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ceaon
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Posted - 2010.08.30 22:29:00 -
[1]
AMD is making a brand merge and ATI brand will be dead awesome way to **** up a brand like ATI i guess some CEO want short term record profits for awesome bonuses
I bet that on long term this will be bad for AMD and if it will they deserve it, is to buy AMD stock ?
Originally by: CCP Adida The male thread was locked because the discussion turned into transsexuals and man boobs.
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Charles Baker
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Posted - 2010.08.30 22:31:00 -
[2]
Long live Nvidia!!
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Barakkus
Onyx Industrial
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Posted - 2010.08.30 22:37:00 -
[3]
They've been trying to dump ATI for years now...not sure why ATI let AMD buy them to begin with...
Originally by: CCP Dropbear
rofl
edit: ah crap, dev account. Oh well, official rofl at you sir.
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ceaon
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Posted - 2010.08.30 23:20:00 -
[4]
Edited by: ceaon on 30/08/2010 23:19:42
Originally by: Barakkus not sure why ATI let AMD buy them to begin with...
because on a market whit only 2 major competitors mistakes cost allot
Originally by: CCP Adida The male thread was locked because the discussion turned into transsexuals and man boobs.
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Lithalnas
Amarr Privateers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2010.08.30 23:30:00 -
[5]
That and AMD thought they were going to streamline the production of chips through their 50, 45 and finally 40 nm chip fabrication facilities. Eventually AMD sold off global foundries because it was costing them money to both develop and pay the upkeep on the chip fab, now that they are separate, both entities are profitable.
AMD wants to kill the ATi name because they have wanted to brand AMD like Intel has branded their parts. They want to make AMD synonymous with total computing systems, this can bee seen in their 2010-2011-2010 roadmap known as "Fusion". -------------
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ceaon
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Posted - 2010.08.30 23:46:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Lithalnas AMD wants to kill the ATi name because they have wanted to brand AMD like Intel has branded their parts. They want to make AMD synonymous with total computing systems, this can bee seen in their 2010-2011-2010 roadmap known as "Fusion".
but that is stupid if that was a good idea today we had coca cola lemon and orange instead of fanta, coca cola energy drink instead of burn etc the bigger and wide a brand is harder is to move it
Originally by: CCP Adida The male thread was locked because the discussion turned into transsexuals and man boobs.
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Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.08.31 00:30:00 -
[7]
Meh, it's just the "ATI" name that's dead. The hardware will continue under an ever so slightly different name. _
Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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Lithalnas
Amarr Privateers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2010.08.31 01:08:00 -
[8]
I must make a correction, its not "fusion" but "vision" and the whole scheme can be found
Linkage -------------
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Wendat Huron
Stellar Solutions
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Posted - 2010.08.31 01:20:00 -
[9]
ITT Nerds writing obscure shorthand.
Delenda est achura. |
Vogue
Skynet Nexus
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Posted - 2010.08.31 10:05:00 -
[10]
ATI have been decent in consistently rolling out new GPU's on time that are competitive. Where Nvidia recently had a problem with yields and heat. To have these two competitors is good for the consumer. I hope with this rebrand ATI of old does not inherit AMD's poor delivery on new product roadmaps with a AMD management style takeover.
.................................................. Cylon cultural victor! |
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Diomedes Calypso
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Posted - 2010.08.31 15:07:00 -
[11]
All they need now is a little "boop -beep -beau -boop " of their own... maybe a "da da da dum" ala behtoven's 5th
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Corozan Aspinall
Party Time Inc.
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Posted - 2010.08.31 16:02:00 -
[12]
Only problem with this is .. AMD's consumer perceived brand image is worse than ATi's ..
Nobody goes to buy AMD if they want 'the best' or the 'fastest'. At least having ATi as a distinct brand allowed there to be some identification among consumers as to what that particular hardware represented in consumer choice terms.
Now its all going to be 'AMD' they are effectively leaving the GPU advertising market open to Nvidia uncontested. Even though they aren't actually/literally. Its going to be perceived as capitualation and customers shopping for GPU's will not look in the AMD section until a lot of money has been spent on brand awareness.
All seems kinda silly to me. There's nothing stopping AMD producing context/platform/market segment specific hardware via their subsidiary and shipping it as AMD solution/s. At least doing that for a few years would help prevent the chasm of consumer confidence/awareness associated with straight up merging the two brands. Ho hum. What do I know?
