win 7...and nothing else.
Google around...you will find it educational. ____________________________________________________________________________________________________ Fact of EVE forums: They will always come an anounomys alt-toon and question someones character... |
Terminal Insanity
Minmatar Gith Industries
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Posted - 2010.06.26 10:28:00 -
[28]
Originally by: AterraX http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/
Thanks for proving my point for me. DX11 support is at 5.6% lol
~ ° ° ° ~ Non-Gameplay Enhancements! |
AterraX
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.06.26 10:31:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Terminal Insanity
Originally by: AterraX http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/
Thanks for proving my point for me. DX11 support is at 5.6% lol
You are not the fastest moped on the pier, eh? Look at adoption rates.
XP is dying and should have died years ago.
DX11 + DX10 > DX9
And that trend will only grow.
Did the entire fallbcak path thing go over your I.Q.?
More fail you want to post? ____________________________________________________________________________________________________ Fact of EVE forums: They will always come an anounomys alt-toon and question someones character... |
Terminal Insanity
Minmatar Gith Industries
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Posted - 2010.06.26 10:39:00 -
[30]
Originally by: AterraX You are not the fastest moped on the pier, eh? Look at adoption rates.
XP is dying and should have died years ago.
DX11 + DX10 > DX9
And that trend will only grow.
Did the entire fallbcak path thing go over your I.Q.?
More fail you want to post?
Mr Obvious! Of course xp is only going to continue dying, even microsoft is stopping corporate support for it soon. Of course dx11+10 are going to continue to gain popularity. Any 5 year old can point these out, he learned this with his Pokemon games. Nobody plays Pokemon Red anymore, because the newer, better is out.
My point is, player support is at 5% right now. There are other things in the game that effect 100% of the eve population that still need fixing. I would prefer CCP work on fixing the things that apply to the ENTIRE POPULATION OF EVE before they worry about hardware tesselation for 5% of its users.
If you're developing a brand new game, defiantly use dx11. But as another posted stated in here, eve isn't even making full use of the dx9 spec, what the **** is the point of switching to dx11 when ONLY 5% WILL BENIFIT
Yes, it may be easier for programmers, as you mentioned its been COMPLETELY OVERHAULED to make it MUCH EASIER. Even though its EASIER, its still DIFFERENT, wich requires TIME to train and adapt to the new spec. Should CCP developers take a few weeks off and learn dx11, then spend the next 2 or 3 months rewriting the graphics engine just to support FIVE PERCENT OF THE EVE POPULATION?
~ ° ° ° ~ Non-Gameplay Enhancements! |
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