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Veronica Levova
Slopes for the Slope Throne
0
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Posted - 2012.08.20 17:49:00 -
[1] - Quote
(A little background: my main spent the last year in 0.0, and I recently have been chilling in lowsec a ton, so that is why these questions arise)
As someone who is genuinely lacking in lowsec experience, I am wondering if this is something that people actually do. I look at the vast swathes of lowsec which seem completely empty, and I wonder if there are enterprising groups out there that "lay claim" to their areas of operation and basically control all activity in the space. Does this happen? Things I am thinking of as examples of this sort of activity:
Purging existing POCOs and putting up your own to create income Finding valuable (at least for lowsec) moons and towering them for use and profit Interdicting local mission and complex runners to discourage their activities Basically what I am asking is whether this sort of thing ever happens in lowsec, whether it is a good content driver in an otherwise stagnant landscape, and if there are any notable examples of this sort of thing going on in New Eden. What type of numbers and capital assets would be needed to make this viable? Obviously good diplomacy goes a long way to facilitating some of these goals.
If this is not a common thing for groups to do in lowsec (my inclinations tell me it isnt), what are the barriers that make this an unattractive option for people?
Feel free to provide any insight you may have or just general comments.
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Veronica Levova
Slopes for the Slope Throne
0
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Posted - 2012.08.20 18:04:00 -
[2] - Quote
I got CCP'd and double posted, apologies. The other thread seems to be blank... |
Tiberious Thessalonia
True Slave Foundations Shaktipat Revelators
382
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Posted - 2012.08.20 18:05:00 -
[3] - Quote
We do this. Well, most of it. The Moon thing just isn't worth it in almost all of low-sec.
There are complications, of course. The inability to put up things like bubbles or cyno jammers make it harder to keep people out when you don't want them there, but on the other hand there are less logistical issues.
Most people are not living in low-sec for the profit, though, they are living their for the fights. |
El Cid Campeador
Exploding Squirrels
52
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Posted - 2012.08.20 18:10:00 -
[4] - Quote
We just took a system, our first one. (In lowsec of course) We do what we can to slow the traffic, but with inexperienced pilots combined with no bubbles we cant stop all traffic. But no one missions/mines/whatever in our system anymore |
Karl Planck
Heretic Army Heretic Nation
219
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Posted - 2012.08.20 18:17:00 -
[5] - Quote
Veronica Levova wrote: Purging existing POCOs and putting up your own to create income
yes, its quite common
Veronica Levova wrote:Finding valuable (at least for lowsec) moons and towering them for use and profit
try it and come back and tell us why it didn't work for a small group
Veronica Levova wrote: Interdicting local mission and complex runners to discourage their activities
less to discourage, more to get their stufz. And because, well, why NOT shoot them?
Veronica Levova wrote: 1) Basically what I am asking is whether this sort of thing ever happens in lowsec, whether it is a good content driver in an otherwise stagnant landscape, and if there are any notable examples of this sort of thing going on in New Eden.
2) What type of numbers and capital assets would be needed to make this viable? Obviously good diplomacy goes a long way to facilitating some of these goals.
3) If this is not a common thing for groups to do in lowsec (my inclinations tell me it isnt), what are the barriers that make this an unattractive option for people?
Feel free to provide any insight you may have or just general comments.
Bulleted you q's, lets get to each one at a time
1) Yes it does, CoC is probably one of the better exapmles of a small group that encroached the EVE Gate area and have successfully held it for years. Lots of mining ops in the back systems, where intel will get to them. Hard to jump caps in so they are relatively safe from invaders.
Another example from a group that for the life of me I cant remember the name of. They used to run outiside of Hydelies running lvl 5's in carriers. They had friends in the nearby sov holding 0.0 which saved them from getting hotdropped, as long as they came to CTA's and such.
In general though, for a small group its not much of a content driver as the isk you make there is rarely worth the split you need to make it worth it (as a resource pool to fight over), especially in comparison to other things. As a goal in and of itself maybe, but there are better alternatives that people usually go to.
2)Extremely situational depending on where it is, who lives there now, what you want to do, how skilled your comrades are, etc.
3) Its probably more common than you think, but yea, its not the most popular option in eve lol. Most people who would do this do wh's instead. Probably the largest barrier is a number of things, IMO.
a) to stay in lowsec you usually WANT to shoot at things but need a way to earn back your losses. The limited returns and high risk of common forms of pve make it difficult for a lot of players to earn isk the way they normally do.
b) as you said, a large amount of areas in lowsec have a very low population (just like null). Most people you see will not be viable targets and unless you know the area very well, any type of gang you organize will eventually be spotted and targeted. Some groups have been moderately successful with this like black rebel rifter club, but obviously it wasn't that good cause they moved to npc null.
If you cant keep the people there who want to pvp due to lack of action, but you need them there for defense, it creates eventual bordem and they likely move on to something more interesting
Hoped this gave you some insight, and despite the tone of pessimism in this post, I feel that there are numerous group who have accomplished and maintained what you are looking to do.
