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Koen L
Galactic Defence Consortium United Pod Service
1
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Posted - 2011.09.26 11:33:00 -
[31] - Quote
A tech 3 Mining ship should make mining in 0.0 space more attractive for (high sec) miners. Doesnt really need to make more yield in general, but being specialized in abc ores and stealth mining would be interesting. It should balance the fact that ratting in 0.0 is more attractive then mining at all.
I have seen so many 0.0 systems with full rich belts of best ore but nobody is mining it. Tech 3 Ships could make mining more interesting and lucrativ if done right. I like the idea of stealth mode for those ships, better combat abilities and higher tank plus versatility for special tasks. Fit it for one type of ore with a good tank and able to disappear fast if uncovered, or being able to defend against attackers. Make it elite. Make it expensive. Make it fast. |
Obsidiana
White-Noise
5
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Posted - 2011.09.26 12:32:00 -
[32] - Quote
/me wants sniper miner to kill rocks from mad range... and maybe a clocking device too. |
AureoLion
Etoilles Mortant Ltd. Solyaris Chtonium
1
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Posted - 2011.09.26 14:59:00 -
[33] - Quote
In order to implement one, especially if it has an increased yield, one of those four is needed: Bump-up of mineral consumption. Mining bot scourging (Including ratting bots in drone regions) Revamping of Drone Loots to get refinables out Nerf to refining values of EVERYTHING. (As a bonus, destroys the whole "enough trit/pye for a SC in two JFs" thing) I'd be for refinables out, but still, any is good.
Starting cargo of ~6000 CPU/PG contrains specified in their subs EHP ^same - Hull/Armor HP should be pretty low, to dampen the DCs usefulness, since the ship is balanced on the assumption that lows are yield-buffers. Base Speed/Agility of a 25-50% buffed version of a Skiff.
Role Bonus: Mining lasers have been refocused, allowing their pulling strenght to destabilize a warp core. Mining lasers can be used on ships, hitting for minimal damage (iirc 100 dps/laser) and doing a -1 warp core strenght. Gas harvesters do a light webbing (20%), ice harvesters have a chance to jam (~1.5 strenght) and deep core miners do their damage reduced by 80%, but directly applied to the hull, bypassing armor and shield.
Now, for planning: Offensive subsystems: - Hyper-Focusing Beams - ~120% of a hulk's yield. - 3 highs, 3 turrets. Damage bonus of 50%. - Hauler Reconfiguration - Gains an Ore Bay of 200k m3. 6 highs, 0 turrets. - Covert Ops Reconfiguration: Extra highs for cloak, can use cov ops cloak, can jump on cov ops bridges. ~90% of a hulk's yield. - 5 highs, 3 turrets. - Drone Reconfiguration: Bandwidth upped from 50 to 125. Can field 5 additional mining drones. Mining drones mine 300% more. Drone damage up by 25%. 3 highs, 0 turrets. (That should make up 10 drones, base 600, up to 2400. Rigs may throw it off balance, though.
Defensive Subsystems: Supplemental Screening (+2m) Amplification Node. (+2m +1L) Reinforced Shield Emitter - Can use Stront to Reinforce shields for up to 5 minutes. Consumption balanced to about ~1mil a minute. Can't cancel until completed. Will not be able to move for 3min after the Reinforce finishes. Tactical Boosting Reconfiguration: +2 high, can fit boosting links. (+1m)
It's important to note that ONLY the amplification node subsystem should be able to tank triple-BS spawns with ease (Others should with deadspace fittings). EHP with no faction mods should be around 50k, 150k for supplemental screening, and proper loss for the -2 mids on the reinforced shields and -1 mid on Tactical Boosting, bringing total ehp down to something 30k and 40k. Starting cargo of ~6000 CPU/PG contrains specified in their subs EHP ^same - Hull/Armor HP should be pretty low, to dampen the DCs usefulness, since the ship is balanced on the assumption that lows are yield-buffers.
Electronic subsystems: CPU Efficiency Gate - Fatter CPU for active tanking. (+3 mids) Long-Range Reconfiguration: 100% bonus to targeting range, 300% bonus to mining laser range. (+2 mids) Emergent Locus Analyzer: 50% bonus to scan strenght, (+1 high +3 mids) Sub-Optimal Jamming Arrays: 50% bonus to jammer strenght & range. -50% to shield HP and boosting. (+4 mids)
Engineering Subsystems Power Core Multiplier - (+2 mid, +1 low) Allows enough grid to fit another LSE. Capacitor Regeneration Matrix (+2 mid, +1 low) Allows enough to fit and run a XL booster. Compactation Refocusing - Grid goes down to non-LSE allowing, unless using drone offensive sub. compact ore, about only what it mines itself. (+1 mid) Warp Core Power Relay - Max cap down by 20%. Warp strenght of +4. (+1 mid)
Compactation Refocusing and Warp Core Power Relays have a CPU loss over the other systems, about the need to run an additional MLU.
