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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.04.25 01:43:00 -
[1]
Bond Details I am looking for a 10 billion ISK unsecured investment for 90 days. The bond starts earning interest May 1.
I'm offering 7.5% interest paid monthly (June 1, July 1, August 1), with a minimum investment of 500 million ISK.
The investor(s) can end their participation in this bond at any time, and I will endeavor to liquidate and pay-out their portion ASAP.
Purpose of Bond The ISK will be used to grow my various trade and manufacturing interests, which if you read the other forums at all you've probably seen my many posts about over the years. As I'm a forum junkie, you also should have a lot data to glean my character from.
I hate to name drop, but I'm a director in Proton Power's corporation, so we trust each other a great deal. I wanted to take my chances with my own MD forum bond offer, rather than just getting a loan from him.
Why This Bond Some recent ISK expenditures:
* 10 billion of materials currently in production. * 2 billion recently invested in additional BPOs to increase my current manufacturing capacity. * 1.5 billion per member increase in corp contribution (my idea). * 1.5 billion investment in spare ships, because stuff happens (and it did, but not to me).
So I'm not very liquid at the moment and need an ISK infusion. I've already canceled all my buy orders, losing a lot in broker fees. It is easier for me to offer a bond than to liquidate some assets.
Assets As I'm a director, I asked other members about me getting an audit, but they didn't want the exposure. So even though I know that these numbers are meaningless, for those that do think I'm trustworthy:
I have these on a spreadsheet:
* 14,873,257,695.00 NPC value of BPO
The rest are estimates:
* 10 billion of materials in manufacturing * 10 billion in ships * 3 billion in POS * 2.5 billion in corp fund * 600 million on sell orders * 175 million in personal wallets
Probably a couple billion in miscellaneous other assets and materials not currently in manufacturing.
Other Debts I am otherwise debt free.
Unless you count the 1.72 billion I borrowed from Proton Power, to buy a Rorqual, and repaid in full the next day. He refused to accept 700 million, in return for me compressing ore. I guess you could say I'm his ore compression 'ore now.
Risk As far as this bond is concerned, none really, unless you are worried about me being struck by an meteor or something similarly unpredictable.
I urge everyone to NOT invest in this bond if you don't think you can trust me!
Investors Please post in this thread if you are interested in participating in this bond, and indicate to what extent.
1. (500m open) 2. (500m open) 3. (500m open) 4. (500m open) 5. (500m open) 6. (500m open) 7. (500m open) 8. (500m open) 9. (500m open) 10. (500m open) 11. (500m open) 12. (500m open) 13. (500m open) 14. (500m open) 15. (500m open) 16. (500m open) 17. (500m open) 18. (500m open) 19. (500m open) 20. (500m open)
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Proton Power
Amarr Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.04.25 01:47:00 -
[2]
I have now played Eve with Tau for going on I want to say probably 6mths maybe longer. He is good friends with someone I have played eve with since beta.
I trust very few people to this extent, I will cover 5bil isk of the 10bil isk if he does scam. If that's not an endorsement I don't know what is.
Also put me down for 1bil, I would buy it out but he wants to do it this way :)
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.04.25 01:56:00 -
[3]
I've been advised to clarify that I'm taking reservations at this time.
I'd like to confirm all reservations before the start of the bond before May 1.
Once confirmed, ISK can be sent to me, and I'll confirm receipt of ISK.
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.04.25 02:00:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Proton Power Also put me down for 1bil, I would buy it out but he wants to do it this way :)
Confirming your 1 billion reservation. Thanks Proton Power.
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Gei'neille
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Posted - 2011.04.25 02:05:00 -
[5]
Reserving 1B
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.04.25 02:13:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Gei'neille Reserving 1B
Confirming your 1 billion reservation. Thanks Gei'neille.
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Syds Sinclair
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Posted - 2011.04.25 03:58:00 -
[7]
..Just an FYI, Tau's partner in crime (no pun intended, really!) Proton Power just got a 25b unsecured bond filled.
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Elise DarkStar
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Posted - 2011.04.25 04:12:00 -
[8]
wow a second cashout bond for proton power, now through someone else. how audacious. im sure the ******s will gobble it up.