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Zeba
Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company
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Posted - 2010.08.31 19:59:00 -
[13]
Maybe the new moniker for ati will be some ornate made up symbol so they can put in a little text blurb underneath it with 'the brand formerly known as ati' in it so people will know what it is?
Originally by: CCP Oveur My milkshake brings all the boys to the yard.
Originally by: Ryhss There is no paranoia in Eve, everyone is out to get you....
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Corozan Aspinall
Party Time Inc.
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Posted - 2010.08.31 20:32:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Zeba Maybe the new moniker for ati will be some ornate made up symbol so they can put in a little text blurb underneath it with 'the brand formerly known as ati' in it so people will know what it is?
Like this?
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Corozan Aspinall
Party Time Inc.
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Posted - 2010.08.31 20:35:00 -
[15]
According to the article here:
Quote: 1) AMD brand preference triples when the person surveyed is aware of the ATI-AMD merger. 2) The AMD brand is viewed as stronger than ATI when compared to graphics competitors (presumably NVIDIA). 3) The Radeon and Fire Pro brands themselves (without ATI being attached to them) are very high as is.
Sheesh. Not. The first rule of running a corporation in to the ground: commission outside 'consultants' to conduct shyte quantitative surveys to tell you fanciful nonsense about your product/s. Fail. Hard fail. Strong fail.
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TimMc
Brutal Deliverance Intergalactic Exports Group
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Posted - 2010.08.31 22:04:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Corozan Aspinall Only problem with this is .. AMD's consumer perceived brand image is worse than ATi's ..
Nobody goes to buy AMD if they want 'the best' or the 'fastest'. At least having ATi as a distinct brand allowed there to be some identification among consumers as to what that particular hardware represented in consumer choice terms.
Now its all going to be 'AMD' they are effectively leaving the GPU advertising market open to Nvidia uncontested. Even though they aren't actually/literally. Its going to be perceived as capitualation and customers shopping for GPU's will not look in the AMD section until a lot of money has been spent on brand awareness.
All seems kinda silly to me. There's nothing stopping AMD producing context/platform/market segment specific hardware via their subsidiary and shipping it as AMD solution/s. At least doing that for a few years would help prevent the chasm of consumer confidence/awareness associated with straight up merging the two brands. Ho hum. What do I know?
This.
AMD is known for being cheaper than Intel.
ATi is known for being a competent rival to nVidia, with buggy drivers.
Why they want to lose that image, I do not know. Plus ATi logo is cooler.
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ceaon
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Posted - 2010.08.31 22:46:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Corozan Aspinall Edited by: Corozan Aspinall on 31/08/2010 20:40:51 According to the article here:
Quote: 1) AMD brand preference triples when the person surveyed is aware of the ATI-AMD merger. 2) The AMD brand is viewed as stronger than ATI when compared to graphics competitors (presumably NVIDIA). 3) The Radeon and Fire Pro brands themselves (without ATI being attached to them) are very high as is.
Sheesh. Not. The first rule of running a corporation in to the ground: commission outside 'consultants' to conduct shyte quantitative surveys to tell you fanciful nonsense about your product/s. Fail. Hard fail. Strong fail.
you can add this ppl change their behavior when they are aware you make a survey or when they are observed
Originally by: CCP Adida The male thread was locked because the discussion turned into transsexuals and man boobs.
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Zeba
Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company
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Posted - 2010.09.01 02:45:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Corozan Aspinall
Originally by: Zeba Maybe the new moniker for ati will be some ornate made up symbol so they can put in a little text blurb underneath it with 'the brand formerly known as ati' in it so people will know what it is?
Like this?
Pfft.. There is always going to be a budget conscious segment of the gamer population that will buy into the cheap but useable cards. Even though I am an nvidia fanboi(too many core issues with ati products. sorry) I recognise that without a valid competitor even nvidia will waffle and start making crap just because they can. Hopefully this move will bolster the former ati sales due to internal streamlining and being able to put out an even cheaper product but I guess time will tell.
Originally by: CCP Oveur My milkshake brings all the boys to the yard.
Originally by: Ryhss There is no paranoia in Eve, everyone is out to get you....
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Zirse
Minmatar ZED Industries
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Posted - 2010.09.01 11:01:00 -
[19]
Originally by: TimMc
AMD is known for being cheaper than Intel.
Meh it wasn't that long ago that no one would be caught dead with an Intel CPU in their rig. A few years is a long time in that industry and its impossible to say where it will be in a few more years.
