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Katy Karkinoff
Minmatar Psycho Chicks
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Posted - 2011.03.13 20:31:00 -
[1]
For some reason a lot of people dislike them and I would like to explain why you're wrong.
Firstly, lets examine what we have right now. Currently we have three varying sizes of squares that are extremely difficult to distinguish (relative to the new system anyhow). Now because many of us have played this game for so long we have learned to identify that very tiny variance in size but for new players I can easily understand how it would not only be difficult to differentiate the class sizes but also comprehend what a bigger square signifies. Also there is currently no difference between the battleships and capital classes which is just plain silly.
With the new system it addresses the battleship/cap ship issue, and makes differentiating industrials from combat vessels extremely easy. While we will need to adjust a little bit it will by no means be even remotely difficult to identify what it is now on your overview. Most importantly however the amount of dashes makes it easy for even new players to recognize that more dashes = bigger target, and probably a bigger threat.
So to all of you who think this change is going to cripple your ability to identify ships then you're just dumb and clearly lack the ability to adapt to the blatant improvement of the overview UI.
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Catari Taga
Centre Of Attention Middle of Nowhere
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Posted - 2011.03.13 21:08:00 -
[2]
So you are saying counting tiny dashes is easier than differentiating a huge cross from a tiny one? To say it in your words, that is "just plain silly".
But I don't care either way, I don't use those icons other than to see who's yellow or red boxing me. --
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Kieron VonDeux
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Posted - 2011.03.13 21:31:00 -
[3]
I think the old system was good enough when we had less ship classes. It is in need of a major overhaul.
I'm gonna wait to see what else the Devs come up before I say too much, but the new system looks interesting.
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Rixiu
The Forgotten Navy
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Posted - 2011.03.13 23:30:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Rixiu on 13/03/2011 23:30:18
Originally by: Catari Taga So you are saying counting tiny dashes is easier than differentiating a huge cross from a tiny one? To say it in your words, that is "just plain silly".
But I don't care either way, I don't use those icons other than to see who's yellow or red boxing me.
Cross? Ship icons are square? Check your eyesight please :)
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Catari Taga
Centre Of Attention Middle of Nowhere
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Posted - 2011.03.13 23:40:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Rixiu Edited by: Rixiu on 13/03/2011 23:30:18
Originally by: Catari Taga So you are saying counting tiny dashes is easier than differentiating a huge cross from a tiny one? To say it in your words, that is "just plain silly".
But I don't care either way, I don't use those icons other than to see who's yellow or red boxing me.
Cross? Ship icons are square? Check your eyesight please :)
lol, fair point. He was talking about new players so I was automatically thinking NPC. --
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xXxSatsujinxXx
Reaper Industries Eternal Rapture
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Posted - 2011.03.14 00:56:00 -
[6]
Ain't broke, don't fix it.
Just enable the ship type column in overview if you can't figure out what you're shooting at...
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Mirabi Tiane
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Posted - 2011.03.14 02:33:00 -
[7]
Originally by: xXxSatsujinxXx Ain't broke, don't fix it.
It was kinda broke. If you use the ship type column so much, you won't care about these new icons at all, amirite? _____________________________
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Pesets
The Hunt Club
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Posted - 2011.03.14 02:57:00 -
[8]
The new icons don't really match the style of the rest of the icons, and aren't even consistent among themselves (cruiser icon is equilateral but other ones are not). That's probably the main reason why a lot of people hate it. It is, however, awesome that they're overhauling the ship icons in the first place.
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ACESsiggy
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.03.14 03:56:00 -
[9]
Edited by: ACESsiggy on 14/03/2011 03:57:09 Wonder if the same people disliked the new interface that was suppose to launch Why not scratch overview all together and create a better playable interface for veterans and noobs alike>.
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cyclobs
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.03.14 03:59:00 -
[10]
the new symbols are terrible. i mean i dunno whats wrong with the old system. small squares for small ships and big ones for big ships. simple and easy to look at. even better you can tell between NPCs and players.
the new system is horrible. you have 30 different types of symbols and they barely follow any standard differences between them. bring back old symbols!
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Saman Ayan
Minmatar Lazy.
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Posted - 2011.03.14 11:54:00 -
[11]
If CCP is going to put in new ship icons, then they really should add separate ones for destroyers and BCs, and possibly supercapitals. Better now than in a couple years, given CCP's development cycles!
Also, I'm not really happy about NPC and player ship icons - there isn't much to distinguish between them apart from the dots in the middle of icons for NPCs, and all pirate NPCs are coloured white.
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Mirabi Tiane
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Posted - 2011.03.14 16:31:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Saman Ayan all pirate NPCs are coloured white.
That's just a bug. _____________________________
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Sturmwolke
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Posted - 2011.03.14 17:13:00 -
[13]
Just dropping a note to CCP.