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Brock Nelson
Caldari T2 Technologies Unlimited SRS.
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Posted - 2011.04.25 04:48:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Elise DarkStar wow a second cashout bond for proton power, now through someone else. how audacious. im sure the ******s will gobble it up.
Grow some balls to post with your main
Investor Relation | IPO Doc | BSAC SE Listing |
Elise DarkStar
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Posted - 2011.04.25 06:21:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Brock Nelson Grow some balls to post with your main
This is the forum default character, so this is what I post with. That's how seriously I take "MD rep". My main is the ceo of this corp.
That made a big difference, didn't it?
******.
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting
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Posted - 2011.04.25 07:55:00 -
[11]
Well, since I have some idling cash doing nothing anyway, put me up for 3B.
Auditing | Research | 3rd Party | Collateral Holding | EvE RL Charity |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.04.25 08:38:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha Well, since I have some idling cash doing nothing anyway, put me up for 3B.
Confirming your 3 billion reservation.
Thank you Vaerah Vahrokha.
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.04.25 08:45:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Elise DarkStar wow a second cashout bond for proton power, now through someone else. how audacious. im sure the ******s will gobble it up.
Thank you for bringing this to everyone's attention. I can understand your concern, and will attempt to address this issue, though I don't expect to be able to reassure anyone.
I won't go into the cash-out issue, as I think the ridiculousness of it has been sufficiently hashed out in Proton Power's own bond offering thread. Instead let me attempt to explain my motivation in involving Proton Power in my bond.
Proton Power warned me that he has his detractors, and he asked me whether or not I wanted him associated with my bond. I chose to risk being associated to Proton Power, a successful industrialist whom is known for his integrity, if not for his personal popularity. It was my choice.
I did it because we are already in the same corp, Proton Power is the CEO, and it wouldn't take anyone very long to notice that and concoct some sort fiction to attack my bond offering if I failed to disclose. Also, I hoped to draw out some of the people that missed out on Proton Power's own bond. I didn't expect them to invest in me by proxy, but rather at least read and consider my bond on its own merit, rather than it going unnoticed as I'm not as well known in the investment arena. This is my first bond after all.
Proton Power really has nothing to gain from this bond. I'm actually quite surprised that he has even offered to insure it for 50%. I didn't expect him to do that.
Elise DarkStar, you are completely right and justified in pointing out that investment in EVE is a risky business with no controls, and that I can't offer investors in my bond any concrete guarantees because of that. All I can offer is my assurance that I have no intentions of burning my reputation, and it may not have any value to anyone other than me though.
If anyone is willing to offer me 10 billion in exchange for a bunch of unfinished materials that may be hard to sell, I can contract them to you ASAP and I won't need this bond. Or people can choose to invest in my bond and earn 7.5% monthly for doing nothing more than taking a risk by trusting me with their ISK for 3 months.
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Hello Pretty
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Posted - 2011.04.25 09:39:00 -
[14]
Put me down for the rest. I dont count so good.. is that 5 ? Let me know will send.
K thx
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Tanaka Kharn
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Posted - 2011.04.25 09:41:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Hello Pretty Put me down for the rest. I dont count so good.. is that 5 ? Let me know will send.
K thx
Posted with wrong char soz.
Put me down for 5.
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.04.25 14:54:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Tanaka Kharn
Originally by: Hello Pretty Put me down for the rest. I dont count so good.. is that 5 ? Let me know will send.
K thx
Posted with wrong char soz.
Put me down for 5.
Confirming your 5 billion reservation. Thank you Tanaka Kharn.
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.04.25 15:03:00 -
[17]
Now that the reservations are finished, I invite the following people to send me the ISK on or before May 1:
Proton Power: 1 billion Gei'neille: 1 billion Vaerah Vahrokha: 3 billion Tanaka Kharn: 5 billion
I will send an EVE-mail reminder.
Thank you all.