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Vogue
Skynet Nexus
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Posted - 2010.09.01 11:06:00 -
[20]
Like a lot of consumers I switched to AMD CPU's after the bad pentium 4. And I stayed with AMD up to the AMD x2 6000+. By then the performance of it's cpu's was not as good as the current Intel's. So i switched in January to an Intel I5 which is OC'd to 4ghz.
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Grez
Empire Assault Corp Dead Terrorists
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Posted - 2010.09.01 11:20:00 -
[21]
Switched over to ATI during the NVIDIA 5 series debacle. Haven't switched back. Owned some very nice 9600, 9800, X1900, HD4870 and a HD5850. All the best cards of their time. Never had any issues beyond little driver faults (but then I had them at NVIDIA too).
Sad to see the brand name go, but I've also owned flawless AMD processors, so no biggy. ---
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Corozan Aspinall
Party Time Inc.
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Posted - 2010.09.01 12:22:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Corozan Aspinall on 01/09/2010 12:27:34
Originally by: TimMc
This.
AMD is known for being cheaper than Intel.
ATi is known for being a competent rival to nVidia, with buggy drivers.
Why they want to lose that image, I do not know. Plus ATi logo is cooler.
Well we're just losers playing an MMO, or not playing it to be more accurate, so we really don't know jack ..
However .. I think .. such as that matters .. they are well aware of the truth of your summary there. But ..
Originally by: Zeba Pfft.. There is always going to be a budget conscious segment of the gamer population that will buy into the cheap but useable cards. Even though I am an nvidia fanboi(too many core issues with ati products. sorry) I recognise that without a valid competitor even nvidia will waffle and start making crap just because they can. Hopefully this move will bolster the former ati sales due to internal streamlining and being able to put out an even cheaper product but I guess time will tell.
This is the reality. AMD have massive debt, or did last time I checked. They insanely over-extended themselves to acquire ATi in the first place and then promptly ejected their CEO (who had been a liability for years) and replaced him with a bean counter to get them back on track. If you recall they lost out big time to Intel on some serious anti-trust issues that cost them big money and they never really recovered from it, even if they thought they had.
I'm guessing they were/are looking at years of steady growth to claw their way back to profitability (in heavily contested markets or more preferably in new ones they can create and control however briefly) and most of the original strategy has been flushed in favour of short-mid term liquidity. Hence, if any of that is still or ever was close to the mark, the dumpage of ATi: Its a costs/bottom line move taken, probably, in full awareness of the impact it will have on the GPU market. They obviously have other ideas and/or feel that the continued exhistence of expensive subsidiaries like ATi are not worth the outlay. They've given up on the standalone GPU market imho. Presumably in favour of the integrated solution/s they have been spinning to us for the last three to four years now with little to no end product to show for it.
AMD bankrupt? Possibility tbh. Or at least seriously down-sized. I bet they would have liked to jettison ATi to someone else but there isn't anyone else who isn't part of the Wintel NAP nonsense is there? Certainly not in these troubled economic times and with the cash flow to outright acquire ATi. AMD probably think the intellectual assets ATi have are worth keeping/denying to competitors anyway, even if the market share/brand is not.
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Vogue
Skynet Nexus
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Posted - 2010.09.01 12:30:00 -
[23]
Problem AMD has is that the corporate IT market is very conservative and likes to play it safe with purchases. In my IT career I worked at 9 places and not one had AMD CPU's in desktop PC's.
Intel has far superior economies of scale than AMD. I think if Intel wanted to they could ride a vicous price war and put AMD out of business. But the US anti competetive regulotory bodies won't let that happen.
AMD out of business would be really bad news for consumers. Intel would let prices rise to increase stock dividends for greedy investors.
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Corozan Aspinall
Party Time Inc.
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Posted - 2010.09.01 12:38:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Vogue Problem AMD has is that the corporate IT market is very conservative and likes to play it safe with purchases. In my IT career I worked at 9 places and not one had AMD CPU's in desktop PC's.
Intel has far superior economies of scale than AMD. I think if Intel wanted to they could ride a vicous price war and put AMD out of business. But the US anti competetive regulotory bodies won't let that happen.
AMD out of business would be really bad news for consumers. Intel would let prices rise to increase stock dividends for greedy investors.
This. Where does AMD make its profits? CPU's don't matter anymore, they have been faster than anything, even the code for most applications and OS's, can optimally make use of, for years now.
GPUs? Huge overheads, small returns. Massive expense outlay in advertising and too reliant on other markets ie memory to be worth risking the house on.
Where is the money? As you say Vogue .. its corporate and embedded. And AMD has no foothold in either of those as far as I can tell.