Propulsion Subsystems Cargo Bay Reconfiguration - +100% cargohold, Mass doubles, max speed -50%, can't fit AB/MWD. +1 low, +1 mid. Interdiction Nullifier - Immune to bubbles, +2 warp strenght, stacks with power relay. +1 low. Propulsion Side-Powering - Eliminates the capacitor need malus of a MWD, AB has +50% speed bonus. +1 low, +1 mid. Jump Drive - Ship gains a jump drive that can lock on normal cynos. +1 low, +1 mid.
All in all, a fleet of those WILL be able to put up a fight against a small gang, and a single one will be able to resist a short amount of time to wait on cavalry. For use in hisec, suicide ganking would be out of it's way, like it's out of it's way on tengus, though. Faction fit it and it'll blow up.
To rebalance the nerf of yield, Faction MLUs should pop up, and be quite expensive. Same applies to faction miners. T1 MLUs should be around ~3%, T2 ~5% and Faction ~7% - At the moment, using double MLU's is basically needed.
ORE LPs would become actually wanted, driving someone to that region of nullsec to do actual missioning. Surely won't hurt. Numbers _will_ need tweaking.
Mining should be able to pull in higher numbers with higher investment. And the ships should be able to defend themselves to a degree, like missioning ships can defend themselves, to a degree.
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stoicfaux
240
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Posted - 2011.09.26 16:22:00 -
[34] - Quote
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote: So, going on the 5 possible subsystems, where is there any advantage to any of them for mining ? More CPU ? Covert Configuration ?
Some fuzzy ideas:
Offensive: * Increased laser mining amount * reduced strip miner cycle time * increased drone bay, drone damage bonus, and drone travel speed * Q-ship: moderate bonuses to guns/missiles * Increased life of T2 mining crystals, increased yield of crystals
Defensive: * Increased mineral specific cargo bay * Increased buffer tank + resists * Increased active boosting tank * Fleet boosters - mining links/boosters
Electronics: * Increased fitting- ex: CPU Efficiency Gate * Boost tractors, probes, and mining scanners * CovertOps cloak * Super boosted tractors with increase to number of targeted items, limited RR * Detects afk cloakers * Automatically dumps minerals to jet-can
Propulsion: * Increased Warp Strength plus agility * Increased Agility * Faster warp speed, reduced capacitor needed for warps. * MWD - used for Q-ship, to cloak+mwd
Engineering * increase life of T2 mining crystals? * increase general purpose cargo space by reducing "engine size": reduced agility, slower warp, lower top speed, reduced capacitor. Turns you into a space whale/mini-freighter so you can transport your rocks to a market hub.
Although TBH, I imagine miners would be happier with a T3 Secure, Fast Anchoring, Anchor Anywhere, Jet-Can.
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Azaraius
Pawn Brokers
0
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Posted - 2011.09.26 23:49:00 -
[35] - Quote
Are you guys all forgetting CCP's idea to have Planatary ring mining? At one ofe the last Fan fests I believe I remember they were working on making it possible to give miners something new to do... Now on that note... maybe you need a t3 mining ship to stay in position with a moving ring. Maybe t3 mining ships would need thrusters on all sides and special tractor beams to pull in astroids from deep in the ring (maybe a ring would be too think to fly through). And arent these forums for CCP to read through for new ideas anyway, so who knows. |
GooieGoober
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2011.09.26 23:54:00 -
[36] - Quote
What about adding a module that allows for remote refining?
it would be soo cool to be able to mine the roids and refine on the spot...maybe at a minor loss...but you could haul away much more in the cargo bay.
I had often thought about a complete change in the mining operation....maybe instead of lasers/strips, you just collect the roids, break them up into smaller fragments, take those back to the starbase and then "prescreen" the usless material from them, then run them through the refinery. Prescreening would take time...unlike the instant refining.
I say pre-screening...because the mining laser seems to do this for you. There is no way a hulk is going to be able to haul in a few huge veld roids if that was just veldspar in them in any reasonable time.
Maybe add this feature to a T2 Orca/Roq? |
Barbara Nichole
Cryogenic Consultancy Black Sun Alliance
5
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Posted - 2011.09.28 03:52:00 -
[37] - Quote
For T3 what makes sense is a wormhole offering. so make it a 5 high slot with bonuses to gas harvesting.
