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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 12 post(s) |
Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
9
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Posted - 2012.07.26 04:53:00 -
[1] - Quote
CCP Soundwave wrote:Tyberius Franklin wrote:Zagdul wrote:Gone are the days where EVE is a dangerous place. I seem to have missed the part when they made all player ships immune to damage. That won't happen as long as I'm around, btw. Suicide ganking wasn't designed to be profitable, it's meant to be an option that let's you punish someone else at your expense. The money you paid for a ship to gank with compared to the money lost by your target was completely off and this change should bring that to a better spot. That said, the numbers can still be adjusted.
Boom, headshot
/thread
Entire ganking team is babies!
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Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
9
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Posted - 2012.07.26 05:50:00 -
[2] - Quote
Richard Desturned wrote:CCP Soundwave wrote:Yeah my point is that I don't think they should be profitable to gank. I think it should be possible, but not necessarily profitable (profitable might be the wrong word, but more that the expenses should be higher for the attacker than the defender). so you're saying that it should literally cost half a billion to kill an afk mining hulk, one with nothing fitted as far as a tank, absolutely nothing trained as far as tanking skills and no effort taken to mitigate the risk of being blown up i'm not trying to put words in your mouth but that sounds like what you're trying to say by "it should cost more to kill a ship than what the ship is worth"
Quote:but more that the expenses should be higher for the attacker than the defender
Oooh, that's a Bingo!
Is that the way you say it? "That's a bingo?"
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Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
9
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Posted - 2012.07.26 07:11:00 -
[3] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:
I was under the impression that suicide ganking wasn't "designed" at all, insofar as all ships anywhere in space can be attacked by default.
CCP made the game mechanics knowing full well that ships could still fire on other ships in high sec even though war was not declared. CCP also sets the time to kill for CONCORD. CCP designed the setting, tools, everything that allows suicide ganking to occur, and has said that they are cool with it as long as someone does not avoid punishment by CONCORD. |
Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
9
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Posted - 2012.07.26 08:07:00 -
[4] - Quote
Quote:After the changes, mining profitability will drop off a cliff because the only people doing it will be those asleep at the keyboard or whose cats are playing for them.
Or maybe the gankers will have to go back to shooting each other to make their money. Get their asses back out there blowing each other up and creating upward pressure on the price of minerals.
The risk free money of blowing up a exhumer, looting the t2 strips, salvaging intact plates, and getting a isk GG pat on the ass from goons all for the cost of a well fit dessie isn't going to be there anymore.
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Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
9
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Posted - 2012.07.26 08:12:00 -
[5] - Quote
Quote:the fact still remains; mineral prices will be going down.
True. Its the nature of the industry. Just have to hope for more wars.
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Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
9
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Posted - 2012.07.26 08:23:00 -
[6] - Quote
Destiny Corrupted wrote:Ah, yes, the good old "gankers should grow balls and go shoot each other" argument. I guess for people who've never once fit guns to their ships, it always has to be one or the other.
You realize lots of miners producing cheap ships and lots of wars blowing up those cheap ships are good for the game, right? Circle of life/production/destruction?
PvP'ers cannibalizing miners is counter-productive to the flow of the game. Shooting your foot so to speak.
Pussies did it though because they could make a quick buck without having to put up a fight.
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Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
10
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Posted - 2012.07.26 08:59:00 -
[7] - Quote
Quote:So while you are celebrating cheaper ships, just be aware that you are supporting bots.
I'll leave it to CCP to declare whose a bot and whose a single mom hoovering scordite between loads of laundry.
In the end, the price of minerals will be determined by NullSec Wars (upward pressure) and CCP's lack/strength of bot banning (downward pressure.) Sure, there are lots of little things in between that affect it, but IMNSHO those are the big things. As the price fluxes, you will see real miners join and leave the profession. They are more reactionary, not a market maker, not a influence. Its big wars draining the supplies, and CCP either doing something or not to cut off the cheap minerals.
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Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
10
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Posted - 2012.07.26 09:07:00 -
[8] - Quote
Evei Shard wrote:Mara Rinn wrote:But the risk-free parking your exhumer in a belt and sucking up all the rocks or ice you can will be there.
This is false. You could increase the base EHP on a Hulk to 200,000, and it still would not be "risk free". The only risk-free thing you can do in Eve is stay docked.
I was docked and this guy wanted to sell me a Navy Raven real cheap since he was moving out to NullSec. But when I finished the trade he had given me a normal Raven. For some reason he won't talk to me anymore.
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Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
10
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Posted - 2012.07.26 09:38:00 -
[9] - Quote
Quote:This really looks like a change which does nothing else than protect players who are unable/refuse to protect themselves, and trying to balance the game to make it safer for the lowest common denominator just smacks of the wrong direction, totally
No...just, no.