Maybe they are going for the integrated/portable market. Maybe they are teetering on the brink. Who knows. Not I for sure.
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ceaon
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Posted - 2010.09.01 16:29:00 -
[25]
Edited by: ceaon on 01/09/2010 16:32:53
Originally by: Vogue AMD out of business would be really bad news for consumers. Intel would let prices rise to increase stock dividends for greedy investors.
but if there is a awesome profit other will jump on to get a slice of the profit this is why regulations are bad, regulation keep a live bad products
Originally by: CCP Adida The male thread was locked because the discussion turned into transsexuals and man boobs.
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Toshiro GreyHawk
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Posted - 2010.09.01 20:21:00 -
[26]
Regulations are good. Regulations keep the robber barons from owning everything.
There is a tendency towards those who have money - getting all the money. The only recourse the public has - if their government won't do it for them - is to revolt. Revolutions ... are like ... really painful ... and don't always have good outcomes.
Regulations - if applied - would have protected us from the recent recession.
A regulated power industry a few years back would not have ****d the citizens of California - the way the unregulated industry they have now - did.
The problem with regulations is that they have to strike a balance between protecting the public and not driving all your capital over seas. That isn't always all that easy to do. But **** up either way and you are going to suffer for it.
Anyway ... I've got a lot of ATI stuff I've gotten a lot of use out of, though I've had a lot of it fry on me. For older systems the only decent new cards I could find were ATI. It's a real pain in the ass with their drivers though ...
Anyway ... we'll see what happens. There's something of a weeding out process the up and coming new kids on the block have to make it through as they become part of the established powers. If you're really big and well established ... you can **** up ... some ... and sorta get away with it - you also have the resources to come back and regain your lead. AMD right now sorta reminds me of Borland when they bought Ashton-Tate ... oops ...
Orbiting vs. Kiting Faction Schools |
Corozan Aspinall
Party Time Inc.
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Posted - 2010.09.01 21:27:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Toshiro GreyHawk
Borland
Good God. Blast from the past! What happened to them?
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Toshiro GreyHawk
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Posted - 2010.09.02 00:36:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Corozan Aspinall
Originally by: Toshiro GreyHawk
Borland
Good God. Blast from the past! What happened to them?
Borland.
The short version being that Phillip Kahn's ego got the better of him and he bit off more than he could chew. Like AMD taking on Intel - he was going to take on Microsoft - and lost badly.
Borland was doing OK producing Software Development tools as they were very user friendly so that a lot of programmers preferred them to Microsoft's much more powerful but less friendly programs. Serious developers had to use the Microsoft compilers as there were a lot of functions which Borland simply didn't support. I did an evaluation on them for my job and ... we had to go with Microsoft as the Borland compiler just wouldn't do what we needed. Then of course ... Microsoft got better ... and provided a level of support that Borland couldn't touch - especially when it came to Windows.
But the thing that really did Borland in - was wanting to move out of the development tools area (where they had been competitive) and into selling Office packages to compete with Microsoft on all levels. To do this they needed a Data Base program and they bought Ashton-Tate.
Ashton-Tate's dBase was one of the big players in the DOS world but they, in a classic example of the Computer Company Life Cycle, after having worked themselves senseless getting to the top - then relaxed and sat on their laurels ... and were quickly surpassed by other data base companies - especially Oracle - which took over much of the corporate world dBase had ruled. For the desk top - instead of buying a company on it's way down - Microsoft bought FoxPro - a company on it's way up - and then proceeded to thrash Borland in that market. Borland acquired Paradox, a good Data Base program but again from the DOS era and ended up with two data base programs that didn't really make the transition to Windows.
Then of course there was the Windows vs. OS/2 thing ... but that's an entire subject unto itself. A number of DOS giants like Lotus - bet on 0S/2 - and lost badly.
If you're interested in that kind of thing - read "Accidental Empires" by Robert X. Cringlely (not his real name). It's pretty old now but explains a lot about the early days of micro computers. I've gotten vague on when it cut off though ... so the Borland and Lotus debacles may well not be in there.
Orbiting vs. Kiting Faction Schools |
Obsidian Hawk
RONA Legion
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Posted - 2010.09.02 02:53:00 -
[29]
If this is all true, AMD will shoot themselves in the foot with this.
*huggles his x1600 pro* IT STILL WORKS!
But still AMD is committing suicide with this if they follow through. The name ATI sells it not AMD. plust the ATI girls are hot.
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