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Renix Xerar
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Posted - 2011.01.23 19:46:00 -
[1]
I have a question.
For getting the best efficiency out of a mission ship w/ Amarr... what would be the best ship to shoot for out of all faction, navy, t2 ships?
Nightmare, Armageddon Navy Issue, Apocalypse Navy Issue, or Paladin? Or something else...
I'm shooting for amarr but I want it to equate to a CNR in missioning efficiency...
I see Armageddon as more of a brawler, which I never have luck with, mainly because of Tracking Disruptors and close orbiting ship (The 2nd one can be solved by a propulsion mod, ofc) But in missions such as Sanshas Blockade, I have a problem with the TDs because my tank always breaks before my drones can kill the disruptors...
I feel like I left something out sooo point out the obvious and jog my memory whilst you flame about "blah blah go caldari they so so good"
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Obsession Paranoia
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Posted - 2011.01.23 19:58:00 -
[2]
You can't go wrong with Nightmare or Paladin. Nightmare is widely considered one of the outright best mission ships. The Paladin also has the advantage of being able to fit Tachyons due to '4 weapons do double damage' gig. They are both obviously high aims, but well worth it.
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Goose99
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Posted - 2011.01.23 20:23:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Obsession Paranoia You can't go wrong with Nightmare or Paladin. Nightmare is widely considered one of the outright best mission ships. The Paladin also has the advantage of being able to fit Tachyons due to '4 weapons do double damage' gig. They are both obviously high aims, but well worth it.
That gig is for NM, Paladins have grid issues when fitting tachs.
Any laser boat is going to have trouble shooting non-Amarr rats. Even a 1k dps tach NM that cut through Amarr rats like hot knife through butter won't do much more actual dps than a drake on Guristas/Serp rats, less than a drake for elite cruisers. It may have trouble even breaking tank on elite Angel cruisers.
This can be alleviated somewhat by using a Navy Armageddon. It has the bandwidth to field 5 sentries and drone room to carry a flight of light/mid drones in addition for frigs. It's an extra 5 guns that you can switch damage with. Another way is to just crosstrain for something else for use with non-Amarr missions and swap ships accordingly. If you fly NM, you'd have trained Caldari bs already. A CNR wouldn't come close to NM for Amarr missions, but will be handy to have on everything else.
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Raymond Moons
Sebiestor Tribe
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Posted - 2011.01.23 21:35:00 -
[4]
I find the Fleet Typhoon pretty good for Amarr missions. Being Minmatar it has reasonable EM/ Thermal native resistances, can fit 5 cruise launchers, 3 large auto's and a complete set of large/ medium/ small drones or sentries as you like. A single TP and Afterburner and you're set for everything :)
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Centus Commander
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Posted - 2011.01.23 21:36:00 -
[5]
One word: Legion
I know it isn't one of your ships but its worth training
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Xina Tutor
Amarr Hot Chicks
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Posted - 2011.01.23 22:22:00 -
[6]
I have a few faction ships, but I still prefer the Navy Apoc for nice easy L4 EM missions...
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Renix Xerar
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Posted - 2011.01.24 00:13:00 -
[7]
I'm using an Abaddon/Raven combo atm.. but it seems I'll have to upgrade both hulls rather than compromising? Kinda blows that amarr are only good vs. other amarr factions...
The only reason I don't wanna get a CNR is because it would most likely mean I need t2 cruise missiles trained...which is 30 days in the opposite direction, y'know?
Well, I was really hoping to only have to buy one faction ship to sink all of my money into, but now that I might need 2...ugh...oh god...
Ummm HAM Legion - Yes, let's throw that one into the mix here.. Different damage types, I'm all trained up for it.. save for 4d left on t2 HAMs (No big) but uhh yea how would that go? I just feel like a legion would be a little less effective as say a marauder or faction bship.. But if it keeps me from having to buy 'two' money sinks.. well, I can live with that...