Effort on the new icon is nice, but my senses tell me it looks "cluttered".
Yes, if you say you have different shapes for the hull classes - the problem is glancing at these shapes is hard because they're basically the same size. The means, your brain will have to process the fine lines between a triangle vs a pentagon .... and since these icons are already small on screen, it makes it very hard to distinguish.
Tell you what, if you're serious about fixing the UI - have a look at the Homeworld series iconography. Learn and adapt from that.
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mkmin
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Posted - 2011.03.14 20:35:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Sturmwolke Just dropping a note to CCP.
Effort on the new icon is nice, but my senses tell me it looks "cluttered".
Yes, if you say you have different shapes for the hull classes - the problem is glancing at these shapes is hard because they're basically the same size. The means, your brain will have to process the fine lines between a triangle vs a pentagon .... and since these icons are already small on screen, it makes it very hard to distinguish.
Tell you what, if you're serious about fixing the UI - have a look at the Homeworld series iconography. Learn and adapt from that.
^^ This
Also, these types of icons are fine for player ships where it's an improvement, but against NPCs, where there really are only 3 sizes that matter (big medium and small) the crosses are better. As I posted in the other thread:
Originally by: mkmin I'm kinda dreading icons going live as opposed to crosshairs. They might look a little bit more up to date (i.e. 1980's instead of 1970's) but it is much more difficult to tell the size differences at a glance. Yes you can see the difference if you look at it for a moment, but no one's EVER going to mix up a frig cross and a battleship cross, regardless of eyesight, state of inebriation, or whether or not they happen to be sitting at their computer at the moment.
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Wendi Watson
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Posted - 2011.03.15 00:18:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Katy Karkinoff For some reason a lot of people dislike them and I would like to explain why you're wrong.
...
So to all of you who think this change is going to cripple your ability to identify ships then you're just dumb and clearly lack the ability to adapt to the blatant improvement of the overview UI.
And here is where I tell you where you are wrong. I dislike them because they look like hell.
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Razin
The xDEATHx Squadron Legion of xXDEATHXx
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Posted - 2011.03.15 00:29:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Sturmwolke Just dropping a note to CCP.
Effort on the new icon is nice, but my senses tell me it looks "cluttered".
Yes, if you say you have different shapes for the hull classes - the problem is glancing at these shapes is hard because they're basically the same size. The means, your brain will have to process the fine lines between a triangle vs a pentagon .... and since these icons are already small on screen, it makes it very hard to distinguish.
Tell you what, if you're serious about fixing the UI - have a look at the Homeworld series iconography. Learn and adapt from that.
Could you link some examples of these fine icons? ...
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Sturmwolke
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Posted - 2011.03.15 11:26:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Sturmwolke on 15/03/2011 11:27:44
Originally by: Razin Could you link some examples of these fine icons?
/me raises an eyebrow
Take a look at :
http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1103/homeworld2complex.PNG
The above is a screenshot of the HM2 Complex mod, however, the basic ship icons remains essentially the same throughout. The issues with the current CCP ship icon implementation is three-fold :
1) Not size distinguishable 2) Not EXPLICITLY shape distinguishable (if you glance at the pentagons and etc, with exception to the triangles - they resemble circular motives) 3) Not color distinguishable (which has already been made obvious)
Whomever at CCP who is behind re-designing these icons need to take a very serious and hard look at some of the older more successful games and learn what things they did right. You're needlessly re-inventing the wheel, not only failing but have managed to invent an octogonal wheel that you'll hope everyone will pass of as chick and cool innovation - never mind the fact that ye old circular wheel is pretty much the last word when it comes to wheel technology.
In other words, if you're trying to innovate, make sure whatever that you're doing fulfils or exceeds the previous designs - before even breaking into the new path.
Edit:spelling
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Renan Ruivo
Caldari Hipernova Tribal Conclave
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Posted - 2011.03.15 11:58:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Renan Ruivo on 15/03/2011 11:59:11 I take your Homeworld 2 and raise a Starfleet Command.
On my mind, its quite simple. So simple that its ugly.
Replace icons for letters.
P = Pod S = Shuttle F = Frigate D = Destroyer C = Cruiser BC = Battlecruiser BS = Battleship DN = Dreadnaught CR = Carrier SC = Supercarrier T = Titan I = Industrial
Very ugly, yes, but you cannot say thats inneficient. I give you a "BS" and a Pentagon. Which would you naturally asume means "Battleship"? ____________
I like woman because breasts |
Sturmwolke
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Posted - 2011.03.15 13:09:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Renan Ruivo I take your Homeworld 2 and raise a Starfleet Command.
Doesn't matter. The point to the whole exercise is to tell CCP to go back and re-work their designs - with flaws being pointed out.
