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Calathea Sata
State War Academy
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Posted - 2011.04.17 14:51:00 -
[1]
Why???? It looks so epic in the poster but in-game the ships dont look too much bigger or smaller than eachother, CCP you lier!
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Sader Rykane
Amarr Midnight Sentinels Midnight Space Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.04.17 14:58:00 -
[2]
perspective.
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Sarmatiko
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Posted - 2011.04.17 14:58:00 -
[3]
Have you changed hair?
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Zxays
Caldari Echolon Four Inc.
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Posted - 2011.04.17 14:59:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Zxays on 17/04/2011 15:05:51 Edited by: Zxays on 17/04/2011 14:59:17 It's all about the perspective. You know, it's the same thing people use to make things look the same size as the Eifel-tower or whatever u can think of.
Or would you say our sun is only the size of a grape just because that is the way you see things...?
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Vincent Gaines
Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2011.04.17 15:01:00 -
[5]
Because it's more important to get tattoos and piercings than to waste silly time making a carrier larger than a battleship.
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Stern Kyrenov
Executive Intervention Controlled Chaos
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Posted - 2011.04.17 15:04:00 -
[6]
First of it's liar. Second of all, the ships are most certainly to scale, it's your perspective that is lying to you.
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Logan LaMort
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.04.17 15:06:00 -
[7]
Yes they are.
It's just a matter of perspective
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Amberlamps
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Posted - 2011.04.17 16:51:00 -
[8]
The question is more like why are all Caldari ships absolutely tiny... yet the Amarr battleships are practically bordering capital ships.
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mkint
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Posted - 2011.04.17 17:02:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Amberlamps The question is more like why are all Caldari ships absolutely tiny... yet the Amarr battleships are practically bordering capital ships.
The real issue isn't the size of ships being what's "claimed" but that you can fit 2 assembled big battleships in a carrier that is smaller than the battleship.
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Quinc4623
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Posted - 2011.04.17 17:14:00 -
[10]
Whenever the camera focuses on something new, it zooms in or out so that object takes up the screen and no more. Zooming out for battleships, in for frigates. You can actually see it zoom if you switch between differently sized ships while in the hangar. In space you have to get two ships close to see the difference. This often happens at busy stations and trade hubs as you exit, but you can also just approach someone in a battleship.
Yes, the camera adjusts, and I think ship models are given the same level of detail regardless of size, so clicking "look at" gives you no idea how big it is unless there is something nearby for comparison.
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Kijo Rikki
Caldari Point of No Return Waterboard
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Posted - 2011.04.17 17:14:00 -
[11]
I think it has more to do with client gpu issues. If you were in a frig next to a bunch of carriers that were drawn to their actual size your card might crap itself. So while in a carrier, frigs look like gnats, but vice versa, they don't look so big compared to your frig.
That doesn't really explain stations though, except that possibly there is only one of them on grid usually.
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Soi Mala
Whacky Waving Inflatable Flailing Arm Tubemen
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Posted - 2011.04.17 17:15:00 -
[12]
I'l just leave this here...
Though yeah, a lot of the models are messed up... Why is a sabre bigger than a vaga?
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Azureite
Amarr Special Forces Operation Detachment Delta The 0rphanage
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Posted - 2011.04.17 17:15:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Azureite on 17/04/2011 17:16:53
Originally by: Calathea Sata Why???? It looks so epic in the poster but in-game the ships dont look too much bigger or smaller than eachother, CCP you lier!
The Nidhogger is way not to scale in that picture.
Edit: or its listed length in that picture is way too big. Take your pick.
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2011.04.17 17:19:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Calathea Sata More Junk
Hasn't your account unsubbed yet? Please? I'll pay you $15 per month just to shut up.
Wealth, howsoever got, in Eve makes Lords of morons and gentlemen of thieves; Aptitude and intellect are needless here; 'Tis impudence and money that grants fame. |
voiddragon
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Posted - 2011.04.17 17:22:00 -
[15]
Same reason your thumb looks bigger than the moon, doesn't mean it is.