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Proton Power
Amarr Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.04.25 16:10:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Tau Cabalander Now that the reservations are finished, I invite the following people to send me the ISK on or before May 1:
Proton Power: 1 billion Gei'neille: 1 billion Vaerah Vahrokha: 3 billion Tanaka Kharn: 5 billion
I will send an EVE-mail reminder.
Thank you all.
Glad this worked out for you.
For those that think its just me trying to pull in another 10bil; if I wanted 10bil isk more I would ask for it, if I wanted 50bil isk more I would ask for it. No need to hind behind alts to get isk.
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Ray McCormack
Nordar Innovations.
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Posted - 2011.04.25 16:13:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Hello Pretty
Why hello.
I agree that shooting people with a headache in the head is a good idea, because it will stop their headaches. |
Edwin Rothbard
Interstellar Arbitrage
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Posted - 2011.04.25 16:37:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Proton Power For those that think its just me trying to pull in another 10bil;
When you guarantee a loan for another person it's the same as borrowing the money yourself. You borrowed at least another 5b if not another 10b isk in this thread.
Said another way, if this guy had not made any connection to you this deal would have been DOA without collateral.
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Lando Antilles
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Posted - 2011.04.25 16:50:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Edwin Rothbard if this guy had not made any connection to you this deal would have been DOA without collateral.
I'd venture a guess that Tau's rep is worth more than 10B. Just b/c he spends more time on S&I than MD doen't make him an unknown with no social incentive to make good on a debt.
Wish I had caught this opportunity before it filled, and before my wallet was empty. ---------------------- My *locked* EVE CV |
Proton Power
Amarr Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.04.25 17:48:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Edwin Rothbard
Originally by: Proton Power For those that think its just me trying to pull in another 10bil;
When you guarantee a loan for another person it's the same as borrowing the money yourself. You borrowed at least another 5b if not another 10b isk in this thread.
Said another way, if this guy had not made any connection to you this deal would have been DOA without collateral.
No if I was borrowing it myself I would be recieving the isk and paying the interest on it. I am securing 5bil of it, just like if he handed me 5bil in collateral for the bond.
Per the 10bil comment learn to read, why would I go through all the hassle of using an alt when I can post with PP and get the isk. 25bil is not near would I could pull from the MD community if I had even half a plan, and then who knows what else from others not in the MD community. Don't believe me go look at some of my prior offers.
Anyway this is Tau's thread, congrats mate and I will leave it be now.
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Edwin Rothbard
Interstellar Arbitrage
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Posted - 2011.04.25 18:15:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Proton Power No if I was borrowing it myself I would be recieving the isk and paying the interest on it. I am securing 5bil of it, just like if he handed me 5bil in collateral for the bond.
You might want to read up on what a cosigner is because that's what you obligated yourself to in this thread. Cosigners don't receive the money, they merely agree to repay in case the borrower defaults. You are on the hook for the loan. You don't get to say that you are backing the loan AND that you didn't take on new debt. They go together.
Originally by: Proton Power Per the 10bil comment learn to read, why would I go through all the hassle of using an alt when I can post with PP and get the isk.
I was not implying that you were using an alt to get more money. I was, however, pointing out that you took on more debt.
Originally by: Proton Power 25bil is not near would I could pull from the MD community if I had even half a plan...
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.04.25 19:20:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Edwin Rothbard When you guarantee a loan for another person it's the same as borrowing the money yourself. You borrowed at least another 5b if not another 10b isk in this thread.
The guarantee aspect is a valid point I hadn't considered.
But to be precise Proton Power has only guaranteed 5 billion, and I also don't expect he gave it any more thought than trying to help a friend.
Originally by: Edwin Rothbard Said another way, if this guy had not made any connection to you this deal would have been DOA without collateral.
I'm not convinced that this bond would have been DOA without an endorsement, but I don't deny that it helped. Perhaps the bond wouldn't have filled as quickly or completely.
One of my most memorable moments in-game happened on a long trip, I think from Rens to Amarr, when someone spotted me at a gate and wrote in local something like: "Hey, it's the famous Tau Cabalander!" That prompted a really great convo. So I don't think I'm completely an unknown.