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Kriminal Ahn'Khor
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Posted - 2011.01.24 02:06:00 -
[8]
Been using Abbadon/CNR combo. Mainly Abbadon... never really had any problems popping frigs, frying cruisers, and melting B.S.'s with pulse II's so I didn't see the need for a T2 or even a T3 except for the CNR and that's only because of the few Angel missions (Worlds Colide and AE) I get.
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Rip Minner
Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries
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Posted - 2011.01.24 05:38:00 -
[9]
It is just my opion but I feel Caldire or Min ships are best at missioning everywere do to Damage selections.
Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here. |
catinboots
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Posted - 2011.01.24 08:39:00 -
[10]
if you want to keep it cheap a abbadon,with mega pulse II a AB and with all your energy managing skills atleast 4 or 5 it is king of the T1 amarr battleships, great tank and good damage dealer, aslonng you are not up against angels, guristas still doable tho a bit slower , but against angels you will have problems on some of the lvl 4 missions it is like doing missions on very hard mode
ps even against serpentis it does well depends on what crystals you are using
Atrick to get those pesky TD cruisers in the sansha blockade, they are your priority targezts on the second and fourth wave fly straight at them and melt them close up with your pulse wait firing till you within 10k and let your drones target the same target
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Xina Tutor
Amarr Hot Chicks
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Posted - 2011.01.24 08:58:00 -
[11]
if you are in caldari space you really just need a caldari ship, same in amarr space. you might just want an em ship in caldari space now and then to do em missions a bit faster.
So say in caldari space your main ship is the best one for the main kin/therm missions and you farm then. The em ship is just for when you get a bit stuck.
I love the CNR. It's such epeen, I get em on LP and sell them to the boys and play with plex. It's not actually any good, but the boys love their big toys.
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Julia Venatrix
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Posted - 2011.01.24 12:58:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Goose99 That gig is for NM, Paladins have grid issues when fitting tachs.
Not with a faction repper and AWU V. No AB, but with tach optimal you don't need one.
--- Some days you are the pigeon, and some the statue. |
Mavnas
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Posted - 2011.01.24 17:48:00 -
[13]
HAM Legion has one very obvious problem: no drones to handle the small stuff that your HAMs do bad damage against.
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Shoa Jinn
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Posted - 2011.01.25 00:44:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Shoa Jinn on 25/01/2011 00:45:03
Originally by: Julia Venatrix
Originally by: Goose99 That gig is for NM, Paladins have grid issues when fitting tachs.
Not with a faction repper and AWU V. No AB, but with tach optimal you don't need one.
lolwut to both of these. paladin can easily fit tachs,ANLAR and an ab
paladin or nightmare are best bet for mission in amarr space
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Renix Xerar
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Posted - 2011.01.25 00:59:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Mavnas HAM Legion has one very obvious problem: no drones to handle the small stuff that your HAMs do bad damage against.
TP = win, how bout now? HAM Legion or a CNR/Nightmare and/or Pally combo? nightmare and pally wont do that great on their own, i mean there's the sanshas...and then there's the angels and...its just... a mess...
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Renix Xerar
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Posted - 2011.01.27 03:27:00 -
[16]
Oh and on a HAM legion i get about...what was it... like 325 dps? How much dps does a Paladin and/or Nightmare get? its about 350-375dps w/ all L5s for legion I think, just to use that as a benchmark...
I just see a lot less training in Legion for me atm.. With a TP to handle frigs I dont see what I else I have to worry about...
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skreeDK
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Posted - 2011.01.27 10:25:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Renix Xerar Oh and on a HAM legion i get about...what was it... like 325 dps? How much dps does a Paladin and/or Nightmare get? its about 350-375dps w/ all L5s for legion I think, just to use that as a benchmark...
I just see a lot less training in Legion for me atm.. With a TP to handle frigs I dont see what I else I have to worry about...
Doesn't have to be so hard. I'm running a Geddon / Oneiros combo, and I'm doing 800-1000 DPS while tanking anything a lvl4 mission can throw at me...AND I'm doing amarr, so missions are over very fast :)
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Renix Xerar
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Posted - 2011.01.27 19:54:00 -
[18]
Originally by: skreeDK
Originally by: Renix Xerar Oh and on a HAM legion i get about...what was it... like 325 dps? How much dps does a Paladin and/or Nightmare get? its about 350-375dps w/ all L5s for legion I think, just to use that as a benchmark...
