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Adean Starsailor
Amarr Conquest United
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Posted - 2010.08.07 13:27:00 -
[1]
I have looked throguh the forums alot and I have not found any real stances on the harbinger in pvp. I know in pve, if fit right can blitz lvl 3 missions and do some lvl 4 missions. However, I was wondering how good of a ship it is in PVP, I did some searching in EVEMON on fits and found one that has 620 dps and a 72.5k buffer tank. Is that good? I am only used to flying frigates and cruiser so I am not 100% sure if the harbinger would be a good pvp battlecruiser hull for amarrians, comparred to the hurricane, drake, brutix, and drake. All help is appreciated.
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Grek Forto
Malevolent Intentions Dark Solar Empire
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Posted - 2010.08.07 13:29:00 -
[2]
The Harbinger is an awesome, awesome, awesome battlecruiser. I am sure someone will link a good fit for you.
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Adean Starsailor
Amarr Conquest United
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Posted - 2010.08.07 13:35:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Adean Starsailor on 07/08/2010 13:35:43 Well I have found a decent fit I believe:
[Harbinger, PVP] Damage Control II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Adaptive Nano Plating II
10MN MicroWarpdrive I Warp Disruptor II Medium Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800 Stasis Webifier I
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Medium 'Gremlin' Power Core Disruptor I
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Hammerhead II x5
It has 620 dps and a 72.5k buffer. I just don't know if it is an effective boat against, say a one on one of a hurricane, a drake, or a brutix.
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Grek Forto
Malevolent Intentions Dark Solar Empire
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Posted - 2010.08.07 13:36:00 -
[4]
Seems solid.
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raukosen
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Posted - 2010.08.07 13:42:00 -
[5]
Harb should have 3x HS
Shield tanking it is also better IMO but enjoy your dying slowly with your buffer because you got caught aligning
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Adean Starsailor
Amarr Conquest United
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Posted - 2010.08.07 13:47:00 -
[6]
Originally by: raukosen Harb should have 3x HS
Shield tanking it is also better IMO but enjoy your dying slowly with your buffer because you got caught aligning
the three heatsinks adds like 30ish-50ish dps if that, and do people really tank shields with a harbi?
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Denuo Secus
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Posted - 2010.08.07 13:53:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Adean Starsailor
Originally by: raukosen Harb should have 3x HS
Shield tanking it is also better IMO but enjoy your dying slowly with your buffer because you got caught aligning
the three heatsinks adds like 30ish-50ish dps if that, and do people really tank shields with a harbi?
More important you can fit 2 TEs and some nano stuff in the lows then. Don't forget the Suitcase II. And it's no active shield tank. Just fit some shield buffer. The Harb becomes faster and deadlier that way. Great tracking and range. -
Save the missiles from the glowing blob :S
R ----------> * A --------> * V --------> * E -------> * N ---------> *
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Adean Starsailor
Amarr Conquest United
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Posted - 2010.08.07 13:58:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Adean Starsailor on 07/08/2010 13:57:55 Then can someone post this awsome nano shield buffer harbinger fit with its stats and what not, cause this sounds kindah iffy. Just my two cents.
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Denuo Secus
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Posted - 2010.08.07 14:18:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Denuo Secus on 07/08/2010 14:22:53
Originally by: Adean Starsailor Edited by: Adean Starsailor on 07/08/2010 13:57:55 Then can someone post this awsome nano shield buffer harbinger fit with its stats and what not, cause this sounds kindah iffy. Just my two cents.
Well the shield harb is just one possibility. Its maybe not that flexible due to less med slots for EW and tackling. But it does the damage job better. It depends on your environment.
[Harbinger, Shield] Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Tracking Enhancer II Tracking Enhancer II Nanofiber Internal Structure II
10MN MicroWarpdrive II Initiated Harmonic Warp Scrambler I V-M15 Braced Multispectral Shield Matrix Large Shield Extender II
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Small Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Hammerhead II x5
760 DPS with INMF and drones @9,7+8,2km 638 DPS with Scorch and drones @29+8,2km 0,12 rad/s tracking with INMF 0,09 rad/s tracking with Scorch 36k EHP 1245 m/s 7,8 s to warp
This fitting is vulnerable to Neuts. A cap booster instead of tackling would be another possibility. The strengths of this fitting are damage, tracking, range and speed.
