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Olthel
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Posted - 2011.02.14 14:22:00 -
[1]
This belongs in Features and ideas, but I wanna see how quickly the pirate community can find loopholes in this thing I have in mind...
Idea: So the ransom option appears when you right click a player's name and go to the pilot menu. When you click it, you get an interface similar to a contract creation interface. There you put in the price and the members of your fleet/camp/just you/an alliance/whatever, while the target's name is already chosen. The contract like thingy is then presented to the victim (he/she can see the names of the ppl you inserted into the contract and the price, of course). If the contract is accepted, the victim cannot be targeted (and ignores bubble effects) by any of the people in the contract for 15 mins (more/less, if you can customize time in the interface, 5min minimum).
I can see the loopholes: 300M instead of 30M (like jita scams and such), not all people present in the camp are in the list, therefore they can still kill you... etc., basically it's just like contract scams - if you aren't careful, you lose.
Anyway, troll and discuss.
TL;DR: Read the post, it's not that bad.
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Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
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Posted - 2011.02.14 14:26:00 -
[2]
Originally by: Olthel This belongs in Features and ideas, but I wanna see how quickly the pirate community can find loopholes in this thing I have in mind...
Great idea Einstein. Deliberately posting something that you know will be locked, with an idea that you know is flawed. Hopefully, for that great idea of yours, your prize will be a well deserved forum "vacation". - I'd tell you why but then I'll have to kill you. And to kill you I'd have to log in. And to log in I'd have to stop browsing these forums. Both you and me knows that'll never happen. |
Olthel
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Posted - 2011.02.14 14:29:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Olthel on 14/02/2011 14:30:55
Originally by: Misanth
Originally by: Olthel This belongs in Features and ideas, but I wanna see how quickly the pirate community can find loopholes in this thing I have in mind...
Great idea Einstein. Deliberately posting something that you know will be locked, with an idea that you know is flawed. Hopefully, for that great idea of yours, your prize will be a well deserved forum "vacation".
Thank god I have 4-ish accounts and can continue my shiptoasting on other useless alts. Oh, I know the idea is somewhat flawed, however, a single person rarely finds all the ways to abuse something - be it a carebear or pedobear victim. That's why I'm trying to get some input here, so I can make the idea better which enables me to jump into the postmobile and POAST MOAR!
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Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
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Posted - 2011.02.14 14:30:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Olthel Thank god I have 4-ish accounts and can continue my shiptoasting on other useless alts.
Hey, you did ask for it.
Originally by: Olthel Anyway, troll and discuss.
- I'd tell you why but then I'll have to kill you. And to kill you I'd have to log in. And to log in I'd have to stop browsing these forums. Both you and me knows that'll never happen. |
Olthel
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Posted - 2011.02.14 14:33:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Olthel on 14/02/2011 14:33:23 Always a pleasure talking to C&P regulars ... now did you have any input or are we just trolling each other today? Would a deposit of ISK help my cause?
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Gavjack Bunk
Gallente PCG Enterprises Huzzah Federation
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Posted - 2011.02.14 15:00:00 -
[6]
I like the struggle to convince a man that despite all we know of each other, I still retain my standards and expectations.
If I can't convince him, I don't deserve the payout. I don't necessarily want the uncertainty of ransoms to be removed, but thanks anyway.
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Captain Die
Suicide by Cop
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Posted - 2011.02.14 15:07:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Olthel This belongs in Features and ideas, but I wanna see how quickly the pirate community can find loopholes in this thing I have in mind...
Idea: So the ransom option appears when you right click a player's name and go to the pilot menu. When you click it, you get an interface similar to a contract creation interface. There you put in the price and the members of your fleet/camp/just you/an alliance/whatever, while the target's name is already chosen. The contract like thingy is then presented to the victim (he/she can see the names of the ppl you inserted into the contract and the price, of course). If the contract is accepted, the victim cannot be targeted (and ignores bubble effects) by any of the people in the contract for 15 mins (more/less, if you can customize time in the interface, 5min minimum).
I can see the loopholes: 300M instead of 30M (like jita scams and such), not all people present in the camp are in the list, therefore they can still kill you... etc., basically it's just like contract scams - if you aren't careful, you lose.
Anyway, troll and discuss.
