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Simetraz
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Posted - 2011.03.25 20:24:00 -
[1]
After listening to the Security Presentation I have a question.
It was stated that previous GM decisions in regards to approved software are no longer valid. That is right past decision in regards to that app are no longer valid. That stance was hardline, one of the security department will interpret the EULA and if the application you are running violates it, you get banned. I have seen this before and it has its good and bad points.
Now any company that goes this far generally puts into play something else at the same time. That of an approved application list. Something that was totally missing from the presentation.
The presenter did use fraps as an example of an application that won't get you banned. However someone brought up Steam which they said would be fine as well.
The point being is you use software and you can be sure it violates the EULA in some cases and yes you should get banned for that. But what about the list of other software that come under the tool section, it does what you want, it isn't a bot so how are you going to know if the programmer did something they shouldn't have ? Examples: Fraps Steam evemover synergy isboxer evemon
If CCP is going to get rid of botters great ! But do your honest fans a favor and put into a play a process to submit an app for an approved list and give us that list. I would hate to try and log in one day to find I was banned because I was using evemon to make eve run in full screen.
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Xavier Isaacson
Minmatar Surface Detail
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Posted - 2011.03.25 20:36:00 -
[2]
Originally by: Simetraz
It was stated that previous GM decisions in regards to approved software are no longer valid. That is right past decision in regards to that app are no longer valid. That stance was hardline, one of the security department will interpret the EULA and if the application you are running violates it, you get banned. I have seen this before and it has its good and bad points.
Please don't take this the wrong way, but I have no idea what you are saying. Can you make it a little clearer please?
Originally by: Verone BBC Trust are a sack of arses.
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sableye
principle of motion
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Posted - 2011.03.25 20:52:00 -
[3]
just be careful of usinga nyting that automates movemnt/taks. fraps does;nt automate anything it just records what you do. does say synergy do this then yes but who is to say if its gonan be detectable or not and really it don;t automate anything as such as you still ahve to make the initial action it just replicates it as far as I can tell.
----------------------------------------- View The North Star! In All Its Glory!! |
Miilla
Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage
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Posted - 2011.03.25 21:32:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Miilla on 25/03/2011 21:34:31 Virus scanners that can shut down applications (Eve exe) based on network string matching (enemy bppears in local) are also permitted by implication.
There is no way to prevent these except by using RECENT SPEAKERS (aka delayed local) and make sure their name doesnt appear in network traffic until they talk in local.
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Barakkus
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Posted - 2011.03.25 22:26:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Simetraz
Examples: Fraps Steam evemover synergy isboxer evemon
Fraps-no /facepalm
Steam-no you can purchase eve through steam /facepalm
evemover-no, and isn't necessary anymore /facepalm
synergy-probably not, as long as you don't run a mod for it to bot
isboxer-probably not, as long as you don't run a mod for it to bot, the software by itself can't be used to bot
evemon-no /facepalm - - [SERVICE] Corp Standings For POS anchoring
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Breaker77
Gallente Reclamation Industries
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Posted - 2011.03.25 22:34:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Barakkus
Fraps-no /facepalm
Steam-no you can purchase eve through steam /facepalm
evemover-no, and isn't necessary anymore /facepalm
synergy-probably not, as long as you don't run a mod for it to bot
isboxer-probably not, as long as you don't run a mod for it to bot, the software by itself can't be used to bot
evemon-no /facepalm
Microsoft Paint - YES!
Warden, by Blizzard, at one time thought MS paint was a bad program and banned accounts that had it running.
Thats the problem with detection programs, they are not always 100% accurate.
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Diamond Knights
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Posted - 2011.03.26 02:11:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Diamond Knights on 26/03/2011 02:11:08 (cough) rn explorer.exe (cough)
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Erichk Knaar
Caldari Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
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Posted - 2011.03.26 02:18:00 -
[8]
PPL who didn't actually watch it, who understand this stuff, should.
I think its a pretty good solution for what they have to deal with.