Edit: tbh I wouldn't use medium drones. Two flights of small drones are better imho. But again it depends on the situation ofc. I used them here for better comparability with your fitting. -
Save the missiles from the glowing blob :S
R ----------> * A --------> * V --------> * E -------> * N ---------> *
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Khors
Amtek Inc
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Posted - 2010.08.07 14:25:00 -
[10]
Worthless to have a scram on a shieldharby imo, you want to keep distance and melt people with scorch.[Harbinger, shield] Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Fourier Transform I Tracking Program Damage Control II Nanofiber Internal Structure II Nanofiber Internal Structure II
Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Warp Disruptor II
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M [empty high slot]
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Hammerhead II x5
Damagecontrol for another heatsink if you like.
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Danny Lonnegan
Caldari United Amarr Templar Legion Fidelas Constans
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Posted - 2010.08.07 18:05:00 -
[11]
The Harbinger doesn't get any bonuses to armor, which is why shield fits are viable. Anyway, EVEfit warrioring got me this variant of Khors' fit:
[Harbinger, Shield Harbinger Mk.2] Nanofiber Internal Structure II Nanofiber Internal Structure II Fourier Transform I Tracking Program Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II
Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II V-M15 Braced Multispectral Shield Matrix
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M [empty high slot]
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Warrior II x5 Hornet EC-300 x5
Lasers do 479 DPS at 25km optimal. I usually prefer Hammerheads on the Harbinger because they provide a substantial boost to DPS, but since this ship doesn't have a web or a neut, light drones are its only defense against tacklers. I don't bother fitting tackle onto shield Harbingers; they need the mids for tanking.
The thing that scares me about this setup is the lack of tank. Without the DC II, it only has about 43,000 EHP. I'm wondering what would happen if you fit it with an afterburner and flew it like a Zealot, but I'm pretty sure its base speed is too low and its sig radius is too high for that to be effective.
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Ap0ll0n
Gallente Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2010.08.07 23:39:00 -
[12]
Don't really need all that tracking, HPL II tracks just fine without TE's. Also, never fly without point or scram on a BC. ECM drones is just way better than damage drones. Works excellent against assault frigs and other fast stuff you can't hit.
[Harbinger, Nano] Nanofiber Internal Structure II Nanofiber Internal Structure II Damage Control II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II
Large F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction Invulnerability Field II 10MN MicroWarpdrive II Dread Guristas Warp Scrambler
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M [empty high slot]
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Medium Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Vespa EC-600 x5
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Danny Lonnegan
Caldari United Amarr Templar Legion Fidelas Constans
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Posted - 2010.08.08 04:41:00 -
[13]
The TE's more for range than tracking, but I see your point. Speaking of points (ha ha), what's the rationale for always carrying a point on a BC? I understand why most fits have them, but I was assuming that in certain gang compositions, the extra tank is worth more to a shield Harb than a warp disruptor.
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Frozean
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Posted - 2010.08.08 04:50:00 -
[14]
If your gang is large enough, then you can start forfeting scrams and points for more tank/gank.
But if it isnt large enough, you wont have enough coverage for tackling frigs, where you will NEED both scrams and webs to stop them from freely tackling and you dont have enough to pop him quick enough with your med guns and drones.
Even worst if you all field hammerheads. Some ints laughs at those.
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Aralieus
Amarr The Inf1dels En Garde
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Posted - 2010.08.08 05:00:00 -
[15]
[Harbinger, GRRR] Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Damage Control II Heat Sink II Medium Armor Repairer II
Warp Scrambler II Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I, Tracking Speed Disruption Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I 10MN Afterburner II
Medium Diminishing Power System Drain I Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Hammerhead II x5
Requires good skill set to fly(BC V, DI V, Weapon Disruption IV, All related Cap skills V-4 at least) but deadly in the right hands.
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Danny Lonnegan
Caldari United Amarr Templar Legion Fidelas Constans
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Posted - 2010.08.08 05:09:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Frozean If your gang is large enough, then you can start forfeting scrams and points for more tank/gank.
But if it isnt large enough, you wont have enough coverage for tackling frigs, where you will NEED both scrams and webs to stop them from freely tackling and you dont have enough to pop him quick enough with your med guns and drones.
Even worst if you all field hammerheads. Some ints laughs at those.
I see where you're coming from. Of course, in small gangs, Harbingers tend to be called primary early, which is where the extra tank comes in handy.
Man, I've been flying Harbys for six months now and I still feel like a nublet.
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EFT Worrier
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Posted - 2010.08.10 00:00:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Danny Lonnegan
Man, I've been flying Harbys for six months now and I still feel like a nublet.
Well you sure fit like one. Try this:
[Harbinger, dual-prop pulse armour harb] Damage Control II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Adaptive Nano Plating II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Warp Disruptor II 10MN Afterburner II Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Cap Booster 400 10MN Digital Booster Rockets
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Acolyte EV-300 x5 Warrior II x5
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Danny Lonnegan
Caldari United Amarr Templar Legion Fidelas Constans
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Posted - 2010.08.10 00:18:00 -
[18]
Yes, actually, I've fit and flown a pulse/buffer Harbinger before; it's pretty much the orthodox Harby fit. The dual prop I've never seen before, though; what's the reasoning?
