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Shodai Caldari	Posted - 2010.07.07 05:45:00 - [1] I have been toying with the idea of buying a Nightmare for running Lvl 4's for the past 3 weeks now. I have read all I can on it and most seem to say it is the best laser ship for the job but I have a few questions which hopefully some Nightmare veterans can answer. 1. What is the minimum sustained and reinforced defence for a comfortable mission without it getting hairy. 2. Are Faction or T2 Tachyons the best way to go and do they track well enough for up close. 3. I am mainly missioning against Sansha and Serpentis so any good fits would be appreciated (faction&officer ok) 4. Is there any videos of this beast running some of the harder level 4 missions so I can see it in action. Thanks
vicror Caldari Critical Density	Posted - 2010.07.07 06:27:00 - [2] Edited by: vicror on 07/07/2010 06:34:28 I've used the ship a long time now. Against just about anything and everything. I can say that the fit will and should change depending on several factors. 1) Skills determine much how to fit it as mine did change over time and how comfortable I became in using it. 2) I always try to use the right fit for job at hand. Therefore, I often switched up between tachs and pulse. 3) Main factor is how much are you willing to spend on it. I started out with a gist xl and still have it on to this day. Because there are some instances that you actually need to repair your shields. Not that it means a great deal now. Because, I hardly ever have a need to rep. Rats die very fast and at longer ranges that I use the tach fit for. I use mega pulse Pal or 800mm ac Mach for closer ranges. A few rules would be Gank fit it with 3x heat sinks, 3x specific res. or 2 spec. and 1 inv., 2x tc, 2x te, 1x cap recharger or heavy cap booster are pretty much cookie cutter for it. I would absolutely w/o question use 1x t2 energy discharge or 1x t2 ccc(more expensive, same purpose) and 2x t1 ccc rigs. xl sb faction or better(isk wise). boost amp isn't really important for most missions. Cap is key with or w/o a cap booster. If you're worried about cap and shields dropping low. Then, you can choose to fit 2x flux, 1x caprech., t2 ccc, 2x t1 ccc and xl gist. That's the carebear(permaboost) non gank fit that does work well. But, you lose the xtra tracking speed/range the te give it. Sorry, no vidoes. I don't need to fuel my ego or epeen like some other people.
Sturmwolke	Posted - 2010.07.07 06:32:00 - [3] 1. Newbies > 450 dps defence. Veterans 250-350 dps defence. Measured with specific hardeners against NPC. 2. Properly fitted with good skills, Tachyons track as well (if not better) than Megapulse w/Scorch on an Apocalypse. Run faction if you don't have T2 Beam skill > L3 and you have spare isk to spend. 3. Good fits generally have 2-3x CCCs, 1-2 TE, 1 TC, 3-4 hardeners and a utility mid for AB/hvy or med Cap Booster. You will need cap boosters for certain missions as the boat does not have the cap endurance if you run with Tachyons. [Sample Nightmare] Damage Control II Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Tracking Enhancer II Pithum C-Type Medium Shield Booster Tracking Computer II, Tracking Speed/Optimal Range Photon Scattering Field II Photon Scattering Field II Heat Dissipation Field II Heat Dissipation Field II Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 25 Imperial Navy Tachyon Beam Laser, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Imperial Navy Tachyon Beam Laser, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Imperial Navy Tachyon Beam Laser, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Imperial Navy Tachyon Beam Laser, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Small Tractor Beam I Auto Targeting System II Large Energy Discharge Elutriation II Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I 4. Google it.
Lena Planeswalker IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2010.07.07 07:33:00 - [4] I have been using a transformed pvp fit to run the occasional mission with the nightmare 4 t2 mega pulse, 2 heavy nos shield booster, 2 invuls, 2 amps, cap booster, web(tracking computer) 3 heat sinks, tracking enhancer, damage control 1 em rig, 2 cap safeguard rigs upgrade to faction where you see fit. And yes i am using pulse with scorch didn't like that sig anyways...
Shodai Caldari	Posted - 2010.07.07 07:49:00 - [5] many thanks for the replies. I should have mentioned, I can use T2 so scorch isnt a problem. So it seems there are missions where the Paladin is a better choice than the Nightmare and also Pulses over Tacs for certain situations. Can you let me know when to use Paladin and when to use Nightmare or is it all range dependent. Thanks for your help.
Lugalzagezi666	Posted - 2010.07.07 08:06:00 - [6] [Nightmare, New Setup 1] Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Tracking Enhancer II X-Large Shield Booster II Photon Scattering Field II Photon Scattering Field II Heat Dissipation Field II Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800 Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L [empty high slot] [empty high slot] Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Hobgoblin II x5 Curator II x2 You can use some t2 energy weapon rig is you have isk /t1s are stacked too much/ because cccs arent really necessary. Paladin is never better in kill speed, but lets you loot while you are shooting rats - this can be useful in missions where tags are big part of your income /ea/. I always use tachyons, i cant think of any mission except damsel where megapulses would be better /but tbh difference is hardly noticeable/...