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Spergy McSpergo
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Posted - 2011.03.26 03:03:00 -
[9]
PLOSTFU
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Lukriss
Caldari Notorious Legion Tactical Narcotics Team
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Posted - 2011.03.26 04:01:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Breaker77
Originally by: Barakkus
Fraps-no /facepalm
Steam-no you can purchase eve through steam /facepalm
evemover-no, and isn't necessary anymore /facepalm
synergy-probably not, as long as you don't run a mod for it to bot
isboxer-probably not, as long as you don't run a mod for it to bot, the software by itself can't be used to bot
evemon-no /facepalm
Microsoft Paint - YES!
Warden, by Blizzard, at one time thought MS paint was a bad program and banned accounts that had it running.
Thats the problem with detection programs, they are not always 100% accurate.
Blizzard once banned people who ran wow through wine.
Originally by: Redloc I want to gank hulks in high sec! I have a dedicated miner account so I have the funds to throw away.
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Aessoroz
Nohbdy.
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Posted - 2011.03.26 08:16:00 -
[11]
Moral of the story, inject code into eve by injecting STEAM first hence making this hilarious.
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Stefan Pompka
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Posted - 2011.03.26 11:46:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Aessoroz Moral of the story, inject code into eve by injecting STEAM first hence making this hilarious.
Yeah, all you need to do is to pretend to be one of MS CRT dlls and you are done. Oh and CCP won't tell me what I can run on my computer.
This move is like DRM - make it pain in the behind for everyone and botters will adapt in two weeks. They will probably start with renaming autohotkey.exe to steam.exe and it will work just fine.
This idea will do nothing about botters but will annoy many normal players.
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Internetz Spaceship
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Posted - 2011.03.26 11:55:00 -
[13]
Quote: The point being is you use software and you can be sure it violates the EULA in some cases and yes you should get banned for that.
you're not sure? ->petition. It took me about 10sec to solve your problem. You're welcome.
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Ancyker
Test Alliance Please Ignore
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Posted - 2011.03.26 12:00:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Ancyker on 26/03/2011 12:03:54
Originally by: Stefan Pompka This idea will do nothing about botters but will annoy many normal players.
This.
How much money does Microsoft put into anti-piracy each year? How many of you are running pirated versions of Windows, Office, etc?
The only thing DRM, "anti cheating", etc does is annoy people playing by the rules. People not playing by the rules find a way around it and aren't affected by it at all.
Every company out there thinks it can beat hackers/botters/pirates. Hint: None of them ever do nor can they. The best detection method is humans. There are lots of players willing to help out, give them some tools like for reporting ISK spammers. Check up on people that get reported a lot, ban/warn people constantly false reporting. At a minimum it won't be any worse than an app to do it since even with an application layer to do it, if someone was doing something wrong they are going to petition it anyway so a GM still has to get involved and at best it will be better.
Edit: I realize the petition system does this now, but it's still a hassle. It'd also be nice if CCP would post a LIST of people, or even an amount, they've banned for botting each month so we actually SEE them doing something about it. A lot of people I know that hate botters stopped reporting because it seems CCP does nothing about it. That generic "We'll look into it" isn't enough to make me think something is being done about it.
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Ban Doga
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Posted - 2011.03.26 12:15:00 -
[15]
The thing I found strange was that CCP Sreegs had no idea about synergy. Apparently there has been no exchange of information about what the GMs have done so far. Should have been trivial to get a list of currently accepted / rejected software.
While the talk in general was quite nice I find it somewhat lacking that the guy talking about security doesn't know what customer support's current approach to this is. Looks like some more communication between departments could help...
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Jenny Kitty
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Posted - 2011.03.26 12:17:00 -
[16]
How can I get a summary of this presentation please ?
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Miilla
Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage
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Posted - 2011.03.26 13:26:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Miilla on 26/03/2011 13:28:00 So if we run Eclipse, Visual Studio , WireShark or a command line compiler or something for developing / debugging an application that consumes the published Eve API we get banned.
Way to kill the community.
Yes we run Eve while debugging our Eve API applications, how else can we test it.
This is going to end badly for CCP
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