TL;DR: Read the post, it's not that bad.
Not that bad no. But easily abused outside of combat. --- DIE - EVE-O's SADOMASICHIST I WHO HAVE NOTHING! |
Toilarmius
Minmatar Auxilia Enterprises
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Posted - 2011.02.14 15:19:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Olthel Would a deposit of ISK help my cause?
Yes, yes it would. Anything less than 100m, this is the dumbest idea I've ever seen. Anything north of 100m, depending on how far north it is, I'll sing its praises as varying degrees of genius. Yes, I can be bought that easily. I await for wallet blinky.
Originally by: CCP Fallout I can scan (but don't have time atm) a picture of one of my mother's modeling photos and you'd see hers as well, and she's more obviously a women than I'll ever be.
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Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
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Posted - 2011.02.14 15:54:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Olthel Would a deposit of ISK help my cause?
Well, what the guy above me said. Sure, I'll give you my feedback. The problem is, the amount of isk you'd deposit may or may not affect my (potentially brutal) honesty. -
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Kitty McKitty
Gallente Trillionaire High-Rollers Suicidal Bassoon Orkesta
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Posted - 2011.02.14 19:43:00 -
[10]
There is already a ransom feature, you just have to communicate with others playing this MMO. I know it's a pretty crazy system but I'm sure you could adapt given enough time.
~~~
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Le Poupon
Gallente Center for Advanced Studies
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Posted - 2011.02.14 20:03:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Kitty McKitty There is already a ransom feature, you just have to communicate with others playing this MMO. I know it's a pretty crazy system but I'm sure you could adapt given enough time.
You want me to "chat" with people? Are you trying to have me groomed? ----------sig------------------------- A Higher grade of posting
Originally by: CCP Mitnal Beware of the revenge of elves for the non-believers.
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Olthel
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Posted - 2011.02.14 23:36:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Kitty McKitty There is already a ransom feature, you just have to communicate with others playing this MMO. I know it's a pretty crazy system but I'm sure you could adapt given enough time.
F*CK yeah! I was spanked
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Goonsarecorwards
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Posted - 2011.02.16 02:11:00 -
[13]
Do it now |
Aerion Va'rr
The Priesthood The 0rphanage
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Posted - 2011.02.16 04:57:00 -
[14]
A ransom interface option?
No thanks, some of us have no interest in keeping our word (we also lol @ the very mention of e-honor).
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Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
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Posted - 2011.02.16 08:32:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Le Poupon
Originally by: Kitty McKitty There is already a ransom feature, you just have to communicate with others playing this MMO. I know it's a pretty crazy system but I'm sure you could adapt given enough time.
You want me to "chat" with people? Are you trying to have me groomed?
Last time we had this conversation you were begging for it. -
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War Kitten
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Posted - 2011.02.16 20:12:00 -
[16]
Assuming you're serious, tons of flaws to abuse:
- Right click anyone in space, ransom them, see if they pay for no good reason. (Or did you want the system to somehow verify that a person is tackled and into x% structure and really has no chance of winning?)
- Alt ransoms his main, includes whatever 0.0 residents have the gate bubbled on the other side, main accepts for 10 isk, skips through gatecamp.
-Oh, so you have to be in the alliance/corp to force your mates to give up any powers? K - then what good is the whole ransom window in the first place if you can't use it with a mixed corp pirate gang?
-And exactly who has rights to just give away a corp's power to shoot at someone? Add it to the already complex corp management window?
-How many ransom situations have you been in where you have time to fill out a form in triplicate, include all the proper names and dignitaries, and then send the contract to the victim? He's either logged off and almost gone by now, or griefed you by wasting all your time filling it out when he clicks "decline".
TL;DR - its a programming nightmare and of almost 0 practical value. |
Barakkus
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Posted - 2011.02.16 20:18:00 -
[17]
Was already a discussion on this last year I think, in this same board...I believe many "pirates" liked it too, but a bit different implementation. - - [SERVICE] Corp Standings For POS anchoring
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Olthel
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Posted - 2011.02.17 03:48:00 -
[18]
Originally by: War Kitten Assuming you're serious, tons of flaws to abuse:
- Right click anyone in space, ransom them, see if they pay for no good reason. (Or did you want the system to somehow verify that a person is tackled and into x% structure and really has no chance of winning?)