Riho Gallente Magnificent Beavers	Posted - 2010.07.07 11:56:00 - [7] my fit. [Nightmare, PvE] Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Tracking Enhancer II Damage Control II Dread Guristas X-Large Shield Booster Caldari Navy Shield Boost Amplifier Caldari Navy Shield Boost Amplifier Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II Heat Dissipation Field II Core X-Type 100MN Afterburner Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L 'Vrykolakas' Heavy Nosferatu I Medium Diminishing Power System Drain I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Hammerhead II x5 had the ship for over 6 months. tho i do use a alt sometimes with maxed out absolution with me. ---------------------------------- Fighting for something Yes... this is my main. Extreme Troll Slayer...
Sturmwolke	Posted - 2010.07.07 23:37:00 - [8] Originally by: Shodai So it seems there are missions where the Paladin is a better choice than the Nightmare and also Pulses over Tacs for certain situations. Can you let me know when to use Paladin and when to use Nightmare or is it all range dependent In terms of dps, the Nightmare is always the better choice, if you consider cookie cutter setups and equal skills. Its advantages in having TE(s) (better damage projection & hit quality) and tracking bonus (better hit quality) cannot be beaten by the Paladin's cookie cutter setups. Close combat is a non-issue as swapping Tachs => Pulse on the Nightmare is a non-issue and the cap savings may allow you to field an extra TC or web in the mid. That said, there are shield tanked Paladins around that equalizes the mod differences, but it'll still lose out to the Nightmare's inherent tracking bonus. It also has to make certain mobility/tank sacrifices in order to fit all of it into 4 med slots, notwithstanding being completely inflexible without a TC to combat Sansha/Blood TD. To conclude, for all missions => Nightmare. However, if you'd like to maximize isk returns by doing some salvaging on-the-go, then => Paladin. Just keep in mind these boats are most effectively used is Amarr space. When you go outside of Amarr space, the balance changes.
Mustacho Caldari Y hulo thar buttsecks	Posted - 2010.07.08 01:19:00 - [9] This is my Nightmare setup that I've used to run missions for the past few months. [Nightmare, Bowie Express] Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Tracking Enhancer II Caldari Navy Shield Boost Amplifier Caldari Navy Heat Dissipation Field Caldari Navy Photon Scattering Field Invulnerability Field II Caldari Navy X-Large Shield Booster Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800 Shadow Serpentis Tracking Computer, Tracking Speed Dark Blood Tachyon Beam Laser, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Dark Blood Tachyon Beam Laser, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Dark Blood Tachyon Beam Laser, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Dark Blood Tachyon Beam Laser, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Small Tractor Beam I Small Tractor Beam I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Running in Amarr space, I find that most missions I don't even need to touch my cap booster. Never had tracking issues aside from The Blockade mission where those 6 or so elite cruisers come in the same wave and tracking disrupt at the same time. I always use faction tachyons over T2 as they are less cap intensive, which is really your only worry for the Nightmare.
RentableMuffin	Posted - 2010.07.08 01:24:00 - [10] Originally by: Lugalzagezi666 [Nightmare, New Setup 1] Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Tracking Enhancer II X-Large Shield Booster II Photon Scattering Field II Photon Scattering Field II Heat Dissipation Field II Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800 Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L [empty high slot] [empty high slot] Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Large Capacitor Control Circuit I Hobgoblin II x5 Curator II x2 You can use some t2 energy weapon rig is you have isk /t1s are stacked too much/ because cccs arent really necessary. Paladin is never better in kill speed, but lets you loot while you are shooting rats - this can be useful in missions where tags are big part of your income /ea/. I always use tachyons, i cant think of any mission except damsel where megapulses would be better /but tbh difference is hardly noticeable/... best fit imo. I fly it without the sentry drones, need to train them on that character.

Von Kapiche Minmatar	Posted - 2010.07.08 12:44:00 - [11] Mine also has the two TCs/cap booster/3 hardeners mids, go for that one. I've hit orbiting cruisers at 10km with tachs with that. You can always move to minimize tracking issues. Never gone up vs Serpentis in it, but I've used it for everything bar Angels and it's happy.
Gligan	Posted - 2010.07.08 13:38:00 - [12] I usually fly with a cap stable fit with a gist x-type large, 2 cn invulns and tachyons. I really hate lugging cap charges. And it does very good against serpentis, or EOM for that matter. MF does a lot of thermal damage and that's the second best all around damage in game
Shodai Caldari	Posted - 2010.07.08 17:08:00 - [13] Many thanks for all the input, gives me a few options.
Haary	Posted - 2010.07.10 11:45:00 - [14] Edited by: Haary on 10/07/2010 11:46:12 Edited by: Haary on 10/07/2010 11:45:40 http://dl.eve-files.com/media/0905/Burning_Eve_5_Final.wmv and http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1001/Burning_Eve_6-2.wmv Cant understand why you would like to PVE in such a monsterous boat
Miriiah	Posted - 2010.07.10 19:01:00 - [15] Originally by: Haary Edited by: Haary on 10/07/2010 11:46:12 Edited by: Haary on 10/07/2010 11:45:40 http://dl.eve-files.com/media/0905/Burning_Eve_5_Final.wmv and http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1001/Burning_Eve_6-2.wmv Cant understand why you would like to PVE in such a monsterous boat Maybe because it's a good isk farming ship you can set up very easily for way under a bill isk?


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