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Talis Antebellum
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Posted - 2011.02.21 08:59:00 -
[1]
Here's the deal - everytime you mess with someone in hi-sec they bring out their passive or active tanked drake monster to overkill your poor frigate, cruiser or whichever ship you are in.
So, any EFT warriors out there able to take on the following task:
A ship that can take down a Drake (assuming good T2 fitted Drake and not T1 lolfits), with the following criteria:
1) If T1 ship, then not bigger than battlecruiser hull. 2) If T2 ship, then not bigger than cruiser hull. 3) Be able to keep the Drake pinned (disruptor & webifier) 4) Must be Amarr or Gallente (since those are the ships I can fly)
Sick and tired of these carebear drakes showing up with their easymode tank fits to try taking out my assault ships or cruisers.
I've tried quite a few different setups myself, but I'd like to hear what our great assembly of EFT warriors might cook up. An attempt with a T2 Ion fitted Deimos was made (2x dam mods) but didn't manage to break the tank (Medium blaster spec 4, drone spec 4, otherwise optimal skills). Could tank it easily, but what's the point if you can't get the kill eh?
Any suggestions for a comrad in need?
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Kepakh
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Posted - 2011.02.21 09:13:00 -
[2]
Thanks to passive recharge on shields, Drake is pretty much unbeatable in 1v1.
What could work is triple repper Myrm but I am not sure you will have enough boosters to outlast the Drake.
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AtheistOfFail
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.02.21 09:16:00 -
[3]
1) No such thing as active drakes (it's either semi-active or fully active)
2) Semi Active - Neut the ****er dry on a battlecruiser with neuts (no warp scram, so easy to get away if it goes south).
2.1Harbinger does this best (Drake has 0 EM resist and **** therm resists off the bat)
2.2) Fully Active - Overwhelming DPS (i think the max for drake passive tank is like 500 DPS or so).
2.2.1) Real PvP fits will be buffer as opposed to regen so you should be ok if you can do more damage than them.
3) PS: You have spare mids (for Cap boosters), use them, he does not.
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Dorian Tormak
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Posted - 2011.02.21 09:17:00 -
[4]
Maybe a targetting range dampening Celestis?
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Malema
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Posted - 2011.02.21 09:20:00 -
[5]
Going to regret typing this but ...
Get a Drake
------------------------------------------------ Miners/Industrialists : Get back ! |
Paikis
Red Federation
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Posted - 2011.02.21 09:35:00 -
[6]
Originally by: AtheistOfFail
1) No such thing as active drakes (it's either semi-active or fully active)
Actually there are completely passive drakes. Ones without invuls wont have as good resists, but they'll still be pretty beefy.
Originally by: AtheistOfFail
2) Semi Active - Neut the ****er dry on a battlecruiser with neuts (no warp scram, so easy to get away if it goes south).
A properly fit HAM drake will have full tackle. Also they'll be using VERY minimal cap, so it'll take a while to drain it.
Originally by: AtheistOfFail
2.0.1) Harbinger does this best (Drake has 0 EM resist and **** therm resists off the bat)
Drake has 25 EM resists (base, battlecruiser V). It's worst resist is better than most other BC's best.
Originally by: AtheistOfFail
2.1) Fully Active - Overwhelming DPS (i think the max for drake passive tank is like 500 DPS or so).
ok, at this point I was begining to get the idea that you had no idea what active/passive actually mean. A fully ACTIVE tank will have a shield booster and active hardeners. Neut it.
Originally by: AtheistOfFail
2.1.1) Real PvP fits will be buffer as opposed to regen so you should be ok if you can do more damage than them.
Agreed. Although a bigger buffer will give you better regen anyway.
Originally by: AtheistOfFail
3) PS: You have spare mids (for Cap boosters), use them, he does not.
True.
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Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.02.21 09:36:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Dorian Tormak Maybe a targetting range dampening Celestis?
And bore the drake until he self destructs?
Problem is that there are quite some different drake setups, and you seem kinda angry that those so called 'carebears' dont bring ships you can kill easier, who is the carebear now?
Your best bet is probably a gank myrm if they do bring some lol 4 SPR drake. Also fit a neut since they most likely will have active hardeners.