There are plenty of examples out there, it just so happens HM2 floated to the top of my head because it has one of the better examples without having to write a wall of text to press the point, which nowadays will glaze many readers' eyes.
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Razin
The xDEATHx Squadron Legion of xXDEATHXx
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Posted - 2011.03.15 14:40:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Sturmwolke Edited by: Sturmwolke on 15/03/2011 11:27:44
Originally by: Razin Could you link some examples of these fine icons?
/me raises an eyebrow
Take a look at :
http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1103/homeworld2complex.PNG
The above is a screenshot of the HM2 Complex mod, however, the basic ship icons remains essentially the same throughout.
While I agree there is always room for improvement, IÆm not sure why you think that example is any better than what we have on SISI. Take those HW icons, reduce them in size, and populate a busy overview with them, and youÆll have the exact same situation you are complaining about, if not worse for what looks like a pretty large set of icons.
The current SISI setup isnÆt perfect, but it does make sense while minimizing the number of types to a manageable set. For most important ship-types we have a geometric shape increasing by one side for a step up in hull size, combining frig/destroyer, and cruiser/b-cruiser to avoid clutter. For better definition you can always have a ship-type column right next to the icon column in your overview.
I personally have no trouble distinguishing between the new icons, and do not think the pentagon can be confused with the circle. Which circle icon are you confusing it with?
According to several posts the NPC icons will be red in color, which is currently bugged.
...
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Achaikos
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Posted - 2011.03.15 15:08:00 -
[21]
New icons makes it more annoying for looking at the overview seeing difrent ones whole time.
Atleast make it like that you can decide i want old one or the new version.
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Sturmwolke
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Posted - 2011.03.15 16:43:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Razin Post #20
I sort of expected that response.
Well, I don't have time for fencing today, if CCP chooses to heed what's been said, then good. If not, then it's nothing new. Either way, what needed to be said was said.
Your arguments are irrelevant. |
Razin
The xDEATHx Squadron Legion of xXDEATHXx
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Posted - 2011.03.15 16:53:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Sturmwolke
Originally by: Razin Post #20
I sort of expected that response.
Well, I don't have time for fencing today, if CCP chooses to heed what's been said, then good. If not, then it's nothing new. Either way, what needed to be said was said.
Your arguments are irrelevant.
I concede your defeat. Better luck next time. ...
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Saint Lazarus
Pwn 'N Play Chaos Theory Alliance
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Posted - 2011.03.15 16:55:00 -
[24]
I like that they're trying but I also dislike them immensely.
They are plain ugly, and cluttered and NPC's icons definitely dont need an overhaul, the red crosses are iconic, simple and easy, no need to mess with them.
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My EvE Comic
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DonHel
Gallente Kentucky Fried Capsuleer
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Posted - 2011.03.15 18:03:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Renan Ruivo Edited by: Renan Ruivo on 15/03/2011 11:59:11 I take your Homeworld 2 and raise a Starfleet Command.
On my mind, its quite simple. So simple that its ugly.
Replace icons for letters.
P = Pod S = Shuttle F = Frigate D = Destroyer C = Cruiser BC = Battlecruiser BS = Battleship DN = Dreadnaught CR = Carrier SC = Supercarrier T = Titan I = Industrial
Very ugly, yes, but you cannot say thats inneficient. I give you a "BS" and a Pentagon. Which would you naturally asume means "Battleship"?
ugly yes, but i would take this style over the new one being introduced for sure
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Sturmwolke
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Posted - 2011.03.15 19:40:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Razin I concede your defeat. Better luck next time.
If it makes you fell happy, smug and almighty, certainly. Nothing would please me more than to concede to whatever defeat you have in mind.
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Kieron VonDeux
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Posted - 2011.03.15 20:02:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Renan Ruivo .Replace icons for letters.
Oh hell no. You may not like the new system but this would be far worse IMO.
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Renan Ruivo
Caldari Hipernova Tribal Conclave
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Posted - 2011.03.15 20:12:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Kieron VonDeux
Originally by: Renan Ruivo .Replace icons for letters.
Oh hell no. You may not like the new system but this would be far worse IMO.
Well, yeah. In hindsight, it would make it too easy :) ____________
I like woman because breasts |
Salpun
Gallente Paramount Commerce
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Posted - 2011.03.15 21:34:00 -
[29]
I like the new ones hope the new version on sisi comes up soon.
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Razin
The xDEATHx Squadron Legion of xXDEATHXx
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Posted - 2011.03.15 23:10:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Renan Ruivo
Originally by: Kieron VonDeux
Originally by: Renan Ruivo .Replace icons for letters.
Oh hell no. You may not like the new system but this would be far worse IMO.
Well, yeah. In hindsight, it would make it too easy :)
Sure, 'cause alphabet soup on your screen is a good thing, right? ...
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