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Logan LaMort
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.04.17 17:45:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Soi Mala I'l just leave this here...
Though yeah, a lot of the models are messed up... Why is a sabre bigger than a vaga?
I'll just confess my love for you right here...
I just tried it right now and ****! I've been annoyed by this kind of perspective representation in EVE for years and this fixes it completely.
Thank you!
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Azureite
Amarr Special Forces Operation Detachment Delta The 0rphanage
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Posted - 2011.04.17 18:35:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Logan LaMort
Originally by: Soi Mala I'l just leave this here...
Though yeah, a lot of the models are messed up... Why is a sabre bigger than a vaga?
I'll just confess my love for you right here...
I just tried it right now and ****! I've been annoyed by this kind of perspective representation in EVE for years and this fixes it completely.
Thank you!
This method doesn't actually change your perspective the way your mouse wheel does (by moving your PoV), instead it takes your view as an image and zooms in on it as you would a video or still photograph. That's why if you go all the way in the stars get rather large.
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mkint
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Posted - 2011.04.17 18:49:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Azureite
Originally by: Logan LaMort
Originally by: Soi Mala I'l just leave this here...
Though yeah, a lot of the models are messed up... Why is a sabre bigger than a vaga?
I'll just confess my love for you right here...
I just tried it right now and ****! I've been annoyed by this kind of perspective representation in EVE for years and this fixes it completely.
Thank you!
This method doesn't actually change your perspective the way your mouse wheel does (by moving your PoV), instead it takes your view as an image and zooms in on it as you would a video or still photograph. That's why if you go all the way in the stars get rather large.
That thing does make things look cooler, but it makes it harder to tell what's going on. Every now and then I'll double check to make sure my camera angle is still set as wide as possible to make sure I can see what's going on. With Tyrranis CCP made the default camera angle narrower to make the planets look more epic. (in fact, according to CCP themselves, so much of PI was so shoddy on launch because they put all their development effort into making planets look cool rather than making PI fun. kinda bugs me that more people aren't angrier about that.) I'm not sure if they let you configure your camera angle before that, but that's when I learned you could do it.
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Kern Hotha
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Posted - 2011.04.17 22:04:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Soi Mala I'l just leave this here...
Though yeah, a lot of the models are messed up... Why is a sabre bigger than a vaga?
I never knew we could change the field of view like this. Nice find. --- "The data does not support that polished quality sells better than new features." -Nathan Richardsson, Senior Producer at CCP |
MotherMoon
Huang Yinglong
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Posted - 2011.04.17 23:07:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Azureite
Originally by: Logan LaMort
Originally by: Soi Mala I'l just leave this here...
Though yeah, a lot of the models are messed up... Why is a sabre bigger than a vaga?
I'll just confess my love for you right here...
I just tried it right now and ****! I've been annoyed by this kind of perspective representation in EVE for years and this fixes it completely.
Thank you!
This method doesn't actually change your perspective the way your mouse wheel does (by moving your PoV), instead it takes your view as an image and zooms in on it as you would a video or still photograph. That's why if you go all the way in the stars get rather large.
noo waaaaaay off.
field of view makes things closer smaller, and things far away bigger. It changes how big things become big in other words.
I could show you in 3dmax, and I can understand why you would think it's so simple, but thank fully, it's not.
I suppose at the super version where it gets hard to see anything it MIGHT seem that way since it also happen to push the perspective to orthographical.
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Nypheas Azurai
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Posted - 2011.04.17 23:08:00 -
[21]
It's not just POV, it's bad concept design.
EVE ship designers seem to have an unjustified fetish for placing blinky lights all over the ship without regard to what they actually mean. In sci-fi lore and ship design, a source of glowing light on a ship constitutes a window, with the smallest dot the size of a porthole.
This rule which allows a human observer to judge scale quickly is unthinkingly exploited by placing random dots of all shapes and sizes scattered all over a ship's model. In some large ships it does give a sense of accurate, but having a million and one glow-y dots all over a small plane-sized frigate is just silly and ruins the immersion.