And yes both the Mackiinaw and the Skiff out mine the hulk on special skills for ice and Mercoxit. I see no reason not to make a really good gas havest specialty ship. [IMG]http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a208/DawnFrostbringer/OldST.jpg[/IMG] |
Marl Xun
Xun Armaments Corporation
0
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Posted - 2011.09.28 14:59:00 -
[38] - Quote
Could T3 ships could also be used to combat bots?
[Ore Type] subprocessor - increases the yield of the listed ore type but dedicates the ship's hardware to that ore type. You cannot mine any other type of ore. This would, if nothing else, force macroers to return to base to refit from time to time
Microcompressor - compresses ore in the same way as a Rorqual (much lower efficiency however, 2:1, 3:1, etc). Does not require fuel or lock down the ship, but cannot mine ore while compressing. This will allow people who are not afk to mine-compress-mine while at a belt, increasing overall yeild while making things more difficult for macroers.
I'd like something to do with drones, but I'm not sure what at this point. |
Hestia Mar
Calmaretto
0
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Posted - 2011.09.28 15:21:00 -
[39] - Quote
I agree that there cannot be changes to yield and so on because of the ultimate effect that would have on the market, so instead of increasing yeidl and/or barge cargo capacity, give miners the opportunty to scan down grav sites or other mining opportunities with ores that are more rare, while in their hulks.
Given the current RL questions about dark matter and stuff, lets have dark matter (or antimatter - where does the AM in ammo come from I wonder) as a substance that has to be scanned down and harvested, then refined in the players PI set up, before it can go to market.
Maybe the result could be specialised fuel for supercaps (or something similar) so that there is a demand generated...how much would a supercap pilot be willing to pay to have fuel delivered to him...-ú-ú-ú-ú-ú!
H |
DrBmN
Axial tilt Blue Moon Alliance
0
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Posted - 2011.09.29 08:35:00 -
[40] - Quote
a very interesting thought.
i would love to see t3 mining ships to happen.
let me add this, in every mining crystals description it say that the charge size is SMALL, wonder what upcoming ship will use a large one ;) |
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Amsterdam Conversations
Cheesecake Starshine
14
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Posted - 2011.09.29 11:07:00 -
[41] - Quote
AureoLion wrote: Propulsion Subsystems Interdiction Nullifier - Immune to bubbles, +2 warp strenght, stacks with power relay. +1 low.
This is probably the most ******** thing you could ever do. Not only does it allow for safe 0.0 mining, even more so it makes botters completely uncatchable. Even without the nullification thingy, I would never give a default WCS to any ship but those who have them. The T2 haulers have 20 seconds align time, so it's fine, but I can already see players crying for mining ships with 30k m-¦ cargo bay, +2 warp stab, nullifier, covert cloak and 10 seconds align time.
T3 nullifiers were one of the worst things CCP has done recently. I don't really mind them on T3 cruisers, but on mining ships that is pure comedy. Maybe if in turn they took 30 seconds to align, but other than that, no.
And to clarify: I don't ever bubble camp, I use nullified T3s sometimes too, and yeah they're terribly broken. |
Skippermonkey
Tactical Knightmare
59
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Posted - 2011.09.29 11:33:00 -
[42] - Quote
why do you need a new t3 ship?
just get ORE to release a new line of INDUSTRY subsystems for the current t3 ships |
ehon
Edani Innovations
2
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Posted - 2011.09.29 19:35:00 -
[43] - Quote
Tau Cabalander wrote:There can never be more yield than a Hulk. CCP won't accept that, as it would affect the markets.
every thing effects every thing thus one has to do things no matter what it does.... |
ehon
Edani Innovations
2
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Posted - 2011.09.29 19:39:00 -
[44] - Quote
i don't see the t3 making the yields killer higher really. i was hoping for some other stuff like being able to fit a tank while having max mining speeds. cargo space could be nice. Plus null keeps complaining about their null sec not moving the resources it needs the t3 could be more of a battle ship size with a tank some hold and yield.
the biggest complaint i have had for this inferior barges has been the complete lack of tank ability. even focused on pure tank they could not surpass a basic crusier fit. |
Father Ted
Hedion University Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2011.09.29 22:04:00 -
[45] - Quote
I could see a T3 only ships miner module that compressed the ore. T2 miners (not strip miners) with compression unit in High Mid or Low. Limited by the subsystems and how many turrets they allow.
Same yield as any t2 miner, so less than Hulks. But he compression would make the smaller volume hold worth while for low and null sec mining. |
Vanessa Vansen
Ore Hogz Rolling Thunder.