Good luck Low-sec Best-sec |
Veronica Levova
Slopes for the Slope Throne
0
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Posted - 2012.08.20 18:26:00 -
[6] - Quote
Karl Planck thanks for the nice reply. At this point this is all purely research into new areas of the game before I really commit to my next moves. You definitely gave me some info to think about. |
Pinstar Colton
Sweet Asteroid Acres
235
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Posted - 2012.08.20 18:33:00 -
[7] - Quote
There is another angle to this. As one who lives in low sec as an industrialist, I can confirm the POCOs and moon mining POSes are nice, but not the whole picture.
There is something about the nature of high sec that is flat out boring after awhile. Anyone can mine, manufacture and ship stuff around high easily. If I had been doing that I would have quit eve long ago.
Doing the same thing in low sec adds an element of danger. Getting that load of moon minerals and PI to market under threat of gate camps and such is more rewarding than getting a load of veldspar I just mined 3 jumps to the nearby trade hub.
Rather than trying to lock down a system and claim complete ownership, I prefer co-habitation. Knowing there are plenty of pirates out there who would love to blow me up and take my stuff, I simply learn to better avoid them. In the cat-and-mouse game that is low sec, there is no shame in learning to be a better mouse. |
Inxentas Ultramar
Ultramar Independent Contracting
46
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Posted - 2012.08.21 23:49:00 -
[8] - Quote
We sort-of do the same things. I'd like to add a little politicking in the mix, as POCO taxes are defined by corporate Standings. Brokering these for your corporation can be very rewarding, as it will benefit a greater number of people. The same goes for Standings with NBSI PvP corporations, pirates, and possibly hisec industrials that wish to expand into lowsec. There are many variables to consider as each group has their own priorities and agenda.
Total security is an illusion and thats just the way I like it. You can be cool with someone but still blast their socks off if push comes to shove. Or turn a killright into a friendship instead of a killmail. Challenge the ship you just spotted on d-scan for a duel at the nearest planet. Every system has it's own status quo, and it's fun to either adhere to or disrupt. The ebb and flow of invading pirates only adds to the fun. |
James 315
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
2438
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Posted - 2012.08.21 23:54:00 -
[9] - Quote
Judging by the CSM minutes, it's lowsec itself that needs to carve out a niche.
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ MinerBumping.com -½-½-½-½-½-½-½-½-½-½The daily saga of one man's quest to bring civilization to highsec by bumping miners out of range. |
Herping yourDerp
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
657
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Posted - 2012.08.22 00:18:00 -
[10] - Quote
the problem with low is simple no one goes there because their are pirates and pirates hate it because there aren't enough targets.
the pirates kill anything they can, weather it be newb in a rifter or empty hauler, which is sad, because if less people got killed in low more people would go there. lets say pirates selected their targets based more on value, empty hauler, meh let it go. a week later said hauler if full of mission loot? kill it
of course this will never happen because people think killboards matter for some reason. |
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Whar Target
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
35
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Posted - 2012.08.22 02:34:00 -
[11] - Quote
There is not significantly more isk to be made in low-sec to justify moving/basing there just to make isk. Low sec anoms are unlikely to make much more isk than running level 4's, yet there is considerably greater risk involved whenever neutrals are in system.
Moon mining? I can almost guarantee the profitable moons will likely be held by null sec alliances. Most of the minerals you're lucky to make a profit after you pay for fuel costs even on a small pos, and even when you do make a profit all of the time spent maintaining/hauling moon goo, etc you find that your time is better spent just doing some other isk grinding activity.
As already stated, people live in low-sec to pvp themselves or on an alt. Yes, you can carve out a little home for yourself. You don't even need a corp to do it, just be very good at avoiding being a noob/target and people will ignore you eventually. But is it worth it to live there if you don't want to pvp? Absolutely not. |
Sajira Sykhari
Myriad Contractors Inc.
0
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Posted - 2012.08.22 03:03:00 -
[12] - Quote
Herping yourDerp wrote:the problem with low is simple no one goes there because their are pirates and pirates hate it because there aren't enough targets.
the pirates kill anything they can, weather it be newb in a rifter or empty hauler, which is sad, because if less people got killed in low more people would go there. lets say pirates selected their targets based more on value, empty hauler, meh let it go. a week later said hauler if full of mission loot? kill it
of course this will never happen because people think killboards matter for some reason.
Whenever your done wiping the tears from you eyes, you should re-read the OP.
Pretty much everything else stated here is quite accurate, there really isn't any benefit to "holding" space aside from having somewhere to call home. but in reality you can plop yourself down anywhere and call it home.
As mentioned the largest portion of people living in low are there for the PVP, so locking down/holding individual systems or small groups of systems isn't exactly conducive to finding fights (especially if you decide the quieter ones are where you want to be.) There are certainly areas that are more target rich than others, but these systems/regions aren't controlled by anyone which I would dare to guess is what keeps these places active.
Speaking as far as controlling POCO's, Moon's etc. I definately see many groups wresting control of clusters of systems with quality planets, and putting up there own POCO's. As far as moons are concerned, most of the towers I see up are there for manufacturing/research/invulnerable gang links - with a splash of moon harvesting for good measure. |
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