See, Ruby Porto there, loves to post that list of "how not to die as a miner" in every thread he comes across where someone bitches and whines about getting ganked. I like it, I like alot of it. I actually have done quite a bit of it myself. I mine in grav sites and mission sites when I'm in high sec, otherwise I'm hidden in WH's.
Here's my problem with his list when it comes to fitting. Which is really what we're arguing about in this thread. The stat changes and fitting changes to barges.
He includes the exhumers using every single slot fitted for tank.
It is not acceptable that just to survive vs. a T1 dessie for all of 25 seconds a T2 Exhumer commit every single slot and rig to tanking.
Imagine if you flew anything other than an Abaddon in a Lvl 4 with every slot packed with T2 tank mods you were expected to explode within 30 seconds. There would be people complaining about the ship imbalance. People might feel that either the difficulty of the missions or the tanks of other batteships was off.
Needless to say, there would be some bittervet screaming about back in his day, there were no Abaddon's and they ran Lvl 4's in Fleets, exploded, and they liked it!
If an exhumer with half slots tank, half slots yield, had a chance against a decent ass dessie fit, we wouldn't be where we are today. But it doesn't, and here we are.
Suck it up, HTFU, and adapt.
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Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
10
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Posted - 2012.07.26 09:50:00 -
[10] - Quote
Quote:I can figure out how to avoid getting suicide ganked in a Hulk without any tank mods at all. If you can't, why should I stand back and let you get coddled by CCP? It's your own damn fault if you can't be creative enough to play this game properly.
Where did I say I have ever been caught? I avoid em by actions. Its fittings/stats that are the subject of disagreement. Keep up with the conversation.
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Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
10
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Posted - 2012.07.26 09:57:00 -
[11] - Quote
Quote:I don't see what the problem is, then.
Quote: Its fittings/stats that are the subject of disagreement.
*sigh* |
Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
10
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Posted - 2012.07.26 10:05:00 -
[12] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:Jypsie wrote:Quote:I don't see what the problem is, then. Quote: Its fittings/stats that are the subject of disagreement. *sigh* If we've demonstrated that tank is unnecessary, why are you still arguing about it?
We haven't. You're straw manning towards actions while the discusson is about statistics.
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Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
10
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Posted - 2012.07.26 10:27:00 -
[13] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:Jypsie wrote:We haven't. You're straw manning towards actions while the discusson is about statistics. If it helps you along: Quote:To "attack a straw man" is to create the illusion of having refuted a proposition by replacing it with a superficially similar yet unequivalent proposition (the "straw man"), and refuting it, without ever having actually refuted the original position. You know, I really wish we could go back to this magical time where I don't have to go back and remind people what they said. You said that you take issue with the fact that properly tanking an exhumer to survive a suicide ganking attempt requires using all of the ship's fitting slots, sacrificing cargohold and yield. I replied by stating this is irrelevant, because you can fit for max yield and avoid suicide ganking altogether. You continued by repeating your original position that the fitting stats were insufficient, which completely ignores my point that they're only insufficient to a completely inflexible and lazy play style. There's no straw man here.
Both you and I have stated that it is possible to avoid ganking via actions. I have stated that by current stauts quo of fittings and statistcs for exhumers, it is not reasonable to avoid suicide ganking. I have reflected that other members of this forum stated that the statistics were reasonable.
You and I and Ruby are right that people can avoid being ganked by actions. This is a straw man when the thread is about statistic changes and fittings. Its similar yet unequivalent position.
Look at the monkey
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Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
18
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Posted - 2012.07.30 02:04:00 -
[14] - Quote
Reiisha wrote:Fun to see people whine who's motivation clearly is to only pvp when their targets cannot defend themselves :)
I doubt they can even see the joke in this.
96 pages of ganker tears.
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Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
18
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Posted - 2012.07.30 02:18:00 -
[15] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote: No, I'm not, you are!
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Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
18
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Posted - 2012.07.30 02:53:00 -
[16] - Quote
La Nariz wrote:...instead you're getting ganked because you whine and tantrum over it...
Awesome, we've circled back to posts around 116'ish
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Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
20
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Posted - 2012.07.31 23:19:00 -
[17] - Quote
Andoria Thara wrote:Dave stark wrote:krickettt wrote:So much butt-hurt in this thread. The tears are glorious! i'll wager if you go through the whole threat there are more posts saying how many tears there are rather than posts containing actual tears. I always see more gloating on these forums than actual tears.
ITT I'm seeing it something more like this on both sides of the arguement.
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