4
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Posted - 2011.09.30 06:36:00 -
[46] - Quote
There were several similar threads in the old forum e.g. http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1568829
The following corresponds to post 14 of the thread mentioned above
Quote:The bonus of the industrial modules correspond now to the exhumer bonus, i.e. more yield instead of faster cycles.
1. Industrial ("offensive") subsystem the first three subsystems should lead to a similar yield than the corresponding exhumer but with faster cycles
a) ore prospector (resembles Hulk) 3 high slots Able to equip Strip Miner and Ice Harvester turrets. 15% better yield for Strip Miner (covers Mining Barge Skill Bonus) 3% better yield for Strip Miners per level. (covers Exhumers Skill Bonus)
b) icebreaker (resembles Mackinaw) 2 high slots Able to equip Strip Miner and Ice Harvester turrets. 100% bonus Ice Harvester yield but 25% penalty to ice harvester duration 5% reduction in Ice Harvester duration per level.
c) mercoxit prospector (resembles Skiff) 1 high slot Able to equip Strip Miner and Ice Harvester turrets. 15% better yield for Strip Miner (covers Mining Barge Skill Bonus) 60% bonus to Mercoxit Mining Crystal yield multiplier per level
d) gas harvester 5 high slots 100% bonus Gas Cloud Harvester yield but 25% penalty to Gas Cloud Harvester duration 5% reduction in Gas Cloud Harvester duration per level.
2. "Electronics" subsystem
a) Harvester/Miner Range 5% bonus to range of strip miners/ice harvester/gas cloud harvester per level. (max. targeting range should be able to cover that with maximum skills)
b) Survey Range 50% bonus to range of survey scanner per level
c) Emergent Locus Analyzer see corresponding T3 cruiser sub system
d) Improved Mercoxit Mining 20% reduced chance of Mercoxit gas cloud forming per level
3. "Engineering" subsystem 4500m3 Cargo hold (that should do), 25m3 drone bay, 25 Mbit/sec drone bay, 2 low slots, 4 medium slots
a) Covert Reconfiguration Can fit covert ops cloaks. -96% to -100% reduced CPU need for cloaking device per level.
b) Ore Packing 4000m3 Ore Hold per level.
c) Warp Stabilizing +0.4 warp strength per level.
d) Drone Upgrade 5m3 drone bay per level. 5 Mbit/sec bandwidth per level.
Defensive and Propulsion similar to corresponding Tengu subsystems, warfare processor -> foreman processor with bonus on Mining Foreman Links.
Please notice that it is not possible to have all three sub-systems (covert reconfiguration, warp stabilizing and interdiction nullifier) at once, but two off them. |
Hebrang
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2011.09.30 10:34:00 -
[47] - Quote
How about they just fix harvester implants and turn them into what we want .... and have money to pay.... +5s with bonus to striper range.... cause +3 no thank you thats for pvp |
AureoLion
Etoilles Mortant Ltd. Solyaris Chtonium
4
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Posted - 2011.09.30 12:36:00 -
[48] - Quote
Amsterdam Conversations wrote:AureoLion wrote: Propulsion Subsystems Interdiction Nullifier - Immune to bubbles, +2 warp strenght, stacks with power relay. +1 low.
This is probably the most ******** thing you could ever do. Not only does it allow for safe 0.0 mining, even more so it makes botters completely uncatchable. Even without the nullification thingy, I would never give a default WCS to any ship but those who have them. The T2 haulers have 20 seconds align time, so it's fine, but I can already see players crying for mining ships with 30k m-¦ cargo bay, +2 warp stab, nullifier, covert cloak and 10 seconds align time. T3 nullifiers were one of the worst things CCP has done recently. I don't really mind them on T3 cruisers, but on mining ships that is pure comedy. Maybe if in turn they took 30 seconds to align, but other than that, no. And to clarify: I don't ever bubble camp, I use nullified T3s sometimes too, and yeah they're terribly broken. Apart that tacklers for gangs with multiple points are quite common, yes, that subsystem (AND the other +warp ones) are meant to increase inertia substantially, since the inertia is derived from the warp core in this universe. Forgot to mention that, i seem to take fluff as gameplay value. with both stabilizing subs and no nano's, it should align in 40s or so. That ship tanks quite a bit, and it's not meant to be shotted by a scout, anyway. We can't motivate ship balancing on bots, though. |
Weaselior
BUTTECORP INC Goonswarm Federation
63
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Posted - 2011.09.30 14:40:00 -
[49] - Quote
there's never going to be any more t3 ships, all the people involved are now making pretty dresses for your dollies |
Sobkilla
Sob Industries League of Hephaestus
0
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Posted - 2011.09.30 20:48:00 -
[50] - Quote
id have to say the best t3 miner would be to take a hulk give it a lil more ehp/tank and 1 extra high slot for a covert ops cloak all that is needed null / low sec mining would become alot more popular then it is now. which would not hurt the market values of ore as there would still be plenty of them getting caught uncloaked and destroyed. |
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Fiedems
Capital Industries Research And Development Fidelas Constans
0
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Posted - 2011.10.01 05:43:00 -
[51] - Quote
I like a lot of the ideas here, really like the idea of my hulk being able to survive a bit longer. However, I kinda wish they would just fix the hang ups on asteroids.