- Alt ransoms his main, includes whatever 0.0 residents have the gate bubbled on the other side, main accepts for 10 isk, skips through gatecamp.
-Oh, so you have to be in the alliance/corp to force your mates to give up any powers? K - then what good is the whole ransom window in the first place if you can't use it with a mixed corp pirate gang?
-And exactly who has rights to just give away a corp's power to shoot at someone? Add it to the already complex corp management window?
-How many ransom situations have you been in where you have time to fill out a form in triplicate, include all the proper names and dignitaries, and then send the contract to the victim? He's either logged off and almost gone by now, or griefed you by wasting all your time filling it out when he clicks "decline".
TL;DR - its a programming nightmare and of almost 0 practical value.
Fleet members only and this is all solved? Contract made by fleet leader, automatically fills itself out with fleet members, you only need to insert price - 15 seconds unless you can't type numbers Oo. If there is no fleet this is a useless feature/obvious scam. It makes sense for 1 fleet to be camping a gate, and you can check the names.
If there is no fleet the contract has only the individual who is making it in the list.
C'mon, this is what the next exp is about :P
"- Right click anyone in space, ransom them, see if they pay for no good reason. " This is C&P. You should be happy there's a new potential scam!
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Bestor Triol
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Posted - 2011.02.17 04:55:00 -
[19]
Well lets see how many OBVIOUS loopholes there are in this..
- Ransom a sucker. Once he has paid kill him with an alt not on the contract.
- Get everyone in the camp to ransom the guy individualy. OK not really a loophole but a good way of extracting a lot of isk.
- For the victim, pay ransom, immediatly turn around and engage the people that just ransomed you. They cant target you for 15 mins so you should be able to get a couple of them. You can always just tackle them and call in the fleet..
- Jump in to enemy camp. Ransom corp/fleet mates. Ignore bubble and warp away unharmed.
- Jump in to enemy fleet. 1 member of the fleet (or a neut) ransoms fleet mates and includes all of the enemy members on the contract. Enemy now cant engage you.
I'm sure there are WAY more, but seriously, this was 15 seconds of thinking.
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Vorekk
Gallente LowBall Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2011.02.17 07:43:00 -
[20]
Fail, fail and fail. Not even worth my time pointing out why. --- Join Lowball Heavy Industries. Small, focused fleets - lots of high intensity action, the EVE way. |
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Alotta Baggage
Amarr Imperial Manufactorum Armada Assail
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Posted - 2011.02.17 08:31:00 -
[21]
What if I catch 2 carebears and want to offer ransom in the form of pitting them against each other and then letting the winner go? Got the idea from the Joker
Originally by: Magnus Andronicus ur character looks like a f***ing clown dude.
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Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
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Posted - 2011.02.17 11:47:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Alotta Baggage What if I catch 2 carebears and want to offer ransom in the form of pitting them against each other and then letting the winner go? Got the idea from the Joker
..best suggestion I seen so far. -
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Miles Parabellum
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Posted - 2011.02.17 12:40:00 -
[23]
Since a working ransom system would really boost this game, why not debate it a bit... This doesn't solve everything, but let's make it so that the contract can only be written and sent while in station, and the victim will only recieve it once he docks..
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Valerax Orion
The Corsairs Total Comfort
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Posted - 2011.02.17 13:37:00 -
[24]
Interesting idea for a system - the idea is sound, implimentation not so.
My suggestion: Ransom option on target- only usable in low/null sec, to a max range of your warp scramble range and if they are scrambled, and only if you are in a fleet of less than XYZ size for the sake of argument.
They accept ransom and you attempt to attack them/don't turn your scrambler within a certain time - you recieve no ransom, no massive punishment but if you ain't gonna honour it, why bother in the first place. You only recieve the ransom if they reach a certain distance from you - say a couple of hundred kilometers/outside of system/experiencing a session change.
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Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
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Posted - 2011.02.17 14:26:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Miles Parabellum Since a working ransom system would really boost this game, why not debate it a bit...
Because we have not debated this for well over five years, seen tons of great suggestions, and still nothing have happened?