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Liang Nuren
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Posted - 2011.02.21 09:53:00 -
[8]
A few comments (all of this assumes a 7 HML II/2 LSE II,2 Inv II,Web,Disruptor/4 SPR/3 CDFP Drake): - I would expect to need to either be able to tank 350 Kin/Thm DPS. Make sure to kill their drones off early - especially if you don't have any to worry about them remembering to shoot. This will lower their DPS to < 250 DPS in a typical 4 SPR scenario. - I would expect to need to break 830 omni DPS (674 RF EMP, 784 RF PP, 656 IN MF). This is the bare minimum to ever break his tank - if you're buffer fit, you aren't going to win. - Most Drake pilots will not shoot your drones. Furthermore, they are almost certain to shoot kinetic (and only kinetic) at you. - Overheat right as he hits peak recharge .. if you hit "the wall" before then, you probably won't break him before your guns burn out. :-/ - The ability to disengage vs SURPRISE BUTSEXXX!!!! Drakes is a very nice addition.
The Harbinger seems like your best choice - start the engagement at range to see what he's packing. Whittle him down a bit (shields melt like butter until recharge rate is hit) before getting in close and bringing up the close range ammo.
-Liang -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
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Daneel Trevize
Black Viper Nomads
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Posted - 2011.02.21 09:54:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Daneel Trevize on 21/02/2011 09:55:39 3 MFS Astarte does 1300dps with Void and heat for a minute, otherwise 1100dps sustained, ~55K EHP(balanced resists, but much better against kinetic), dps can be dialed down for more tank. You sure you can't squeeze one in? |
Jojo Jackson
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Posted - 2011.02.21 10:17:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Jojo Jackson on 21/02/2011 10:23:11
[Sacrilege] 2 * Medium Armor Repairer II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II 2 * Ballistic Control System II
Y-S8 Hydrocarbon I Afterburners Stasis Webifier II Warp Scrambler II Medium Tapered Capacitor Infusion I, Cap Booster 200
5 * Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Torrent Rage Assault Missile 50W Infectious Power System Malfunction
Medium Anti-Thermic Pump I Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I
Hobgoblin II x3
Tanks 326 damage with all active (include NEUT) for 3m12. 549 firepower with drones. Need 1% PGU implant :/.
Once neuted and the Invus are off, you should have enough damage to break the tank. Drakes with 4*SPR don't have to much cap anyway.
PS: resitences are ~72% EM, 73% TERM, 79% KIN, 89% EXP So a typical 4*SPR Drake will not do realy much damage against you anyway. Include your AB speed sig-tank and his blown up Signatur from shield-buffer, your changs shouldn't be to bad. |
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Talis Antebellum
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Posted - 2011.02.21 10:37:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Talis Antebellum on 21/02/2011 10:37:29
Originally by: Jojo Jackson Edited by: Jojo Jackson on 21/02/2011 10:23:11
[Sacrilege]
Sadly no HAM skills & was planning to use a Warp Disruptor, not a scrambler, since it makes it so much easier to catch people on the gates.
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Jojo Jackson
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Posted - 2011.02.21 10:50:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Jojo Jackson on 21/02/2011 10:52:57 20km Scram is no prob ... HAMs are ^^. You can switch for HM but then you won't have enough firepower anymore :(.
EDIT: 390 DPS WITH drones, 331 without. So you would realy need to time your drones to break his peek. And you need a 3% CPU imp.
[Sacrilege] Medium Armor Repairer II Medium 'Accommodation' Vestment Reconstructer I Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II
Y-S8 Hydrocarbon I Afterburners Faint Warp Disruptor I Stasis Webifier II Medium Tapered Capacitor Infusion I, Cap Booster 200
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile E50 Prototype Energy Vampire
Medium Anti-Thermic Pump I Medium Warhead Calefaction Catalyst I
Hobgoblin II x3
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Headerman
Minmatar Metanoia. Test Alliance Please Ignore
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Posted - 2011.02.21 11:12:00 -
[13]
If it was me, i would pull this out:
[Typhoon, Gank] 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Armor Kinetic Hardener II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II
100MN Afterburner II X5 Prototype I Engine Enervator Faint Warp Disruptor I Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron
Siege Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Torpedo 800mm Repeating Artillery II, EMP L 800mm Repeating Artillery II, EMP L 800mm Repeating Artillery II, EMP L
Large Ancillary Current Router I Large Trimark Armor Pump I Large Trimark Armor Pump I
Berserker SW-900 x2 Wasp EC-900 x3 Warrior II x5 Warrior TP-300 x5
But n this case, i think a myrm would go pretty well. It's repping bonus would be quite handy.