I just see a lot less training in Legion for me atm.. With a TP to handle frigs I dont see what I else I have to worry about...
Doesn't have to be so hard. I'm running a Geddon / Oneiros combo, and I'm doing 800-1000 DPS while tanking anything a lvl4 mission can throw at me...AND I'm doing amarr, so missions are over very fast :)
I don't have an alt/friend that flies a logi to be my unwitting pawn in L4 missions, so that's kind of out of my reach here...
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Reikye
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Posted - 2011.01.27 20:06:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Centus Commander One word: Legion
I know it isn't one of your ships but its worth training
Seconded. Tank of a BS, DPS of a BC, Speed of a cruiser. Handles the big stuff well at close range and can make short work of webbers/scrams even without drones. I'm having lots of fun running one through Amarr L4s myself.
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Renix Xerar
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Posted - 2011.01.27 20:17:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Reikye
Originally by: Centus Commander One word: Legion
I know it isn't one of your ships but its worth training
Seconded. Tank of a BS, DPS of a BC, Speed of a cruiser. Handles the big stuff well at close range and can make short work of webbers/scrams even without drones. I'm having lots of fun running one through Amarr L4s myself.
Generally, this is my thought right now.. All in one ship, can handle all missions due to HAM damage type, has the speed of a cruiser so I can get in range rather easily and most of all - scan res. Low sec missions wouldnt get me scanned down and killed very easily at all.
Basically I'm thinking this is the cheapest, most efficient choice. Use a TP and dual rep setup and I've got a great mission runner.... Paladin and Nightmare would keep me away from low sec so all in all I think I'm going to choose Legion. Are there any downsides that I really should be aware of?
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Reikye
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Posted - 2011.01.27 20:51:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Reikye on 27/01/2011 20:56:03 Apart from the price of gearing one up, I can't think of many. Not that I'm the best judge, my pilot only has 6.7m in SP and has never flown anything bigger than a cruiser hull.
Lack of Drones from all but one (crappy) offensive subsystem is the major issue. Another could possibly be that in using HAMs you might be accused of building a Tengu lite.
It is an incredibly durable ship though and can build up some pretty impressive buffer numbers without sacrficing too much in DPS or speed. You can take it into the thick of things in Amarr L4s (Worlds Collide, Blockade etc) with some confidence that one bad move doesn't mean that you are toast. Given its expense, I don't think I would be comfortable taking it out in low-sec - at least not for a while - but as you pointed out, its pretty easy to make difficult to scan/probe.
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Tusen Takk
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2011.01.27 21:04:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Tusen Takk on 27/01/2011 21:06:13
Originally by: Centus Commander One word: Legion
I know it isn't one of your ships but its worth training
wayyyyyyyy too low of dps. if you train a T3 go for a Loki or a Tengu for Amarr missions
you get almost as much DPS from a Drake that takes no time to train for (not quite as awesome of natural resists) than a Legion
Originally by: Renix Xerar I'm using an Abaddon/Raven combo atm.. but it seems I'll have to upgrade both hulls rather than compromising? Kinda blows that amarr are only good vs. other amarr factions...
i do the same thing and have the same problem, im about to buy a CNR and call it a day
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Reikye
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Posted - 2011.01.27 21:31:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Reikye on 27/01/2011 21:32:13
Originally by: Tusen Takk Edited by: Tusen Takk on 27/01/2011 21:06:13
Originally by: Centus Commander One word: Legion
I know it isn't one of your ships but its worth training
wayyyyyyyy too low of dps. if you train a T3 go for a Loki or a Tengu for Amarr missions
you get almost as much DPS from a Drake that takes no time to train for (not quite as awesome of natural resists) than a Legion
Originally by: Renix Xerar I'm using an Abaddon/Raven combo atm.. but it seems I'll have to upgrade both hulls rather than compromising? Kinda blows that amarr are only good vs. other amarr factions...
i do the same thing and have the same problem, im about to buy a CNR and call it a day
I think that the DPS comparison is overdone. A Tengu will absolutely get some pretty significant DPS numbers when its 100km away from the target and moving at 1kms - we always talk about DPS under perfect conditions - but what happens when you hit the wrong trigger and are surrounded by 6 battleships and tackle within 20km? In the Oh Sh**** scenario - I would rather be in a Legion. Its a tough nut that gives you enough DPS in situations where it is kill or be killed. Its also a bruiser and its built to endure/last.