The same "hey lets put it on the ship cuz it looks cool" mentality doesn't just apply to dots of light, but other random doodads which look cool when used appropriately, but are rarely used appropriately in EVE ship design. Consider ventilation grating: by itself, a cool accent on a ship. Now consider the raven's (if we are to believe its size is accurate) a single-panel ventilation grating taking up roughly 50% of the left side of it's hull. That is utterly ridiculously unbelievable and immersion shattering. A single grating panel spanning several hundred metres long is about as believable in proportions as having 50 specks of light (windows?) in a square area of less than 50 metres that is inaccessible on a ship anyways.
When and if they revisit ship design, they need to seriously consider why something is being placed, what its function is, and what is its size; not just because glow-y things on mah spaceshirts looks kewl.
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Aderata Nonkin
Amarr
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Posted - 2011.04.17 23:11:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Calathea Sata Why???? It looks so epic in the poster but in-game the ships dont look too much bigger or smaller than eachother, CCP you lier!
It's time for you to take your daily dose of 150mg Risperdal.
It's also rude to put the OP as a link.
ĉIf you are not big enough to lose, then you are not big enough to win.Ĉ |
Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2011.04.17 23:20:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Nypheas Azurai In sci-fi lore and ship design,
By all means, let us insist that ship design be by the absolute authority in such matters.
Wealth, howsoever got, in Eve makes Lords of morons and gentlemen of thieves; Aptitude and intellect are needless here; 'Tis impudence and money that grants fame. |
Nypheas Azurai
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Posted - 2011.04.17 23:25:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Shar Tegral
Originally by: Nypheas Azurai In sci-fi lore and ship design,
By all means, let us insist that ship design be by the absolute authority in such matters.
By all means, let me insist that I can place glow-y dots anywhere I please. By all means let me create unproportionally sized ships that make little sense when compared to each other given their class. By all means let me design arbitrary inconsistencies for no functional design other than to make them look unsymmetrical because unsymmetrical is synonymous for real right?
By all means, it's your own design, do you what you want. But when your design breaks every convention of immersion and the ability for one to grasp the size of ship, then you're doing something wrong, so expect threads like this.
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Azureite
Amarr Special Forces Operation Detachment Delta The 0rphanage
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Posted - 2011.04.17 23:27:00 -
[25]
Originally by: MotherMoon
Originally by: Azureite
Originally by: Logan LaMort
Originally by: Soi Mala I'l just leave this here...
Though yeah, a lot of the models are messed up... Why is a sabre bigger than a vaga?
I'll just confess my love for you right here...
I just tried it right now and ****! I've been annoyed by this kind of perspective representation in EVE for years and this fixes it completely.
Thank you!
This method doesn't actually change your perspective the way your mouse wheel does (by moving your PoV), instead it takes your view as an image and zooms in on it as you would a video or still photograph. That's why if you go all the way in the stars get rather large.
noo waaaaaay off.
field of view makes things closer smaller, and things far away bigger. It changes how big things become big in other words.
I could show you in 3dmax, and I can understand why you would think it's so simple, but thank fully, it's not.
I suppose at the super version where it gets hard to see anything it MIGHT seem that way since it also happen to push the perspective to orthographical.
I reiterate, there is no change in perspective using this method. If you put something in your foreground (like a station) and zoom all the way in you can see stars become several times larger but the station stays in front of your view. That isn't because your PoV is getting so close that the stars appear larger, it's because you're zooming in on the image.
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mkint
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Posted - 2011.04.17 23:46:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Nypheas Azurai a lot of noise about ship design
Your communicating a good message extremely poorly. Poorly enough that I'm tempted to disagree with you on principle.
The message: The game would be a lot more immersive and interesting if ship designs could be taken literally, including but not limited to size, effects, and decorative bling. (How that might apply to stations planets and other celestials is another question altogether.)
As it is now, the dominix in particular is a glowy ball of lights. It makes the ship look like some kind of ugly shoe shaped cruise liner, not a battleship. Is it game breaking? Not really. Does it make the domi less appealing? I've always avoided flying one largely because of appearance.
