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FeralShadow
Black Storm Cartel The Orca Syndicate
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Posted - 2010.10.24 10:19:00 -
[1]
Firstly, this is just a list of things in eve which could be easily remedied through a bit of a change in programming. Really, it'd be no different than programming better graphics, and way WAY easier than walking in stations. So here goes;
First off, the asteroid belts;
To simplify it, scientists today believe that the asteroid belts formed not from breaking apart of planets (which the current asteroid layout seems to suggest) but rather the failure of the asteroids to accumulate enough material in the formation of the solar system that they never had a gravitational field large enough to accumulate the mass required for proper planetary orbit and mass. As such, every system when it forms has its own asteroid belt, whether closer to the sun or further away is irrelevant and is really dependent only upon the method with which the solar system was formed.
This all being said, there is a way I believe is simple enough to create the proper asteroid belt realism, while still maintaining the same functionality that asteroid belts currently have in Eve solar systems;
To coincide with realism, there should be formed one continuous asteroid belt encircling the entire solar system. As was seen with the blown up planet caused by the wormholes forming, large belts of graphically meaningful asteroids can be formed over huge tracts of space (in this case it was around the destroyed planet) while not taxing players' computers. These asteroids have no value... they're not mine-able, and for the asteroid belt realism scenario they probably shouldn't even be target-able. However, for realism, these asteroids should encircle the entire solar system. Now, to maintain asteroid mining, there should be pockets of mine-able asteroids scattered throughout this encircling belt of useless asteroids, and this makes sense. From a lore standpoint, these are warpable points in the giant asteroid belt because they're pockets of useful minerals scattered about the otherwise useless asteroids. In this way, solar systems get a huge boost in realism, in that asteroid belts are gigantic and encompassing the entire solar system, as they should (imagine warping to the mineral spot and seeing the huge belt stretching away into the distance on either side), as well as maintaining the functionality of current asteroid belts in that there will still be warpable points of useful asteroids to mine from (obviously maintaining the same amount of mineable pockets in each solar system is key). As for listing the asteroid belts, you can simply list them by number, instead of by planet, then number, making warping to them a bit less time-consuming and less annoying. Though, other methods of listing them are certainly good as well, I just can't think of any right now.
Second, Nebulae;
With all the systems in Eden, it seems unlikely that none will be in a gas nebulae. While not really as important as the asteroid belts in terms of realism, it would be great to have some systems that have very low viewing range. While any boosts or negatives to any aspect of the ships is quite irrelevant from a realism standpoint, there are many possibilities with flying through a solar system in a nebula. Really, it doesn't make much realism sense to have pockets of random gas within a solar system. As far as we know, that never happens in a solar system (at least not in ours). Though, really, just really cloudy systems would be perfect. Wouldn't require much, it doesn't even have to be high resolution.
Multiple sun systems;
Another facet that's missing. Obviously, multiple suns would be very cool.
Visible black holes;
There's one giant black hole in eve, and it's nowhere to be found. If you think about it, would it really be difficult to be able to view the black hole in relation to how close you are to it? Maybe it simply won't render until you're within X number of jumps to it. There are already the graphics and means to do things like that within WH Space. _______________________________________________ "If you want to taste the ground, feel free to attack." - Kenshin Himura
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FeralShadow
Black Storm Cartel The Orca Syndicate
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Posted - 2010.10.24 10:22:00 -
[2]
There are also other things that should be included in the normal travels of Eden space, such as quasars and pulsars (at least in the background).
Long story short, the asteroid belts I believe is the biggest realism ruiner in Eve to date. Every thing else isn't as big imho.
Suggestions or comments welcome, it's simply a letter noting some observations, take it for what you will.
-Feral _______________________________________________ "If you want to taste the ground, feel free to attack." - Kenshin Himura
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Alara IonStorm
Agent-Orange
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Posted - 2010.10.24 10:26:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Alara IonStorm on 24/10/2010 10:35:42 Edited by: Alara IonStorm on 24/10/2010 10:34:02 Yes there are no Bi or Trinary starsystems, Asteroids IRL are so far apart you would not even see a second, you would have to warp 10000's of km to get to it and there are blackholes that are completely invisible.
It is a game realism went out the window right there, they have more important issues to work on. EVE is pretty let it be for now. Once lags gone then we get cool new stuff.
Also I heard there were Binary Wormhole Systems, can anyone confirm?