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Renix Xerar
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Posted - 2011.01.27 21:49:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Tusen Takk Edited by: Tusen Takk on 27/01/2011 21:06:13
Originally by: Centus Commander One word: Legion
I know it isn't one of your ships but its worth training
wayyyyyyyy too low of dps. if you train a T3 go for a Loki or a Tengu for Amarr missions
you get almost as much DPS from a Drake that takes no time to train for (not quite as awesome of natural resists) than a Legion
Originally by: Renix Xerar I'm using an Abaddon/Raven combo atm.. but it seems I'll have to upgrade both hulls rather than compromising? Kinda blows that amarr are only good vs. other amarr factions...
i do the same thing and have the same problem, im about to buy a CNR and call it a day
Well cut out the training time on the Legion compared to Drake... I have it trained. L5 subsystems and all. But, yes I am worried about being an extreme turtle... That could be a problem...
But, with t2 missiles and some more buffer on my support skills, It can't be too bad... Given I'll be using the right damage type as well...
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Centus Commander
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Posted - 2011.01.27 22:36:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Centus Commander on 27/01/2011 22:37:27
Originally by: Renix Xerar
Originally by: Tusen Takk Edited by: Tusen Takk on 27/01/2011 21:06:13
Originally by: Centus Commander One word: Legion
I know it isn't one of your ships but its worth training
wayyyyyyyy too low of dps. if you train a T3 go for a Loki or a Tengu for Amarr missions
you get almost as much DPS from a Drake that takes no time to train for (not quite as awesome of natural resists) than a Legion
Originally by: Renix Xerar I'm using an Abaddon/Raven combo atm.. but it seems I'll have to upgrade both hulls rather than compromising? Kinda blows that amarr are only good vs. other amarr factions...
i do the same thing and have the same problem, im about to buy a CNR and call it a day
Well cut out the training time on the Legion compared to Drake... I have it trained. L5 subsystems and all. But, yes I am worried about being an extreme turtle... That could be a problem...
But, with t2 missiles and some more buffer on my support skills, It can't be too bad... Given I'll be using the right damage type as well...
LIES!! Legion gets DPS close if not comparable to a Marauder. My Current Legion gets around 800+ DPS and like 950+ OH, and it still has enough tank to do all missions. Drake has like half that DPS
EDIT: Loki has the lowest DPS of all T3's and Tengu only have around 670 DPS
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Dafydd ab'Rhys
Caldari Quantum Horizons
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Posted - 2011.01.28 01:52:00 -
[26]
Hi there
Just a quick though, you do not need to put lasers on an amarr ship.
One option is to go something like an Apoc. The bonus in this ship is range and cap use for lasers, not damage.
If you compare two similar setups using Artillery (8x 1200s with EMP or Plasma) & beams (8xDual Heavy with Multi) then there is only a drop of about 70 DPS depending on the skills and if you include damage rigs
So before training up a second ship and second set of weapons, run some numbers on what the effect is by just swapping out the weapon systems and damage mods. You might find it is a better option
Cheers Dafydd
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Tusen Takk
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2011.01.28 08:28:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Tusen Takk on 28/01/2011 08:29:22
Originally by: Centus Commander Edited by: Centus Commander on 27/01/2011 22:37:27
Originally by: Renix Xerar
Originally by: Tusen Takk Edited by: Tusen Takk on 27/01/2011 21:06:13
Originally by: Centus Commander One word: Legion
I know it isn't one of your ships but its worth training
wayyyyyyyy too low of dps. if you train a T3 go for a Loki or a Tengu for Amarr missions
you get almost as much DPS from a Drake that takes no time to train for (not quite as awesome of natural resists) than a Legion
Originally by: Renix Xerar I'm using an Abaddon/Raven combo atm.. but it seems I'll have to upgrade both hulls rather than compromising? Kinda blows that amarr are only good vs. other amarr factions...