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Nypheas Azurai
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Posted - 2011.04.18 00:02:00 -
[27]
Originally by: mkint The message: The game would be a lot more immersive and interesting if ship designs could be taken literally, including but not limited to size, effects, and decorative bling.
No not quite literally, but rather if ship designs lended themselves to credibility. Like all of us who play EVE, we've probably all seen and remember remarkably good sci-fi lore & ships. Still many of these may be different from each other with seemingly no "recipe"; yet the one thing that binds them is the ability for someone so inclined to immediately look at it and go "yep, that ship is immense, I can see it's immenseness and I believe its size and shape as it appears to be".
For the most part, I find I cannot do that with EVE. And I think that is the problem of OP and many people for whom the ships shatter immersion and break the ability to fully grasp the ship concept.
Again, take the Dominix. It's shape is often compared to a shoe, and it is not very fetching; however I fly one and (disregarding the glow-y light fiasco I mention) I can rather believe it's shape. What I cannot believe is several of the other doodads randomly adorned on the ship, not in the least the silly blips of light. If they were properly sized and uniform, I might believe them to be vast stardecks, hallways, though empty as they are in a ship that is supposedly able to be piloted by a single capsuleer (yet still has crew? another tough pill to swallow). But no, the light sources on the Dominix, even light patterns that are directly next to each other, go in every which way with no rhyme or reason.
Now that just doesn't make sense without requiring a very very good explanation (none of which I've seen yet as to why there exist random glow-y dots everywhere) and certainly the MORE things you need to explain about your ship design which aren't conveyed naturally, that is an indication that it is poor design.
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Logan LaMort
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.04.18 00:06:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Azureite Edited by: Azureite on 17/04/2011 23:33:59
Originally by: MotherMoon
Originally by: Azureite This method doesn't actually change your perspective the way your mouse wheel does (by moving your PoV), instead it takes your view as an image and zooms in on it as you would a video or still photograph. That's why if you go all the way in the stars get rather large.
noo waaaaaay off.
field of view makes things closer smaller, and things far away bigger. It changes how big things become big in other words.
I could show you in 3dmax, and I can understand why you would think it's so simple, but thank fully, it's not.
I suppose at the super version where it gets hard to see anything it MIGHT seem that way since it also happen to push the perspective to orthographical.
I reiterate my point, there is no change in perspective using this method. If you put something in your foreground (like a station) and zoom all the way in you can see stars become several times larger but the station stays in front of your view. That isn't because your PoV is getting so close that the stars appear larger, it's because you're zooming in on the image.
One of you is talking about field of view, the other point of view.
I used perspective as a loose term, but basically, normal zoom is the physical movement of the camera forwards and backwards, this would be your point of view.
Holding down ctrl + both mouse buttons doesn't change your point of view, the camera stays in the same place. It does however change your field of view. The smaller field of view you have, the more the view is stretched and this is why things appear bigger (Like the stars). The bigger field of view fills your entire screen with the surrounding landscape, making things appear more zoomed out.
TL:DR
You're both right
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Merouk Baas
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.04.18 00:38:00 -
[29]
Lovely feature. Do you think they realize they've left it in the client?
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Yxalitis
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Posted - 2011.04.18 03:07:00 -
[30]
The issue the OP has discovered, is that whatever size the in-gameships are supposed to be, the models used to represent them are all the same size. You can zoom in in a frigate as close as you can to a Titan. The level of detail visible is the same, but in the case of the Titan, the lights representing portholes are smaller (not small enough to reflect scale, but the size of the model is a limiting factor here) You've seen the Crysis mod with giant chickens? This is using the same size model as found in game, but scaled differently..that's how Eve does it, all ship models are much the same size (in terms of how there are designed as game assets) and scaled to match their supposed size. Obviously this so done to limit the complexity of the models, or else large fleet battles would be even more laggy. But, when you zoom in on a Titan for the first time, it can be a tad disappointing that you can't keep on zooming until you are staring at a teeny portion of the hull, all drawn in high detail.
I don't believe in signatures, not even really cool ones like "This signature intentionaly left blank" |
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