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Talis Antebellum
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Posted - 2011.02.21 11:24:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Headerman Edited by: Headerman on 21/02/2011 11:21:19 If it was me, i would pull this out:
[Typhoon, Gank]
Chances of actually locking and scrambling the opponent before he manages to warp from the gate is quite slim. No sensor booster or MWD, and even if it had the chances are still slim with 2x 1600mm.
Care to share a myrmidon setup then?
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Cygnus Zhada
Viziam
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Posted - 2011.02.21 11:35:00 -
[15]
I'll probably go to hell for such a crappy fit, but that's what most direct counters are. Oh well.
[Deimos, Drake killer] Medium Armor Repairer II Energized Magnetic Membrane II Energized Magnetic Membrane II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
10MN Afterburner II Warp Disruptor II Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Medium Nosferatu II
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I
Infiltrator II x5
--- Stultorum infinitus est numerus. |
Niclas Solo
Amarr Love n Peace Snatch Victory
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Posted - 2011.02.21 11:53:00 -
[16]
Drake? what is the problem? a standard fitted myrm or harbi should have no problem. And i really like to kill them in my ishtar, 93% kin resist :D who undock without a command legion?
[Harbinger, Gang] Damage Control II 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Centii C-Type Adaptive Nano Plating Heat Sink II Heat Sink II
Warp Disruptor II Stasis Webifier II Sensor Booster II, Scan Resolution Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Medium Energy Neutralizer II
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Valkyrie II x5
---------------------------------------------
[Myrmidon, trirep] Damage Control II Medium Armor Repairer II Medium Armor Repairer II Medium Armor Repairer II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 800 Warp Disruptor II Medium Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 400 Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Stasis Webifier II
Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I Medium Nanobot Accelerator I
Hammerhead II x5 Ogre II x2 Hammerhead II x2 Hobgoblin II x1 Warrior II x5
---------------------------------------------------------------
[Ishtar, armor] Damage Control II Centii C-Type Adaptive Nano Plating Armor Explosive Hardener II Medium Armor Repairer II Medium Armor Repairer II
Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Dark Blood Medium Capacitor Booster, Navy Cap Booster 800 Warp Disruptor II Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I, Optimal Range Disruption X5 Prototype I Engine Enervator
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S 200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S 200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S E50 Prototype Energy Vampire Salvager I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I Medium Nanobot Accelerator I
Curator II x5 Berserker II x5 Hammerhead II x5 Warrior II x5
Originally by: Thorian Baalnorn
I build my own rigs so they are free.
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Talis Antebellum
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Posted - 2011.02.21 13:57:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Cygnus Zhada I'll probably go to hell for such a crappy fit, but that's what most direct counters are. Oh well.
[Deimos, Drake killer]
Used that, his tank held at about 70% - useless I'm afraid.
Will have to try the Harbinger and/or Myrmidon
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Rick Venus
Minmatar Matari Republican Army
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Posted - 2011.02.21 15:18:00 -
[18]
No chance of a dual web 425mm AC plated trimark'd Hurricane doing this?
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Hauling Hal
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Posted - 2011.02.21 15:28:00 -
[19]
1. If he's a PvP HM buffer fit, he won't have a godly passive tank. 2. If he's a HAM Drake, he'll probably sacrifice some of his tank for tackle. 3. If he's a passive fit, he may sacrifice DPS for tank. 4. If he's a passive fit with active hardeners, then he uses cap but it regens slowly. 5. If he's a passive fit with passive amplifiers, then his resists are lower than a Drake with hardeners.
If you're trying to kill a Drake that is setup purely for defense, option 3, then I wouldn't bother as that is known as a draw. You can't kill him, even though he is scrammed, and he can't scram you, so you can warp off.
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Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.02.21 15:29:00 -
[20]
Why would you possible want to dual web something with the sig radius of a medium sized moon and the same agility?
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Ravenesa
The Bastards The Bastards.
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Posted - 2011.02.21 15:35:00 -
[21]
Ishtar w/ T2 Heavies will munch the Drake. You can eithe rdo a massive passive yourself or do a dual armor rep Ishtar. I prefer the Dual Armor version since you can put full tackle in the mids with a web and a drone mod if you want. Highs I use AC's with RF EMP to help hit his EM resists. Unless he is %100 passive you will crack him before he comes close to cracking you.