I'm so tired of not being able to warp because I'm stuck on a piece of space dust. Recruiter for CIRAD http://cirad.f-con.us/ We are always looking for good pilots, join CIRAD PUBLIC to chat. |
Doracos
Teylas Inc.
0
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Posted - 2011.10.01 12:43:00 -
[52] - Quote
t3 could bring one important thing.... MORE HP - make the more difficult to gang in hi sec. |
Igniskhin
Veyr The Veyr Collective
0
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Posted - 2011.10.02 01:01:00 -
[53] - Quote
Although a T3 industrial ship would awesome (cov-ops, nullifier, better align times, etc etc.) am i the only one who would be happy if they tripled the Hulk's power grid allowing for a cruiser size tank? |
tEcHnOkRaT
Aliastra Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2011.10.02 09:21:00 -
[54] - Quote
the only thing needed for miners would be a bigger tank and more storage. higher speed, allign and manouverability would be a nice kandy. but they shouldnt have more mining yield then a hulk with max skills
simply said WE NEED A HULK WITH MORE EHP :D ^^ |
WHDolphin
W.H. Inc.
0
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Posted - 2011.10.02 09:43:00 -
[55] - Quote
as both a group and solo miner in Eve starting back in 07, I can say the yeld of a hulk is a great yeld. and I would say the people in this form saying the miners dont need a T3 ship probly belong to the people that like to gank us at the belts. We Miners Need A Tank Mining Ship. And That Type of ship would bring more miners into Low Sec if not into the 0.0 |
tEcHnOkRaT
Aliastra Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2011.10.02 13:19:00 -
[56] - Quote
Skippermonkey wrote:why do you need a new t3 ship?
just get ORE to release a new line of INDUSTRY subsystems for the current t3 ships
this one |
Battle On
Jitex Inc.
0
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Posted - 2011.10.02 15:53:00 -
[57] - Quote
i would like to see the T3 mining ship as following:
just like a T3 Cruiser, you can modify it however you like.
if you wanna mine ice, you can fit it with 3 icemining lasers and some modules to boost cycletime/range if you wanna mine regular ore, you can fit 3 regular stripminers and some subsystems to boost your cycletime/range if you wanna mine morphite, you can fit it with 2 deepcore stripminers ans some subsystems to boost your cycletime/range/chance on explosion decrease if you wanna harvest gas, you can fit it with 6 gasharvesters and some special subsystems for more yield (a rokh can fit 8 harvesters so it woul be a shame is a BS would beat a T3 miner). if you wanna do this all, you can choice a combined one with with 4 slots (3 for turrets and 1 for something else like a cloak) and subsystems for the thing you are doing.
also there should be subsystems for faster ability, so that it will be faster then the exhumers and mining barges. the cargo will be depending on which subsystem you use. instead of an "cargo hold" you will have a "ore hold" (like an orca), "ice hold" or "gas hold" + a cargohold of 1,000 m3 for the crystals. the amount of cargo these will have, will be the job of CCP. if you ask me i would say give the ore on 10,000m3, the ice one 15,000m3 and the gas one 5,000m3.
midslots will be depending on which subsystem you use for that. you can choice for boosting stuff or for tanky stuff. same goes for lowslots.
this all wouldnt effect the market too much and will give more satisfaction to the player for the more profit he makes. |
Vanilla Twilight
Your Slit is Mine Federation
18
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Posted - 2011.10.02 17:49:00 -
[58] - Quote
T3 miner should have a better tank to be against suicide ganks. |
Weaselior
BUTTECORP INC Goonswarm Federation
76
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Posted - 2011.10.02 18:13:00 -
[59] - Quote
we'd still suicide them
all miners will hang |
grumpyguts1
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
2
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Posted - 2011.10.02 18:41:00 -
[60] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:we'd still suicide them
all miners will hang
You really are short sighted, no miners, less minerals(can get some from mission salvage).. no shiny ships to gank or gank in DOH!!!!
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