Edit: for new post. a Quasar would not fit in the Galaxy and would eat it but there are Pulsars in Wormhole space, none that we can go to because we would be killed instantly. I can not overestimate the destructive power of a Pulsar, let alone a Quasar which puts out over 1000 times the Energy of our Galaxy.
Quick Wiki Fact Check
The most luminous quasars radiate at a rate that can exceed the output of average galaxies, equivalent to one trillion suns. Quasars are believed to be powered by accretion of material into supermassive black holes in the nuclei of distant galaxies, making these luminous versions of the general class of objects known as active galaxies.
I think bumbing that counts as being podded!
-- I am now on a Crusade to Fix the Omen!
For Great Justice!
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El'Niaga
Minmatar Republic Military School
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Posted - 2010.10.24 10:29:00 -
[4]
All systems in eve are binary systems. They are not near binaries but far binaries though. This is what EVE Lore says, you need a binary system to make a jumpgate.
Rendering limits is probably what got the asteroid belts to be around planets, think of them more as large planetary ring systems in eve :).
Keep in mind space is not a vacuum in EVE either, it has the viscosity of 30 SAE Motor Oil.
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FeralShadow
Black Storm Cartel The Orca Syndicate
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Posted - 2010.10.24 10:33:00 -
[5]
Haha true enough. Though one would think with all the upgrades undergone that they could at least do low res asteroids as fillers. _______________________________________________ "If you want to taste the ground, feel free to attack." - Kenshin Himura
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JeanLuc Blindtard
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Posted - 2010.10.24 10:49:00 -
[6]
What are you? Some kind of a critic? :))
If you want realism lets kill the eve space ship/gun/explosion sounds and since the distances in space are a lil big lits make delay when people use coms.
Can you imagine a fc sending a command to a scout and waiting for 40min for a response from the other planet?
And lets keep the text / voice coms to a solar system. I mean it would take hundreds of not thousands of years for a message to get to another star. Not like theres a gate activation every time a dude sends a mail or talk on fleet coms.
If you want realism lets make warp to 0 to stars blowing up the ships, I mean I know these ships are tuff but at 0 to a star???
Oh and lets maybe just maybe make gun / missile fire / ammo not pass through asteroids and other ships... can you imagine a 1.2k people fight then?
EVE is a game, Making it real... would kill it LOL
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djan go
BIG Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2010.10.24 10:50:00 -
[7]
There's some of the stuff you suggest that CCP might already be working on. I remember them saying system-wide asteroid belts is something they want to do (a couple of years ago). The other thing a dev previously posted about is the nebulae background revamp (I wonder what happened to it). He said that with the new backgrounds they were working on, you would see regional features of space in a way that makes sense. Like if you're in a system close to the EVE gate you'd see it, and not only in the new eden system.
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Jovan Geldon
Gallente Lead Farmers
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Posted - 2010.10.24 11:04:00 -
[8]
The only thing that genuinely bothers me is the fact that the sun is the same size no matter which planet you view it from. I mean, from Pluto our sun is only the size of any other star in the sky
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FeralShadow
Black Storm Cartel The Orca Syndicate
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Posted - 2010.10.24 11:17:00 -
[9]
Really the only reason i suggested these things is that most are easily doable, and doesn't negatively impact gameplay. Obviously, comm delay would negatively impact gameplay, as would stars blowing up your ships, and planet collision. _______________________________________________ "If you want to taste the ground, feel free to attack." - Kenshin Himura
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Chopper Rollins
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.10.24 11:26:00 -
[10]
Some of these things, being cosmetic, would only add to the look of the game. Here's some reality notes for consideration;
Asteroid belts are terrestrial bodies that failed to form. The belt in our solar system was predicted by the harmonic rule, as was the presence of Pluto.
Gas giants, like Jupiter, are stellar bodies that failed to accrete enough mass for ignition at the core. Jupiter puts out more infra-red than it gets from the sun. Our system IS binary, the second star just didn't make it.
The tetrahedronal constant determines where certain features appear on planets. Basically, a tetrahedron placed inside a sphere will have corners touching the surface at 19.5 degrees north or south of the equator. It's at these latitudes we find the Great Red Spot on Jupiter, Olympus Mons on Mars, on Earth the outpouring of energy creates vulcanism that breaks through as plates shift to form the island chain of Hawaii. This being the internet, i know you either know this already or don't care, but some folks might be interested.
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JeanLuc Blindtard
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Posted - 2010.10.24 11:29:00 -
[11]
Well Ok jokes aside now..