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EFT Worrier
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Posted - 2010.08.10 03:09:00 -
[19]
cause scrams are common and going fast is always good.
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XIRUSPHERE
Gallente THE DISC
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Posted - 2010.08.10 06:16:00 -
[20]
Edited by: XIRUSPHERE on 10/08/2010 06:19:33 [Harbinger, Pew Pew Lazorbeamz] Adaptive Nano Plating II 800mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Damage Control II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II
Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I Warp Disruptor II Langour Drive Disruptor I
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M [empty high slot]
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Hammerhead II X5
Don't forget the Lancer G-2 gamma they are dirt cheap. 899 DPS overloaded with my skills and clone.
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Lugalzagezi666
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Posted - 2010.08.10 09:47:00 -
[21]
[Harbinger, New Setup 1] Damage Control II 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II
Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I Small Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 400
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M [empty high slot]
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Fits with kza implant or cpu implant. If you want to use slaves/akemon/disruptor/small neut, just downgrade to deadspace anp. Drones to taste /hhs, valks, ecm vespas or warriors + ecm hornets/.
Btw i like shield fit more, if i want to fly slow plated brick i can as well use bs with bigger buffer and more dps.
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Indeterminacy
THORN Syndicate Controlled Chaos
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Posted - 2010.08.10 13:59:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Adean Starsailor Edited by: Adean Starsailor on 07/08/2010 13:35:43 Well I have found a decent fit I believe:
[Harbinger, PVP] Damage Control II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Adaptive Nano Plating II
10MN MicroWarpdrive I Warp Disruptor II Medium Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800 Stasis Webifier I
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Medium 'Gremlin' Power Core Disruptor I
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Hammerhead II x5
It has 620 dps and a 72.5k buffer. I just don't know if it is an effective boat against, say a one on one of a hurricane, a drake, or a brutix.
This is a nice solid base you can tweak for the situation a bit.
I load 5 warrior and 5 ec-300 for drones. Get the named MWD if you can't fit t2 (better cap use), but fit T2 if you can (less of a cap capacity penalty). I sometimes run dual webs instead of the cap booster. These are especially useful against increasingly common armor hacs and of course frigs.
Yes it's slow to align. Pay attention to fleet movements and FC orders. Don't travel solo.
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Proxyyyy
Caldari The Tuskers
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Posted - 2010.08.10 14:31:00 -
[23]
Here, showing support for this awesome looking ship. F4CK YEAH!
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Lauren Helix
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Posted - 2010.08.10 14:38:00 -
[24]
newb question here:
why nobody relies on active armor reppers? is because of being neuted in pvp or there is any other reasoning behind that?
thanks
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Kaileen Starsong
Amarr Veto. Veto Corp
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Posted - 2010.08.10 14:50:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Lauren Helix newb question here:
why nobody relies on active armor reppers? is because of being neuted in pvp or there is any other reasoning behind that?
thanks
1. They don't hold up well enough vs ship of similar size(like, at all) 2. Cap/module management 3. More slots used if fitted for active tank compared to buffer (4. On BS scale they're pain to fit)
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Mackenna
Amarr Eye of God Black Star Alliance
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Posted - 2010.08.10 16:51:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Lauren Helix newb question here:
why nobody relies on active armor reppers? is because of being neuted in pvp or there is any other reasoning behind that?
thanks
Even if you fitted the best armor repairer available, it will only slightly prolong the inevitable during a gang fight after you're called as a primary target. The Capacitor and CPU requirements that come with an active armor tank will force you to omit things that could help you and your gang more. There is little you can do vs. heavy neutralizers in any Amarr ship. Capacitor Boosters are your only option.
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superteds
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Posted - 2010.08.10 17:23:00 -
[27]
[Harbinger, PVP CR Shields] Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Tracking Enhancer II Tracking Enhancer II Nanofiber Internal Structure II
Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Large F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction Large F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction Warp Disruptor II
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M [empty high slot]
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Warrior II x5 Hornet EC-300 x5
Gang fit ofc.
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Indeterminacy
THORN Syndicate Controlled Chaos
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Posted - 2010.08.10 17:36:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Lauren Helix newb question here:
why nobody relies on active armor reppers? is because of being neuted in pvp or there is any other reasoning behind that?
thanks
the above reasons given and...
lag. in the event you are unable to activate modules...your tank is unaffected (the damage control being the exception). hopefully lag will 'break up' enough in time to call for and receive reps from logi.
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