i do the same thing and have the same problem, im about to buy a CNR and call it a day
Well cut out the training time on the Legion compared to Drake... I have it trained. L5 subsystems and all. But, yes I am worried about being an extreme turtle... That could be a problem...
But, with t2 missiles and some more buffer on my support skills, It can't be too bad... Given I'll be using the right damage type as well...
LIES!! Legion gets DPS close if not comparable to a Marauder. My Current Legion gets around 800+ DPS and like 950+ OH, and it still has enough tank to do all missions. Drake has like half that DPS
EDIT: Loki has the lowest DPS of all T3's and Tengu only have around 670 DPS
lets see this fit then... i went all eft warrior on it (1st time for everything) and the max i could get it was 550dps with CONFLAG (lol) and basically no tank whatsoever. also i was talking about HML Drake vs HML Legion mate
also lol tengu usually has around 850dps nevermind you must be trolling
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Cyberus
Caldari Final Destination.
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Posted - 2011.01.28 09:00:00 -
[28]
Machariel.
Best all around. Best for any kind of mission. If you want do rigth do it in Machariel ===== * Your signature file is broken. Please use one that will display - Fallout |
Cyberus
Caldari Final Destination.
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Posted - 2011.01.28 10:19:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Centus Commander Edited by: Centus Commander on 27/01/2011 22:37:27
Originally by: Renix Xerar
Originally by: Tusen Takk Edited by: Tusen Takk on 27/01/2011 21:06:13
Originally by: Centus Commander One word: Legion
I know it isn't one of your ships but its worth training
wayyyyyyyy too low of dps. if you train a T3 go for a Loki or a Tengu for Amarr missions
you get almost as much DPS from a Drake that takes no time to train for (not quite as awesome of natural resists) than a Legion
Originally by: Renix Xerar I'm using an Abaddon/Raven combo atm.. but it seems I'll have to upgrade both hulls rather than compromising? Kinda blows that amarr are only good vs. other amarr factions...
i do the same thing and have the same problem, im about to buy a CNR and call it a day
Well cut out the training time on the Legion compared to Drake... I have it trained. L5 subsystems and all. But, yes I am worried about being an extreme turtle... That could be a problem...
But, with t2 missiles and some more buffer on my support skills, It can't be too bad... Given I'll be using the right damage type as well...
LIES!! Legion gets DPS close if not comparable to a Marauder. My Current Legion gets around 800+ DPS and like 950+ OH, and it still has enough tank to do all missions. Drake has like half that DPS
EDIT: Loki has the lowest DPS of all T3's and Tengu only have around 670 DPS
Actualy my tengu has 727 dps.... so you doit wrong. But still as i said the machariel is more superior for any kind of mission.
with t2 800 autocanon's with t1 ammo you can get close to 1200 dps and with combo 4 centry's and 5 ligth drones you can get even over 1400 dps.
But it just my 2 cent ===== * Your signature file is broken. Please use one that will display - Fallout |
Centus Commander
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Posted - 2011.01.28 13:37:00 -
[30]
lets see this fit then... i went all eft warrior on it (1st time for everything) and the max i could get it was 550dps with CONFLAG (lol) and basically no tank whatsoever. also i was talking about HML Drake vs HML Legion mate
also lol tengu usually has around 850dps nevermind you must be trolling
I suppose HAM Tengu does, but the ppl I hang around usually use 670 DPS HM Tengu's so I'm just used to saying that I guess. :P but yea, Tengu can get more. HML Legion is fail, you shouldn't be in a Legion using HML's Here's the fit that you failed at making: http://eve.battleclinic.com/loadout/49347-Pimpin-L4-800-DPS-Legion.html#export
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