There is also room for comets in the solar systems, and ccp did promise those long ago. As rare events and that might bring in t2 building mats or something to balance the t2 market.
They didn't do that (but the t2 market got better). :)
Still comets would be cool.
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Jekyl Eraser
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Posted - 2010.10.24 11:37:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Jekyl Eraser on 24/10/2010 11:38:41 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuiper_belt
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hills_cloud
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Stitcher
Caldari legion of qui
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Posted - 2010.10.24 11:44:00 -
[13]
Originally by: El'Niaga All systems in eve are binary systems. They are not near binaries but far binaries though. This is what EVE Lore says, you need a binary system to make a jumpgate.
That particular piece of lore is so out of date that it remembers walking five miles to t'mine at four in t'morning oophill both ways in t'snow to work a fifteen hour shift with no lunch break and nowt but a stale crust wi' pork drippings to come home to, and it was one of the lucky ones.
It's as obsolete as muskets, the horse collar and the trebuchet. -
- Verin "Stitcher" Hakatain.
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Bobby Case
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Posted - 2010.10.24 11:49:00 -
[14]
there's only 5k solar systems in game. Galaxies can have billions of stars, so perhaps these 5k are all of the stars with economically feasible planets -- which would mean non-binary, predictable and similarly classed stars. There's a lot of room for other classed stars and celestial bodies but there doesn't seem much reason for a pod pilot to travel to a red dwarf or binary system outside of tourism.
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Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.10.24 12:39:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Bobby Case there's only 5k solar systems in game.
7,881 actually, if I haven't missed anything. 5,382 k-space and 2,499 w-space. _
Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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Siigari Kitawa
Gallente Senex Legio Get Off My Lawn
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Posted - 2010.10.24 13:59:00 -
[16]
Originally by: El'Niaga Keep in mind space is not a vacuum in EVE either, it has the viscosity of 30 SAE Motor Oil.
I laughed pretty hard at this. I guess we're moving away from "Eve is a bath" to "Jita just got an oil change."
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Doravos
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Posted - 2010.10.24 15:07:00 -
[17]
"one continuous asteroid belt encircling the entire solar system"
Sounds like you're describing an Oort Cloud.
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V'hellu
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Posted - 2010.10.24 15:36:00 -
[18]
You want realism?
Ok.
No sound in space.
When you turn off an afterburner and your engines, you should still be going at the speed you were before you turned it off without any penalty to the capacitor. (same for MWD)
No warping through planets.
Asteroids don't simply disappear when they're mined out.
Big ships should have the capacity to have smaller guns also to take out smaller ships (I.E. battleships SHOULD always dominate frigates).
Learning skills in Eve should take minutes, not days (with that kind of tech, wtf?)
I should be able to autopilot dock to a station.
Blueprints should have infinite runs.
Mission rats shouldn't go "Well that's the first guy we've seen, ATTACK HIM! Wait, there's someone else hitting harder? WHO CARES, ATTACK THE FIRST ONE!"
Some of these should be changed, others would make it boring.
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Ghoest
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Posted - 2010.10.24 15:47:00 -
[19]
You think that changing asteroid belts will make the game better and is a good way for devs to spend time?
STOP DOING DRUGS!!!
Wherever you went - Here you are.
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Monte Shill
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Posted - 2010.10.24 17:08:00 -
[20]
Quote: I believe is the biggest realism ruiner in Eve to date
Not to be a downer, but you are not really flying a space ship. Space ships that can warp at multples of the speed of light and leave planetary systems when we can only get a few men and women beyond the atomsphere on primitive fossil fuel boosters. Its easier to accept things as is instead of accepting things of how they can be.
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FeralShadow
Black Storm Cartel The Orca Syndicate
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Posted - 2010.10.25 02:02:00 -
[21]
It's really interesting to see how many people miss the point of the post.
The point is, these things should be changed to improve realism because changing them has no negative side effects on the playability of the game.
There are, and always will be, better things to work on, I thought that was a given that every forum reader knew.
Lol
-Feral _______________________________________________ "If you want to taste the ground, feel free to attack." - Kenshin Himura
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Adunh Slavy
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Posted - 2010.10.25 03:08:00 -
[22]
Originally by: FeralShadow There are, and always will be, better things to work on, I thought that was a given that every forum reader knew.
On Eve forums?
The Real Space Initiative - V6 (Forum Link)
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DarkAegix
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Posted - 2010.10.25 06:24:00 -
[23]
Some of the posts on this thread make me want to cringe. Especially the ones raging about how if the OP wants realism EVE would suck because there'd be no sound and unbalanced mechanics. Fail.