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Seriously Bored
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.02.21 15:42:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Furb Killer Why would you possible want to dual web something with the sig radius of a medium sized moon and the same agility?
I would double check that agility... ùùùùù
Originally by: CCP Big Dumb Object When I nerf something, it takes 2-3 months for your dreams to be crushed.
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.02.21 15:48:00 -
[23]
Either he's properly set up to do some actual damage, in which case his tank does not regen very much (but has a fair bit of buffer), or he is set up to tank a hellalot, in which case you can just wait until he runs out of ammoà ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.02.21 17:00:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Seriously Bored
Originally by: Furb Killer Why would you possible want to dual web something with the sig radius of a medium sized moon and the same agility?
I would double check that agility...
Fairly horrible. Although what i mainly meant was the speed, but then the comparison with a moon would go wrong since moons go pretty fast (and we were talking about 4 SPR drakes so its speed is horrible).
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.02.21 17:23:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Furb Killer
Originally by: Seriously Bored
Originally by: Furb Killer Why would you possible want to dual web something with the sig radius of a medium sized moon and the same agility?
I would double check that agility...
Fairly horrible. Although what i mainly meant was the speed, but then the comparison with a moon would go wrong since moons go pretty fast (and we were talking about 4 SPR drakes so its speed is horrible).
Drake: IM 0.628 + 14,010,000 kg = 8,798,280 Hurricane: IM 0.704 + 12,500,000 kg = 8,800,000 Harbinger: IM 0.704 + 13,500,000 kg = 9,504,000 Myrmidon: IM 0.704 + 13,250,000 kg = 9,328,000
So yeahà best agility, fastest acceleration. Doesn't really qualify as "fairly horrible". ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
Corporal Punishment08
NosWaffle Nostradamus Effect
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Posted - 2011.02.21 17:47:00 -
[26]
What about an ECM boat? Rook maybe? Fitted for dmg, with dmg modifying rigs and BCSs in the low slots, and a few racial jammers in the mids, with a MWD and disruptor/scrambler. Would only need the MWD in between ECM cycles, and that's IF the Drake manages a lock before you jam him up again. I would suggest 3 Gravimetric jammers. If you are not able to break their tank, you could at the very least, warp off.
Dunno if this would fit, but here goes: 5 HAM T2 launchers
3 ECM - Spatial Destabilizer IIs 1 Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon i MWD 1 J5B Warp Disruptor 1 Stasis Webifier 1 Cap Recharger
3 BCSs
2 Warhead Calefaction Catalysts
Could get the job did? Don't know if that would all fit though, I don't have EFT or EVE in front of me atm _____________________________________ Real men corpse tank. |
Liang Nuren
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Posted - 2011.02.21 17:53:00 -
[27]
WTB Rook that does 800 DPS.
-Liang -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
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Seriously Bored
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.02.21 18:02:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Furb Killer Fairly horrible. Although what i mainly meant was the speed, but then the comparison with a moon would go wrong since moons go pretty fast (and we were talking about 4 SPR drakes so its speed is horrible).
Beside Tippia's comment on agility above, it's also worth noting the Drake is only slow compared to a Hurricane. Fitted ship to fitted ship, it's comparable to a Harbinger.
I wasn't meaning to be an ass, it's just that the idea that the Drake is slow or plodding isn't all that justified. You were correct about it's bloated sig though. ùùùùù
Originally by: CCP Big Dumb Object When I nerf something, it takes 2-3 months for your dreams to be crushed.
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Tony SoXai
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Posted - 2011.02.21 18:04:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Ravenesa Ishtar w/ T2 Heavies will munch the Drake. You can eithe rdo a massive passive yourself or do a dual armor rep Ishtar. I prefer the Dual Armor version since you can put full tackle in the mids with a web and a drone mod if you want. Highs I use AC's with RF EMP to help hit his EM resists. Unless he is %100 passive you will crack him before he comes close to cracking you.
This. Drakes are lunch for well-flown Ishtars.
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Teramaxus
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Posted - 2011.02.21 18:13:00 -
[30]
Hi i come back eve i think i hear drake easy kill ishtar lol someone shud doel me drake in ishtare
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