This is clearly not a high priority for CCP, and while I bet alot of players agree with you that it would be nice for EVE to have a functioning ransom system; CCP just don't give a rats ass. Sad but true.
So we might just as well make fun of the issue altogether. These threads are posted in vain. -
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Arth Lawing
Gallente Penumbra Institute
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Posted - 2011.02.17 14:48:00 -
[26]
Having to go through a series of windows clicking and typing would be too much. It wouldn't be... personal enough and it takes time.
To ransom successfully the pirates must be smart enough to make a quick valuation of the targets ship, and include things like insurance payouts and module/cargo costs. Then they must present themselves well in a convo and word it so that the victim will feel the value is worth paying. Ship and cargo scanners on alts are not used enough to allow most pirates to do this. Making too high a ransom will cause any victim to laugh and allow themselves to be destoyed. Not sounding sincere and professional in a convo is not going to make them pay either. Honor doesn't come into a ransom, its a simple business transaction. Make it good and you make isk. You also leave the victim/corp more comfortable with using that route again, increasing the chances for more ransoms or even maybe payment for right of passage.
A contract like system removes the ability of smart pirates to talk the ransom out of a victim, and also removes the pirates ability to see during the convo whether a victim is stalling, either for backup or escape. The idea seems like looking for an easy way of earning, without the ability you need to smoothly talk someone out of their hard earned isk.
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Marchocias
Snatch Victory
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Posted - 2011.02.17 14:52:00 -
[27]
Why not just add escort contracts... Creatable by both the escorter and escort, with either a fixed destination (station/system/constellation/region), or a distance away (eg 3 jumps / hisec), or maybe a particular sovereignty (eg Amarr space)
Then the pirate doing the ransom can offer to escort the victim to 3 jumps away. He doesn't have to actually accompany the victim, but the money changes hands once the escortee gets to the specified destination. That way it is in the interests of the pirate not to dishonour. It may also be a good idea to protect them, in case some other arse kills him and invalidates the contract.
Simple. Potentially scammable I guess, but i don't think there are any holes in the idea which aren't fun ---- I belong to Silent Ninja (Hopefully that should cover it). |
Captain James Kirk
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Posted - 2011.02.17 16:36:00 -
[28]
Best idea I heard for ransom system was to create an Ransom 'agency'.
Potential bounty hunters pay a fee of (insert suitable ammount here) and get a random list of lets say 5 'pirates' ie guys with sec -2 and below, maybe -5 can't remember what was said. The bounty agent act a bit like a locator agent in that the 'pilot was last seen in 'X' region or 'X' system. The bounty hunter gets immediate kill rights on these pirates for 48 hours, the pirate gets a notification that 'he's had a contract taken out on him so to speak but doesn't know who it is.
The ransom ammount could be a set figure derived from the bounty agent 'fees' and also supplemented by players in the same way that bounties are set now.
Sure you could always contact the pirate and make an arrangement to split the bounty but seriously that would require a level of trust by both parties which will most likely be open to awesome abuse, betrayals, setups and backstabbings. Works for me
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Khan Singh Noonien
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Posted - 2011.02.17 16:50:00 -
[29]
Surely, I have made my meaning plain. I mean to avenge myself upon you, Admiral. I deprived your ship of power, and when I swing around, I mean to deprive you of your life.
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Baki Yuku
Minmatar CRANK INC.
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Posted - 2011.02.17 18:52:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Captain James Kirk Best idea I heard for ransom system was to create an Ransom 'agency'.
Potential bounty hunters pay a fee of (insert suitable ammount here) and get a random list of lets say 5 'pirates' ie guys with sec -2 and below, maybe -5 can't remember what was said. The bounty agent act a bit like a locator agent in that the 'pilot was last seen in 'X' region or 'X' system. The bounty hunter gets immediate kill rights on these pirates for 48 hours, the pirate gets a notification that 'he's had a contract taken out on him so to speak but doesn't know who it is.
The ransom ammount could be a set figure derived from the bounty agent 'fees' and also supplemented by players in the same way that bounties are set now.
Sure you could always contact the pirate and make an arrangement to split the bounty but seriously that would require a level of trust by both parties which will most likely be open to awesome abuse, betrayals, setups and backstabbings. Works for me
I like this idea shame ccp are to thick to use and improve on the idea :)
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