The OP wants an increased level of immersive graphical detail. Not game-changing mechanics which break everything.
Making one thing realistic doesn't mean that everything else needs to be realistic.
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Alara IonStorm
Agent-Orange
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Posted - 2010.10.25 08:49:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Alara IonStorm on 25/10/2010 08:53:19
Originally by: V'hellu Mission rats shouldn't go "Well that's the first guy we've seen, ATTACK HIM! Wait, there's someone else hitting harder? WHO CARES, ATTACK THE FIRST ONE!"
I always wondered what this would be like. No more managing Aggro they all attack, shoot a ship in a belt and he calls in every ship from every belt, plex and anom in the ajacent 3 systems(after a 100% chance he turns one the scram, web and ECM instead of 20%).
I imagin NPC's work like this,
Gurista Captain)Wow John is bein hit hard 20km away from us should we help.
Gurista Admiral)No they haven't shot us yet.
Gurista Captain)But we are on the same team, can I jam him at least? We could also use these neuts we always drop and always activate ECM and Tackle maybe switch missiles types?
Gurista Admiral)Hmm... (/Sips Tea) No.
Fire your Fleet Commanders NPC Pirates and hire smarter ones.
I will drop you a Resume!
-- I am now on a Crusade to Fix the Omen!
For Great Justice!
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Dead Jesus
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.10.25 09:50:00 -
[25]
Who gives a damn about asteroid belts except some dullards who think mining is fun.
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Ruairi iliffe
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Posted - 2010.10.25 10:12:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Ruairi iliffe on 25/10/2010 10:14:11
Originally by: V'hellu
No sound in space.
Originally by: JeanLuc Blindtard
If you want realism lets kill the eve space ship/gun/explosion sounds and since the distances in space are a lil big lits make delay when people use coms.
The sound in EvE is justified already, its the computer in your Pod feeding you artifical sounds to improve combat reactions as pilots where having a hard time ajusting to the lack of awareness without it.
also about the instant coms, already mentioned years ago http://www.eveonline.com/background/communication/
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Lost Greybeard
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Posted - 2010.10.25 10:43:00 -
[27]
I know some of these:
-- 'roid belts around planets are accessible, and belts around the star in the accretion disk are not, because your warp drive has to lock onto an artificial beacon or a gravitational mass the size of Earth or so as part of how it functions (thus the moons, the planets, and areas near the planets).
So it's not that belts aren't there, it's that the planet-based mining concerns that exploit them see no advantage in setting up artificial gravity beacons to allow capsuleers easy access to them.
-- Gates can ONLY be set up in binary systems, because the fake-science of jumpgate tech requires that the gate be set up at a "resonance point" in a binary system, i.e. between the star and its mate. You can't see the further-out partner because it just looks like a star.
-- There's no official explanation for maximum speeds in space, but I imagine it has something to do with the 'locking on to large masses' part of the warp drives.
-- A lot of the systems ARE in nebulae, how else would you explain there being gas pockets dense enough to mine the damned things? Remember that nebulae aren't actually the solid bright orange and blue background of recolored Hubble images, though I suppose our cyborg brains could so spectral analysis and interpret them as such at times. ---
If you outlaw tautologies, only outlaws will have tautologies. ~Anonymous |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2010.10.25 11:25:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Lost Greybeard -- There's no official explanation for maximum speeds in space, but I imagine it has something to do with the 'locking on to large masses' part of the warp drives.
I seem to recall reading somewhere that it had to do with the way warp engines worked, and how they constantly generated a bubble in space-time that, as an unfortunate side-effect, created what would best be described as space-frictionà
Iow: we get the ability to travel faster than light using special engines, at the cost of having the engines be very poor at moving us around at conventional speeds (and turning the warp generator on or off takes too long to be practical). ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
Rodj Blake
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2010.10.25 12:02:00 -
[29]
CCP have promised us system-wide asteroid belts with the Shiva patch.
I'm looking forward to it immensely.
Oh wait...
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
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FeralShadow
Black Storm Cartel The Orca Syndicate
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Posted - 2010.10.25 12:16:00 -
[30]
Yeeah. I dont mine. I'm a pirate. I STILL think it would be wickedly awesome, even if it did make our job finding targets harder (as they could be anywhere around the ringing belt at any of the resource points).
;) _______________________________________________ "If you want to taste the ground, feel free to attack." - Kenshin Himura
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