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Roguehalo
Caldari Roguehalo Ship Brokers
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Posted - 2011.04.25 19:36:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Tau Cabalander Edited by: Tau Cabalander on 25/04/2011 19:27:15
Originally by: Edwin Rothbard When you guarantee a loan for another person it's the same as borrowing the money yourself. You borrowed at least another 5b if not another 10b isk in this thread.
The guarantee aspect is a valid point I hadn't considered.
But to be precise Proton Power has only guaranteed 5 billion, and I also don't expect he gave it any more thought than trying to help a friend.
If he wants to back-out on that, or any of the people that have made reservations, I completely understand.
Originally by: Edwin Rothbard Said another way, if this guy had not made any connection to you this deal would have been DOA without collateral.
I'm not convinced that this bond would have been DOA without an endorsement, but I don't deny that it helped. Perhaps the bond wouldn't have filled as quickly or completely.
One of my most memorable moments in-game happened on a long trip, I think from Rens to Amarr, when someone spotted me at a gate and wrote in local something like: "Hey, it's the famous Tau Cabalander!" That prompted a really great convo. So I don't think I'm completely an unknown.
Never heard of you
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RAW23
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Posted - 2011.04.25 19:54:00 -
[26]
Edited by: RAW23 on 25/04/2011 19:54:16 Not sure why people would have a major problem with this bond. From reading his posts it seems clear Tau knows what he is doing (most of the time ) re: industry. He's also an established contributor to the community and is offering a decent rate. The bond is 50% guaranteed by someone that there is really no reason to suspect would default. I've had my problems with one of PP's offerings in the past (primarily for presentational reasons; at least his last one said what the isk would be used for ) and his response to the T4U situation but his own public debts have stayed under a reasonable ceiling and the addition of a 5bil liability really doesn't seem too worrisome. The PP 'stable' has also turned out some good bond runners in the past and no one suggested Lord Arbalest, for instance, was a PP cashout alt. Personally, I would have liked to see a bit more detail in the business plan here and an audit is always a good thing but in it's absence I would place some value on PP's vouching for Tau. In short, this seems like a pretty investable proposition.
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting
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Posted - 2011.04.25 20:03:00 -
[27]
ISK sent
Auditing | Research | 3rd Party | Collateral Holding | EvE RL Charity |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.04.25 20:17:00 -
[28]
Originally by: RAW23 Tau - you mention the possibility of being struck by a meteor. In this event, or the more prosaic 'hit by a bus' scenario, will PP have access to any of your assets that he can pay out and would you be willing to give him permission to do so under certain predetermined conditions?
I don't have a problem with Proton Power doing that, if he was willing. He has access to my BPO collection which as stated in the first post is alone worth more than this bond, as well as many of my ships, and my POS.
Originally by: RAW23 Edit2 - 'Retirement Retreat' doesn't inspire huge confidence as a brand!
What happened was Proton Power was going to join our corp, but we were in an alliance at the time and kept getting wardec'd, which isn't good for his business. I created a corp so that we could place a hisec POS, but I didn't realize at the time there was a 7 day standings wait even for a new corp. So that new corp was opened and closed.
Proton Power to the rescue: he purchased a corp with standings that we all joined. I don't know if he had any hand in the name. I know it really didn't matter to us at the time.
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RAW23
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Posted - 2011.04.25 20:25:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Tau Cabalander
Originally by: RAW23 Tau - you mention the possibility of being struck by a meteor. In this event, or the more prosaic 'hit by a bus' scenario, will PP have access to any of your assets that he can pay out and would you be willing to give him permission to do so under certain predetermined conditions?
I don't have a problem with Proton Power doing that, if he was willing. He has access to my BPO collection which as stated in the first post is alone worth more than this bond, as well as many of my ships, and my POS.
If he would agree to this that would add in a nice piece of additional security at no cost to either the investor or the issuer. I would suggest that such an arrangement kick in after 2 missed interest payments or 30 days after the bond is due to end.
Buying corps off the market can suck re: names. I have picked up some real dogs in the past (characters too - I have one called 'Roideater' ).
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.04.25 20:28:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha ISK sent
Confirming 3 billion ISK received.
Thank you.
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